Originally Posted by all_hell
![]() But Hami-Os still work for Preemies, yes?
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VIP to Premium IO question.
It is also important to note that while it is $2 a month (depending on final pricing) for an IO license it is NOT a subscription (for those people who have some special abhorrence for subscriptions. You would have to buy $15 worth of points (if that is lowest purchase you can make) and then you would have enough points for seven months worth of IOing (and you would also get a Reward token as well.)
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Also, don't forget that anyone currently posting on the boards (assuming the free trials have all run out) will have accumulated at least 400 points since July for having an active subscription; those points can be used for the IO license and the player won't have to pay *anything* for extra points for at least two months.
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Thanks you for starting this thread ClawsandEffect.
I also failed to notice this Flaming Gotcha for droping to Premium level.
I will admit that it is reasonable for the company to take this stance as they have always stated that content is balanced for SO built toons. Fair warning I suppose.
I had planned to let my second account drop to Premium permanently or until I get back to work someday. Now, since I missed the no IO access for Premium consequence, I have to totally rethink that strategy as the five level 50 toons I spent the last few months making and slotting out on that 2nd account ALL require their full IO builds to do what I want them to do. A second build using just SO's will be relatively usless.
I have a different service that I need to direct the money currently spent on the 2nd account to, and as it is for the safety of my wife over the road on her daily commute, it wins. To those of you who have budgets such that $2 a month is trivial, and who don't mind the annoyance of having to remember to buy a license every 30 days - gratz.
I am going to start a new thread asking for suggestions of AT type and Power set picks that function very well on pure SO builds.
i believe the word I want is OOPS,
Jak
Most if not any archetype and powerset combo will work just fine with SOs. We had people doing crazy stuff before IOs. It will simply not be possible tO crazily abuse the limits of what an archetype /can/ do versus what it was /meant/ to do.
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Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
And I want to point out that this, in part, is why you can unlock an empty slot (as I recall) over a used one for premium play.
Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
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Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
I'm sorry. I'm dense. I'm obtuse. I'm lazy. But where is this information found?
My understanding was that if you let your sub lapse and go to free to play you could no longer do certain parts of the game, like Praetoria and Incarnate stuff. How'd I miss this part about IOs being null and void? A level 50(+1) toon with a set of Oblits in burn would be like a level 50 with nothing in burn? I'm not enjoying that one bit. I've already paid for that stuff - (in WW). And my understanding is that Wentworth's is off limits, too. As soon as I confirm this, I'll respec that toon and get those IOs out, at least as many as I can. |
Basically it's an shiny dangled out infront of you to keep you subscribed and if you don't want to subscribe then to buy points every so often for the 30 day unlock.
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the premium player....is basically screwed. you get to keep those crappy vet rewards...woo hoo!, but pretty much after that you get squat!
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Oh right you aren't paying anything and you want what? Hahahahhahahahahahahaha.
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
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Okay, I'm not concerned for myself, since I'll have enough tokens for the global IO unlock on my account.
Still kind of sucks for the guys I got into the game. Not a big deal for the one guy, he rolled an Archery/Energy blaster. The other guy rolled a Claws/DA sccrapper and I hooked him up with a KB protection IO. Since he was planning on playing at Premium level from the get go, he's going to lose his KB protection as soon as his free month runs out. He can always take Acrobatics, but that's going to be yet another toggle in a set that will end up running 10 of them anyway.
I think I'll try to nudge him toward Willpower. Dark Armor is a good set, but it's not particularly beginner friendly.
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
The other guy rolled a Claws/DA sccrapper and I hooked him up with a KB protection IO.
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Yes, that totally sucks that your friend can play for free. *facepalm*
Since he was planning on playing at Premium level from the get go, he's going to lose his KB protection as soon as his free month runs out. He can always take Acrobatics, |
Okay, I'm not concerned for myself, since I'll have enough tokens for the global IO unlock on my account.
Still kind of sucks for the guys I got into the game. Not a big deal for the one guy, he rolled an Archery/Energy blaster. The other guy rolled a Claws/DA sccrapper and I hooked him up with a KB protection IO. Since he was planning on playing at Premium level from the get go, he's going to lose his KB protection as soon as his free month runs out. He can always take Acrobatics, but that's going to be yet another toggle in a set that will end up running 10 of them anyway. I think I'll try to nudge him toward Willpower. Dark Armor is a good set, but it's not particularly beginner friendly. |
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
List of Invention Guides
Yeah because it's actually a good idea for the devs to give away everything for free.
Look right now if you stop paying your subscription, you don't get to play at all. With i21, if you stop paying, you can still log in and use your second build for SOs. FOR FREE. Why should we really get more than that? |
My thought was that way if someone did have a license that expired, lets say because they fell onto hard times for the month financially, or something else outside of their control, and their IOs died, they could still keep the IOs in that build, instead of having to dump a lot of them because we only have so much non-slotted enhancement space, but switch to another one with SOs and keep playing effectively. A few months later, after the hard times have past, they can get their license again, and go back to their IO builds.
I would say that would work pretty well. Another option would be to just turn off the procs, globals, and set bonuses from IOs if you don't have a license to use them, but the base values for the IOs still apply. You don't get all the benefit, but its not as much of a shock still having some enhancement from the slotted ones.
Another option would be to just turn off the procs, globals, and set bonuses from IOs if you don't have a license to use them, but the base values for the IOs still apply. You don't get all the benefit, but its not as much of a shock still having some enhancement from the slotted ones.
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The problem with this is if you have a pure frankenslotted build, you *are* getting all the benefit, without having to sub or pay anything for access. If IO values remain exactly the same and don't grey out, you'll still be able to have 6 or 7 SOs' worth of enhancement in only 4-5 slots, a very definite advantage over an SO build.
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But I was merely trying to introduce a possible compromise option that still had the benefit for them paying for access, but also didn't completely screw over someone who did IO out their builds but then couldn't continue paying for it later on.
So maybe some kind of scaling down to give what SO values would be
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but also didn't completely screw over someone who did IO out their builds but then couldn't continue paying for it later on. |
I'm still having trouble seeing how folks feel getting to play for FREE is screwing someone over. If your top toon(s) have all of their builds filled with pricey IOs that you don't want to rip out and replace with SOs, play some other character that still has an extra build to spare.
Sheesh, this isn't hard, unless you're trying really hard to make it hard. You can also buy some of the Premium IOs that don't require a license. Or pay the measly two bucks a month for the IO license. I spent more than two bucks on a friggin' single serving of frozen yogurt just today. Jeebos Christos on a stick folks. I'd be a lot more sympathetic to your arguments if you could come up with something besides "playing for free is screwing me over."
Which would be extra work for the devs, to benefit customers who by definition aren't going to pay.
Whereas now you're completely screwed over if you can't pay because you can't play at all. I'm still having trouble seeing how folks feel getting to play for FREE is screwing someone over. If your top toon(s) have all of their builds filled with pricey IOs that you don't want to rip out and replace with SOs, play some other character that still has an extra build to spare. Sheesh, this isn't hard, unless you're trying really hard to make it hard. You can also buy some of the Premium IOs that don't require a license. Or pay the measly two bucks a month for the IO license. I spent more than two bucks on a friggin' single serving of frozen yogurt just today. Jeebos Christos on a stick folks. I'd be a lot more sympathetic to your arguments if you could come up with something besides "playing for free is screwing me over." |
Maybe it's because i live in what's considered a First World environment, but i spend more than $2 *a day* on beverages. Those who whinge about having to spend $2 *a month* to have access to IOs while playing CoX without spending anything more to play the game completely exasperate me. Especially since they're paying approximately 7.5 times that a month to play the game right now.
Anyway, $2 a month works out to under 7 cents a day. If you can't find a way to get an additional 7 cents a day in your budget then playing any computer games at all should probably be one of your lowest priorities.
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Exactly.
Maybe it's because i live in what's considered a First World environment, but i spend more than $2 *a day* on beverages. Those who whinge about having to spend $2 *a month* to have access to IOs while playing CoX without spending anything more to play the game completely exasperate me. Especially since they're paying approximately 7.5 times that a month to play the game right now. Anyway, $2 a month works out to under 7 cents a day. If you can't find a way to get an additional 7 cents a day in your budget then playing any computer games at all should probably be one of your lowest priorities. |
"Do you pay for things with cash?"
"Yes, sometimes."
"--You could put all of your change in a jar and probably have more than enough to make up for the $2/mo license...possibly even $4/mo for two licenses.
--What are you paying for your internet/tv/(possible phone) service?"
"About $120."
"And you pay that every month?"
"Yes."
"--You could drop even ONE of your services down a notch on the quality scale and more than make up for your monthly license fee.
--You could skip lunch at a restaurant ONCE and more than make up your monthly license fee for two, three, maybe even SIX MONTHS.
--You could buy store brand bread instead of name brand bread and make up your monthly license fee, possibly for several months, depending.
--There is NO REASON to be pancaking about a TWO DOLLAR monthly fee. Go check out Zimbabwe, where they live on less than ONE DOLLAR A DAY. THEN you can complain about a two dollar monthly fee."
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I think possibly some of us particapating in this discussion have lost sight of the core idea behind the F2P and Premium Status add-on to our existing model.
That foremost goal, as I undersatnd it, is to greatly expand our player base. The primary quality of the F2P experience and the Premium experience should be that they are serious FUN and create a desire in those new and returning players to have More Fun by becoming more deeply involved in CoH, eventually choosing to be VIPs. For players that need or want for whatever reason to be Premium only, there needs to be a solid Fun factor to fuel those micro transactions.
A secondary goal is to allow everyone, particularly Premium Players to spend as much or as little as they wish, when they wish, or to play completely for free at times if they wish, as that is the way a LOT of people prefer to manage their MMO experience.
The current implementation of the IO restriction is going to be really not-fun to returning players with existing Alt's with IO's and to currently subscribed players such as myself that, for money reasons, must fall back to Premium on an account for some unknowable period. I think that this Lack of Fun should be addressed. Completely new players will not miss what they never had and the utility of the IO system will be a nifty carrot to draw them on.
While it would not help my situation with my 2nd account, one of my SG Leaders had a suggestion that I think would make a lot of sense for maximising Fun for returning returning Vets and also for lot of people slipping back to Premium. It would put one of the funnest things in the game within a more reasonable investment level for new Premium players.
That would be to adjust the Vet Reward/Reward Token level where you gain permanent access to the Invention System to a lower tier, perhaps 5. This would more nearly match the Tier where you gain access to the Trading house/Auction House/Black Market. He suggested that since both Trading/Auction Houses and the Invention System were introduced in Issue 9 it would make a lot more sense if they became permanent at about the same level. Sounds like a good idea to me. I might even be able to eventually ooch my 2nd account up to Tier 5 as 13 tokens is a lot more do-able than 27.
Anyway, we all need to focus on the idea of Fun and put aside any dissappointment with the implementation as best we can. The Train is on the tracks and coming fast and we Have to jump on board or be flattened.
Jak
PS: And now for a little RANT.
As has been relentlessly repeated Premium Player status is a gift to those of us who are not going to keep an account fully subscribed. I am glad to recieve it and will treasure and enjoy it like a new puppy, even if it has a broken ear and limps a bit.
And I am glad that for most of you, $2.00 a month is a trivial amount of money. For my wife and myself $2.00 is the cost of some of our generic prescriptions. We forego any form of pay TV. We have the stupidest possible phones with the fewest possible minutes only so we can summon help if a car breaks down or there is a medical emergency. We do not rent movies, we do not go out to the movies, we do not go out to eat, we buy no liquor, no beer, no wine, and eat the cheapest food our individual special diets permit. The only time we get high is when we visit our primary care physcians who happen to have their offices right next to the local Broadcast TV antenna farm, which naturally is on the greatest elevation in the DFW metroplex. We are considering adopting out our pets since we can no longer afford the vets bills. This game is our only extravagance and we are now choosing to laspe the sub on one account, and diverting those funds elsewhere, because of the great generousity shown by Paragon and NCSoft in creating this new model.
For ANYONE on this or any forum to puff up or take to task some other poster because they are thrifty people who want as much as possible for as little as possible, all I can say is:
A) You demonstrate an utter lack of understanding of the basic rules of the marketplace and should probably relocate to a non-capitalist country, or play a game not based in a country that still has the for profit business model in use, however hamstrung that model has become. To review for your benefit: It is the job of the consumer to seek the best deal possible for themselves. It is the job of the merchant or service provider to get as much as possible from the consumer.
B) Are probably youthful and healthy with a shallow life experience.
C) Show a lack of compassion typical of so many of todays light thinking people.
D) Arrogate to yourself an astonishing presumtion in judging others financial desires or decisions with NO knowledge whatsoever of where their shoes pinch them, and
E) A just plain boorish lack of tact.
So if you are 'exasperated' with us 'cheapskates', I can only say that exasperation is a pallid corpse of a word for my reciprocal feeling towards you and all your ilk.
End of Rant.
That foremost goal, as I undersatnd it, is to greatly expand our player base. The primary quality of the F2P experience and the Premium experience should be that they are serious FUN and create a desire in those new and returning players to have More Fun by becoming more deeply involved in CoH, eventually choosing to be VIPs. For players that need or want for whatever reason to be Premium only, there needs to be a solid Fun factor to fuel those micro transactions.
A secondary goal is to allow everyone, particularly Premium Players to spend as much or as little as they wish, when they wish, or to play completely for free at times if they wish, as that is the way a LOT of people prefer to manage their MMO experience. |
While interesting those are not the reasons for the change of model. The primary reason it to dangle a shiny lure out to get people to try the game. And if they don't subscribe then to lure them into buying things anyway from the Paragon Store. That is the primary reason for the change of model. It is all about adding new VIP accounts not about attracting and keeping Free or Premium accounts. And thinking that way will cause you to bounce when you try to figure out why they do things.
That by the way is a dev stated goal. They are not keeping it a secret. The change is being made to make money. This is why deluxe features are not free to Premium players. The whole point of deluxe features like IO's, the market and the like is to dangle them infront of Premium and Free players and lure them into spending money.
Yes Premium is designed to let you play without spending money but they would prefer it if you spent lots of money with them. Possibly more than you would if you subscribed. That is the key to why premium. It isn't to offer as many features for free as they can. But instead to offer just enough that you want to pay for the features they didn't give you.
Oh and regarding the rant. Given that I have friends on very fixed incomes who still seem to find money to subscribe to a couple of MMO's, Netflix and couple of other thing and they take a fair number of prescriptions between them. I'm just not buying your rant.
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
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Oh and regarding the rant. Given that I have friends on very fixed incomes who still seem to find money to subscribe to a couple of MMO's, Netflix and couple of other thing and they take a fair number of prescriptions between them. I'm just not buying your rant.
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A secondary goal is to allow everyone, particularly Premium Players to spend as much or as little as they wish, when they wish, or to play completely for free at times if they wish, as that is the way a LOT of people prefer to manage their MMO experience.
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The devs primary goal is still to have subscribers, and provide an excellent game for them which will keep them subscribing. They also hope that those subscribers will drop a little extra cash in the store from time to time, as used to happen with Booster packs.
As a second best, if people won't or can't sub, then the devs will be happy to take their money on an a la carte basis. In order to encourage this, a wide variety of different parts of the game system have been parcelled out (some ATs, IO, AE, the AH, Praetoria) in the hope that one of them will be something that the player feels is so important to their game experience that they have to buy it.
It is not the intention of the devs to encourage a lot of people to play for free. They can if they want to, but the *goal* is to have everyone either subscribed, or picking up items from the store to enhance their Premium play experience.
From the devs point of view, it's a *good* thing that you have found something that you don't want to play without.
If you absolutely can't afford $2 a month...well, that's a shame. You'll either have to play without IOs, or not play at all -- which is one more option that you'd have pre-Freedom. But the devs are not in the business of giving everyone the game they want for free. Thank goodness. If you want examples of what happens to businesses with lots of customers and no way of getting revenue from them, you'll find plenty back in the dotcom boom.
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