A quick advice in dealing with uncooperative teammates.

I find it amusing that the the OP is getting what they mentioned in the subject line, rather than dispensing it.

To me, there is the basic respect I'm going to extend to another human being, and then the respect someone earns from me.

The first covers people I have not met before. I'm not going to let a door slam in your face, etc. I'll use the basic manners I was taught to have and treat you like a human being that is no better or worse than I am.

If you want respect as a leader, or something beyond the first, that is something which has to be earned.

As it relates to the original post, After joining the team, I'd go to the mission and whatnot no problem. "Lets wait for everyone?", OK. Spouting silly things like "SPAM YOUR BEST ATTACKS" and generally micromanaging how you want me to play would not earn my respect, and I'd probably poke back with sarcasm as "Jerk #1" (I like him) did, to see how you react. If you take it poorly, it probably means you were serious and I'm going to file you in the tool catagory pretty quick. The only reason I'm going to stick around then is for the laughs.

Basically, if you think forming a PUG team in an MMO makes you a winner and people should follow your every micromanagement whim, you should take a step back and think about what you are really doing. How important it is in the grand scheme of things? There are people on the other side, just out to have some fun and leave their problems behind. And they could well know the game as well as, or better than you. If you treat them like an NPC or idiots, or think you are better than them because you have the star, I don't think you even deserve to lead a team, as little of a responsibility as that is.

Now, you see, I would say that for me, anyone I meet for the first time has the right for me to be respectful of them (which is not to say that I do respect them, just that my behaviours towards them are at my "default" setting).

This entitles them to politeness and consideration.

Their behaviour thereafter directly affects whether they gain or lose my respect. As others have said, I don't have a checklist, it's an automatic process.

So, I'd say that yes, respect is earned (or lost), I don't automatically respect anyone, but my default behaviour should be respectfulness.

And it's worth me pointing out that respectfulness is an attitude and behaviour, whereas respect is an emotional investment in the individual. They are two very different things.

I only actually looked at this thread because I saw someone post in it I know.

ViKtoricus, I have thought you made nice, somewhat insightful posts about this game as a new-ish player here. As such, I am rather startled to see you describe that you act this way, and then feel it was justified.

If I saw someone act like you described yourself doing, and I thought they were serious (as you apparently were), I would happily note that person as the **** here, and gladly never have anything to do with them again if I could help it.

Being the team leader in a video game doesn't give you the kind of personal authority over people you seem to think it does. Yes, you can kick them at your whim, with or without justification, because the game software has no way to judge intent behind or validity of such action. That doesn't mean it's justified or appropriate. You reap what you sow, and you acted in an irritating way. You should be surprised not at all when you get negative response from others for doing so.

As to the matter of "respect being earned", as Quat said, there are levels. There is "I respect you as a person" and "I respect you as a leader". The former is automatic, the latter has to be earned. I'm not going to listen to someone order me how to do something I already know how to do well (like play this game) unless I think there's a very good reason to listen to them - such as my knowing they too are very experienced and may well know something I don't. That's what I think of as earned respect in this context.

Moving on to a slightly different point raised in the OP, the order:

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViKtoricus SPAM THE MOBS WITH YOUR BEST ATTACKS.

is almost completely insane.

Let's look at my Eng/Eng blaster's three possible "best" attacks for a moment (I'm not in-game so I'm not looking at the actual numbers here).

Power Bolt. Low on damage, but recharges damn fast.
Power Burst. Nice damage, but takes several seconds to recharge.
Nova. Insane damage, takes an age to recharge, and that End drain is a pain at the wrong time.

Which one of these three should I be spamming?

The real answer is "none of the above". I should be hurling out an attack chain.

It gets even worse if I consider that order from the perspective of my Rad/Psi defender. Rather than dropping the awesome debuffs, healing, firing off Accelerate Metabolism, rezzing fallen comrades... I should be using my frankly feeble (compared to say a scrapper or blaster) attacks?

No. No, no, no, no, no.

My wife would laugh at me if I asked her to "spam the mobs with her best attacks" on her Earth/Kin 'troller. In fact, she'd probably turn around and whack me round the head. Her contributions when we duo are (firstly) holds, immobs, slows. Followed rapidly by enemy debuffs, with team and self-buffs coming in a close third. She sometimes complains to me that she feels useless, standing around doing "nothing" while I'm ripping through enemy groups like a chainsaw through bubblewrap. My normal response is "BWUH? Without you, they'd have slaughtered me. You might not have killed many of them, but you sure as heck helped. A lot!"

So, just adding my weight to people questioning that as an instruction, because it's a poor one, except, perhaps, on an all Scrapper/Blaster team.

I have to join in this side-tangent...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Days_ I know this is totally at a tangent, but I am not convinced that this particular belief is so wrong. I used to be of the opinion that respect had to be earned until someone pointed out something very simple. The idea that your respect is so valuable that other people have to earn it suggests two things. One; that you think a great deal of yourself and Two; that other people should respect you instantly in order to want to gain your respect. In my opinion respect should be a given. Yes, it is very easily lost and very hard to win back but to think less of someone because they haven't yet proven something to you seems rather... disrespectful?

I agree completely!

Quote:

Originally Posted by sleestack Just wanted to say, Days, that I agree with your position on respect. When meeting someone for the first time, I treat them respectfully (i.e., politely, etc.), and how they respond thereafter influences either loss of respect, maintaining "default" level of respect or gaining more. Now this is an intuitive process; I don't have some explicit checklist 'o respect or anything. But basically my default setting is you get my respect, until you prove to me that you do not deserve it. To people who say "I have no respect for you until you earn it" I say, "Thanks for letting me know that. I now have no interest in earning your oh-so-precious respect. Keep it, because you've just shown me that you don't deserve the respect I've already extended to you."

Exactly!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quasadu Same here. I don't subscribe to "respect is earned, not given." I subscribe to "respect is given. Disrespect is earned."

I was going to say the exact same thing! Disrespect is earned!

Others chimed in with some nice contributions to that tanget and represented pretty much what I was going to say.

Still, Claws, I totally understand what you were saying and, yes, I believe it was more a matter of semantics (which is what I think Days was trying to explain to you earlier).
All good. And yeah... there are certain facets that require that level of respect to be earned.
To me, it is somewhat along the longs of... "Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none".

It was a general lack of experience on my part and I think I could have handled the situation alot better.

One of the things that stands out in this thread is my contention that Email, Texting and the like are dangerous ways to communicate, due to how easy it is to misconstrue what is being said due to lack of facial expression, tone of voice, etc.

"Wait" is a good example. Is it a condescending command or the best warning that can be typed in a dangerous situation? Oh, how many times have my last words been "Look out SSSSEEEEAAAAAWWWSSSSSS" due to events unfolding too rapidly? Likewise, explaining in detail what you want someone else to do is fraught with peril-- it can really be off-putting for the reasons noted.

I assume Good Intentions from all on a team until explicitly disabused of such a notion. I try to treat everyone the way I would like and allow for mistakes to be made.

I also allow that the Leader's preference gets great weight. But if you really disagree with the Leader, the better solution is to depart on more or less still friendly terms than have a donnybrook over it. If the leader is a Tank and wants to herd and you do not, do not let things escalate to hostilities--for goodness' sake, tip your hat, depart politely and grab another team. Life is too short and the game is too trivial in the Grand Scheme.

For me, it is always interesting to see how a particular mix of players with particular powers approaches the various challenges the game provides. Sometimes it really IS a good idea to let the Grav Controller snatch the baddies out into the hall with Wormhole, because of the 30,000 Nemesis Snipers in the platform room. Sometimes a snipe and a pull is best. Sometimes the Tank can actually wade in, grab aggro and still make it out alive, much to my surprise. I like that aspect of things.

So be wary of the written word. It may not mean what you think itSSSSSSSSSSSEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWSSSSSSSSSSSS SSSSS

Harsh my ***, the moment team member starts giving you lip you replace them. lol

OP, being a team leader in this game only means that you put the team together. Micromanagement isn't part of the equation, unless of course a member of the team is doing something extremely stupid. At that point, I doubt you'd even have to speak up anyways because surely someone else will. The only situation where you actually have to stand out and give step by step instruction is if no one else in the group knows the mission/content. That type of situation is extremely rare (except for new issues) given the vast amount of veterans that have been playing this game for years.

SPAM THE MOBS WITH YOUR BEST ATTACKS.

haha its not FF

ViKtoricus is really great entertainment
im looking forward to reading your future posts
have fun vik

*edited to add

ok ill bite the bait

just this once

many people in this game due to its age know what they can handle and what they cant
sometimes you can persuade them to push the boundaries but you will get a "i told you so" when you wipe
not that debt has any meaning here

i will also add that you need to becareful with people they will global ignore you and your pool of teams will grow smaller as no one will see your requests

The fact that you think that respect is automagically a given shows who is in the wrong here. It was you. You need to rethink your worldview.

It dawns on me the OP may have been an April fool's joke.