Wow.
Thank you for this thread.
ryancowboy, I feel your pain, but...lol
I hope you can at least appreciate how truly epic and awesome this fail is. This beats the crap outta adding an extra zero to your bid.
Best of luck with the next respec.
Open the pod bay doors, Hal.
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If the price is 1 million yesterday and 5 million today, which price is fair? Or does 'fair' vary by a factor of five or more on a daily basis?|
Originally Posted by Tenzhi
If those prices are the fair value, that's what you should get back. If they're not the fair value, then something should be done about that.
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Originally Posted by Tenzhi
The devs should decide what the fair value is. The player market, if there must be such a horrid thing and it seems that there must, should be limited to reflect that value within a tolerance.
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Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
This is more of a market discussion but the problem stems from the fact the game simply doesn't have a way to keep the influx of inf from bashing critters in check. The 5% WW/BM fee simply doesn't pull enough inf out of the game. With discounts and free tokens at the tailors, they no longer act as a significant inf sink either. Neither is the crafting cost for IOs.
I remember the time pre-market when you didn't earn enough inf to SO your character out totally until you were in the high 20s to low 30s. Decaying enhancements were the inf sink back then but once you hit 35 critters gave you enough inf that you never had to worry about refitting your SOs, assuming you weren't a clothes horse and visited the tailor frequently.
It also doesn't help when you look at the amount of inf you earn bashing enough critters to get a desirable purple recipe. So the inf supply goes through the roof and you get hyperinflation on the desirable items on the market.
So until they get the inf supply under some kind of control (I'm for scaling the WW/BM cut up as the sale price goes up), prices for desirable items on the market will simply keep increasing with no end in sight.
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
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Why do you think that Dom is ruined? You should have enough inf on you to at least visit the Vanguard Quartermaster and fill those empty slots with level 50 SOs. Your Dom should be perfectly viable still. And then, as the inf comes in from running missions and selling stuff on the market, you can piece by piece replace those SOs with set or generic IOs.
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Originally Posted by ryancowboy6
Players helping players even if the comments sting a little....Thats what its all about. I ll still pass u a wakie once u get ripped in half by an Elite Boss and then strike him down with my fully slotted Lightning Rod!!!just cuz I ruined 1 50 dom doesnt mean I dont have a couple more 50's waiting in the shadows of Paragon!!! Muuuhaaaaa!!! Muuhhaa!! -" Fire the Laser "
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That might be worth testing out. One advantage is that as the markets are now it would drain a lot more inf out of the hero market than the villain one.
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I don't wish to contest any of your other points, but I can't resist this. The end is in sight; It's 2 billion. Granted if the perceived value of an item ever warrants it, users could start exchanging outside the market, but there's an element of risk to trusting the user you're making the deal with.
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Originally Posted by Father Xmas
[...]So until they get the inf supply under some kind of control (I'm for scaling the WW/BM cut up as the sale price goes up), prices for desirable items on the market will simply keep increasing with no end in sight.
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"My inner mind has become a reality-cracking overgod. He torments me! Help!"
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I agree; but if they move to a scaling fee, I propose the minimum fee no longer be 5....
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Originally Posted by EvilDeathBee
That might be worth testing out. One advantage is that as the markets are now it would drain a lot more inf out of the hero market than the villain one.
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"My inner mind has become a reality-cracking overgod. He torments me! Help!"
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Well I didn't want to punish the villain's any more than the devs already do. |
Originally Posted by EvilDeathBee
That might be worth testing out. One advantage is that as the markets are now it would drain a lot more inf out of the hero market than the villain one.
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Originally Posted by The Grim Heaper
I don't wish to contest any of your other points, but I can't resist this. The end is in sight; It's 2 billion. Granted if the perceived value of an item ever warrants it, users could start exchanging outside the market, but there's an element of risk to trusting the user you're making the deal with.
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We'll end up seeing characters outside of WW doing /em panhandle.
"Hey Buddy, can you spare a couple of million, I need to buy a Luck Charm."
"Go fight some Hellions you bum."
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
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I took a look at some numbers for doing this. It's quite interesting. Essentially it functions like a graduated Income Tax calculation, and I tried to make the categories fairly broad - what happens is that each "band" takes a higher cut, so the more you purchase something for, the bigger the cut the AH takes, while still passing the inf across to the recipient, and ensuring that there are no "optimum" cut-off points.|
Originally Posted by Father Xmas
So until they get the inf supply under some kind of control (I'm for scaling the WW/BM cut up as the sale price goes up), prices for desirable items on the market will simply keep increasing with no end in sight.
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On the scale I used (starting at 100,000 with a 10% cut, 250,000 with 12.5%, 500,000 with 15%, 750,000 with 17.5%, 1,000,000 with 20%, 2,500,000 at 22.5% etc, etc, peaking at 2,000,000,000 at 52.5%), a 2,000,000,000 inf sale results in 1,019,440,000 going to the seller.
That would be a hell of an inf-sink, but not sure it would really work. Thoughts?
The wisdom of Shadowe: Ghostraptor: The Shadowe is wise ...; FFM: Shadowe is no longer wise.
; Techbot_Alpha: Also, what Shadowe said. It seems he is still somewhat wise 
; Bull Throttle: Shadowe was unwise in this instance...; Rock_Powerfist: in this instance Shadowe is wise.; Techbot_Alpha: Shadowe is very wise *nods*; Zortel: *Quotable line about Shadowe being wise goes here.*
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What do you mean we'll end up seeing this happen? I've been approached by beggers plenty of times.|
Originally Posted by Father Xmas
Well I didn't want to punish the villain's any more than the devs already do.
Yes and when everybody is rich then nobody will be. We'll end up seeing characters outside of WW doing /em panhandle. |
In fact it was some of the damn beggars that killed off my generosity. I used to have no problem helping out a hero or villain who was short of funds until these beggars started putting me on their friends lists and harrassing me with demands for handouts whenever I logged onto that character.
Now I perform random acts of kindness by performing drive by gifting, (I drag and drop something expensive on a total stranger and take off without a word) and by spending way too much for relatively cheap items on the market.
Father Xmas said
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I agree with your fundamental point. However, I wish to point out that the WW fee is 10% total. Because I'm a weenie like that. | his is more of a market discussion but the problem stems from the fact the game simply doesn't have a way to keep the influx of inf from bashing critters in check. The 5% WW/BM fee simply doesn't pull enough inf out of the game. With discounts and free tokens at the tailors, they no longer act as a significant inf sink either. Neither is the crafting cost for IOs. |
(If everyone chips in and makes sure that every item is resold at least twice, we can kick that up to 20%!)
Shadowe: I believe that at a certain point people will do off-market transactions to avoid the fees. I don't have any specific evidence, but I'm guessing you can soak people for about 25% before they move from complaint to action. (My sliding scale would probably be very, very simple. 10% for under 10 million, 20% for over 10 million. This means a vengeful buyer can cost you an extra million by buying for 10,000,001 instead of 9,999,999 . So it goes.)
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
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"if"? "ever"?|
Originally Posted by The Grim Heaper
I don't wish to contest any of your other points, but I can't resist this. The end is in sight; It's 2 billion. Granted if the perceived value of an item ever warrants it, users could start exchanging outside the market,
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Newsflash: Off-market trading is already happening for PvP IO's.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
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And some are selling for more than 2 billion.|
Originally Posted by Ironblade
"if"? "ever"?
Newsflash: Off-market trading is already happening for PvP IO's. |
Nitpick: We've had off market trading going on for 6 years. Thats how we did trades before we had the Consignment House.
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Ah yes, The Hive Open Market. Shout out the crap you dont want. Good times.
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Nitpick: We've had off market trading going on for 6 years. Thats how we did trades before we had the Consignment House.
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Yea, brain-fart. Thinking of the 5% listing fee.|
Originally Posted by Fulmens
I agree with your fundamental point. However, I wish to point out that the WW fee is 10% total. Because I'm a weenie like that.
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Another aspect to the inf supply problem is how much inventory is tied up at the market that's unlikely to be sold due to the asking price. Maybe, just maybe the market should discount items that have been sitting at the market for over a month. Shake loose some of the supply. A simple 10% off for every month it sits unsold on the market until it's sold off, set the bottom cap to store buy back prices or crafting cost for set recipes. Thing is I don't know how much of a problem, if any, this persistent inventory is keeping the prices high. A simpler solution would be to just return it to it's seller unsold after a month or three, force them to reprice it.
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
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Well Father Xmas use to show up in Atlas and Galaxy during the winter event and hand out inf to characters level 10 or less, 10K per level. That was a lot during the pre-market days. I kept a list of characters who I handed inf and sure enough I got people trying to double dip.|
Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
What do you mean we'll end up seeing this happen? I've been approached by beggers plenty of times.
In fact it was some of the damn beggars that killed off my generosity. I used to have no problem helping out a hero or villain who was short of funds until these beggars started putting me on their friends lists and harrassing me with demands for handouts whenever I logged onto that character. Now I perform random acts of kindness by performing drive by gifting, (I drag and drop something expensive on a total stranger and take off without a word) and by spending way too much for relatively cheap items on the market. |
Now post market a 100K is so trivial to make shuttling seriously underpriced common IO recipes to the store that it's not worth doing anymore. I got too many "what only 100K?".
Father Xmas - Level 50 Ice/Ice Tanker - Victory
$725 and $1350 parts lists --- My guide to computer components
Tempus unum hominem manet
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Ha.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
I think it might have invovled some kind of jerk hacking on the devs' part, with him being duped out of his rares.
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Enjoy your day please.
Is the Infamy on this game accounted for? Is it backed by Gold? Or are the (Devs/ Government) Simply printing bills? Is our Infamy today valued less than a year ago? Look At Greece . Cant we learn from them! Its a paragon conspiracy . This is also why " going Rogue" is $29.99 and not $19.99 ... and also, Ive seen some of that oil spill from the gulf of mexico in the waters of Nerva!
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Originally Posted by enrious2
We all make mistakes like that.
Also, elipses (...) do not replace sentence or paragraph structure. |
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What now? You gonna "ban" me for improper paragraph structure?
"Teh interwebz eez funnee."
--Some random dude
"Alien"
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Originally Posted by Infernus_Hades
The way you play changes your IO slotting..
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76 characters and Twenty-four 50s later, I still love this game.
AlienOne's Human-Form Warshade Guide (Old guide+New guide = 12,000+ views!)
I'm not sorry for the below....but i do not mean offence.
because you rushed the respec and didn't read everything proper..you lost big...so
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I dont feel sorry for those who arent careful with respec or the market...
sucks to be you...
Please learn from this experience is all i can say
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No, but you can be arrested for hit and run on sentence. |
Originally Posted by AlienOne
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What now? You gonna "ban" me for improper paragraph structure? |
So be careful.
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Dude, if I get into trouble for marklar, you should get into trouble for that.
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Originally Posted by AlienOne
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What now? You gonna "ban" me for improper paragraph structure? "Teh interwebz eez funnee." --Some random dude "Alien" |
Support the Mentor Project - http://tinyurl.com/citymentorproject
[JFA2010]Mod08: And I will strike down upon thee (enrious) with great vengence and .... oh wait wrong script
@enrious, @sardonicism, @MyLexiConIsHugeSon
If you haven't joined a global channel, you're not really looking for team.
I think it's funny how he says 50 SOs are for rookies. I don't really pay much attention to sets half as often as everyone else does. Sure, when I actually get to the point where I feel I need to wave around my e-peen in PvP, I might start bothering with them. But I play different than most.
Sure, I get wiped out in 5 seconds if I go to a PvP zone, but I don't go often at all. And the sets I do use, I find, or immediately benefit me. ((For instance, the +4 knockdown resistance on my Bane Spider is nice.))
In any case, I never respec and fail to reslot any inventions I do make. That's just plain silly.
Also, I laugh at AE test tube babies. "Farm farm farm" is all they know.