15 EMP Merits to unlock the New Incarnates
By
AresSupreme,
Posted on: 2011-10-24 11:18 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Unless they're changed to zero Emp merits, they'll remain too high. We got 12 new Lore trees for free, why should these new trees be any different?|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
These are still Beta numbers - they can be changed based on player feedback.
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Originally Posted by DumpleBerry
I still don't understand this. Is it 15 Empyreans on top of unlocking the slots through iXP in the trials? People keep telling me that unlocking, say, your Destiny slot gives you some of the Destiny powers, but then you have to pay 15 Empyreans to unlock these more "epic" powers. Are they more powerful? Is it 15 Empyreans for each one?
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Even if you already have each slot unlocked, you have to pay 15 Emp merits for each of these trees. They're basically making you pay to fit your concept better, if these trees do that for you.
Edit: The unlock of these new trees is on top of unlocking the slot through iXP, which is still required for each slot as a whole.
Further Edit: Upon further review, most things are neutral to toxic, with only a few AVs having resists. It's zombie types that resist both psi and toxic heavily, not robots. It still doesn't change the fact that 1/2 strength for toxic DoT is unnecessary when the fire, energy and negative energy all are higher and are barely resisted by mobs, too.
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For all the things I don't like about the current Beta implementation, I have to look at one positive: The development team has finally caught on to the idea of not creating another new currency.
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At this rate, I wouldn't be surprised if creating a Very Rare ability on the Omega slot required 99 Empyrean merits, 999 Astral merits, 9999 Reward Merits, and 2,000,000,000 Influence.
For that price, it ought to at least give you six slots on each every power you have that is slottable, hahaha.
Well since the cats out of the bag I will weigh in.
@Golden Girl, Hon, do you even hear yourself anymore, or do you blindly defend anything the Devs do? Keyes is not, and will not ever be "fun." The idea of a Superhero MMO is to make us feel like Superheroes... this violates that precept by putting in an unresistable damage type that both the Pulse and the AV use like it's a pop gun... Not Fun, even with the proposed changes to tone it down, Not Fun... Not in the least...
@PeterPeter
I disagree; I do not think ANY addition to existing Incarnate slots should ever be locked behind more investment. We already had additions added to incarnate slots once, with Lore, and it cost us nothing other then to unlock those powers as we normally would have to. Now we have to do that AND invest 15 E-Merits, and the powers are lackluster to boot... The new Judgement power is dealing Smashing damage... for example... the most, or second most (can't remember which is which, smashing/lethal...) resisted damage IN THE GAME, but those people who have natural characters will want it, for concept, and will have to pay through the nose for it with they're time and effort.
What really gets to me, is the change to BAF and Lam, as they are at face value a change to make us play the other incarnate trials, ok I get that. Instead of TAKING from us, why not ADD Incentive... When have you ever heard that taking incentive away in a game was a good idea... Something I have learned from basic game design and running D&D for 20+ years is that you ALWAYS make the path you want them to take to be the one with the most incentive... you don't penalize any other path, but you make yours the most attractive and it is naturally the one that is taken... Now that attraction doesn't need to be lucrative in D&D but in an MMO it kinda does... We invest time, we expect payout in our imaginary money... Your telling us Devs that we can't do that anymore reliably, because your taking the reliable investment away, but without a reliable investment I might not feel like it is worth my investment...
The sad reality is this is AIMED at VIP members, as we are the only ones with access to Incarnate... So if we are the Core of your business... Keep Us Happy... No more new currencies, No more surprise costs for existing content expansion, and above STOP Telling Us How To Play, it is what @#$@# everyone off about ED, and the Farm changes, and now your doing it again.
Stop Telling Us How To Play. We pay for the game, and the more you push us away the less of us are going to be willing to be here, I am watching my Global Friends window black out more and more everyday... and it is changes like these... an attitude of you vs us, that causes it. Please help us experience the game, facilitate our play, don't penalize it...
Positive Reinforcement, not Negative.
My two cents...
Elvnsword
"when i can savagely beat sheep while issuing ultimatums and torturing people, then i may go back into it" -vara nocturne
Not enough Evil...
I take it back NC SOFT is enough evil for anyone...
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Thank you. I don't get the design decision, but thank you.
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Originally Posted by Ms. Mesmer
Unless they're changed to zero Emp merits, they'll remain too high. We got 12 new Lore trees for free, why should these new trees be any different?
They aren't really more powerful. The Interfaces follow the Reactive formula, some minor effect plus a DoT component, but with damage types other than fire. The problem is that the psi and toxic DoTs are about half as strong, even though mobs in the level range where you can use them are at best neutral to those types of damage, with many being robots that have a very high resist to either. The Judgement one is thematically very cool for the Natural types, but doesn't seem to be any more powerful than the current ones. The Destiny one is highly gimmicky. The Alphas are more marginal in benefit than the current ones, pretty much across the board. Even if you already have each slot unlocked, you have to pay 15 Emp merits for each of these trees. They're basically making you pay to fit your concept better, if these trees do that for you. Edit: The unlock of these new trees is on top of unlocking the slot through iXP, which is still required for each slot as a whole. |
There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.
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...which is exactly what this thread it.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
These are still Beta numbers - they can be changed based on player feedback.
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Which is being listened to:|
Originally Posted by Xanatos
...which is exactly what this thread it.
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http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...63&postcount=1
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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play nice...we all know GG is a blatant supporter through and through, but she's hardly alone in liking Keyes.|
Originally Posted by elvnsword09
@Golden Girl, Hon, do you even hear yourself anymore, or do you blindly defend anything the Devs do? Keyes is not, and will not ever be "fun." The idea of a Superhero MMO is to make us feel like Superheroes... this violates that precept by putting in an unresistable damage type that both the Pulse and the AV use like it's a pop gun... Not Fun, even with the proposed changes to tone it down, Not Fun... Not in the least...
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Originally Posted by TamakiRevolution
I still love Keyes and I can see it being ran more often with the changes, even though I think they dumbed it down too much.
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I don't think anyone really hates the Underground Trial I just think it gets less play because you have to have the time available on line to play it. I have been on BAFs or Lambdas that were over in less than 30 minutes while the UG requires at the very least a solid hour. I enjoy it but I don't see people recruiting for it as often as BAF/LAM and I know it for that reason.. TIME
Keyes.. I agree with others who have commented here.. I have done 6 and 5 were successful and I still do NOT enjoy it. Even my strongest characters with maxed HP and defenses die during that thing and I refuse to even think about taking my squishies in there. I'm sorry I don't mind a challenge but in case the Devs, or anyone else, hasn't figured it out yet... No one enjoys spending more time face down on the floor or in the hospital waiting on that IDIOTIC door to let you back out. people come to PLAY a game not to play dead. And the claims that all you need are some good tier 3 inspirations are BS.. I went in with NOTHING but tier 3s on one occasion and before we had finished the second reactor I was in the hospital buying teir 1s to replace them cause they were all gone.
I am completely oppossed to the idea of eliminating Emp rewards from the BAF and LAM. There is still enough of a challenge there to justify the reward. And I seriously dislike the idea of paying for those new trees with emps... the excuse that they didn't think people would horde them or grind for so many so quick holds no weight at all.. Have you all been asleep the past few years and not seen players grinding through speed TFs for reward merits or finding ways to create AE stories that maximize the number of tickets earned. As soon as you crate a new form of game "currency" someone immediately starts working on ways to get as much of it as fast as they can. I don't have a huge amount on any character but the ones I have are being saved for one purpose.. to use when NEW powers emerge so I can get them quicker. So what do we get with this new issue.. Not new powers just more options for ones we already have and a propsed FEE to even open them. Then we are all supposed to grind more to get the threads and components we need to build our way up the tree again.. I have 19 incarnates now and all but 2 of them have either teir 3 or tier 4s in all 5 powers.. Yeah I REALLY want to start over and build my way back up to those levels for .. from what I saw weren't any better options than the ones we already have.
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looks like there's nothing to worry about BAF and Lambdas, Posi said the change to their rewards won't go live.
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Yeah. Because you repeating things to yourself over and over is definitely going to change the course of the game; righto. |
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
It'll get more play throughs as soon as I21.5 goes live
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Just like it does for your annual Malleus Badge Jihad, right? *nods* Right. That has worked well so far....
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| someone else: play nice...we all know GG is a blatant supporter through and through, but she's hardly alone in liking Keyes. |
Who is this elusive other creature who likes Keyes...?! Just kidding, but really.... Keyes is not a popular trial. A few here and there might enjoy it, but I really don't see this attempt to use a big stick to get the majority of the playerbase to run it as going to pay off, as in inducing people to farm it endlessly. Its just not a pleasant experience, and this game is here for us to have fun in. We can slog on regardless at jobs we get paid to do, in the real world.
*reads Ms Mezmer's post: I'm not spending 15 Empyrean merits to unlock stuff that lame.... LOL! Are they serious.... I am not sure I would go to the trouble of unlocking that stuff if it were for free!
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15 !! pretty grindy - no thanks.
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Originally Posted by AresSupreme
This is so annoying.
I heard a rumor that for the upcoming destiny, alpha, judgement, and interface, you have to spend 15 EMP merits to unlock them. I hate when no matter how much you play you still have to wait for things such as with the entire alignment system which I have completely ignored due to a near 4 day wait. We got lore without having to do anything more than the usual incarnates. And to add insult to injury BAF and LAM no longer award EMP merits after unlocking the current slots... It seems there is always a negative approach. Instead of doing something to make the other trials MORE desirable they do something to make BAF and LAM less desirable. Aye aye aye---make me a headache! Is there a way to transfer EMP merits across the account? |
I'd be tempted for the Martial Arts one...but my want it now complex won't allow that...
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You can't make that claim.
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Originally Posted by Mazey
They're not run constantly because they're fun
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My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
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You should expect that to change |
Originally Posted by Optimus_Dex
15 !! pretty grindy - no thanks.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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No, we really shouldn't. Not at this point. With this many bad decisions coming down the Incarnate pipe we have no reason to hope for the best, and no amount of your smilies will change that.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
You should expect that to change
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My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
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I'll consider running Keyes when the damage pulse goes away altogether. Nerfing it does not count in the least.
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Originally Posted by Bad_Influence
Just kidding, but really.... Keyes is not a popular trial. A few here and there might enjoy it, but I really don't see this attempt to use a big stick to get the majority of the playerbase to run it as going to pay off, as in inducing people to farm it endlessly. Its just not a pleasant experience, and this game is here for us to have fun in. We can slog on regardless at jobs we get paid to do, in the real world.
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Hell, I'll run it when my resists affect it. Having a /Elec Brute get knocked on his *** by what is essentially radioactive (Energy by game standard) damage with 90% energy resistance is just crap. The pulses also one-shot my Dom and Mastermind should I take ANY damage from mis-aligning Super Leap.
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Originally Posted by Black Zot
I'll consider running Keyes when the damage pulse goes away altogether. Nerfing it does not count in the least.
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My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
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well...considering they're axing the reward changes to Lambda and BAF, we can cross our fingers? please?
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Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim
No, we really shouldn't. Not at this point. With this many bad decisions coming down the Incarnate pipe we have no reason to hope for the best, and no amount of your smilies will change that.
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I'm sorry but I can't even muster up confidence of that level.|
Originally Posted by Mr. DJ
well...considering they're axing the reward changes to Lambda and BAF, we can cross our fingers? please?
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After the Empyrean removal from BAF/Lambda, after the "rare drop of Maelstrom's Pistols as a costume piece" in the TPN trial, and after the FREAKING FIFTEEN EMPYREAN MERITS PER ******* NEW ABILITY unlock that FOLLOWED ALL THE FREE NEW LORE PETS, I have no faith in the decisions made regarding the Incarnate System. At most I will be getting my Alpha for any new 50, as that has the most use (alongside Judgement) in non-Incarnate content. The rest is just fluff to me now.
My guides:Dark Melee/Dark Armor/Soul Mastery, Illusion Control/Kinetics/Primal Forces Mastery, Electric Armor
"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
If this 15 EMP merits goes live i'm taking a break...I usually am so anti-protesting but it's bad enough i'm a PVPer and get shafted there, so the bit of PVE I do and enjoy somewhat should at least cater to the players.
Based on player feedback, the 15 Empyrean merit unlock has now been scrapped:
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showp...7&postcount=98
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
we can has hope nao, Nalrok?
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Weird, it's fun to me. Guess fun is subjective eh?|
Originally Posted by elvnsword09
Well since the cats out of the bag I will weigh in.
@Golden Girl, Hon, do you even hear yourself anymore, or do you blindly defend anything the Devs do? Keyes is not, and will not ever be "fun." The idea of a Superhero MMO is to make us feel like Superheroes... this violates that precept by putting in an unresistable damage type that both the Pulse and the AV use like it's a pop gun... Not Fun, even with the proposed changes to tone it down, Not Fun... Not in the least... |
And as to the OP...I agree with everyone else; I don't see the point in having the new trees locked behind a 15 e-merit 'gate'.
Edit:
Oops, well after I see GG's link to Arbiter Hawk's post....this topic is now moot
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Still asking: no more iXP? It's not in the patch notes.
Okay, catching up. These are more powerful than the other ones, correct? Because if they're not, what's the point? Are they unlocked for all characters?
There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.