Multi-group content is not the way.

My only REAL problem with the multi-group content for the Incarnate stuff (apart from the WoWism of it all), is that really, TWO trials? That you have to repeat again and again and again to get your shineys?

It makes absolutely NO sense, story wise, whatsoever, to repeat the same mission again and again, ad nauseum. It's the continual ignoring of making the game story make any sense that grinds my gears more than anything else.

They need to either give us way more trials to run for our incarnate progression, or they need to expand the areas where incarnate rewards are granted (ie, ALL level 50 content should give drops for all types of incarnate slots.)

Oh, and as for the "IT'S WAR!" comments earlier. Until we actually SEE this "war" in the general zones, I can't consider it as actually happening in Primal Earth. Kings and Steel aren't heavily damaged from Praetorian invaders, so those missions must be on some other Earth that we're helping out.

Seriously Sam I honestly think it's probably time you took a break from the game, you REALLY don't seem to be enjoying yourself, like, at all.

You've gone from someone I actually enjoy reading posts by and slowly turning into someone that does nothing but moan all the time.

You've had some REALLY terrible teams if you can walk away from them and nobody notice you hadn't gone even in the same kind of "where the hell is he, has something happened to him?" if you just upped and left with no word.

As Claws pointed out above, if you don't need anything from other players then why give a crap about if they know you're there or not, that seems a bit, backtofront if you don't mind me saying so.

Perhaps it's because I'm use to playing DPS in WoW that I've never had the 'I need to feel needed' thing going on, I've ALWAYS know there were 20 other people fighting for my spot, especially in the unloved red headed stepchild class of Hunter.

You know what I did to make myself a better applicant than the 20 other dudes fighting for my place?

I brought my A game, I learnt shot rotations, begun theory crafting, researched on what was the best upgrade, turned up for raids. I EARNED my place as DPS in those raids because I had to.

This is probably where our mentality differs, rather than have someone say 'awesome DPS!' myself and my fellow DPSers were the unsung heroes.

We're the guys who deal the damage, watch threat to make sure we don't pull aggro and know enough to let the tanks and healers get us through the fight without them having to worry about us. You don't pull the DPS, everybody fails the boss, you do what you need to do, nobody says 'great DPS' it's simply 'great work guys!'.

In CoH, my Incarnate is a Tank, I am there, I am the meatshield, even if it means being held by Siege and Nightstars 5000 mag holds, if they're still aiming at me, I'm doing my job.

In the same situation, if you Tank badly, everybody knows about it, if you Tank well, nobody will say 'great tanking' you've simply done your job.

Like I said, coming from a WoW background, where everything is a team effort and rarely having an individual celebrated over the group.

It's nice to be told you're wanted, it's better to have the confidence to know you're needed.

Though saying that, one of my proudest achievements was completing what would be the equivilent of an Incarnate solo path, the Hunter epic quest in Vanilla WoW for the legendary bow, Rohk'delar.

You could do these quests only on you're own, not even a pet to help you. Those quests were ruddy hard, one involved fighting in melee and learning how to trap and scatter shot a second mob. The second involved a 5 minute long kite with perfect timing. The third required knowing when to use your abilities and how to joust with wing clip. The fourth and final challenge required use of AoE's. Everything a hunter needed to know and be at the top of their game with.

Completeing that, getting my bow, quiver and staff, it made me feel awesometastic.

Now if Incarnate Solo content could make me feel like that, it would be amazing.

Sadly those quests were tailored specifically for one class and I don't think they're going to do one for every single AT in the same vein as those but if it just replicate that feeling of "yes, I am that awesome, I earned being that awesome" then it would be glorious.

Now off to bed!

I feel awesome if people are excited when I join the team, for whatever reason. So far it's getting there.

I like Group content. Honestly if I wanted to play on my own I wouldn't choose CoH to do it. MMO's just aren't very good single player games, but they're great for finding other people to play with. The whole point for me is to have fun with some other people, make some bad jokes, get enthusiastic about downing the bosses or whatever and generally have a laugh.

Now I realise it's not for everyone. But what is? I don't like Single Player Content. I don't do it and have no real interest in it. I'd rather Duo single player content and take an XP hit than do it alone. I join PvP servers on other games because it forces people to stick together, so I get more teaming in. Heck my favourite game ever was Planetside because of it's teaming, which I'll resist the urge to wax on about like an old man remembering the good old days. I like to see the world react to me or a story unfold if I'm playing on my own and MMO's are a terrible system for this as they're, by thier very nature, fairly static.

Going Rogue wasn't bad for Single Player focus but it was hardly excellent either.

'The game doesn't make me feel special' is just so nebulous it's not really a complaint. The NPC's complimenting me doesn't really make me feel like a badass no matter how hard they try, but other players being happy to see me join a group does!

I like to spread it about a bit too, if people did a good job leading the raid I'll give credit where it's due, if someone caught my eye as doing something 'neat' or even just has a cool looking character I'll mention it. It usually loosens people up a bit and makes it all the more fun as people start to talk and give the recognition to each other that the game simply can't emulate.

But to address the original point? Yeah, don't tie progression to Raid Content. Just because I don't like Solo play, doesn't mean I want them to miss out.

I should probably have done a multi-quote, but I was in a rush for a class... That didn't take place. Only two people of a 20-something group showed up and that doesn't make for a good class. For anything I haven't addressed here, check my previous post. It's likely addressed there.

Still a couple of things I want to comment on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano Seriously Sam I honestly think it's probably time you took a break from the game, you REALLY don't seem to be enjoying yourself, like, at all.

I'm more not having fun on the forums, to be honest, which is why I give that impression. I'm also the kind of guy who ******* about what he hates, but doesn't tend to focus much on what I like. Contrary to that impression, I'm actually having a LOT of fun in the game. Just... Not with Incarnates.

I rerolled a level 50 Fire/Fire/Flame/Incarnate Blaster into a Fire/Fire Scrapper (for reasons I've gone on about before) and got her to level 36 before I even knew what had happened. LOVE the combo, and she's one of my favourite characters, too. One half of my Tale of Two Hearts (available somewhere in the RP forum if anyone cares about an 85 page story ), so getting to play get again without hating myself for playing a Blaster was a nice experience. I thoroughly enjoyed it, and in fact forced myself to stop playing her so I could leave on a positive note and have better memories of her in the future.

I've spent the last couple of days doing an almost complete respec of my level 38 Dark/Dark Scrapper, I redid all of his costumes, I changed up his concept and rewrote his bio from scratch, so basically I changed everything I could change without paying money. Right now, thanks to the weight of changes accumulated over the six years since I last played him, he's awesome. I LOOOVE playing him, and managed to get him from 38 to 40 in a couple of days, thanks to Zamuel's Admiral Stutter TF. He lacks much of any AoE, but he's just evil in combat, between Soul Drain and Oppressive Gloom. It's almost unfair. And he looks awesome. And after I ran his concept through the Vulpish one, we managed to craft an amazing story together. So I'm really happy with the character.

I'm pretty sure my Scrapper will hold me over until the Vanguard pack, when I have a couple of level 40-ish Blasters to remake into using Vanguard Longswords and Vanguard Claws, as well as a 46 Dual Blades Scrapper to get to 50 if I can get her better weapons. So I have things to do for the foreseeable future. I'm not done with the game. I'm still having fun. It's just... People's attitudes and ugly dismissals just rub me the wrong way. If I'd had the good mind to ignore the Evil Geko right from the start, I might not have gotten as bitter, but that's one lesson learned. Truth be told, I'm getting close to doing the same to Claws, as well, since he seems to be determined to show me as a hypocrite or some such, and there are only so many times I can clarify what I mean when words get put into my mouth before I lose patience, but I'm not quite there yet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr_Mechano You know what I did to make myself a better applicant than the 20 other dudes fighting for my place? I brought my A game, I learnt shot rotations, begun theory crafting, researched on what was the best upgrade, turned up for raids. I EARNED my place as DPS in those raids because I had to. This is probably where our mentality differs, rather than have someone say 'awesome DPS!' myself and my fellow DPSers were the unsung heroes.

Yes, very likely. The reason I keep going on about not being a competitive person always feeds back into this: Failure and insufficiency does not motivate me to try harder and work more, it motivates me to not bother and try something else. I don't claim that this makes me a great member of the human race, but it is what it is. However, it does get a bit disappointing when I can't eat my cake and have it too even in make-pretend fictional worlds that I even pay to be part of. And that's not to say that "I pay $15, do what I want now!" so much as to say that I am willing to pay for a fantasy that I don't have to "work" for. I don't need other people's recognition, I don't need to confirm my worth as a human being. I just want a fantasy where good things happen to me because "I'm the hero! This is my story!" Pretty much the same reason I watch movies and read books.

As the brothel owner in DA2 said: "And for 50 silver, someone pretends to like you for an hour." I'd go for that.

The reason I complain as much as I do is because I worry about the state of quality in the game. Now more than ever. And while I have no problem with people who like the game still - hell, I DO TOO - it just ticks me off how fast I fell from "fanboy" to "troll" status for the simple fact that I stopped singing the game's praises even in the face of obvious faults and began criticising it even in the face of obvious perks. I know the few "I'm glad you like it but I don't." posts were in response to posts saying things to the effect of "Well, I like it, therefore there is no problem."

Again - I don't want to take people's game away from them. Goodness no! I just want us all to have a bit more objectivity in these discussions and see past our own noses and, more than anything else, to stop the ad hominem "well, there's something wrong with your head, which is why you don't like this" arguments. These help no-one, because they come down to an argument for why another person should be ignored and not matter. And I can count at least three instances when that has been done to me. It tends to grow old.

This doesn't have to be a war, but it can't be peace if that just means some of us simply don't matter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arcanaville Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

don t worry Moo i m sure after most ppl get all the new sloted T4 or what not 8 man team could run bafs and as for lam i ve alrdy done it with only 4 ppl and it wasn t to hard

Well I gave it a shot.

I'm not really trying to be a dick. I just disagree with the notion that every single player has to feel special at all times in the game.

Even in the case of 8 blasters wailing away on an AV like Siege or Nightstar. You're not really seeing a huge contribution from any particular one of them, but their presence as a group is going to make that fight significantly easier. They may not SEEM important, but when that timer starts getting low you'll be glad they were there. If all those blasters suddenly quit, you might find that you're going to run out of time before you can kill him. Was one person any more important or special than another? No, but they ALL contributed.

And to address an earlier point: How do you KNOW that team would get along just fine without you? Once you're no longer on the team you have no real way of knowing whether they kept trucking along or if they started struggling due to your absence.