Thoughts on the difficulty of STF and LRSF

A friend logged in yesterday and asked what was going on in a private channel. I responded 'Lots of people on STF that have no business on STF.'

It occurred later that it was a really awful thing to say. Everyone who plays the game has payed for the right to attempt and try to learn how to overcome any one of the challenges it presents. 'Keyed' content are one of the most obnoxious game mechanics I've ever encountered in an MMO. Not only does it restrict what a player can do in the game, but it lends itself to abuse and elitism.

Even the Cimerora key is pretty obnoxious despite being soloable simply because it locks out the intrepid explorers.

However, there is a real difference between 'accessible' and 'completable'. Statesman's Taskforce is one of the most difficult challenges in the game. If you don't go at it a certain way and hold your head just right the whole time, you'll be made to regret it.

This is at a real difference to most of the rest of the game. Well-constructed teams help during the other 45-50 TFs, but you're not going to suffer if you decide to switch out a rad for a kin or vice versa.

Most of the rest of the game's content is presented as 'You should be able to do this.' The LRSF and STF are not in that category. They're designed to be extremely difficult challenges for dedicated players. However, aside from one or two loading-screen tips, there's very little in-game information to inform players of this.

Because the STF and LRSF were this week's Strike Targets, it meant that a lot of people who'd planned to solo their entire incarnate career were suddenly trying to work their way onto a taskforce, frequently for the first time. The fact that this was the most difficult taskforce in the game made the situation particularly painful. Some of them turned out to be really good teammates. I met quite a few people that I told I'd like to group with them again.

I also saw a lot of people who tried to get on a taskforce, get confused, frustrated, and discouraged. They were suddenly cast out of 'You should be able to do this' and into 'You may not be able to do this at all.'

Dr. K and Barracuda would have been kinder choices for the first WTF target, but the underlying problem here is that there's never been a very clear way to determine the difficulty of an in-game challenge ahead of time. Players trying to 'get into taskforces' just for the sake of obtaining the new reward should have been told ahead of time, in big, easy-to-read letters, "Hey, this taskforce is a BEAR. It's one of the most difficult taskforces in the game. If you're just learning about taskforces, you might want to wait a week or two until the Strike Target is not quite so difficult."


I recommend a color-coded difficulty system that's shown whenever you talk to a TF contact.

Blue: Beginner Challenge (New Posi 1, New Posi 2, Synapse, First respec)
White: Moderate Challenge (SPTF -- Numina's TF, respecs)
Yellow: Difficult Challenge (Shard TFs. LGTF)
Orange: Very Difficult Chllange (ITF. Dr. Khan. Barracuda)
Red: Extreme Challenge (LRSF, STF)
Purple: Prerequisites required (Tin Mage, Apex)

Most of the STF is doable if you know what you're doing.

Those who were working into the taskforce for the first time need merely to mention it at the start and an old hand at the taskforce would explain what they needed to do as they went along.

Though all but the Thorn Tree, Ghost Widow, Sirocco (who merely requires the squishies standing further back than normal to avoid his killer AoE) and Lord Recluse are your standard Tanky Spanky fights.

I dunno Katie,


thats great, and so was Moos, but it doesnt take into consideration the time taken, and then your still stuck asking others how long it may take, and then you may as well ask others how hard it is.

I personally found the STF to be very challenging when it was put in, many many failed attempts, now that others have fallen into sensible play on it, and good strategy its fun, but I did find it as a casual and fairly numbers ignorant person at the time, to be frustrating.

I have to say I have been very glad over the last few days people have been willing to include my MM, I was worried about her, but I hope my team mates could say over the last few days shes always been useful and not a problem.

The trouble with all TFs, but specifically this TF is that its all backended difficulty. You do a series of relatively easy missions and take down an AV in the end, TF done.

STF is pretty samey, you do a mission and fight a relatively easy AV, and then you fight 4 more in the next mission, and by now you know you've got a problem as they are just so darned easy, if your wiping to them, you could just give up, but chances are your tank may die to the second AV, who does psi damage, but you'll probably be fine.

And through the next, and even the next mission is pretty easy, except for the impossible t defeat it unless you got someone sensible and still connected to use the temp power on the AV. (on a tangent, very annoying to have to give up because someone DCd and they had the temp)

Then you get to the last mission, and you have 3 of the toughest AVs (and 1 pretty easy on) stood next to eachother, they like to come in packs and can do some pretty mean things.

Ghost widow can hold your tank with a mag 100 hold, that requires either some stacked buffing, or alot of breakfrees. Heals herself off melee range (yay broken MM pets) and is a bit of a cow. Now her combat buddy is a guy who charges in with pseudopets that your severely held tank cant get the agro off and they go round throwing squiches int the air hapless abbandon.

It can be pretty tough. Your team could be happily strolling along on the easiest of MO runs, and then literally stop dead and be completely unable to finish, its a bit of a pain in the butt!


Thats generally why I like the slide form AV fights being the hammering down on their HP while they use their trick every so often to being a bit more of an actual challenge.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VoodooGirl [*]Watching out for the Spinning Disco Portal of D00M!*

More often than not I'll take an MM due to both the obscene amount of firepower they can kick out (Thugs/Poison, Thugs/Traps and Thugs/Dark or Bots/Poison, Bots/Traps and Bots/Dark can solo an AV one on one with only a little IO usage) along with the debuffs/buffs they bring.

Reminds me, wouldn't mind doing an All Mastermind LRSF/STF.

I did the LRSF last night,I will admit that at first I had trouble keeping up with the team and found myself lagging behind,I soon got up to speed tho and kept with the team.The hardest part of it was the last mish where you have all the AV,s under the Atlas statue,I would rate this one and the STF about a hard as each other,but with a team that has an idea what they are doing both are fun,my thanks to Bris for inviting me

I got invited onto a STF team with my WP/SS tanker

After the leader accepted the TF, they told me that there was no way my tank could survive the TF, but they'd allow the team to vote on whether I'd be kicked or not. Quit as fast as I could

After quitting the TF, I sent the leader a tell to let them know the tank already had the Saved the World badge. Had obviously survived the TF. And that it was their damned loss

Elitism is an ugly thing

Phone makes selective quoting impossible so just pretend I'm quoting the part in Mega_Jamie's post about the patrons.
Of the stfs I have failed this week not one of them was due to the patrons. In every case our aggro holder (illusionist or tank) wasn't able to keep LR off of us. I understand exactly what I'm supposed to do but without a competent meat shield LR instagibs everyone.

Then we come to what was at one time one of my favorite sfs: rsf. I seem to have lost the knack for this as none of my fights have been the cakewalk I remember. On two of the succesful ones we had to resort to the good old globe pull.

I like the challenge but due to the pain in the butt of pug teams failing multiple times I've already reevaluated just which of my toons really needs a very rare.

I'm not sure if there was a point I was trying to make when I started this but whatever it was I've already forgotten...