Remove 'Participation' from ITrials

Do you understand that what you just described is exactly how the system works now?

From what I understood, there was one threshold for every component type, and depending on how high your participation was, you would qualify for one component type. Then, the reward is chosen randomly on a pool containing every reward that's under the threshold you qualified for.

For example, your participation is "medium", you qualify for Uncommon -> You have a chance to get threads, common or uncommon. Your participation is "excellent", you qualify for Very Rare -> You gave a chance to get threads, common, uncommon, rare, very rare.

If what I descibred is the current system, then the only problem I have is that it's not working, since some of my toons only get Rare+, and others only get Uncommon-.

I think this is the problem, though. I mean we all learned, as any well-trained rat would, that you just have to hit as many of your powers as you can as often as you can . . . even if you feel like they aren't doing anything. So essentially, the "key" to participation (and thus better reward tables) is to spam . . . everything. Even if it's not particularly helpful to the league.

What you want is the current system and it is working. As with all things, random is random.

Then why are people complaining?

Because people, in general, are horrible judges of random. Think about people playing tabletop games. You crit once, and you think that die is lucky, or you fumble once, and you won't put that die back in the pile lest it curse the others.

Basically, people are assuming that because they got the uncommon reward table a few times in a row, there's something besides the random chance going on. Never mind that they got a rare component dropped during the trial, which I believe are on the same random chances as the end of trial reward.

Originally Posted by Back Alley Brawler Did you just use "casual gamer" and "purpled-out warshade" in the same sentence?

Ok then, my bad. If the system I want is actually in game, and the last choice between all tables is purely random, I don't have any problem with the current system. Thanks a lot for the clarification Dechs and Fahx! Because I was really wrong with my understanding of the system.

Because they don't understand the word random.

AFAIK components do not drop during the trial. You can get components during the trial for earning the badges but not as random drops.

I was complaining because I get 10 threads a lot when I am actively participating. Oddly if i don't do as much (usually after I have gotten the 10 threads I get a why the **** bother attitude) I get a participation reward. So recently on a lambda when i actively participated in every aspect I got 10 threads. On the next trial (a baf i think) i didn't do much and got a rare. I was more angry at getting the rare because i felt i deserved 10 threads.

Unfortunately you aren't the only one. There's a lot of misleading and incorrect knowledge about the rewards floating around which ends up causing more problems than the system itself .

Eh, I say bull!
I've been on more than one Lambdaa where I've worked my **** off blasting away on my blaster and dropped less than a scrapper who I happen to be personal friends with... And, after the successful run, I got the Threads Table and the Scrapper qualified for the component table.
I participated in each part of the trial. I blasted away on Weapons Crates. I may have dropped only once during that phase and I hit several of them with my blasts.

So, whatever.
I do not believe it works correctly. It may work correctly for whatever parameters they set... but something is off.
It just seems like it is asking a binary system to gauge something that it is not capable of doing.

You know me. You know how I play.
After going through a Lambdaa run and getting only the Threads table for it... It's not a good vibe.


EDIT: I should make it clear...
If my individual participation was not worthy enough to earn the Component Table Roll, as it was to others within the League, despite the final success of the Trial... Then the system is stupid and I would prefer it be removed.
Either way, I don't think the system works for providing fun.

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Now for my thoughts on that.....

Just a guess of what can be causing the problem for many is what the devs are considering to be the goals of the trial may not be the what we expect.

If one of the goals is to blow up boxes and containers and all you do is clear a path for everyone and or heal/buff people to make it easier for everyone, according to the game, you did not participate because you did 0 damage to the containers.

If one of the goals is to use the acid on the walls and you didnt get any acid, then you had 0 participation for that goal.

If one of the goals is to keep the AV from being enraged and you gave all your grenades to the league leader, or didnt get any, or you killed him fast enough that you didnt need to use them, you did not participate in that goal.

If one of the goals is to break open the weapons delivery but no one needs to do that because all the acids have been used and there are plenty of grenades, there is not only 0 individual participation for that goal, there is no league participation either.

This is all pure speculation of course but it does seem to fit what peple are complaining about. So far in this thread I have not seen anyone that has had an issue with rewards on a BAF trial other than getting DC and getting 0 end reward, and that is a totally seperate issue.

My bots/traps MM is constantly clicking on his powers, summoning pets and traps whether is makes sense or not (because I tried only doing it when it made sense and kept getting 10 threads) and guess what I get? That's right, 10 threads.

So I've tried my primary, no luck there. I've tried my 2ndary, no luck there. I've tried not going into the Lab/Warehouse and just laying traps all around where Marauder is going to show up. And I've tried everything else I can think of. Know what I get for my trouble? I'll bet you can guess on the very first try! Starts with 10.....

My Storm Def was almost as bad until I started just acting like a blaster. Now I'm less effective, but I get my rewards.

If they are going to keep the participation metric it needs to be based on To Hit rolls. My pet and pseudopet To Hit rolls need to be credited to me. All the neat defensive powers (bubbles, shields, etc) all have To Hit rolls so everyone gets to participate. And everyone gets a reward for doing so.

I don't like the back of the bus, know what I mean?

I think you mean Anti-Monitor, lol. Been doing too much Praetorian content?

Unless you know something the developers don't, that is supposed to be unlikely.

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That sounds about right. Though I think it is more than a few in both cases!

I don't have a problem with people leeching getting what they deserve.

I DO!!! have a problem with my Defender getting stuck with 10 threads every time he runs a Lambda and is placed on the grenade team. If you're not a tank, scrapper or stalker on the grenade team you are in great big trouble, because you are going to get jack and ****, in that order. You'll get jack and **** because you're going to die every five seconds. And that's WITH INVISIBILITY. If you're not leading the charge on the grenade team, you ain't getting nothin' honey. Resign yourself.

My Defender isnt leading the charge because its stun-stun-stun-stun-stun-stun-stun-stun-stun and then a few more stuuuuuuuuuuuuuuns of 5 minutes' duration on top of that for good measure. Last time I took him on Lambda I literally had an entire tray of nothing but BFs.

From now on only melee people run Lambda, on my account. Sick of this. It sucks, almost as hard as that arbitrary 10-second timer on the hospital door sucks. WHAT IS THE POINT OF THAT if not to ensure that people can do less, thereby +chance to not get a reward? The whole mess is so infuriating.

I am sorry, I do not in any way,shape or form believe that every time you run a trial that everyone gets a Very Rare. Nope. Sorry. Don't believe it.

And if I did, it would only bear out the point others have made that there is something seriously wrong with how player performance is graded in these Trials, so once again has the opposite effect from what you intended. I find it laugh-out-loud funny that some seem to be stating that the 10 threads reward is "random." Uh, not hardly.

Sorry Voodoo but I have to agree with Tech. Exactly what do you consider participation? On any other TF or trial it would be me doing everything i could to help my team. Well that's what I do. Yesterday my Rad/Rad defender was in there attacking and debuffing every mob in the streets, the courtyard and as we took out the guns. I debuffed the Security Guard and followed my team into the warehouse to find grenades.

Just like Tech mentioned things started out fine. The team took out a few crates and I was right there attacking, healing and debuffing. THEN.. suddenly the entire team was just gone and as I tried to catch up .. I wound up in hospital. I RUSHED back as fast as I could and tried again. Managed to hook up with 2 other team mates and took out one more crate and started a second and.. Back to the hospital again. As i returned the second time all glowies on both side had been found and we started to work the final battle.

Trying to keep me team mates healed and all my buffs on Maurader i died again and hurried back as fast as possible. I was firing off attacks and debuffs as fast as I could until Maurader was defeated.

For my effort.. I got a common component. Did that trial 2 more times that day with pretty much the same results as far as deaths, etc. And never got anything better than a common... and on the final trial a guy that Dc'd and missed part of the search for nades and acids managed a RARE. Not only wasn't he contributing he wasn't even on the map but somehow the GAME decided his "Participation" was two levels of components better than mine?

I am not sitting by the door somewhere watching as others do the work. I am actively attacking, since all my attacks debuff, and using every debuff along with my heal from beginning to end. The SYSTEM rewards high damage, high HP and Good defenses while it punishes squishies that on ANY other TF or trial would be treated like a queen (or King). When i show up with my rad/rad for an STF, ITF or even a LGFT the general comment is "OH great we have a RAD." I did a BAD with her a while back and at one point I had a debuff on both Siege and Nightstar and was attacking each as their health levels fluctuated to keep them close. And my reward for all that... a common. I made out much better on the next one when I said to myself screw the AVs and concentrated my attcks on the ADDs. At the time I was TRYING to open slots and of course the league leader kept throwing me on a team he planned to use against the AVs so I could DEBUFF.

Oh and while we are here complaining that STUPID door at the hospital doesn't help matters either. I die.. I tp as fast as possible to the hospital so I can get back into action and then.. "DOOR WILL OPEN NEXT IN 20 SECONDS" So while I am standing there helplessly for almost half a minute the other members of the team are fighting. I am in TIME OUT... Basically its like saying "Oh well you were a bad girl. you died so you stand here and think about what you did for a while and then i will let you rejoin your playmates." I didn't like it when I saw it on beta and i like it even less now.

These trials are just another type of mission we do.. They are not the Holy grail and certainly not without faults and problems that should be looked at and fixed. Maybe I should hold back? Maybe if I don't die and can stay out there battling but at a nice safe distance I will do better... Gee there's a great attitude isn't it? Now translate that to an STF before everyone had a level shift and 3 to 4 more powers including a mini nuke. If I wasn't face to face with the Av debuffing and attacking the leader would want to know what my problem was but on a Lambda maybe its better to hold back and just stay alive. Fire off my AoEs so i damage as many things as possible and maybe I can get an uncommon or a rare.


I'm sorry but I don't I CAN'T play that way. If I join a team, any team, I go all out from beginning to end. If I die I die but I promise i will take as many of the bad guys as i can with me and I will come back for more OVER AND OVER.. If that isn't participating then someone needs to contact Websters and change the definition.

If you qualify for anything better than 10 threads, the reward table is random. If you are getting to tier 3 and not getting very rares it is probably because they are very rare and you upset the RNG gods somehow.

The game does not decide that those with higher participation scores get better loot. If you dont get the 10 thread reward, you get a random table reward. Commons and uncommons are for some reason more common than rares and very rare rewards are .... well um ... very rare. So if you are getting something other than 10 threads the GAME has decided your participation is enough to not give you the booby prize. What you get from there is random.