Sharks don't hurt.
Consciousness: that annoying time between naps.
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I played with a Scrapper who actually believed this. |
Originally Posted by Starjammer
No friggin' Jack Emmert touting getting killed as a power-up strategy.
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First of all, AV/pylon/GM soloing is not something you do for XP. People do that just for fun.|
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
There's no doubt about it, the bottom line of City of Heroes is dealing damage to defeat the enemy. You don't gain experience for getting hit, debuffing enemies or buffing allies. It pretty much only comes from beating people in the face until they fall down and don't get back up. To that end, people have taken this pursuit to the extremes, such as soloing Pylons, AVs and GMs, even duoing a mothership raid, all without temporary powers.
By choosing a tanker, you cut yourself off from being able to do those things. Tankers are the least damaging AT, and unlike defenders, have very limited means of increasing that. So in a game so focused on dealing damage and feeling super, why do you enjoy playing a Tanker? For me, it still is about feeling super. In fact, it's about feeling outright awesome. I've termed myself an "aggroholic," though I doubt I'm the first person to think of that term. I'm always actively seeking larger groups of stronger enemies. If I don't have to keep a finger on my Dark Regeneration bind, what we're fighting isn't tough enough. It makes me feel awesome to know that what I'm up against should be able to kill me, but can't. That's not all of it, though. By being able to keep all that attention, I'm letting an entire team of people be awesome. Everyone can go full bore with their attacks and not worry about return fire. That makes me feel awesome. |
I think tanker damage is fine. My impression is that my tanker requires 1 maybe two more hits per mob than my scrapper does at the level that I play at. But yet, he can take on waaaay more mobs(and higher level mobs) than my scrapper can. Becasue of this, he will almost always be able to contriburte more to a teams offense and defense.
Tankers can't mathematically match scrapper dps, but when you consider intangibles , then tank is a better overall AT as it relates to the intended/typical playstyle for the game.
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That's true in a sense, but there' more to it (which you talked about as well).|
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
There's no doubt about it, the bottom line of City of Heroes is dealing damage to defeat the enemy. You don't gain experience for getting hit, debuffing enemies or buffing allies. It pretty much only comes from beating people in the face until they fall down and don't get back up.
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- A Tanker getting hit, generally means someone significantly less vulnerable isn't. Allowing them to focus on debuffs, buffs and damage dealing. Think of it like a midfielder passing a soccer ball to striker, the striker scores but the midfielder gets an assist.
- Keeping with the sports analogy, you can also think of it as pure defense. Defenders and goalies don't usually score goals, but they do work to prevent goals being scored (deaths) by the opponent.
- Buffing and Debuffing either continue with the idea of protecting team members, or making them stronger, or making enemies weaker - all allowing for damage to be dealt with greater efficiency, safety or both.
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Originally Posted by SpittingTrashcan
In a word: confidence. A tanker moves forward without trepidation. A scrapper or brute does also, but they ride the razor's edge alone; the tanker's certainty extends to their team.
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In some situations, I find this to be untrue.
Once you go beyond aggro cap, you're beyond aggro cap. No amont of simply being a tanker is going to change that.
Although I do agree that Scrappers and Brutes do ride something of a razor's edge. I think that's what a lot of Blueside players will not understand when they first come into contact with top end fully IOd uber Brutes.
I think anyone not regulary exposed to redside ATs will instantly assume they are both full fledged tanker and full fledged scrapper in one - which while sometimes describes what they are capable of, isn't really accurate or true.
[QUOTE=Airhammer;2975079]
I am Avalance level 50 Ice/Stone tank. Bewteen taunt. chilling embrace and icicles you might not even realize there is a team. And between Fault and Tremor I can either keep you nicely stunned or flat on your back.. You chose.
QUOTE]
Cool, I have an Ice/Stone named Avalanche Girl. Very fun.
I like playing my tank since it gives me the freedom to leave the keyboard for emergencies and come back whenever I want and pick up right where I left off, surrounded by enemies or not 
My stone tank is virtually immortal 
Spines/ D A lvl 50 Scrap, stone/wm lvl 50 tank, Kat/reg lvl 50 Scrap
Grav/Kin lvl 50 Cont, Fire/Enegry lvl 50 Blast
Warshade lvl 50, PB lvl 39, nightwidow lvl 50, crab lvl 42
plant/thorns lvl 50 dom, ice/fire lvl 40 dom, grav/nrg lvl 41 dom
For me, tanking is a playstyle, not limited to one AT. It's a simple and fun playstyle. 1) lead the charge. 2) protect your allies. 3) sacrifice: I'm the only one "allowed" to die. Granted, Tankers accomplish this better than most 
but from time to time I've done it on all my toons.
Don't get me wrong, it's not purely an altruistic playstyle, but it's perhaps the most heroic, and that's the enjoyment for me. It's also why I enjoy having a good tanker on my teams - seeing them be all heroic is inspiring!
Sure, I do damage. Lots even (Fire secondary & APP). And sometimes the sacrifice isn't my death, but just doing something else that helps the team triumph without personal fanfare. But still, there's a unique satisfaction to seeing my health being the ONLY one that dips to dangerously low levels.
I've always thought of super heroes as protectors. Tankers are the ultimate protectors in that their job is to protect other super heroes. "No harm will come to you, not on my watch." is my Tankers' motto. I love it. And there's also just something about being an unstoppable force that's a great deal of fun.
I love my tanks because while i can't do damage, i can stand there and laugh at the pitiful pings enemies do against me
and with some time and effort i have been able to up my damage to reasonable level. Eb's no probs av's and gm's are still no go. but standing against them is awesome
I am passed having fun with them I think. I do think they protect in the most selfless way and I like that the most.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
I think, I fell in love tanking was when I was leveling up an Ice/fire tank, and waded into a swarm of Council after the team of 8 had finished them off..The defender on the team said "How the hell did you survive that??!!???" The blaster on the team answered simply.."Because he is a tank."
"...well I have wrestled with reality for thirty-five years, Doctor and I am happy to state I finally won out over it." Elwood P Dowd (from the movie Harvey)
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Pure truth!|
Originally Posted by DreamsRazor
"How the hell did you survive that??!!???"
"Because he is a tank." |
Be Well!
Fireheart
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Tankers are definitely easier to solo than most Defenders and Controllers.|
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
There's no doubt about it, the bottom line of City of Heroes is dealing damage to defeat the enemy. You don't gain experience for getting hit, debuffing enemies or buffing allies. It pretty much only comes from beating people in the face until they fall down and don't get back up. To that end, people have taken this pursuit to the extremes, such as soloing Pylons, AVs and GMs, even duoing a mothership raid, all without temporary powers.
By choosing a tanker, you cut yourself off from being able to do those things. Tankers are the least damaging AT, and unlike defenders, have very limited means of increasing that. So in a game so focused on dealing damage and feeling super, why do you enjoy playing a Tanker? For me, it still is about feeling super. In fact, it's about feeling outright awesome. I've termed myself an "aggroholic," though I doubt I'm the first person to think of that term. I'm always actively seeking larger groups of stronger enemies. If I don't have to keep a finger on my Dark Regeneration bind, what we're fighting isn't tough enough. It makes me feel awesome to know that what I'm up against should be able to kill me, but can't. That's not all of it, though. By being able to keep all that attention, I'm letting an entire team of people be awesome. Everyone can go full bore with their attacks and not worry about return fire. That makes me feel awesome. |
As for why I enjoy playing my tank...well I don't trust most tankers out there :P.
Seriously, it's just fun to play Tank and being able to hold aggro. Believe it or not, a good tanker is probably the most important thing on any team, effectively holding aggro means that your entire team is taking ZERO damage and not taking other secondary effects from mobs. How many Archetypes can do that?
Sadly, there are a lot of pretty bad tankers out there. Most people think good tankers = survivability, a lot of resistance, a lot of regeneration, a lot of defense...etc. However, what most tankers forget is that even if you never die, you're useless to the team unless you can hold aggro and keep mobs off your teammates.
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Now this guy has been teaming with the people I have!|
Originally Posted by SPiNE
As for why I enjoy playing my tank...well I don't trust most tankers out there :P.
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Originally Posted by SPiNE
Believe it or not, a good tanker is probably the most important thing on any team
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Once you have a good team, though, of people who know how much their own characters can handle, the tank becomes less useful. This happens pretty often with people who have played redside and have a few blue characters.
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Originally Posted by SPiNE
Most people think good tankers = survivability
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Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
Everything Dark Armor | The Softcap
don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
They help the team survive, they can solo at pretty much any level if I'm in the mood to solo. One can stand and face Hami with the aid of buffs and EoEs. Not being two shotted by GMs is a good thing. They survive well. Taunting/Herding/Holding aggro is just fun.
http://tiny.cc/ArcaneDefenseItems
This is a bug, nothing more. Please put away the tin-foil hats, there's nothing sinister going on here.-Protea
http://tiny.cc/WhatBeatsADragon
Last night on a STF was probably one of the best times as a tank
standing toe to toe with the likes of Ghost Widow, Black Scorpion, Scirocco and Cap'n Mako, shrugging of the damage they do and keeping them off of my teamies ahh good times
Why do I enjoy my tank? Because I like it when respites becom "junk" inspirations.
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Aggro cap ? ;p|
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
If a tanker is the last man standing, he has failed.
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Just removing or increasing this useless crap would skyrocket the usefulness of Tankers. Almost anybody with some IO's can tank the cap of 16 enemies... but if the cap was higher and players where able to aggro something like 4 spawns of enemies which would result in ~8 bosses and the whole other stuff hiting the aggro holder a Tanker would be much more desired.
Not to mention that this cap is just frustrating, I just hate it when there are running enemies around, hiting my team and ignoring my taunt completely... I'am forced to "fail" in my role even if my skill as a player would manage the situation quite easily.
I remember those days when there was no aggro cap at all, sure... that was a bit extreme when a Tanker could herd something like over ~300 enemies at once, but at least nobody would have questioned the usefulness of the Tanker.
Two main reasons. Firstly, tanks feel the most superheroic to me, and in a superhero game, that's of utmost importance (it's for this reason why most of my Blueside characters are melee, and why I never play blasters). Second, I've never liked one-shotting enemies all the time. Sure, it's fun once in a while, and can be hilarious, but I'm not having fun unless I'm going punch for punch with some big ugly monster or giant robot or something.
I do also occasionally enjoy playing the role of a tank, as opposed to just playing the AT, although (squishies beware) I don't assume responsibility for everyone's lives, and expect my teammates to be watching their own rears. Yes, I'll be taking the bulk of the aggro, but if I'm surrounded by ten guys, and you get killed by a stray that you pissed off, I'm not going out of my way to save you.
I play my tanks mostly for the survivability.
I tweak my tanks for regen.
I have one build frankenslotted to regen over 100hp per sec with no powers active at 50. I just like experiment with not dying and my tanks are my favorite not dying types.
I play my tankers because its the role I play best in.
Theres been numerous times now where Ive entered a team where everyone is faceplanted and they said wait for the team to get back and ive gone in solo and defeated the entire mob and left people gobsmacked 
The ability to stand in a mob and laugh at whatever hits you without paying stupid armor costs like you do in other games is great.
Tankers are the one role in the game that you cannot perform at all at low level. Every other AT can do some of there role but a level 8 tanker cannot effectively tank because he/she either cannot hold agro or dies with that agro or loses all there endurence. This alone makes it one of the more rewarding after level 22 than any other charecter.
Also its a superheros role to protect, and thats what a tanker does best
My INV/EM Tanker was my very first CoH character 6 years ago. He's gone from good, to really good, to Godly, to horribly nerfed, and is now (with IOs) very tough. I've shelved it 3 times over the years, but couldn't ever pull the trigger on deleting it.
My Tank doesn't pump out Scrapper damage numbers (although pre EM nerf, it was close....) and my Brute blows past it, but there is a Zen to Tanking that cannot be denied.
After playing primarily CoV for a while, I noticed my tanking was noticeably worse when I went Blue Side. I was too used to the whole "handle your own dang aggro" vibe in CoV.
A properly played Tanker is a great teammate. I like being the guy that keeps the Squishies safe.
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That's rapidly becoming my reason as well.
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Originally Posted by NuclearMedicine
For me, it's all the cool folks I get to hang out with on Tanker Tuesdays.
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"I never said thank you." - Lt. Gordon
"And you'll never have to." - the Dark Knight
My very first character was a blaster. And while I enjoyed being able to dish damage, I hated that so many battles turned into tactical exercises. This was back in '05, mind, before any form of difficulty adjustment was brought into the game.
Then I rolled a tank and got him over the End hump. O. M. G. I could wander through maps and take on all comers. If a hidden critter popped out and piled on... meh. Okay, yeah, I had no range and had to chop down Lts and above, but who cares? I wasn't face-planting and debt-capping every time a tough end-boss happened. No perma-Stuns or chain-mezzes. No friggin' Jack Emmert touting getting killed as a power-up strategy.
My only real regret is that I didn't get to play a tank back in the days when they aggroed and herded entire zones into dumpsters.