Blaster Changes Don't Fix Electric


Adeon Hawkwood

 

Posted

This is in its own topic because I wanted to make it very clear to folks: the changes to Blasters don't do *anything* for Electric Blast.

Electric Blast still does not have a complete single-target rotation; it doesn't need a boost to Recovery based on how it works; it doesn't have a tier 3 blast to increase the range thereof; and while the Snipe change is intriguing, it's not enough by itself to make the set relevant.

It's still the only damage set in the game that doesn't have a complete rotation single-target rotation.

Come on. Come on. Do better than this. If you're fixing blasters, then by God fix blasters all the way.

EDIT: As a supporting point: saying "Play /Devices" is *also* not a fix for Electric Blast.


 

Posted

Actualy you need to look more closely at the changes mentioned...

Notice the Fire Aura is mentioned but not the electric aura or dark aura or even psionic confusion aura....so basicaly only one damage aura on a blaster set is getting a change.

Also aside from doing super jumps and flying and maybe runing at super speed while shooting the sniper shot...the amount of times you might need a sniper shot to be un-interuptable isnt there much in the normal game otherwise...i mean its long range...very long range...takes a while to start and go...its the basic original pulling tool that they decided to lower the range on....and then lower the damage...with the excuse being made on each decrease...they are "balancing it to keep it inline with other sniper powers"

To me....and i mentioend this on the other thread....this blaster stuff doesnt really look like a fix for any powerset....but more looks like improvements for PVP combat.

Only things i think the developers should do is actualy make sure the powers work like their text descrpitons say they are supposed to.

Gets really tiring when you use an attack thats says it does "EXTREME" damage and find it does less then your moderate damage second attack.

Also they need to fix electric so it actualy gives the energy to the user...like all the attacks say they are supposed to...because thats just not happening.


 

Posted

Yes...only Blazing Aura is getting a treatment...however at least one power from every secondary is also getting tweaked...many with a +regen or +recov, or both. Cloaking Device from devices. Touch of Fear from dark. Conserve power from Energy. Thunder Clap from electricity. The only secondary blaster set that isn't getting anything new is Mental.

Snipes, as I understand it, will be getting the Assassin's Strike treatement by way of anytime you have 22%+ tohit bonus, the snipe attack will lose its interuptible phase and fire...or quick fire. No wind up, no fuss, no muss. See: using Assassin's Strike in mid combat.

Yes...Electric Blast will not be getting a true T3 blast. Neither will AR as that set doesn't have a true ST T3 blast either (burst and slug is all it's got). Yeah...does kinda suck as my first 50 was an Elec/Dev blaster.

Any and all "short range" blasts, such as Executioner's Shot, Bitter Ice Blast, Blaze, and the like are getting their range increased to 80'...the same as most T1&2 blasts.


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Posted

Electric Blast was a top 5 set before this change...and it gets effected by the change.

That's a plus!

Also, there's three other sets that don't make out from these buffs at all.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
Electric Blast was a top 5 set before this change...and it gets effected by the change.

That's a plus!

Also, there's three other sets that don't make out from these buffs at all.
I'm genuinely (non-sarcastically) interested in how you got this. Where did you see that it was a Top 5 set, what led anyone to say that? It's a low damage set with bad cast times and no practical secondary ability... Endurance Drain on encounters that mean anything is essentially nonfunctional.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
Electric Blast was a top 5 set before this change...and it gets effected by the change.
I find this a very strange thing for anyone to say. Electric Blast is awful.


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Posted

We know Pistols is getting some animation time adjustments. I would be thrilled if Electric blast got a better animation time for Tesla Cage and Voltaic Sentinel. I would really be happy if Voltaic Sentinel got a duration increase (2 minutes minimum, 4 preferred).


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Posted

Poor Electric Blast. And the E3 folks.....I'm sorry.


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Posted

It's just like, if you take this Electric blaster on a iTrial, you are getting substantially less mileage out of him than you would an equivalent Fire or Beam Rifle or (soon) Water Blast character. In things like The Really Hard Way runs it'd be nothing but a drain on the team, and that's just not something that I can easily swallow as a player who's interested in maximum performance.

I mean, geez. It's just not a good set. I really want it to be, but I'm restricted by the design of the set itself.

EDIT: Strongly tempted to do a power-by-power evaluation of Electric Blast versus Fire Blast in the new paradigm to really outline the issues. Here's a hint: Electric wouldn't come out on top.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilGeko View Post
Poor Electric Blast. And the E3 folks.....I'm sorry.
Thank you.. Your sympathy is appreciated


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Posted

Quote:
Strongly tempted to do a power-by-power evaluation of Electric Blast versus Fire Blast
Not a fair comparison since Fire only has damage, so it's pretty much always going to do more damage.

A better one would be Radiation or (Blaster's) Dark Blast IMO. AoE DoT, a single target mez, a debuff secondary effect and thoughts of their damage also being sub-par (Not saying it is, just that I've met some who think that). I already know the answer though, they do more damage while adding more support. If you can prove me wrong then go ahead.

There are three sets which I'll always try to see about getting fixes for. Electrical Blast, Devices and Forcefield. Yes they can work as powersets, but they have been the victims of poor design choices (Low damage for a non-existant secondary effect, repetitive waiting times for what are considerably slow results and the decision of having multiple ways to annoy melee characters on what's already a passive one-trick-pony set). I leave out the usual choice of Energy Melee because while having it's own flaws, I think that what it does do it actually does quite well.

Personally I'd give Tesla Cage the same damage as Lightning Bolt, increase and make the damage of Short Circuit front-loaded like Burn, and give Voltaic Sentinel's attack a chain effect. If that's not enough then change the secondary effect of the ST attacks to an unenhanceable, short duration (6 seconds?) mag 1 tesla cage hold to give extra utility against single targets.

Though a little off topic, on Devices make Time Bomb like Omega Maneuver and add a short duration placate to Smoke Bomb. With Forcefields, make Repulsion Field knockdown, add some -dam and enhanceable -def to Repulsion Bomb and put some defense debuff resistance in Dispersion Bubble. Having played these sets a little more than I'm happy with, these are the changes I think would go a long way to evening the playing field.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakeeb View Post
It's just like, if you take this Electric blaster on a iTrial, you are getting substantially less mileage out of him than you would an equivalent Fire or Beam Rifle or (soon) Water Blast character. In things like The Really Hard Way runs it'd be nothing but a drain on the team, and that's just not something that I can easily swallow as a player who's interested in maximum performance.
Voltaic Sentinel should be a high performer against Tyrant, especially once you get to the actual hard part, since the Olympians will be gone and it will only have one thing to shoot at (although it may also sometimes shoot at the Lights if Tyrant ends up near them, I haven't monitored that on my Emp/Elec).

VS isn't a very good power for spawn to spawn racing and killing mass groups, but it is very good against hard targets. It still should be improved for QoL, but it's strength vs. AVs is not an issue.


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So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by CBeet View Post
Not a fair comparison since Fire only has damage, so it's pretty much always going to do more damage.

A better one would be Radiation or (Blaster's) Dark Blast IMO. AoE DoT, a single target mez, a debuff secondary effect and thoughts of their damage also being sub-par (Not saying it is, just that I've met some who think that). I already know the answer though, they do more damage while adding more support. If you can prove me wrong then go ahead.

There are three sets which I'll always try to see about getting fixes for. Electrical Blast, Devices and Forcefield. Yes they can work as powersets, but they have been the victims of poor design choices (Low damage for a non-existant secondary effect, repetitive waiting times for what are considerably slow results and the decision of having multiple ways to annoy melee characters on what's already a passive one-trick-pony set). I leave out the usual choice of Energy Melee because while having it's own flaws, I think that what it does do it actually does quite well.

Personally I'd give Tesla Cage the same damage as Lightning Bolt, increase and make the damage of Short Circuit front-loaded like Burn, and give Voltaic Sentinel's attack a chain effect. If that's not enough then change the secondary effect of the ST attacks to an unenhanceable, short duration (6 seconds?) mag 1 tesla cage hold to give extra utility against single targets.

Though a little off topic, on Devices make Time Bomb like Omega Maneuver and add a short duration placate to Smoke Bomb. With Forcefields, make Repulsion Field knockdown, add some -dam and enhanceable -def to Repulsion Bomb and put some defense debuff resistance in Dispersion Bubble. Having played these sets a little more than I'm happy with, these are the changes I think would go a long way to evening the playing field.
I'd rather Time Bomb be left as is. Yes it sucks and that just means I get a free power pick at level 35 instead of stopping and deciding what I want.

Oh, and Omega Maneuver on a Crab is still something that most Crabs skip anyway because it can't be up every spawn.


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Posted

VS being a high performer doesn't compete with Disintegrate or Blaze.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakeeb View Post
VS being a high performer doesn't compete with Disintegrate or Blaze.
Electric damage doesn't need to be as good as Fire or Beam and they deal very solid DPS against hard targets. I know people poo-poo on Electric single target output because of the lack of a third tier blast, but when single target DPS really matters, Electric is fine (but VS is annoying because of the lengthy animation and its odd timing needs). On top of that, now Zapp can be used as a great DPA power on occasion, which will only help them more in comparison to other sets.


Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by StratoNexus View Post
Electric damage doesn't need to be as good as Fire or Beam and they deal very solid DPS against hard targets. I know people poo-poo on Electric single target output because of the lack of a third tier blast, but when single target DPS really matters, Electric is fine (but VS is annoying because of the lengthy animation and its odd timing needs). On top of that, now Zapp can be used as a great DPA power on occasion, which will only help them more in comparison to other sets.
I don't think the snipe change will have much effect to be honest, making it almost require Aim or Build Up essentially puts it on a 120s timer, or a 60s timer if you have both powers.

If they just made snipes into quick casting powers on those kind of crazy recharges people wouldn't be happy, but the tohit gimmick seems to have misdirected people.


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Posted

It's a substantial bust to BURST damage, that won't have a huge impact on sustained damage, which is the intention, since the devs have said repeatedly that they don't want balster damage to go much higher.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU View Post
It's a substantial bust to BURST damage, that won't have a huge impact on sustained damage, which is the intention, since the devs have said repeatedly that they don't want balster damage to go much higher.
Have they? That makes me very sad. I would think that by stats blasters should be causing the most damage at pretty much all levels, and I can't believe for a second that the stats bear that out. Nor do I think that the difference is caused by being dead or afraid to shoot.

Also I will never count a single target power as burst damage in CoX. Burst damage is BU+Fireball.

Edit: Also if you need Aim/BU+Snipe then it is situational burst, not even proper burst.


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Posted

Worse, Lightning Clap does Radial KB. Awful power.


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Posted

What if Voltaic Sentinel was finally made into a real pet? Would that fix it?

I know they don't want to do that, but I always thought that would be super helpful. Voltaic Sentinel has always been a cool little concept power, but if it was actually sustainable and more useful, it may convince me to actually play my Elec/Energy blaster who has been abandoned ever since I discovered other blasters back in issue 2 or so.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by StratoNexus View Post
Voltaic Sentinel should be a high performer against Tyrant, especially once you get to the actual hard part, since the Olympians will be gone and it will only have one thing to shoot at (although it may also sometimes shoot at the Lights if Tyrant ends up near them, I haven't monitored that on my Emp/Elec).

VS isn't a very good power for spawn to spawn racing and killing mass groups, but it is very good against hard targets. It still should be improved for QoL, but it's strength vs. AVs is not an issue.
DPS of Electric's ST attack chain, including Voltaic Sentinel, is almost exactly tied with Energy Blast (Electric Blast is something like 4% better).


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakeeb View Post
I'm genuinely (non-sarcastically) interested in how you got this. Where did you see that it was a Top 5 set, what led anyone to say that? It's a low damage set with bad cast times and no practical secondary ability... Endurance Drain on encounters that mean anything is essentially nonfunctional.
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...&postcount=233

Admittedly, it only gives up to DP's release. If it's moved down the list, I have no idea.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakeeb View Post
It's just like, if you take this Electric blaster on a iTrial, you are getting substantially less mileage out of him than you would an equivalent Fire or Beam Rifle or (soon) Water Blast character. In things like The Really Hard Way runs it'd be nothing but a drain on the team, and that's just not something that I can easily swallow as a player who's interested in maximum performance.

I mean, geez. It's just not a good set. I really want it to be, but I'm restricted by the design of the set itself.

EDIT: Strongly tempted to do a power-by-power evaluation of Electric Blast versus Fire Blast in the new paradigm to really outline the issues. Here's a hint: Electric wouldn't come out on top.
this is what annoys me about players like you, not to make this personal in anyway but you had to go the "vs fire blast" route, why? why in gods name would you sit there and compare this set to a pure damage set? lets just look at the facts here, and i must address to all, stop moaning about these changes,i havnt heard anyone being greatful about this, hasnt anyone sat down to think this might actually give us more of a reason to play this set more, blasters arent broken, they are definitely not worthless, every now and then some guy will pit any blast set against fire, for astart, fire is raw damage, it has no secondary effect like adebuff or end debuff liek electrical blast, its a unique set, and that is why they have given one aura a buff and not all the others, it seems these days players just want to roll a toon and expect pure god mode in a heartbeat just because thye asked for it, nah sorry, work for the build and make it what you will, but dont compare it or any other primary to fire blast, its very amateurish (if thats a word lols) and annoying, like i said its not a personal attack, just clearingup what i see time and time again on the boards, as soon as a change comes along, just because its not to everyones taste, ppl go nuts and they get ungreatful and whiney, pfft, i am very happy with the changes and applaud arbiter hawk for his work on this, its definitely a big take on things in a slightly different direction, on a lighter note, i will love to see how electrical fairs once ive completed a build with the numbers in mids, that is when i24 drops of course, but for now speculation and estimating and all that.