The Marketing of WWD, or A Question for Black Pebble and Co.
By
Agent White,
Posted on: 2012-03-26 10:18 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Quote:
"A wizard did it"
|
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Also, at least it could be worse.
It could be Mass Effect 3's ending >_> |
Thought for the day:
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."
=][=
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Slaunyeh
"A wizard did it"
|
My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
And... it's now Live. See this thread for a Spoilery discussion of the content of #7.
Speeding Through New DA Repeatables || Spreadsheet o' Enhancements || Zombie Skins: better skins for these forums || Guide to Guides
Quote:
The forum software recognizes two kinds of accounts:|
Originally Posted by LISAR
p.s. Are freemium accounts the only ones that can't delete messages or was this function fully removed? |
VIP (all features available)
Non-VIP (limited features available)
VIP's can still edit and delete their posts, can have and change avatars, can have and change signatures, can send and receive PM's, can post in any forum section and much more.
If the game spit out 20 dollar bills people would complain that they weren't sequentially numbered. If they were sequentially numbered people would complain that they weren't random enough.
Black Pebble is my new hero.
So, Statesman gets his death spoiled, it happens, he gets a big funeral piece, commentary from the designers, etc.
Next episode, mums the word from anyone. Psyche bites it. Nothing. oh and Penelope Yin makes mention of her. Everyone else says nothing or talks about Statesman.
May as well just be a footnote in the game. ;p
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Agent White
So, Statesman gets his death spoiled, it happens, he gets a big funeral piece, commentary from the designers, etc.
Next episode, mums the word from anyone. Psyche bites it. Nothing. oh and Penelope Yin makes mention of her. Everyone else says nothing or talks about Statesman. May as well just be a footnote in the game. ;p |
Sister who? Oh! You mean Primal Mother Mayhem?
Thought for the day:
"Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."
=][=
Quote:
Inorite?! |
Originally Posted by LISAR
Man it was really considerate of him to get more face for you to punch.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Slaunyeh
"A wizard did it"
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
|
So after playing through part 7 and seeing the last of the storyline I think the best thing I can say about the whole thing is
It was great to see Penelope Yin as a full blown hero.
Second best: it was cool to fight along side so many big names (even if game mechanics had them acting like my henchmen)
That's it. No "this fight was epic" no "horrified x person died" no "wow, I didn't see that twist coming"
And the deaths? These were big name heros not some street punks, they're not going to die easily. c'mon, bullet to the head was such an ignominious end and "oh look I'm the worlds most powerful hero and I'm going to walk into the worlds most obvious trap". Seriously?? NONE of them actually had a decent real fight, you expect at least one....
So yeah, overall disapointed. Not even worth replaying, I'll just farm part 1 from now on for the rewards because it's the quickest to get done.
Quote:
Michelle, you're asking these questions of a marketing team that thought "Who Will Die?" was a great title for a story. |
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Like I said, it's not even so much about the storyline. That raises its own debate.
I'm strictly talking about how the publicity for this was handled. I sometimes wonder if they throw darts at a board to determine what gets publicized and what doesn't. And Gods know that if given the chance at the Pummit, I'd love to corner Brian Clayton, Black Pebble, Ghost Falcon, and whoever, and go, "As someone who obviously doesn't understand Marketing, how was this meant to be successful?" |
I don't think that Marketing 101 even applies to SSA1. I've more or less concluded that the marketing was spearheaded by suits at NCSoft, maybe even NCSoft Korea, who didn't give a rip about marketing but who are using SSA1 as one part of a big experiment to decide what direction ALL NCSoft games ought to be moving towards as they all move to Freemium status.
That's the only way I can make sense of the whole thing. Either it was done by amateurs who had no business getting near a marketing plan, or it was done by Korean bigwigs who figure that Americans need things simple and so they broke it down into the simplest marketing effort possible.
Quote:
Considering the body count, I'd say it's less epic like One More Day and more epic like Countdown to Final Crisis.
|
Originally Posted by Niklarus
To put it in comic book terms, what some of us (myself included) were hoping for was epic like Crisis on Infinite Earths. What we got was "epic" like One More Day.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
|
Quote:
Also, I have to agree with this. Marketing a story based on there being a character death in it is nothing but poor taste. In the best case scenario, you're killing a character people liked and, as it turned out in reality, you're killing a character people didn't really care about, you're killing him for petty reasons and you're wasting both dramatic impact and good will.|
Originally Posted by SlickRiptide
Michelle, you're asking these questions of a marketing team that thought "Who Will Die?" was a great title for a story.
|
It's pretty evident right from the title that "Who Will Die?" would be all payoff and no setup, since the payoff is what this was being marketed with. But the thing about payoff is that it's the setup that pays off in the end. You need to build up to that climax of drama and excitement for all that built up emotion to pay off in the end. Opening the thing with promises of a character's death is pretty much the same as advertising, say, Planet of the Apes by having the statue of liberty on the cover.
Wait...
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
|
Quote:
See, that's what I'd love to know. Did NCsoft shove it down their throats, or did they do it to themselves? That's what I'm trying to understand. Once I know how their Marketing operates (note I did *not* use the word "works"), then I know what to expect... or not to expect.|
Originally Posted by SlickRiptide
Michelle, you're asking these questions of a marketing team that thought "Who Will Die?" was a great title for a story.
I don't think that Marketing 101 even applies to SSA1. I've more or less concluded that the marketing was spearheaded by suits at NCSoft, maybe even NCSoft Korea, who didn't give a rip about marketing but who are using SSA1 as one part of a big experiment to decide what direction ALL NCSoft games ought to be moving towards as they all move to Freemium status. That's the only way I can make sense of the whole thing. Either it was done by amateurs who had no business getting near a marketing plan, or it was done by Korean bigwigs who figure that Americans need things simple and so they broke it down into the simplest marketing effort possible. |
And now having played WWD7, I *REALLY* know how I would have done ads for both the entire series and just for WWD7 (as a final buildup).
Oh, well.
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Like I said, it's not even so much about the storyline. That raises its own debate.
I'm strictly talking about how the publicity for this was handled. I sometimes wonder if they throw darts at a board to determine what gets publicized and what doesn't. |
********SPOILERS for the "Who Will Die?" arc herein**********
Well, part of the problem was that they PUBLICIZED the storyline, both by revealing "Who Will Die" and then commenting a good deal about it, as I detailed previously. So I was told that the "how" of Statesman's death was going to be of major interest and the death scene itself would be "stirring." It proved to be the opposite.
Positron's published comments about "killing off" the Statesman character told me that Sister Pysche, the other of Jack Emmert's creations, was as dead as a red shirt on Star Trek at that point. And gosh, she got killed. Again. By Manticore. What does that make, THREE TIMES?? But the third time is the charm, apparently.
As you said, there were any number of positives that Marketing could have focused on regarding episodes 6 and 7, but could it be that the feedback from the playerbase suggested that things were not being so well received and they just held their piece? Or did they just not have a plan?
I can think of a number of instances in which the death of a major character in an established franchise was 1) a surprise and a shock and 2) noble and heroic and the public responded quite favorably. Here, we did not even have the Joss Whedon random knockoffs for shock value-- it was apparently Jack's creations only, with shock value as sort of a bonus.
There is still lots to love about CoH, so here I am still, but the way this whole business was publicized has me as mystified as yourself.
"How do you know you are on the side of good?" a Paragon citizen asked him. "How can we even know what is 'good'?"
"The Most High has spoken, even with His own blood," Melancton replied. "Surely we know."
Quote:
*mashes "Devs, Hire This Woman!" button several times more*
|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
And now having played WWD7, I *REALLY* know how I would have done ads for both the entire series and just for WWD7 (as a final buildup).
Oh, well. Michelle aka Samuraiko/Dark_Respite |
"How do you know you are on the side of good?" a Paragon citizen asked him. "How can we even know what is 'good'?"
"The Most High has spoken, even with His own blood," Melancton replied. "Surely we know."
Quote:
Amusingly, as i read this response Beautiful Girl by the Gadjits started playing.
|
Originally Posted by SlickRiptide
That's the only way I can make sense of the whole thing. Either it was done by amateurs who had no business getting near a marketing plan, or it was done by Korean bigwigs who figure that Americans need things simple and so they broke it down into the simplest marketing effort possible.
|
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
Quote:
Only because behind Chuck Norris' beard there is no...eh, you've heard that one.
| You guessing he has the most powerful chin ever seen? |
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
Quote:
Besides, in Norris' case it would be "the most powerful chin never seen."
|
Originally Posted by Venture
Only because behind Chuck Norris' beard there is no...eh, you've heard that one.
|
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
Considering we have players completing Paragon Market posts to list what items are on sale...
(No Spoilers Follow)
What I liked best about this arc was the way they handled the Death Scene:
Even working though his grief, Statesman managed to put together Wade's plan to take over the Shadow Shard. Realizing how dangerous stopping him would be (and probably wanting a personal crack at him), the red herring lead Marcus tossed your way worked just long enough for him to get to the Shard first.
Panicing, Wade pulled out all of the stops, sending in an overwhelming force of Shard creatures after the lone hero. Stranded and alone, Statesman battled against the seemingly endless waves of Shard beasts, fighting with every ounce of his might and will. As the scene pulled back further and further, the heroic battle music fading to a plantive tune of soft strings, the screen went dark. When we arrived, moments too late to prevent the death, but still in time - barely - to disrupt the ritual transferring Statesman's power fully to Wade, we garaunteed that the fallen hero's spirit would be free to seek its reward, rather than be chained forever to Wade's diminion. Wade still retained enough power for a final strike at us, of course, one heck of a battle...
Oh, that's not what happened?
Um, never mind, then.
"Strength of numbers is the delight of the timid. The valiant in spirit glory in fighting alone."
- Mahatma Gandhi
Still CoHzy after all these years...
Quote:
Seriously?!|
Originally Posted by Zortel
Considering we have players completing Paragon Market posts to list what items are on sale...
|
*goes to look*
Oh, FFS...
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
Quote:
Yup.
|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Seriously?!
*goes to look* Oh, FFS... Michelle aka Samuraiko/Dark_Respite |
Quote:
Okay, how often do "new storyline starts in comic book" or "comic book storyline continues after death of major iconic character" make it into the mainstream news?|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
When the whole SSA/WWD thing first started, there was really just minimal hype - the notion of an overarcing story that would be released over a period of time rather than the entirety of a task force in one go. But it being "Who Will Die?", this was potentially really big news.
Issues 1-4 were mentioned, casually discussed... Then Issue 5 was RAMMED DOWN OUR THROATS OMG SPOILER SPOILER SPOILER THIS IS HUGE YOU GUYS WILL LOVE THE CUTSCENE SNAPE KILLS DUMBLEDORE IT WAS HIS SLED ETC ETC ETC... Then nothing on 6 or 7. Ummmmmm... color me confused, Marketing. |
How often do "comic book kills off major iconic character" make it into mainstream news?
There you go.
Character index
Quote:
I'm not talking about mainstream news - granted, "The Death of Superman," "The Assassination of Captain America" (and his subsequent resurrection), those were big. |
Originally Posted by Silver Gale
Okay, how often do "new storyline starts in comic book" or "comic book storyline continues after death of major iconic character" make it into the mainstream news?
How often do "comic book kills off major iconic character" make it into mainstream news? There you go. |
"Will Archie Marry Veronica or Betty?", that was big (though I have no idea why - had Veronica and Betty married EACH OTHER, *THAT* would have been big).
I'm talking about just within the news feeds of the gaming industry - Massively, TenTon Hammer, OnRPG, IGN, maybe even Kotaku, etc.
Hell, even just within our own COMMUNITY! They could have kept the ball continuously rolling from 1-6 to keep the hype up for 7, but no.
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
Marketing for CoH has always been a little schizo. But this highlighted it will strobing, neon-pink, billion-candle lamps while a fleet of town criers took to the streets in PA-mobiles screaming "WE...ARE...SCHIZO!" before kicking a hospital full of shrinks into the pit of despair.
Hyperbolic?
Yeah.
But it paints the right mental picture about how bizzare CoH's marketing has been, especially lately.