I'd like to say that I'm with the camp that supports not messing with official canon unless it's "obviously" in place to justify game mechanics rather than making sense within the world. Unfortunately, actually saying that only makes the problem worse, because then you have to decide where to draw the line. Ouroboros is, plainly and simply, a system designed to let us play back over specific bits of content. Is it more or less of a game mechanic than security level? What about Wentworths? Sure, we can accept that Paragon has a number of prestigious auction houses, but do they really trade in enriched plutonium, or the personal weapons of gods? The divide isn't always as obvious as we'd like.
In the other corner, player canon isn't much better off. Firstly because of the lack of consistency; players' decisions about how the world works contradict one another constantly. But also because even if something is generally accepted (like certain items on restaurant menus being best avoided), these accepted points aren't written down anywhere. I didn't know about Up-N-Away's chicken salad, probably because I've never spent a lot of time around Galaxy Girl. Obviously that's a trivial point, as any contradiction can just be a difference of opinion, but the same applies to any player-generated idea that anyone considers fact.
As far as power goes, I do my best to exercise moderation. That doesn't mean that I'm against high-powered characters, but handling them well is a major challenge, and I never even know if I'm doing justice to the theoretically simpler characters I do play.
Knights Exemplar: Wolfram, Autumnfox, Starlit Spirit.
Militia: The Portent, Wavekite, Mr. Sandman.
The Cadre: WarpLocke, Zajin.
Numerous others.
In the comics themselves, I suppose there's a not-too-dissimilar parallel; Superman is the ultimate uber-hero, and Stan Lee himself has often repeated the question "Why need a team like the Avengers anyway, if you've got Thor?" You have to wonder what, on paper, gives half the JLA and Avengers something to do when crisis threatens - even if Superman and Thor were out drinking together in Asgard, what could a sulky millionaire or a WW2 throwback with a patriotic frisbee bring to a fight where Wonder Woman and Green Lantern, or Iron Man and Ms Marvel, had already opened their respective cans of whup-[censored]?
I'm sure I was going to mutter something about creative storymaking, but thanks to a boisterous 8-year old running riot behind me I've forgotten what my point was... 
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FFM and SG still play their characters as pretty much gods.
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Speaking for myself only, but I disagree. Sure Ellie is powerful, I list her as one of the more powerful Peacebringers in the city, but that's merely transferring game mechanics over to RP. She IS powerful, and has a very effective build. She very rarely faceplants anymore when missioning because I've spent a lot of time tweaking her, and she can even go toe to toe with an AV and survive.
Sure, her backstory contains something that can push her to extremes at times, such as her "little problem" right now, but that has a specific cause, and a specific solution; but she's by no means a god. A god character implies little or no weaknesses, and Ellie has plenty of them. Some more debilitating than others, and one which could be downright hilarious amongst the right players. 
So no, I disagree that Ellie is a godlike character. Overpowered, I WILL agree on, hence the additional weaknesses to counterbalance her additional strengths.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Plus you can -really- screw Ellie over with LOUD NOISES. As I so love doing.
Alright then, let's take the example of Zortel.
She has money. She has tech. She has property and she has a suit of powered armour, various cybernetic implants and a large group of metahumans behind her.
She overpowered? With that combination, yes. Can I do a thing about it, and still keep the essence of the character?
... I don't actually know, and could probably do with some help there. Lose the wealth and property? The Unity Vigil and New Vigilants go up in a cloud of bankruptcy and red tape. Losing the tech or smarts isn't really viable, seeing as she kind of needs them. The cybernetics and suits come in as a part of that.
I guess my only God Character is Jessica Kade, and she tends to just hug her cooking utensils, do gardening, fish and work on her boat now, as well as serve up tasty treats in the UV Cafe.
Aww heck, now my mind is starting to contemplate a bloody continuity restart, thanks guys :/
It's always fun!
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Plus you can -really- screw Ellie over with LOUD NOISES. As I so love doing.
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Well, with super-hearing comes super-sensitivity to sonic effects. Sonic weapons make mincemeat of her.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Frankly, being very mean, but to myself as well, Ellie and Jessica, and to some extent War Crow are bad examples of uber characters. They are uber because their owners thought that would be cool/wanted them to be uber. In my defense, when I relaised I'd made Crow totally unplayable, I IC retconned him to not be. FFM and SG still play their characters as pretty much gods.
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As I tend to stay away from plots or what ever, the being more powerful then god bit tends to be rather in the background.... Yeah, I exaggerating.
So yeah, she can put a lot of punch behind her spells, they're not beyond lvl 50 controller bits that she might use 'regularly'.
Well, let's set the record straight, shall we?
Jessica in my mind is a powerful mage.
In play she's about average with a lot of confidence. This play is RP/plot, btw, not just ingame missions.
She has a lot o behind the scenes resources, meaning she can do what ever is needed and or entertaining, with enough time to research and such.
She's a real believer of "magic is what you make it, not what I make it" so when handling a curse or spell or what ever, there's plenty of possibilities and angles and stuff.
There is NO flicking fingers to fix stuff, unless it's desired and I find it plausible (the latter part about as unlikely as the former)
@ShadowGhost & @Ghostie
The Grav Mistress, Mistress of Gravity
If you have nothing useful to say, you have two choices: Say something useless or stay quiet.
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Well, let's set the record straight, shall we?
Jessica in my mind is a powerful mage.
In play she's about average with a lot of confidence. This play is RP/plot, btw, not just ingame missions.
She has a lot o behind the scenes resources, meaning she can do what ever is needed and or entertaining, with enough time to research and such.
She's a real believer of "magic is what you make it, not what I make it" so when handling a curse or spell or what ever, there's plenty of possibilities and angles and stuff.
There is NO flicking fingers to fix stuff, unless it's desired and I find it plausible (the latter part about as unlikely as the former)
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Dr Strange in other words?
Basically battling limitless powered entities from beyond mortal ken in his own series?
Not wanting to attract said things to Earth by using that kind of level of power, for Earthly matters?
But without the awesome stache
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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Dr Strange in other words?
Basically battling limitless powered entities from beyond mortal ken in his own series?
Not wanting to attract said things to Earth by using that kind of level of power, for Earthly matters?
But without the awesome stache
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Not really knowing much about Dr Strange (or even half the marvel and a tenth of the dc heroes) I guess that's a fair discription...
@ShadowGhost & @Ghostie
The Grav Mistress, Mistress of Gravity
If you have nothing useful to say, you have two choices: Say something useless or stay quiet.
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Plus you can -really- screw Ellie over with LOUD NOISES. As I so love doing.
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Well, with super-hearing comes super-sensitivity to sonic effects. Sonic weapons make mincemeat of her.
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Of course, there's absolutely no reason that Ellie is: superstrong, supersensitive, has claws that can carve very big holes in any thing she wants... other than that you didn't want her as anything other than the most powerful entity you could think of.
No, Ellie's just a powerful kheldian... while all the other kheldians get by on being, well, kheldians.
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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Dr Strange in other words?
Basically battling limitless powered entities from beyond mortal ken in his own series?
Not wanting to attract said things to Earth by using that kind of level of power, for Earthly matters?
But without the awesome stache
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Not really knowing much about Dr Strange (or even half the marvel and a tenth of the dc heroes) I guess that's a fair discription...
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Knowing more about Doc Strange and Jess, no, it's not even close. It's what she's doing right now, but it isn't Jess. Jess' saving grace is that you don't get involved because you'd break any plot you were in.
You're hardly the only one. Given a superhero game, people tend to go "Oo, I have to be the greatest, best <something> there is." It's almost always more fun, and more in-keeping with the CoH universe, to play people who aren't actually the best there is.
But this is all totally off-topic, really.
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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If anything, the worst thing about Shadowe is not his nature, it's his wealth and technology.
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Got to agree with you, there, Birdy. At least on some counts.
As far as his available technology is concerned, there are one or two things that I agree could be toned down - most of it, though, is stuff that exists in-game, or as an explanation for stuff that exists in-game (though there is one aspect that is solely there to make my life easier. More on that later).
Things like the teleport network and Huntington Manor's defences exist for the sole reason that it makes sense for them to be there, for those things to fit within the game world.
The most blatant example of technology that Richard had which is a bit 'naughty' on my part is his battle-suit, but other than the helmet it is absolutely nothing but a shell - it's not designed to offer protection, or any sort of offensive weaponry, but as an excuse for Richard to have those things. The helmet is the naughty bit - full 360-degree sensory and recording technology is pushing the boundaries a bit. Oddly, though, those things only extend to Local chat range, in-game. Another bit of cheekiness on my part, there.
His biggest problem is his wealth. When you can afford to buy anything you want, you tend to throw money at your problems. This is due to be the focus of an upcoming plot by me, anyway, because even I recognise that the wealth he is purported to have is far too vast.
Oh, and that bit of tech I mentioned that exists to make my life easier? The recording stuff. It's there so that I can have Samantha know what's going on around the statue without having to dual-box all the time.
The wisdom of Shadowe: Ghostraptor: The Shadowe is wise ...; FFM: Shadowe is no longer wise.
; Techbot_Alpha: Also, what Shadowe said. It seems he is still somewhat wise ; Bull Throttle: Shadowe was unwise in this instance...; Rock_Powerfist: in this instance Shadowe is wise.; Techbot_Alpha: Shadowe is very wise *nods*; Zortel: *Quotable line about Shadowe being wise goes here.*
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His biggest problem is his wealth. When you can afford to buy anything you want, you tend to throw money at your problems. This is due to be the focus of an upcoming plot by me, anyway, because even I recognise that the wealth he is purported to have is far too vast.
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Perhaps it's because he's very old, but Jason doesn't suffer from the "throw money at it" thing. He's probably the richest person at GG. He could finance the repairs to the Towers without breaking a sweat (if anyone thought to ask, he possibly might). He has almost limitless wealth, though huge sums might take time to liquidise, as with any very rich person.
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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Of course, there's absolutely no reason that Ellie is: superstrong, supersensitive, has claws that can carve very big holes in any thing she wants... other than that you didn't want her as anything other than the most powerful entity you could think of.
No, Ellie's just a powerful kheldian... while all the other kheldians get by on being, well, kheldians.
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Ellie's claws are a psychomorphic projection of the claws her cat side remembers having, manifesting as pure Kheldian energy. Energy tends to trump the densest of matter, so it passes between and disrupts molecular bonds much like Talsorian weapons apparently do. Note, she's had these LONG before Impervium or Talsorian weapons entered the game. That doesn't mean she can cut through ANY thickness though... They're only 3 inches long, and a sufficient thickness of impervium WILL stop them (I figure maybe 2 cm tops). Her cell in the Zig was a foot thick wall of impervium.
I could go through all her different weaknesses on here, but I'm not just going to TELL people how to take her out.. Her extra senses are obvious, the countermeasures should be equally so. The point is though, that yes, of course she's powerful. We ALL want our characters to be powerful, yes? So I fell into what many of us want to do. At least I've tried to balance that with appropriate weaknesses. There are a LOT of chars out there in RP land with NO weaknesses.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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That doesn't mean she can cut through ANY thickness though... They're only 3 inches long, and a sufficient thickness of impervium WILL stop them (I figure maybe 2 cm tops). Her cell in the Zig was a foot thick wall of impervium.
I could go through all her different weaknesses on here, but I'm not just going to TELL people how to take her out..
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Having to wear a thick suit of Impervium to stand a chance in melee against her is a weakness? O.o
She NEVER uses her claws against people. She's not a murderer!! When she DOES kill, it's when she has no other choice. She saves her claws for fighting machines and monsters.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
*Hands Floaty a power shovel, one that can dig through Impervium!*
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
she does chew on Freakshow arms tho FFM ..P
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she does chew on Freakshow arms tho FFM ..P
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I'm sure he means while doing heroey things, what she does in her private life doesn't count :P
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she does chew on Freakshow arms tho FFM ..P
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Don't remind me! She went through GALLONS of mouthwash and god knows how much floss after that! 
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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How does a level 1 enemy with a pistol differ to a level 50 with a pistol? Are they better shots, different bullets, some strange quantum effect that means a level 25 being shot by a level 1 with a pistol will take minimal if any damage even if they're a normal human with a bow, standing still, while a level 50 will leave them bleeding on the floor?
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The gun thing is one of the things I just plain ignore. If I'm playing as a character who just happens to be wearing armour and/or is 'invincible' then it doesn't matter so much.
If Kata were truly up against a band of Hellions, it would undoubtedly take a lucky shot/ shot at point blank to incapacitate her. She's not superhuman and no amount of Super Reflexes could avoid it.
Similarly being bludgeoned with a shovel, engulfed in flames, frozen solid, electrocuted, having to wade through quicksand... you get the picture - Kata should be dead as should quite a lot of heroes, villains and civilians. So, I just ignore the game mechanic.
PvP between consenting roleplayers is fun, but then I like to play the game for fun when it comes to things like that. If Kata went up against someone such as her old friend Red Commissar, he'd have shot her to pieces before she could even get near him with a punch most probably. IC though and the fight would not happen.
Having said all this, I noted from a couple of Open RP thingies that I always downplay Kata's abilities. Perhaps I should, just for fun, let her do some interesting backflips and chokeholds. She's capable of it - but I'd rather have her wearing body armour and raiding a drugs lab (the game mechanic, obviously, doesn't allow for her to have body armour without rolling a new char) or interrogating a prisoner than going all Onnatop (spelling?).
My 3.5 inf
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Of course, there's absolutely no reason that Ellie is: superstrong,
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Sorry, slightly OT here, but... Kheldians aren't superstrong? I assumed Peacebringers and Warshades were rather strong and tough, at least towards the upper limits of the human scale, if not more, due to being Kheldians. I've always played Luna like that... Is this not so?
I have two Uber characters. Both with quite grand concepts. The first, the Knightmare is the physical incarnation of fear itself. Now that in itself is uber as my canon on fear is that it's a pan-dimensional, pan-versal entity that connects all consciousness and exists everywhere. Of course even this has its limits. I use 'consciousness' rather than 'life' because not all creatures are capable of fear. Simple organisms like amoeba simply don't have the capacity for even base instincts like fear. That being said 'consciousness' can cover incorporeal beings like spirits or even gods.
The meat and potatoes of the concept is complex but I'll try to keep it brief. There are two aspects to the Knightmare; The Phobos Omniscia, the pan-dimesional fear entity, and the Knightmare itself, the physical incarnation. The Phobos Omniscia exists as instinct and operates as such. The Knightmare itself is simply an incredibly dense concentration of phobic energy. Energy that had to be manifested into physical form in order to exist in the Unionverse. This grants the Knightmare almost limitless knowledge, but certainly not limitless power. I say almost limitless knowledge, because to the Phobos Omniscia/Knightmare existence is like a painting. It usually views this painting from a distance, seeing the whole, but it misses the minute details like texture and brush strokes.
In terms of physical power Knights has exceptional strength and durability, but while the matter that comprises it is technically indestructible, Knights is by no means unbeatable. Physical trauma destabilises its physical form. With enough trauma it would dematerialise. Its signature power is the ability to tap into the part of itself that lies within all consciousness and induce their fear. The limit on this is that Knights requires this fear energy to sustain itself and thus its range isn't far reaching. This varies between individual victims however.
I was going to go into my other uber-esque character but this post has dragged on long enough. In short though, whilst I have an uber concept character, I've nerfed him enough not to be god-mody.
----- Union's finest underachiever -----
Farewell CITY of HEROES
The First, the Last, the One.
Union: @ominousvoice2059
I will admit Ed is fairly uber.
He's a DM/Regen, they're notoriously tough and about to come tougher mechanicswise with the new Issue 13 changes but that's PvP and in PvP Ashley and Walter both took him down (damn you vomiting hold!). He fought a Purple IO'd up Lea tanker to a stand-still (neither could hurt one another), beat a BS/regen scrapper and managed to beat Walter once by getting the jump on him and a few lucky resists. That, however, is PvP, none of that was IC infact Ed has only had three IC fights in his entire career and two were against Battle Unit Omega and once agains a Kat/SR scrapper (who sadly I have forgotten the name of).
Edward actually would rather not go toe-to-toe with Cass, IC wise he knows Cass outmatches him pound for pound on the strength case, Ed can take the pummelling though.
He is, however, vulnerable.
Psychic powers can get in and screw with his head, they did deep enough and find his true name...he's toast. Soaring Horizon has Ed worried because she has experience fighting Demons, which means she would know various binding spells, containment spells and probably could research his true name given enough time.
All the damage Ed recieved in the 'thrive by chaos' thread was physically based, swords, grenades and fists, however is Soaring Horizon had been given enough time to let off a spell Ed would have been buggered.
Only two people know Eds true name, both of which have no interest in him any more.
Oddly Ed is a character of duality despite being the same person he is two different powersets and ATs.
When he's using his robots as a Mastermind Ed is quite easy to slap around if caught with his pants down. The reason for this was that I knew if I combined the two, a DM/Regen scrapper with the offensive power of Bots and the defensive power of Forcefields, he would be so overpowered he would be godly.
Mastermind Ed = Original Ed or Doctor Mechano, he's a frail old man who has a very weak bladder and if he has no bots or forcefields to protect him, he's going to be toast. However he does have mass firepower on his side and high levels of protection if he's well prepared.
DM/Regen Ed = Main fighting Ed, If Ed is going to get into a fight with another superpowered being, this is the form he'll take simply because Mastermind Ed would get pummelled to hell and back.
I've always thought of it as changes of focus, when using the bots, Ed doesn't see the need for his non-dark powers (he still has the dark powers from the Ghost Widow PP) and his forcefields will provide ample protection so he gets cocky, lets his gaurd down because the bots are doing most of the work and in day to day life most EB's (even some Archvillains) can be breezed through like a wet towel thanks to his gadgetry, he grows complacent and that's why if you break those defenses he's completely unprepared for it.
Scrapper Ed, meanwhile, means he knows he's going to get into trouble, he's focusing all of the nether energy he can muster and knows that he's got to use his fists and his regeneration because he doesn't have the mass firepower around to back him up.
Ed however, is a mad scientist, he gets his money through Necrotech Industries selling the Walkie-Talkie toaster and now offering the 'create a dream partner' service for the few that ask for it.
Of course the fact that most of his dream partner clients aren't actually after love dolls but getting him to create super-powered beings they can control means he gets paid top money to stop asking questions like, "so...you must like to play rough if you want them THIS tough...seriously, you know softer skin really would be better for this kind of investment..." and so on.
By now the walkie-talkie toaster industry has probably begun to fail due to his return to villainy and his products have probably been removed from all US store shelves, doesn't stop them being popular elsewhere though.
Badge Earned: Wing Clipper
A real showstopper!
I agree with the;
Story Canon > Player Canon > Mechanic Canon.
Personally, I think a sort of mass guidebook would be a good idea. Im sure nearly everyone knows the Union Handbook. Why not a 'Paragon Guidebook' RP inspired guide. I know that something of that scale would be a huge thing (and doubtless a lot of arguing) but it would be a useful point of reference. Note down IC locations and such, IC scales of power and relations...stuff like that? Otherwise, until the end of time, there will still be those awkward moments in RP, followed by "((Right, how do we fix this?))", "((I dunno -shrug- )).
A thought, anyhow. We have basic parts that could mesh nicely (the power graphs on the handbook and such). Again, as ever, it would depend on people agreeing on stuff.
That, and the continued suggestion of the Rikti Invasion code for enemies...-ponders-
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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