Quote:
I don't have a shielder, anyone with Def/Rech slotted in Vengeance, or any of the somewhat more esoteric things like HOs in Power Boost/BuildUp.|
Originally Posted by Trilby
Does anyone have a build that relies heavily on HOs and tell me what they lost? I'm interested to see how big a nerf it actually is.
|
The biggest effect on any build of mine has been my melee spec Night Widow, who had three Membranes in Mind Link. If you completely lose the +rech slotting, Mind Link can no longer be "perma", which is an immense impact on the character's performance.
However, Def/Rech IOs still work. Without too much work you can get close to the Membrane slotting with three Level 50 Def/Rech and one Level 40 That's all the options that are readily available. However, one can close the gap further by going for more extreme components, such as using Enhancement Boosters to make the level 50 pieces into 50+5, and or dip into PvPOs to find a third level 50 Def/Rech IO.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Quote:
Can we lay of the semantic arguments beyond "exploit", for which we actually have a developer quote?|
Originally Posted by Kazz
It isn't a nerf, it's a fix. One that's been coming for a while.
|
It seems ridiculous to me to argue that point. Something can be both a fix and a nerf. Just because we knew a fix was coming someday has nothing to do with whether or not it "nerfs" the ways in which it was used.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Quote:
Fair enough, I'll apologize for my last post.
|
Originally Posted by UberGuy
Can we lay of the semantic arguments beyond "exploit", for which we actually have a developer quote?
It seems ridiculous to me to argue that point. Something can be both a fix and a nerf. Just because we knew a fix was coming someday has nothing to do with whether or not it "nerfs" the ways in which it was used. |
Haven't played in a month. Got tired of waiting on solo incarnate content. Abandoned CoH for <other MMO>, though I expected it to be temporary.
Haven't read the thread. I'd rather play <other MMO> than wade through it all.
About the only reason left to slot HOs WAS the exploits. I have huge piles of uplevel ones. Spent tens of billions. Now half of them are useless. Yes, I knew I was "cheating", that they would some day be nerfed. I knew the risks. I took my chances. It served me well for years. I finally got burned. I know it's my fault. Doesn't make the news any more pleasant to me.
It would have been better to rebalance HOs, make them competitive with purples and PvP IOs in some way, rather than nerf them into oblivion. But I didn't expect that. I expected the eventual nerf, and that's what we got.
Yes, I know it's no big deal in the grand scheme of things. It doesn't really hurt me that bad. I spent those tens of billions to get small percentage point improvements in characters, so I'm only losing a few percentage points. I'll get those points back and MUCH more if I switch to purely +5 IOs and rebuild characters around the incarnate powers instead of just adding them on afterwards. As for my main shielder and DDR, his whole point is damage, and so the DDR loss won't be that big a deal to me, unlike to people playing shields for survivability.
But it's a straw that threatens to break the camels back. I'm annoyed, and like everyone, I have alternatives. I don't HAVE to continue paying this company to annoy me.
They'll keep getting my money for the moment, but I'm going to continue not playing for a while. Maybe I'll check back in in another month. I'll probably be resigned to my fate by then, and thinking more of what I can do instead of what I've lost. And hopefully the first thing I see when I check back in will be good news instead of bad. Like maybe the rumored solo incarnate content. Maybe it even won't suck the way (to me) the group incarnate content sucks.
We'll see.
Later.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Werner
Like maybe the rumored solo incarnate content.
|
It's not rumored, it's on (VIP) test right now.
Culex's resistance guide
It's coming Werner! i22!
I liked the HO's for the slot saves they allowed me. Yeah, had to move some slots around after this.
Keep hoping they'll just give HO's greater enhancement values. That would equal them out nicely.
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
Quote:
But Shields WILL have high levels of DDR even after this fix -- I think the second-highest possible in the game. Substantially higher than other defense-heavy sets like Invulnerability and Willpower.|
Originally Posted by Combat
(despite the fact that I think that defense set should have high levels of DDR to protect against cascade failure)
|
It just won't have the same level as Super Reflexes.
Since SR is just one set, what your quote is really saying is you feel that Shields should have the highest possible level of DDR, despite having layered mitigation SR does not get AND being massively better offensively.
Because Shields with the nerf/fix/change will still have better than every other set EXECPT SR.
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
----------------------------------------------------------
The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
Quote:
I'm betting that this will soon be followed by the "If the devs are going to fix our favorite exploit then they must give us something good in return, or else it's unfair!" argument...
|
Originally Posted by Sailboat
But Shields WILL have high levels of DDR even after this fix -- I think the second-highest possible in the game. Substantially higher than other defense-heavy sets like Invulnerability and Willpower.
It just won't have the same level as Super Reflexes. Since SR is just one set, what your quote is really saying is you feel that Shields should have the highest possible level of DDR, despite having layered mitigation SR does not get AND being massively better offensively. Because Shields with the nerf/fix/change will still have better than every other set EXECPT SR. |
Quote:
Wut?
|
Originally Posted by Demetrios Vasilikos
Whether we like it or not COX is a PVP MMO
|
I used the enzyme exploit shamelessly. If there aren't any consequences for using an exploit, or if the consequences cannot be reasonably enforced, I see no reason not to. That said, I'm also not going to complain now that it's fixed. You knew the risks when you slotted the enzymes.
Quote:
This is the guy who claims that "NOTHING is strong to psi" [sic]. Just smile and nod and go on your way.
|
Originally Posted by Erhnam
Wut?
|
Quote:
This post nailed my feelings exactly.|
Originally Posted by Werner
Haven't played in a month. Got tired of waiting on solo incarnate content. Abandoned CoH for <other MMO>, though I expected it to be temporary.
Haven't read the thread. I'd rather play <other MMO> than wade through it all. About the only reason left to slot HOs WAS the exploits. I have huge piles of uplevel ones. Spent tens of billions. Now half of them are useless. Yes, I knew I was "cheating", that they would some day be nerfed. I knew the risks. I took my chances. It served me well for years. I finally got burned. I know it's my fault. Doesn't make the news any more pleasant to me. It would have been better to rebalance HOs, make them competitive with purples and PvP IOs in some way, rather than nerf them into oblivion. But I didn't expect that. I expected the eventual nerf, and that's what we got. Yes, I know it's no big deal in the grand scheme of things. It doesn't really hurt me that bad. I spent those tens of billions to get small percentage point improvements in characters, so I'm only losing a few percentage points. I'll get those points back and MUCH more if I switch to purely +5 IOs and rebuild characters around the incarnate powers instead of just adding them on afterwards. As for my main shielder and DDR, his whole point is damage, and so the DDR loss won't be that big a deal to me, unlike to people playing shields for survivability. But it's a straw that threatens to break the camels back. I'm annoyed, and like everyone, I have alternatives. I don't HAVE to continue paying this company to annoy me. They'll keep getting my money for the moment, but I'm going to continue not playing for a while. Maybe I'll check back in in another month. I'll probably be resigned to my fate by then, and thinking more of what I can do instead of what I've lost. And hopefully the first thing I see when I check back in will be good news instead of bad. Like maybe the rumored solo incarnate content. Maybe it even won't suck the way (to me) the group incarnate content sucks. We'll see. Later. |
Why do something that literally only annoys players? This 'fix' does nothing to improve the game. I'm still waiting for someone to field an argument to explain how it improves the game, but the only one I'm seeing is that HO's weren't 'intended' to work this way and that they always intended to 'fix' them.
Like you, I've played literally twice in the last month for the same reason as you. I've been waiting for staff melee to come back, but if they intend to keep 'fixing' the game like this, like you, it doesn't make me any more anxious to come back.
So why post? Because I've played this game for five or six years straight, and I've loved it - so I still care about what happens to the game, and I hate it when the devs do things that in my opinion not only do not add value or fun to the game, but detract from it. This fix clearly makes HO's far less useful than they are now, so they clearly detract from the fun factor for those that were using them, while adding ZERO benefits to the game for anyone else, outside of the usual fanboys who feel the devs can do no wrong.
Look at werners situation - clearly he was heavily turned off by the lack of a solo incarnate path. Many players shared this feeling and made it very clear to the devs that there should be a solo path right off the bat. The devs ignored them and the fanboys cheered. Well not providing a solo path was similar to this situation - it did nothing to add to the game, it only annoyed some players, and in the end, no doubt lost them some players. And that hurts not only the devs, but the game as a whole and every player who plays it, because less players means less money which means less goes into this game, and less players in an mmo is not a good thing. Sure the devs are providing said solo path months and months later, but the damage is done, and some players that those moves lost are probably gone for good.
I hope the devs will learn from that mistake, and rethink this move before they make it, and before they piss off a bunch of players for literally no good reason.
Quote:
Then voice up and get them to get them to increase the effectiveness of HOs! |
Originally Posted by Cyber_naut
This post nailed my feelings exactly.
Why do something that literally only annoys players? This 'fix' does nothing to improve the game. I'm still waiting for someone to field an argument to explain how it improves the game, but the only one I'm seeing is that HO's weren't 'intended' to work this way and that they always intended to 'fix' them. Like you, I've played literally twice in the last month for the same reason as you. I've been waiting for staff melee to come back, but if they intend to keep 'fixing' the game like this, like you, it doesn't make me any more anxious to come back. So why post? Because I've played this game for five or six years straight, and I've loved it - so I still care about what happens to the game, and I hate it when the devs do things that in my opinion not only do not add value or fun to the game, but detract from it. This fix clearly makes HO's far less useful than they are now, so they clearly detract from the fun factor for those that were using them, while adding ZERO benefits to the game for anyone else, outside of the usual fanboys who feel the devs can do no wrong. Look at werners situation - clearly he was heavily turned off by the lack of a solo incarnate path. Many players shared this feeling and made it very clear to the devs that there should be a solo path right off the bat. The devs ignored them and the fanboys cheered. Well not providing a solo path was similar to this situation - it did nothing to add to the game, it only annoyed some players, and in the end, no doubt lost them some players. And that hurts not only the devs, but the game as a whole and every player who plays it, because less players means less money which means less goes into this game, and less players in an mmo is not a good thing. Sure the devs are providing said solo path months and months later, but the damage is done, and some players that those moves lost are probably gone for good. I hope the devs will learn from that mistake, and rethink this move before they make it, and before they piss off a bunch of players for literally no good reason. |
They're working as intended now, sure...but if they increase their effectiveness, you can keep the builds, but replace the Enzymes with Cytoskeletons for the same effect!
Maybe even better, since that would possibly mean more ENDRED.
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
Quote:
It doesn't annoy me. I like it. It clearly improves balance, making the game as a whole better. When there's only one choice that's clearly the best, and the other choices are suboptimal, a game feels badly designed -- because it is.|
Originally Posted by Cyber_naut
This post nailed my feelings exactly.
Why do something that literally only annoys players? This 'fix' does nothing to improve the game. |
And I have more Shield characters than any other single Tanker/Brute/Scrapper set. And Shield is still strong.
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
----------------------------------------------------------
The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
Quote:
It doesn't annoy me. I'm glad they fixed it, because the game is balanced now. Shields aren't far and away the best choice for a defense-based set now, which means SR can shine more (though I still think it could use some buffs).|
Originally Posted by Cyber_naut
This post nailed my feelings exactly.
Why do something that literally only annoys players? This 'fix' does nothing to improve the game. I'm still waiting for someone to field an argument to explain how it improves the game, but the only one I'm seeing is that HO's weren't 'intended' to work this way and that they always intended to 'fix' them. |
Quote:
|
Like you, I've played literally twice in the last month for the same reason as you. I've been waiting for staff melee to come back, but if they intend to keep 'fixing' the game like this, like you, it doesn't make me any more anxious to come back. So why post? Because I've played this game for five or six years straight, and I've loved it - so I still care about what happens to the game, and I hate it when the devs do things that in my opinion not only do not add value or fun to the game, but detract from it. This fix clearly makes HO's far less useful than they are now, so they clearly detract from the fun factor for those that were using them, while adding ZERO benefits to the game for anyone else, outside of the usual fanboys who feel the devs can do no wrong. |
Quote:
| Look at werners situation - clearly he was heavily turned off by the lack of a solo incarnate path. Many players shared this feeling and made it very clear to the devs that there should be a solo path right off the bat. The devs ignored them and the fanboys cheered. Well not providing a solo path was similar to this situation - it did nothing to add to the game, it only annoyed some players, and in the end, no doubt lost them some players. And that hurts not only the devs, but the game as a whole and every player who plays it, because less players means less money which means less goes into this game, and less players in an mmo is not a good thing. Sure the devs are providing said solo path months and months later, but the damage is done, and some players that those moves lost are probably gone for good. |
Quote:
| I hope the devs will learn from that mistake, and rethink this move before they make it, and before they piss off a bunch of players for literally no good reason. |
TL,DR I'm sorry that you've lost enjoyment in the game over this, but I'm glad the devs are still trying to fix the game.
Quote:
Honestly, there's little chance anyone can give you an answer you will accept. The very fact that you cannot see how being able to slot things in ways that give benefits which were never intended can be detrimental means that you probably will not see the value in any argument for fixing it.|
Originally Posted by Cyber_naut
Why do something that literally only annoys players? This 'fix' does nothing to improve the game. I'm still waiting for someone to field an argument to explain how it improves the game, but the only one I'm seeing is that HO's weren't 'intended' to work this way and that they always intended to 'fix' them.
|
The argument "it doesn't break the game" is not a valid argument against fixing things that are working in ways that are not intended.
Bear in mind, I knew about this bug/exploit/whatever, and after holding off for a long time in case the devs fixed it, I finally started using it fairly shamelessly. I was in no hurry for the devs to fix it, before or after I started using it. I'm not some campaigner for this change.
At issue here is that you may not agree with other people about what constitutes "harm". If Shields is in every functional way the mitigation peer of SR, and provides offensive benefits that SR does not, why would anyone choose SR other than concept? Situations like that are usually viewed with dismay by good stewards of games they maintain. Maybe you don't care about things like that, but yours is not the only viewpoint that matters. And it's not only the devs that can dislike that scenario - it can create sour grapes for people with long-standing characters of the obsoleted powersets.
Its absolutely fair to request that the devs evaluate whether any given bug needs fixing, or whether it's actually created/discovered a feature worth keeping. Other than allowing top-end builds to creep higher in their performance envelopes, I'm not clear on what the value of this "bug" as a game feature is, and I'm pretty sure that bugs that improve the top 1% of build or some such is not high on the list of game "features" the devs will think are worth keeping as formal benefits.
It's also a fair argument to point out that this undercuts one of the last areas in which HOs saw strong, frequent use. Enzymes and Membranes were relatively common elements in high-end builds solely because they enhanced things nothing else could. Now that this is no longer the case, they will be less favored. Others have already mentioned many times in this thread that this is a great opportunity to revisit HOs and give them new or better benefits - reasons for people to favor them again - and I agree.
If you think that the devs of this or any game should just leave edge problems alone, just because you don't see those problems as causing great harm, you are going to be regularly disappointed. Usually the only devs who leave things like that alone are ones who just don't have the time or resources to address them, not ones who think the problems should be left there for people to use. There are famous exceptions (see: "skiing" in Tribes), but they are just that - exceptions. You shouldn't expect such things in general.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Quote:
If the devs were willing to learn the lesson you want them to learn, long ago they would have learned to reverse ED and scrap the invention system.|
Originally Posted by Cyber_naut
I hope the devs will learn from that mistake, and rethink this move before they make it, and before they piss off a bunch of players for literally no good reason.
|
You seem to think someone is going to come along and logically prove to you that you shouldn't get what you want. So I'll terminate that line of thought by saying its considered an axiom that a properly functioning game is better for the long term health of the game, and no one that actually builds MMOs that I'm aware of questions that axiom. So long as that axiom exists, there is no logical argument possible that can reverse it. That's what axioms are.
You can question it, rail against it, but because everyone who makes games believes it there is no escape from it without quitting MMOs and taking up hacky sack.
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
I think everyone who's still upset, is forgetting that the game was balanced around the idea that anyone could still play the game on Single Origin enhancements. Hami-O's were balanced around SO's to be "the better option" for that style of game play. Then the Invention System was created to be "the next evolutionary step" floating above HO's but slightly overlapping their ideas/usage enough that they may still incorporate in some IO'd builds. Years later, after experiencing nearly five years of "broken HO's", the development team altered the format of the game and made it "Free to Play", literally separating the game into SO-HO vs. IO. The HO's still need to exist in the game As Intended, to balance the SO game. Yes, SO-Only builds were able to abuse the broken-HO's, but not nearly to the extreme that an IO-User could; this did not however change the fact that SO-Users were, in fact, doing something they were not intended to be able to do. With the game now definitively defined between "SO" and "IO", that fix was clearly coming.
It may not be at the top of everyone's "Fix It" list, but it was time, and the ability to correct it was evident. Will they improve HO's? No, probably not. Realistically, we, as IO-Users, already have our "HO's" in the Purple Sets. The issue there is that we're still waiting for them to finish expanding those options to the remaining types (Defense/Resistance/Etc).
Quote:
I like Hacky Sack. I like MMO's.|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
You can question it, rail against it, but because everyone who makes games believes it there is no escape from it without quitting MMOs and taking up hacky sack.
|
I Should make a Hacky Sack MMO.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Warning: crazy space limit reached. Please delete some crazy and try again. |
Quote:
There are still reasons to slot HOs over IOs, Cytos are better than all Def/End IOs.
|
Originally Posted by Werner
Haven't played in a month. Got tired of waiting on solo incarnate content. Abandoned CoH for <other MMO>, though I expected it to be temporary.
Haven't read the thread. I'd rather play <other MMO> than wade through it all. About the only reason left to slot HOs WAS the exploits. I have huge piles of uplevel ones. Spent tens of billions. Now half of them are useless. Yes, I knew I was "cheating", that they would some day be nerfed. I knew the risks. I took my chances. It served me well for years. I finally got burned. I know it's my fault. Doesn't make the news any more pleasant to me. It would have been better to rebalance HOs, make them competitive with purples and PvP IOs in some way, rather than nerf them into oblivion. But I didn't expect that. I expected the eventual nerf, and that's what we got. Yes, I know it's no big deal in the grand scheme of things. It doesn't really hurt me that bad. I spent those tens of billions to get small percentage point improvements in characters, so I'm only losing a few percentage points. I'll get those points back and MUCH more if I switch to purely +5 IOs and rebuild characters around the incarnate powers instead of just adding them on afterwards. As for my main shielder and DDR, his whole point is damage, and so the DDR loss won't be that big a deal to me, unlike to people playing shields for survivability. But it's a straw that threatens to break the camels back. I'm annoyed, and like everyone, I have alternatives. I don't HAVE to continue paying this company to annoy me. They'll keep getting my money for the moment, but I'm going to continue not playing for a while. Maybe I'll check back in in another month. I'll probably be resigned to my fate by then, and thinking more of what I can do instead of what I've lost. And hopefully the first thing I see when I check back in will be good news instead of bad. Like maybe the rumored solo incarnate content. Maybe it even won't suck the way (to me) the group incarnate content sucks. We'll see. Later. |
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
Quote:
Indeed. Every Invuln toon I roll gets three Cyto's in Invincibility.|
Originally Posted by Santorican
There are still reasons to slot HOs over IOs, Cytos are better than all Def/End IOs.
|
Perfection!
Quote:
Seconded. I never took advantage of the Enzymes in invuln toons (i Did in Shield toons).|
Originally Posted by mauk2
Indeed. Every Invuln toon I roll gets three Cyto's in Invincibility.
Perfection! |
But, 3 cytos in invulns is ideal and I'm guessing the difference between that and 3 enzymes in Invuln is very small.
On my shield toons, yeah, its a change, but I knew what was going on when I slotted it so I can't complain. I actually think its a good thing to maybe see more SR toons again.
End Game- LVL 50 Scrapper-DM/INV
Ripjak- LVL 50 Defender-Rad/Rad
Extruder- LVL 50 Scrapper-DM/REG
Juicie- LVL 50 Blaster-ELEC/ELEC
Mind Sync- LVL 50 Controller-MIND/FF
Quote:
Three Enzymes in Invincibility would have been wasteful. The main advantage of "abusable" Enzymes was that they buffed Defense by 33% per Enzyme. So two Enzymes pushed you past the ED softcap for defense slotting, which is 60%.|
Originally Posted by Ripjak
But, 3 cytos in invulns is ideal and I'm guessing the difference between that and 3 enzymes in Invuln is very small.
|
Enzymes had no advantage for toHit slotting.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Wow, reading about the nerf/fix the devs are doing to hamis really hurts innocent users of hamis.
When I use mids to make a toon up it shows what hamis do in a power and thats how i decide to use it.
Unless I were to spend countless hours digging for info this specific I dont know about it being an exploit or not.
I have spent a lot of money and time getting enzymes and membranes thinking they were pretty nice. Now from what Im reading its a waste to do any trial or hami raid where hami's are a big part of the reward.
Next they will nerf all purple sets by half claiming they are to overpowering and an exploit. Bam! more money gone. This fix/change only hurts all players using hamis and disrupts the market again! I feel like the devs are some bunch of psychos who like to hit us with pleasure then hit us with pain leaving us confused as to if we want to keep playing at all.
Im not feeling very vip lately.. Thanks devs
Yeah, because, you know, pain is so totally the only thing the devs have given us over the past couple of years, right?
Welcome to playing an online game. Online experience is subject to change. Sometimes we'll like it, sometimes we wont.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Quote:
I've been keeping an eye on a small MMO (the "massively" part really doesn't belong, but that's what it's called) that shouldn't have any business being still played, much less paid for, and yet still is, mostly thanks to the dev team introducing horribly overpowered things every now and then, often for limited amount of times. Balance has been turned on its head multiple times to the point I'm not sure anyone sees the big picture, power creeps up in spikes and that keeps an hardcore fanbase playing, for the sake of getting that next elite item that will obliterate everything and so on.| So I'll terminate that line of thought by saying its considered an axiom that a properly functioning game is better for the long term health of the game, and no one that actually builds MMOs that I'm aware of questions that axiom. |
If anyone wants to look it up (mostly because I wouldn't blame you if you think I'm making this up), it's called Helbreath. Be warned, the community is very abrasive.
Edit: OK. I found out.
Does anyone have a build that relies heavily on HOs and tell me what they lost? I'm interested to see how big a nerf it actually is.