Speed boost usage

I'm looking at and liking a build I have for a kinetics/archery defender (or corruptor). I played the defender version up to level 12 and learned very quickly that I really do not enjoy maintaining speed boost on my teamates. Frankly, I mainly play scrappers and damage dealers, and the idea of rebuffing 7 players every 2 minutes all night long is not fun for me. I'm aware that this may just mean kinetics isn't the set for me, but I'm wondering if any of you expirienced kineticists find that not having speed boost, or not keeping it up 100% of the time is heavily frowned upon.

Also, as an alternative, if there's a bind/macro I can use to quickly cycle through my teamates by tapping a button 7 times in a row, that'd probably help me enjoy the toon a lot more.

Any suggestion or advice?

About 70% of the Kins that I have played with lately do not even speed boost.

I would be more worried if a Kin didn't fulcrum shift.

I can understand being frustrated by continually speed boosting the team, but Speed Boost will have a significant effect on the effectiveness of the team -- mostly due to the Recharge buff. I consider SB to be a key power in the set and one of the main reasons to have a Kinetics character on the team.

Personally, if a Kin joins my team and won't SB the team, I generally make a note of the person and won't team with him again. I don't make a stink about it and generally don't say anything. I also won't kick somebody for that, but I can choose to avoid him in the future.

I use a series of binds that lets me SB the team by simply hitting a keypad key for each team member. To add ID, I hit the "0" key -- I don't bother with ID most of the time, but may use it on someone having knockback problems or to Un-Stun a teammate.

Why would you want to play kinetics if its not for buffing?

I mean I get the point that its frustrating to keep SB up on a team all the time (add ID for mez protection to your def/troller team mates and that literally is almost all your doin). My own kin defender has stalled at 45ish because the play style is so tiring.

But besides that, what are you tryin to accomplish by not taking SB? Self damage boost via FS? Sorry brother but any aim+build-up blaster is goin to do more damage.
And as great as the trans* powers are, you can take aid self and build for end sustainability.

Im not tryin to dissuade you from playin how you wanna play, I just dont understand why'd you wanna play kinetics if you dont want to use the set defining power(s).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Ravenwolf My favorite combo is Faceplant/DebtCap with the TeamWipe Ancillary

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dispari Yeah, I like Blasters too.

When I stop and think about this, I always wonder what's the difference between repeatedly using a power on the enemy to make them fall over and repeatedly uisng a power on teammates to make them perform better?

There definitely is a difference. I've enjoyed playing buffers, and tried to keep everyone SB'd on my Kineticists, but it was often quite frustrating.

I think the worse thing is that players have really good AI for getting out of range or round the corner, especially with a movement buff. Buffing is like fighting Circle of Thorns mages times a hundred, they run away constantly when you're trying to hit them.

The binds I used were just the simple:

/bind numpad1 teamselect 1
/bind numpad2 teamselect 2
/bind numpad3 teamselect 3
/bind numpad4 teamselect 4
etc.

and then had Speed Boost and ID in 9 and 0 on my tray. With SB, I wouldn't sweat it if you miss someone. Let them know ahead its OK to say "SB plz" once, after all it saves you the trouble of keeping track of who you've missed because they just zipped round the corner.

Oh yeah, and fights are the best time, not in between. Everyone tends to bunch together and stand still in a fight.

It's great when a kin can keep up a steady stream of SB. The team greatly benefits from it. When I play my kins I keep up SB as much as I can. Playing with a kin who has SB and doesn't use it is very annoying. I usually just ask once and hope they get the hint (usually they don't).

So having SB and not SBing your team is a bit of a waste of a power. Since you don't like SBing then either don't take SB at all or only use it on team mates that are struggling with end. If you play on random pugs people will ask and expect SB. You may be kicked for not having SB or not giving it out. But I think that is rare at least in my experience.

I don't have SB in my Kins anymore. It felt nagging to have to constantly re-apply it and I just wasn't able to enjoy a Kin until I got rid of it. I won't knock the power beyond that; it's very potent in the early/mid levels. However, once you have Transference and Fulcrum shift things are going to be dying so quickly it hardly matters whether or not they have some recharge on them as well. Like tossing a cigarette into a forest fire.

If you decide not to take SB do yourself a favor, and make it KNOWN that you don't have it before you join a team. The occasional player is looking for someone with SB specifically, and they go a tad insane if they invite you and realize you don't have it.

It's true that being begged for it can be annoying, and I'm not one to complain about not being speed boosted all the time(I took teleport, IO'd for recharge/recovery etc...), but it just seems crazy to me that so many people can be so adverse to spending 7 endurance and 1s to MASSIVELY improve the viability of the stone tank/brute. I've played buffers before in games with FAR worse UI/helpfulness than this, yeah it's annoying to have to keep someone perma buffed, but IMO if you're playing buff class it's just what you gotta do.

As for not taking it at all, it's a rediculously good buff for very little cost to the user, outside of RP reason I don't see any reason not to take it. The only power in kinetics that's even arguably around the power level of speed boost is fulcrum shift, both those powers are so far and away better than the rest of the stuff in kinetics(and the buffs in most sets in the entire game) that if you didn't take them I'd have to ask 'then why even play kinetics'.

It's also hard to know when to speak up about it as a stone brute/kin. I've seen some kins actually forget about it and need to reminded, I've seen some kins ask to be reminded when it's going down, and I've seen some kins be super touchy about being reminded(the best kin ever was one that kept it on me permanently in a random outdoor even when we weren't teamed together at all, impressive!).

Most people will expect a Kin to have speed boost in the higher levels if you're teaming seriously for things like TFs and Trials. The expectation is pretty valid though since it's one of the strongest buffs in the entire game that can be kept up constantly, and if you don't like using it you're probably better off playing with friends or yourself to avoid drama. It's just one of those things that comes with the territory as they say.

Maybe it's just my general self sufficient standpoint that every character should be able to do the entire game without XYZ with them. Naturally, there's rare exceptions to this rule, most namely the Mo's, but even then there shouldn't be a *need* for anything. The reason I don't like having stone tanks/brutes around is because of their (general stoner population) need of speed boost to be able to keep up with the team. I'm not saying SB wouldn't be helpful, because frankly unless your build is 20 seconds or less recharge powers for both sets, you can always use the +recharge by my general philosophy (see below).

Also, as far as mob to mob travel on a stone tanker, I'm torn between people taking teleport and my friend's stone brute who in granite or rooted can outrun a level 20 character (without swift) with sprint on. Granted, he doesn't use his Stone brute much, but that doesn't mean that people can't be effective on general teams without sb with stone armor. That's all I ask, I don't want to sit and wait for a certain power set (or power in this case) to come along to start my TF because the stoner "needs" it. Helpful, of course. Needed is a completely different thing that greatly annoys me to the point of rather using the /kick on the stoner and go from there than looking for a specific power.



General Philosophy: Every character can manage on their own without another specific teammate on the team. Like a Dark Tanker not having endurance or defense issues (Cold Doms are tasty in the upper levels if you are having issues), Stone tanker's need for speed boost, or defense for a squishy.

Also, I estimate battles (engaging the enemies, killing them, and getting to the next mob) on a generic team to be roughly 25-35 seconds, steamrolling 20-25 seconds. That's at least how I estimate how often powers come up and if I'm satisfied with longer recharge power's recharging.

I am in the camp of having SB, using SB, but if it's not up 100% of the time - too bad.

I try to speed boost right before the first spawn in a mission, after each group in a mission, and right before the tough boss at the end to make sure everyone is recharged and endurance recovery in place for the start of each fight. I don't chase teammates anymore. I have no pity for teammates that burn through all their end in the middle of long fights, which there shouldn't be that many because of the kinetic prep. If you run out of end, you haven't stayed in close to your tank/scrapper/brute for support and to get your share of transfusion and transference.

I also don't get it that, kinetics don't take increase density in the late game. People get held, even use wakies and need to be alert and able to get back in the game. I also do not try to keep increase density active on 7 teammates 100% of the time either. I will hit the teammates before the big boss fights for mez protection in the boss' alpha. Other than that, I look for 'zzz' tells and people using wakies.

If you don't mind getting hated on by your teammates, sure, go for it.

Most people want SB for the +Recharge, not just the +Recovery. If you only give it to people low on end, your not using it to the fullest.

I have a Kin/Psy, he's a very, very old toon. I barely ever play him anymore because I got completely sick and tired of only buffing teams. It got to the point where I don't even bring him out anymore except very rarely with friends. If there's as much as a single pick-up member I will take someone else.

You know, far too many people watch their buffs blink and disappear for those 10 seconds just so they can yell at the kin on the team for letting their speed boost dissipate. I mean they literally just [Censored]ing STAND THERE and watch it go away. Screw that. I'm not your damn baby sitter unless you're going to pay me $8 for the night and let me take a popsicle out of your fridge.

And it better not be a lemon one, either.

Well you could set up a various amount of binds that makes one key cycle through your entire team. The only bad part is you would have to press the button each time and if you pressed it before the buff was cast it would skip a person. If you want that then you could always use this:

speedboost1.txt:
\ "teamselect 1$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost2.txt"
speedboost2.txt:
\ "teamselect 2$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost3.txt"
speedboost3.txt:
\ "teamselect 3$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost4.txt"
speedboost4.txt:
\ "teamselect 4$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost5.txt"
speedboost5.txt:
\ "teamselect 5$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost6.txt"
speedboost6.txt:
\ "teamselect 6$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost7.txt"
speedboost7.txt:
\ "teamselect 7$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost8.txt"
speedboost8.txt:
\ "teamselect 8$$powexec_name Speed Boost$$bind_load_file c:\kinbinds\speedboost1.txt"

Thanks to all who replied. Interesting thread. I've really not spent much time on the buffer side of the game, so this is all new to me. Personally, I've never played a toon who felt speed boost was needed. But I do like having it. I just never knew it took so much upkeep by the buffer.

To the people who said "why would you play a kin without speed boost". It's simple. People play blasters, right? Well, I'd rather have fulcrum shift then have all 9 powers of any blaster secondary. Most teams would agree with that, too.

(note, this toon, if he gets played up will be a corruptor, so damage is 'supposed' to be one of the focuses of the toon).