Farmer Doom says; "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!"
By
Aipaloovik,
Posted on: 2011-09-20 09:22 in Mission Architect
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...it already was enough. and (for the critters on my map at least) regen didnt increase anythings survivablity AT ALL. Granted, not giving minions a rez would have likely been good (i actually did that for a short while but people didnt like it)|
Originally Posted by Giant2005
Actually, from my testing it seems to increase both. We should have been doing this a long time ago.
Without the regen, one footstomp and one tick of a damage aura is enough to kill the minions, TTK has gone down significantly. |
Either way, im already working on testing and optimizing my map for these changes. I would not be suprised if we end up even faster.
Overall its not as fun as it used to be, but its not that much slower.
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm!"
-Al Gore
Fiery Aura is only good for farming, I'm cereal
@Caucasiafro
Meh, just slows it down a little bit. Still easy to level. I am much more annoyed with the people who keep whining that there are farmers in AE.
"NO....No clowns" - Positron
50s: Smasha (SS/SD Brute), House Rules (Mind/Thorn Dom), Wind of Mind (Illusion/Storm Controller), Coraxa (Kat/Inv Scrapper), Summer's Dream (Fortunata)
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It was my understanding that RMT farmers share accounts and have quotas to meet. This would preclude using the market to generate inf as the guy on the next shift could then yoink all your stuff and sell it toward his quota.|
Originally Posted by RemianenI
The people who think RMTers use AE as a primary means of inf generation don't know any RMTers (from ANY game) and/or are so naive as to believe AE is the single most profitable activity in CoH. It's not, by any stretch of the imagination. Go look at the ever escalating market value of purples and PvP IOs.
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I would honestly love to see some hard numbers as to how much inf has actually been sold by RMTers in the history of this game. I'm willing to bet it's a much smaller amount than the "RMTers are worse than farmers" crowd would like us to believe.
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Originally Posted by UberGuy
Uhh... they said this in what I considered the equivalent of 48-point, bright red font, way back in issue 14.
I say this as someone who has no issues with people farming the thing ... how could anyone have missed what they've said before? |
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Lot of farm hate here. The nerf doesn't really impact farming. You can still ticket cap in a short time and convert those tickets into market items. The only impact a ticket farmer is going to see is about 30-45 sec per run to cap.
The nerf is a huge hit to Power Leveling. There is a difference. This means double the time to 50.
As a farmer, I can live with this and the new marty system because they clearly don't care about ticket farmers anymore. As a PLer, I hate it cause its means we are basically back to the Old demon map speed.
over all. this should help the economy. The supply side will still be met from the ticket farmers and the demand will be reduced bye the reduction in quick 50s. In the end only the RMT and PL for pay people will really benefit from the nerf as people accustomed to the faster leveling times look to other options. We'll know soon enough if PL rates increase as demand goes up.
"If a system can be exploited, it will be exploited. And if a developer thinks their system cannot be exploited, it'll be exploited like a new actress in her first porn movie." Sanya Weather MMORPG Examiner
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If you wish farming in all its' various flavors to be removed from the AE ... remove the rewards. All of them. No tickets. No experience. No influence. No prestige. Nothing.|
Originally Posted by Lady_of_Ysgard
We can dream...
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And having done that, delete every published arc/mission from the database forcing a clean slate approach. That'll clear the backlog of broken, unused and unmaintained farms (and other missions that are also broken, unused and unmaintained) from the search.
Then you may make your stories without a AE farmer to trouble you ever again.
...
Not willing to go that far? Heh. Then the farmers and those being farmed will not go away. Some farm for tickets. Some farm for experience. Some farm for influence. Some farm for prestige. If you leave the rewards in, the AE will be used for its' rewards by someone.
Myself? I grind out tickets when I want recipes. Both for the recipes themselves and for the salvage to make them. The stuff I don't use/want gets tossed on the market for 6 inf (or simply sold to the vendor for the NPC prices if it doesn't sell within a few minutes). So long as you leave tickets in? I'm going to be grinding tickets. Remove the tickets? And I become remarkably less interested in using the AE (at all).
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Pretty much this. The only way to prevent the AE from being used as a farming tool is to completely remove all rewards from it, and frankly, I can't see them doing that. The fallout would be tremendous.
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Originally Posted by Sun_Runner
<snip>
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To this 4/4 beat, I'm in time with you. To this 4/4 beat, I would die for you. Your lovesick melody is going to get the best of me tonight, but you won't get to me 'cause I won't sing.
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I think it'd be hilarious. Not only would you have all of those people with dedicated farmers up in arms, but the ******** would change from "ebil farmers ruining our AE!" to "no one uses the AE!". The AE system would turn into yet another abandoned subsystem that only the diehard supporters even think about using. lolAE will be added to the same list as lolPVP.|
Originally Posted by Staccato
Pretty much this. The only way to prevent the AE from being used as a farming tool is to completely remove all rewards from it, and frankly, I can't see them doing that. The fallout would be tremendous.
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Totally should do it.
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I would agree, but I actually like using AE. :P
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Originally Posted by Sun_Runner
I think it'd be hilarious. Not only would you have all of those people with dedicated farmers up in arms, but the ******** would change from "ebil farmers ruining our AE!" to "no one uses the AE!". The AE system would turn into yet another abandoned subsystem that only the diehard supporters even think about using. lolAE will be added to the same list as lolPVP.
Totally should do it. |
To this 4/4 beat, I'm in time with you. To this 4/4 beat, I would die for you. Your lovesick melody is going to get the best of me tonight, but you won't get to me 'cause I won't sing.
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So do I. I use it to ticket farm, as stress relief and to make things for myself and my friends.|
Originally Posted by Staccato
I would agree, but I actually like using AE. :P
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The stress relief properties of smashing nine spawns of +4/x8, surrounded by so many enemies you can't even see your character except for the occasional FX flash from an area-effect ... is awesome. It always cheers me up. I'd continue to do that on occasion even without the rewards.
In the end, I hope they add a tag. The Farm Tag. So that farmers can find good farm missions and the storypeople can find the arcs they are interested in. Probably the best solution to this problem making everybody happy.
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That would make sense. Thereby, it isn't going to happen.|
Originally Posted by Gunbunny
In the end, I hope they add a tag. The Farm Tag. So that farmers can find good farm missions and the storypeople can find the arcs they are interested in. Probably the best solution to this problem making everybody happy.
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Besides, if they did that, it'd take the wind out of certain people's sails because they wouldn't be able to claim that "the ebil farmers are ruining the game" if the powers that be acknowledge the farmers in such a manner. Can't have that.
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We're already there.
| I think it'd be hilarious. Not only would you have all of those people with dedicated farmers up in arms, but the ******** would change from "ebil farmers ruining our AE!" to "no one uses the AE!". The AE system would turn into yet another abandoned subsystem that only the diehard supporters even think about using. lolAE will be added to the same list as lolPVP. |
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
I don't know..
The OP posted once and created 5 pages. I think he won.
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They've also, basically, said that it's inevitable that people are going to be doing it, and that they were alright with it once all of the bugs and exploits (I.E. Hami farm ban wave) were dealt with.|
Originally Posted by UberGuy
Uhh... they said this in what I considered the equivalent of 48-point, bright red font, way back in issue 14.
I say this as someone who has no issues with people farming the thing ... how could anyone have missed what they've said before? |
I'm talking about their recent statement that MARTy was not aimed at AE farming, or "any playstyle," in regards to exploitative and cheating behavior.
Their stance is that anything that goes beyond what they feel we should be getting is a cheat and/or an exploit, even if it's completely within the design to accomplish it.
This has already begun to encroach on non-farm territory and will continue to do so, and yet farmers will always be generating more inf and drops than those who do not wish to farm. Everybody should be angry about MARTy... we're all playing in the same pool here.
-Proud leader of Captain Planet's Magical Friends
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MARTy proves they would not have to do this at all, just make MARTy's AE brother with a much lower throttle. Most likely it would have almost no effect on running most story arcs.|
Originally Posted by Sun_Runner
If you wish farming in all its' various flavors to be removed from the AE ... remove the rewards. All of them. No tickets. No experience. No influence. No prestige. Nothing.
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It's not going to happen, though, for the same reason the devs have long since stopped talking about farming in AE. Someone above the dev team is perfectly happy with it.
Personally, I don't care about farming on AE, just give me a Story Arc tag so I can find non-farms. My only beef with farm writers is not them clogging up AE with farms, but them clogging up AE with 50 million versions of the exact same farm.
@Doctor Gemini
Arc #271637 - Welcome to M.A.G.I. - An alternative first story arc for magic origin heroes. At Hero Registration you heard the jokes about Azuria always losing things. When she loses the entire M.A.G.I. vault, you are chosen to find it.
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Maybe. If we are, its' only light rumblings that I've noticed.|
Originally Posted by Venture
We're already there.
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Originally Posted by plainguy
I don't know..
The OP posted once and created 5 pages. I think he won. |
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Originally Posted by Doctor_Gemini
MARTy proves they would not have to do this at all, just make MARTy's AE brother with a much lower throttle. Most likely it would have almost no effect on running most story arcs.
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| It's not going to happen, though, for the same reason the devs have long since stopped talking about farming in AE. Someone above the dev team is perfectly happy with it. |
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| Personally, I don't care about farming on AE, just give me a Story Arc tag so I can find non-farms. My only beef with farm writers is not them clogging up AE with farms, but them clogging up AE with 50 million versions of the exact same farm. |
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MARTy applies to a lot of things than the AE. If MARTy was too aggressive in clamping down on rewards, it would affect people who aren't explicitly trying to PL or farm, but who can come close to farmer/PLer reward rares, even if for a short time, thanks to the power we have available to our characters through IOs and Incarnates, and the access to critters available with I16's difficulty settings.|
Originally Posted by Virusman
They've also, basically, said that it's inevitable that people are going to be doing it, and that they were alright with it once all of the bugs and exploits (I.E. Hami farm ban wave) were dealt with.
I'm talking about their recent statement that MARTy was not aimed at AE farming, or "any playstyle," in regards to exploitative and cheating behavior. |
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| Their stance is that anything that goes beyond what they feel we should be getting is a cheat and/or an exploit, even if it's completely within the design to accomplish it. |
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| This has already begun to encroach on non-farm territory and will continue to do so |
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| Everybody should be angry about MARTy... we're all playing in the same pool here. |
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Agree with Bill. Farmers are from what I can see, directly responsible for the generally deflation in rare salvage. Stuff that used to be 2million+ is now pretty much always available for 1.5mil or less.
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Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
You only look at the negative.
Have you compared, say, Alchemical Silver now to what it was, oh, two weeks ago? I have. 2 weeks (ish) ago = 300,000 or so. Now = 25,000. Sometomes down to 10-15k. They may be "pumping INF into the system at an exorbitant rate," but others are pumping *supply* into the system as well. I know, because *I* do it when I'm trying to get stuff for crafting IOs for SGs. Need X and Y, dump W, Z, Q, B, and V onto the market in stacks. Repeatedly. And I don't need a specialized farm or farming character to do it. |
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
Reality check for the elitist people in the AE story writing community:
There is low demand for your stories.
If farms were removed, more people would not suddenly start playing your stories.
So chill out on the hate.
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If farms were removed, we could start trying to change public perception of AE from the current Monty Haul wonderland to a source of new content. Then, maybe, we might see more traffic.| If farms were removed, more people would not suddenly start playing your stories. |
If farms stay, there's no hope. Story arcs are lost in the noise and no one is even looking for them because they don't even think in those terms. This is why a "farm" or "story arc" tag is not going to help.
Current Blog Post: "Why I am an Atheist..."
"And I say now these kittens, they do not get trained/As we did in the days when Victoria reigned!" -- T. S. Eliot, "Gus, the Theatre Cat"
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I so want to do this now.
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Originally Posted by Venture
Because farmers have the same effect on AE as, say, a paintball match would have if held in the same room as the chess club.
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How do you know this? Have you spoken to everyone? Or is this just baseless conjecture?|
Originally Posted by Venture
...no one is even looking for them because they don't even think in those terms.
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Maybe no-one is looking because they're not interested in player-written storyarcs.
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I think this is quite a dream you are expressing here.|
Originally Posted by Venture
If farms were removed, we could start trying to change public perception of AE from the current Monty Haul wonderland to a source of new content. Then, maybe, we might see more traffic.
If farms stay, there's no hope. Story arcs are lost in the noise and no one is even looking for them because they don't even think in those terms. This is why a "farm" or "story arc" tag is not going to help. |
The truth is, of all the people I have ever played with in CoH, I only know of two that have bothered reading any of the content in the Dev created arcs. People just don't tend to care about the stories. I don't see what you can do that the Devs can't to make people care about yours.
People used to care about AE storyarcs. If you look at arcs created before mid-2009 (even the bad to mediocre ones), they typically have a lot of plays. Publish a story arc now and you're pretty much guaranteed to get zero plays unless you solicit plays aggressively... even if it's a great arc. Dev's choice or HOF is *it*.
That still doesn't prove that there's a demand for them *now*, mind. Xanatos may be right: that period in '09 was just a period of "shiny" until the AE experience grew stale.
Consider this, though -- a lot of people run the same content (typically "not-so-great" content, ie newspaper/radio missions; tips are better, but the repetition still applies) over and over. You can get the same rewards in AE while playing better content. Why not put the several thousand "good" story arcs* in AE to use instead?
-- Z.
* Yes, the big caveat is that you need to be able to find the good content amidst the thousands of abandoned experiments, broken farms, and just plain bad arcs. Blah blah Sturgeon's Law. If the search interface was overhauled (and maybe the rating system too), this could be possible via favorites lists, recommendations, etc.... this has been discussed a lot of times on these forums already.
Well, I think it is about time they did something to make farming less effective. Farming will always exist and I can live with that, but you can overdo things. It should not be much more effective then normal play if you ask me. But yes, for AE storytellers this is not the good news we were hoping for.
There will be new farms, optimised for the current rules. So we will see an increase in farms instead of a lessening.