Missions that need to be changed
By
AzureSkyCiel,
Posted on: 2009-09-20 24:36 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Sorry, but I enjoy the Atta mish as is. It used to be that players knew what to expect up front and were willing to man up for the task
We need to improve the players, not the mission
(just kidding, but some players do get whiny about any little thing like a long mission)
There is no such thing as an "innocent bystander"
I don't find Atta that bad... I DO find those late semi-filler missions that have the MASSIVE maps (5+ story tech lab with multiple sets of elevators? seriously?!?!?!) to be simply unfun, as they're just needlessly long without much at all happening on them.
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Originally Posted by ShadowNate
;_; ?!?! What the heck is wrong with you, my god, I have never been so confused in my life!
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Originally Posted by BigFish
Sorry, but I enjoy the Atta mish as is. It used to be that players knew what to expect up front and were willing to man up for the task
We need to improve the players, not the mission (just kidding, but some players do get whiny about any little thing like a long mission) |
When you think about it, its not so much that the mission itself is extra long, its that by the time you've completed half the map you have probs outleveled the mobs or the reward has gotten so low that the team has now lost interest.
@Damz Find me on the global channel Union Chat. One of the best "chat channels" ingame!
But the mobs do level up, from front to back. The rewards shouldn't be dropping...
...plus everyone wanted to get that famous screenshot
It's what used to make it a popular mission. A 'must do' in the Hollows. Frostfire got so popular that people get to that and then head to Steel?
There is no such thing as an "innocent bystander"
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Originally Posted by BigFish
But the mobs do level up, from front to back. The rewards shouldn't be dropping...
...plus everyone wanted to get that famous screenshot It's what used to make it a popular mission. A 'must do' in the Hollows. Frostfire got so popular that people get to that and then head to Steel? |
What screenshot do you mean? Never heard/seen of a "must have" screenshot in the atta mission.
Well usually in the Atta mission, the mobs are even/1 level below you to begin with, but with the sheer amount of mobs there are in that map [plus the low amount of xp needed at the low levels] you could easily level 4/5 times [whereas the enemies are USUALLY at most +2 max] thus getting the xp/inf lowered.
Just since its the final main enemy in the hollows arc [excluding the trial], something should be done about it to make it more desirable imo [even a FF cutscene would add more feel to it].
@Damz Find me on the global channel Union Chat. One of the best "chat channels" ingame!
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I know when I finally got to the end of that mission I had to take this one:|
Originally Posted by EU_Damz
What screenshot do you mean? Never heard/seen of a "must have" screenshot in the atta mission.
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I've only completed Atta once, on that scrapper. I got almost 2 levels out of it, but it did take a VERY long time. A later attempt, with an Ill/Kin controller didn't go so well (try clearing out that map when your entire attack chain is comprised of Spectral Wounds, Blind... and Brawl.)
It is doable though, and the sheer size does make it rewarding. I have to agree with the other comment about the multi-level, multi-elevator science bases though - they're an utter drag.
Maps that need to be changed?
How about Arachnos maps with spawn points that are at (or very near, within typical agro distance of) the door?
We just did Atta tonight. The six of us had a lot of fun and although it is a long mission, it feels like an achievement when you complete it rather than a drag. I think it stands out from the other missions in the same way Frostfire seems to. Its a bit of a landmark at that point in the game. The problem with the lab type multi-level missions is that they don't really feel like any kind of achievement, just something to get out of the way. Atta seems to have more of a point, maybe just because you have a named bad guy to deal with.
Pyrokine
"Live forever or die tryin'"
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I think labs feel less speacial because there are so many of them, and they're generic - they're used for Nemesis, or Crey, or Praetorians, and they don't really feel like the reflect their users properly - like Nemesis should have steampunk labs, and the Praetorian ones should be more like Arachnos base maps.|
Originally Posted by Pyrokine
We just did Atta tonight. The six of us had a lot of fun and although it is a long mission, it feels like an achievement when you complete it rather than a drag. I think it stands out from the other missions in the same way Frostfire seems to. Its a bit of a landmark at that point in the game. The problem with the lab type multi-level missions is that they don't really feel like any kind of achievement, just something to get out of the way. Atta seems to have more of a point, maybe just because you have a named bad guy to deal with.
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I know caves are used for several groups too, but because they're natural features instead of man-made ones, I think it's not really a problem.
Warehouses and offices are ok too, because they're being invaded, or used as temp hideouts - but for maps that are supposed to be a factions home turf, I think they should be built in the style of the faction.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Missions that need changed...
1: Click the glowies simultaneously missions need redone to remove that requirement (either that or rework the system so it is not possible for the contacts to force you to take it before they will offer anything else).
2: Kill All missions... If the mission is a kill all, then say so, either in the brief from the contact or in the objectives on the nav bar. Example last night was one from Kestrel: Save the Paragon Protectors from the Circle of Thorns. Even after you save them, you still have to defeat everything in the mission to complete it. There is no indication anywhere in the briefing or elsewhere to indicate this requirement.
3: Unannounced timed missions. I know that there is at least one of these remaining. There's a low level mission you get to defeat a bunch of outcasts or something. Then as soon as you complete it, you get sent on a timed mission without any warning whatsoever (and yes, I looked carefully through the brief several times and saw absolutely nothing that would indicate it was going to put you on a timed mission.)
Meg Mason's first mission is another that gives no indication that it is timed until after you accept it. All of the missions from Marcus Valerius in Cimerora are like this too.
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Every single, gods-forgotten mission that is "defeat all" on anything but small or medium maps, and most of the ones on medium.|
Originally Posted by EU_Damz
So what missions do you feel that need to be tweaked to be made either smaller or even a bit larger?
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Next on the agenda is the "Paragon Ping-pong" where you have to run back and forth across the town to do bog standard, unexciting missions.
After that -- all the old, by-the-numbers missions that nobody ever recalls because they're so drearily standard and uneventful. You know the ones -- the ones with dull dialogue, underdeveloped plot, poor or missing motivation and no followthrough. The ones where it doesn't really matter which enemy group you're fighting, because the whole thing is utterly replaceable.
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The devs should hold a big AE contest where participants can pick any one of the old missions and completely rewrite it in the Architect. (update dialog, tweak plots, etc). Then the best ones get to replace their original versions outside of AE. Perhaps the top three can earn the submitters a bunch of reward merits to be applied to one character of his or her choosing.
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Originally Posted by Leif_Roar
After that -- all the old, by-the-numbers missions that nobody ever recalls because they're so drearily standard and uneventful. You know the ones -- the ones with dull dialogue, underdeveloped plot, poor or missing motivation and no followthrough. The ones where it doesn't really matter which enemy group you're fighting, because the whole thing is utterly replaceable.
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A good idea, but considering that NCSoft wasn't even able to keep the "Dev's Choice" list spinning, I'm not sure it's a practicable one.
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Originally Posted by Willowpaw
The devs should hold a big AE contest where participants can pick any one of the old missions and completely rewrite it in the Architect. (update dialog, tweak plots, etc). Then the best ones get to replace their original versions outside of AE. Perhaps the top three can earn the submitters a bunch of reward merits to be applied to one character of his or her choosing.
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They'll get back to dev choices once they stop working on GR 
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Yeah Nightshade, that's the one
was trying to avoid the whole 'spoiler' thing, as the throne room makes everything else worth the effort
and I've never gotten more than 2 levels out of the mish, so you started at a lower level?
sometimes it just doesn't pay to rush things
There is no such thing as an "innocent bystander"
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everything storyline that launched with the game could stand to be pulled up by the roots and replaced.
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Originally Posted by EU_Damz
So what missions do you feel that need to be tweaked to be made either smaller or even a bit larger?
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The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
"Talk to Crimson" and "Talk to Indigo." I get why their briefings are really long, Malta plots being what they are, but we have a "tell me more" option for contacts now, use it. Talk to anyone, barring an actual physical object that must be delivered. All the contacts have cell phones. They should exchange numbers.
Defeat alls on outdoor maps. Defeat alls on outdoor maps with patrols. That defeat all psi clockwork on the factory map with patrols that get stuck on stuff. Most defeat alls in general.
Street hunts in a different zone from the contact, the only exception being the Rikti in Crey's Folly hunts from Steven Sheridan, since he's right next to the door and it's a quick way to get his number. Street hunts of more than 30. Street hunts that you have to do to progress with a story arc, that must be done in a specific zone (so you can't just grab a paper mission with the appropriate enemy group).
Any mission that is essentially a repeat of the previous one, story-wise. Any mission that is essentially a repeat of any other mission. I have already saved one law firm from the DE. I don't care to save any more.
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
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I could not agree more. After Going Rogue I very much hope the developers consider revamping Issue 0-1 content. It's embarrassingly bad compared to the most recent additions.
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
everything storyline that launched with the game could stand to be pulled up by the roots and replaced.
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@Demobot
Also on Steam
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And the first improvement of players would have to be the team lead. I've had several that have called for "mission in the hollows" only to dump Atta on us after we've all appeared. I realize newbie leaders might not know what they're getting into, but its disrespectful of the other players' potential time needs not to be up front about it in the invitation. Even then, they try to make it a "clear all" mission. IMHO, it would be better to state that we're driving straight towards Atta, no side trails.|
Originally Posted by BigFish
Sorry, but I enjoy the Atta mish as is. It used to be that players knew what to expect up front and were willing to man up for the task
We need to improve the players, not the mission (just kidding, but some players do get whiny about any little thing like a long mission) |
Last time I enjoyed an Atta mission was when a team lead surprised us by using an exploit to pull 2 teams into the same mission. 15 players can do a lot of damage in that mission! (ps...its an exploit. I don't recommend trying it.)
I suppose if you reworked Atta it could be more interesting if there were multiple bosses leading up to him, like the Warrior mission using the same map from the gal in Midnighter's club. Or some nice surprises like ambushes or patrols (last I recall it was all static groups).
After 600+ runs on Frostfire, I wouldn't mind seeing some minor tweaking there. Mostly I'd be seeking a few more named bosses working at various points in the building.
Though I can't recall who issues them, there are a couple of Tsoo missions with too many sorcerors in the same big room. I've had a couple of those drag on forever due to all the mutual healing going on. Wouldn't mind seeing a rework on that.
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Street hunts that require you to defeat mobs in a specific area in which those mobs don't spawn. I'm looking at (or through) you, Kelly Nemmers. |
Originally Posted by Eva Destruction
Street hunts in a different zone from the contact, the only exception being the Rikti in Crey's Folly hunts from Steven Sheridan, since he's right next to the door and it's a quick way to get his number. Street hunts of more than 30. Street hunts that you have to do to progress with a story arc, that must be done in a specific zone (so you can't just grab a paper mission with the appropriate enemy group).
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She gives you three hunts that require you to defeat mobs specifically in the Misty Woods area. The Tuatha are easy, since they actually spawn heavily all through the area. The Fir Bolg and Red Caps, not so much--you might find one or two right at the edges that qualify, or that wandered in. To complete the hunts, you have to pull them in before you finish them off. That's particularly screwed up in the case of the Fir Bolg hunt, as the ostensible purpose of the mission is to keep them out of the Woods.
The Way of the Corruptor (Arc ID 49834): Hey villains! Do something for yourself for a change--like twisting the elements to your will. All that's standing in your way are a few secret societies...and Champions of the four elements.
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Meg Mason: When you first talk to her, she says: "all my assignments are on a strict deadline."|
Originally Posted by Willowpaw
Meg Mason's first mission is another that gives no indication that it is timed until after you accept it. All of the missions from Marcus Valerius in Cimerora are like this too.
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Marcus Valerius doesn't have similar text, but both Marcus Valerius and Meg Mason are essentially newspaper/radio mission givers for a zone which doesn't have newspaper/radios available.
Borea in the RWZ is the same way, and the first mission you get from her, she tells you: "Oh, and rule number 4 - we work on a tight schedule, so everything but the hunting tasks is going to be timed."
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Oh and another thing: heroside really could use some more EBs. Upgrade some "end of story arc" bosses (Ubelmann is the first that comes to mind, but some others could use the treatment as well), and downgrade the Faultline AVs. It's lower-level content, it shouldn't have so many AVs in it, and Sands is the only one of those guys remotely cool enough to be an AV.
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
I disagree about the Faultline AVs. I recently soloed those arcs on a Controller (so PToD was trouble), and the only problem I had (ie: the only time I died and had to hit the hospital) was against Sands in the mission with the subs, and then I only had to hosp once.
In Agent G's final mission, where all three appear fighting each other, I would have had lots of trouble, if I had fought them. Fortunately, you only have to free Penelope, unless you really want those SOs.
And this was all on a lowbie Controller with endurance issues.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Yay, you fought them and didn't die. So have I. That isn't the point. There is no story reason for those guys to be AVs, aside from "these guys are more important than the goons, let's make them AVs." Heroes fight four AVs in that zone, in four fairly short arcs. Heroes fight four AVs outside that zone, in all the non-TF content up to level 40.
The EB rank is seriously underused, especially blueside. We have what, four? Maybe a few more in the RWZ? Not everything needs to be an AV.
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
Now that teams doing dev created content are back in full force [constantly on almost full teams!
], i've once again come across missions that just beg for the devs to visit them and tweak them slightly.
By todays standards i'ld happily say that players prefer missions that dont seem to last forever and would rather play short/medium sized ones.
So what missions do you feel that need to be tweaked to be made either smaller or even a bit larger? The first main mission in my opinion is
@Damz Find me on the global channel Union Chat. One of the best "chat channels" ingame!