MA: I weep metaphorical tears of despair
By
3dent,
Posted on: 2009-04-10 24:12 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Hmmm... if the HoF tag is awarded only upon rankings is that really a bug? But if you lose the badge credit on your character as well, then that's unforgivable and should be fixed. At least it explains where the claimed HoF arcs keep disappearing to though, and it wouldn't surprise me if every arc that makes it was being downgraded again through spite...
All I'm saying is you're very quick to claim spite, when it could be that maybe it isn't as good as people are making out and some people didn't feel it warranted the high ranking.
Thats just honesty compared to some where lots of people are adding 5 stars for people they know? Plus, one person rating it one star wouldnt be enough to drop it anyway.
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Whilst I personally agree it didn't deserve a 5 star ranking Shazan, the only way you can claim it deserves a 1 is if you try to make the argument that you are balancing out the average; because an honest vote, considering all the effort that went into writing, spell checking, and testing it wouldn't be a 1 either; it may not be to taste, but saying it's as bad as some of the efforts out there... So which is easier to believe; it's an honest attempt to fairly review it, and at a 1 star rating too... or there's jiggery pokery going on of some kind?
I have done that Arc with a fine comb to look for a reason, any reason to not give it 5 stars (I wanted to be certain that I would approve of it hitting HoF) of I couldn't find it.
Of course that doesn't say a thing, who am I after all.
However I do believe that there are not so nice people out there who like to mess things up. Why? I have no idea, I am not a shrink.The only ones who can shed a light to the matter of spite voting are the persons who can look at the votes. If there is suddenly a high increase of 1 stars, then you can bet something fishy is about.
An open rating system like this should filter out 'silly' values. If hundreds of votes are 4's and 5's and one person gives it a 1, there's something not right.
I don't like these sorts of systems but with the ludicrous number of arcs published, I suppose it's the only way - there's no way the devs could play through every single way and rate them themselves 
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He WAS in the HoF. I have seen that myself. Then suddenly poof he is gone.
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Are you suggesting people are hassling the HoF?
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He WAS in the HoF. I have seen that myself. Then suddenly poof he is gone.
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Are you suggesting people are hassling the HoF?
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That is one possibility yes. There are other scenarios of course.
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He WAS in the HoF. I have seen that myself. Then suddenly poof he is gone.
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Are you suggesting people are hassling the HoF?
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Oh c'mon, you hoff got to be KITTing?
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The person who wrote the arc said that when he recieved HoF, (thankfully once you get into HoF you never lose the badge associated with it) he would suddenly recieve a flurry of one star votes which caused it to drop out.
The devs are in the process of fixing said problem that once an arc hits HoF it remains there.
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He WAS in the HoF. I have seen that myself. Then suddenly poof he is gone.
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Are you suggesting people are hassling the HoF?
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Oh c'mon, you hoff got to be KITTing?
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I KARRn't believe you said that.
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The person who wrote the arc said that when he recieved HoF, (thankfully once you get into HoF you never lose the badge associated with it) he would suddenly recieve a flurry of one star votes which caused it to drop out.
The devs are in the process of fixing said problem that once an arc hits HoF it remains there.
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But each person only gets one vote.
If the mission had a high number of 5's to begin with, then it would probably take a few to bring it down even to 4
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when it drops down to a 4 it loses HoF status, for HoF you have to be atleast 4.5 average to achieve it.
Also I'm not saying it was but one man preforming it, would be a group of people obviously.
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Ok, but wouldnt the same happen if they all gave 4's or 3's?
Just seems more than a bit paranoid to think loads of the people are out to get the creator.
Zhaan, Chakyra, Fiorina 161, Aeryn, Polly Nation, Dee Pression, Shazanne, Night Jester and too many more to mention.
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Just going by what the guy said, seems a little odd that he would suddenly recieve a lot of lowered votes once he hit hall of fame status, that's 1000 or more people have played it and rated it a 4.5 or above, surely somewhere in those 1000 people there would have been those that disagreed with the 'popular' opinion and rated it a 3 if the arc was really only average.
Seriously it's the one MA arc I've heard from quite a few people and have talked about myself being really good and worthy of HoF status, yes your opinion may differ but feel free to play through the arc and vote accordingly, it's not like I'm yelling at you to give it five stars, hell it's not even MY arc...mines languishing at 4 stars and 9 plays...but then I actually except mine isn't that great.
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Thats good to hear, however, continued tweaking of architect (much like pvp) is not NCsoft's workload but the Dev's,... like I said, more time invested.
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It almost seems like you're complaining a) that the Devs are continuing to undertake development work and b) that the Devs are continuing to support recently-released projects within the game.
You might not be massively fond of MA, but - objectively - wouldn't you be more concerned if they'd just decided to drop it on its [censored] and not invest resources to improving it?
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Umm, no, you're right features should be supported, but really its about an expanding wealth of features (and maintainance thereof) diffusing the focus of the product at this critical time.
'City of' has enough game reward systems now, enough QoL qizmos now, as handy and welcome as they are Its the bare bones of 'City of' that need updating now or else it is not going to hold its place in the market in 2-3 years time.
I'm not overly convinced that on the eve of the arrival of CoH's first major competitor in the market - that Paragon Studios is concentrating on the areas of the game that it should be to match the expectations of new subscribers, and new subscribers are lifeblood for any MMO.
New subscribers/Trial players don't care about PvP or Mission Architect, they'll be too busy experiencing the wealth of the game we all did several years ago... at least they would if they stayed around long enough to work through it all, and quite a lot aren't as I'm hearing comments like "You subscribe to this? LOL, the graphics are worse than Second-Life!". Unfortunately Shiny does matter an awful lot to the uninitiated
So back to your point, of-course newly-Introduced features need to be supported, but if those features need continual support and tweakage with every single patch and every single Issue (and I fully expect MA to join PvP as one of those systems thats going to need perpetual tweakage) then that has got to (by the very logical definition of only having so much time between Issues) take away time that could & should be going into PvE content, graphics/engine-revamps/refined Character-meshes/Costumes/Audio-redesign/ and global zone enviroments.
In-short, On the eve of the competition arriving, Paragon Studios should be doing everything to take points away from Champions-Online and introduce systems and features they hold to be unique about their product, that combined with revamping the visual look and sound of the game will ensure it stays ahead. Not listening to suggestions we've been asking for for years, or thinking the product has enough heritage to attract new subscribers without a shiney revamp will (I fear) ensure it doesnt.
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Very well said indeed ML.
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when it drops down to a 4 it loses HoF status, for HoF you have to be atleast 4.5 average to achieve it.
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You got a redname quote on that?
As far as I know the only time the specification for HoF was given was when Ex Libris (US redname) posted that The Hall of Fame is where the best player rated content goes. To get to this rank you need to have over a 1000 votes with an average of 5 stars (we round up).
As I've pointed out several times, this seems to mean that the mean average is used and that the score is rounded up, not rounded to the nearest integer, so to get in HoF the arc needs 1000+ votes with a mean average score above 4.
So it's not >4.5 it's >4.0
So it could be easy to lose HoF:
You have the following:
499 3 star votes
1 4 star vote
500 5 satr votes
Mean average = (499*3+1*4+500*5)/1000 = 4.001 which is rounded up to 5, making the arc a HoF arc
If the next vote is a 3 then the mean average drops to (500*3+1*4+500*5)/1001 = 4 exactly, which is not a rating good enough for HoF.
So, obviously, it's possible to drop an arc from a HoF rating without 1 starring it.
Although it's worse if the rating is 1 starred to grief - every 1 star rating needs 3 5 star ratings to 'cancel-out' for the purposes of HoF.
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In-short, On the eve of the competition arriving, Paragon Studios should be doing everything to take points away from Champions-Online and introduce systems and features they hold to be unique about their product, that combined with revamping the visual look and sound of the game will ensure it stays ahead. Not listening to suggestions we've been asking for for years, or thinking the product has enough heritage to attract new subscribers without a shiney revamp will (I fear) ensure it doesnt.
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I've been avoiding entering this argument, mostly because I really can't grasp how people can complain about this feature, but then again I can't understand how people can still complain about PvP and on the same breath talk about how CoH needs to remain competitive.
The bolded statement pretty much sums up my argument. Personally I think the MA is the most interesting thing to be added to CoH since inventions, and it tops that easily in novelty and coolness factor.
That said I do agree that it would help the games survivability considerably if they upgrade the graphics somehow. I have seen nothing to indicate that this is not in their plans already.
PS: The Champions graphics are not so much better then what CoH allready has, they use the same engine for [censored] sake, an engine originaly created back in 2000.
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Problem is, how do u know it was spite? It could just be that someone else didnt want to back slap as they didnt like it.
Its all subjective.
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If you don't like something because it's not to your taste, then a 2 or 3 star rating might be a apropiate (although I usually just quit without rating). 1 star is for badly written bilge or game breaking bugs.
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PS: The Champions graphics are not so much better then what CoH allready has, they use the same engine for [censored] sake, an engine originaly created back in 2000.
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Actually it isn't the same incarnation of engine.
Cryptic Engine [u]2.0[u] and the Cryptic Animation Rig are just two of the tools that were developed specifically for and used for the Champions-Online title, and the engine is capable of faster reactions and better graphics and animation. The good news is that with the sale of the CoH IP Cryptic licences NCsoft to use these engine technologies for all future products.
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That said I do agree that it would help the games survivability considerably if they upgrade the graphics somehow. I have seen nothing to indicate that this is not in their plans already.
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It wasn't so long ago that it was confirmed the Paragon team are looking at possible graphical improvements.
Yeah, It was Positron I believe, alluding to the fact that the current engine is capable of more, but they had been holding back on showing just what it was capable of with respect to subscriber's Min/Max PC specs.
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Yeah, It was Positron I believe, alluding to the fact that the current engine is capable of more, but they had been holding back on showing just what it was capable of with respect to subscriber's Min/Max PC specs.
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This is exactly the problem as i see it we come on here and whinge about the Devs aren't doing this and the Devs aren't doing that, why haven't they updated they graphics they need to update the graphics or CO will be much better and every one will go play that.
Yet the devs are on record as saying the core game engine is more powerful than what we see and that it is capable of doing far more.
So why don't they up the graphics simple there thinking of us the current player base how many would be strait on here moaning that the game wont run any more or that its to laggy or there PC spec doesn't meet the requirements of the game.
Just look back to when CoV launched and there was the texture update on CoH it made the game look great (hell it still looks good when you have the graphics sliders maxed) now take that to the next step a full on graphics over hall can you imagine the complaints cause i can.
So yes personally i would love to see the graphics ramped up but i have a relatively good PC what about those that don't have good PC is the possibility of getting a more subscribers worth the risk of loosing loyal current subscribers?
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PS: The Champions graphics are not so much better then what CoH allready has, they use the same engine for [censored] sake, an engine originaly created back in 2000.
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I don't think the problem with CoH graphics is the engine as much as it's a lot of rather dull and same-y graphics that needs to be reworked.
Ueah, you missed what I said, I meant the one star, didnt doubt that he was in the hall of fame.
Zhaan, Chakyra, Fiorina 161, Aeryn, Polly Nation, Dee Pression, Shazanne, Night Jester and too many more to mention.
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