It's a major part of comics that I can't belive they've ignored.
Any major super hero has at some point been turned to the opposite gender and that includes Superman and Batman.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
they first made spiderman, later on you got spiderwoman...in the same suet 
also, if you look at camelion he uses shapeshifting and sex change fir getting in and out of highly securitive places without any problem, only with a spider sense like spiderman it's possible to sense him, but even then you first need to find him.
o and yes, there is absolutely no argument if not doing it.
there is lately a pretty simple thing in the MMO world, don't like it?, don't use it.
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o and yes, there is absolutely no argument if not doing it.
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Amount of coding involved, and the small number of people it would benefit.
See, you're talking of shapeshifting as a power - which we already have in the form of Peacebringers and Warshades. This type of "shapeshifting" though, would not be a power, but a cosmetic change; and one that may not make sense.
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they first made spiderman, later on you got spiderwoman...in the same suet
also, if you look at camelion he uses shapeshifting and sex change fir getting in and out of highly securitive places without any problem, only with a spider sense like spiderman it's possible to sense him, but even then you first need to find him.
o and yes, there is absolutely no argument if not doing it.
there is lately a pretty simple thing in the MMO world, don't like it?, don't use it.
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It breaks immersion for some people.
It's all fine and dandy to say, "Don't like it? Don't use it.", but I sure hope our team of developers does'nt think like that, and I highly doubt that they do, or they'd lose alot of subscribers very fast.
Don't even think of saying, "there's no argument for why it should'nt be implemented", because you're wrong. And what you're saying is completely different, Spiderman and Spiderwoman are two different people, he didn't get his reproductive organs changed.
It would just (in my opinion), be far too strange.
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o and yes, there is absolutely no argument if not doing it.
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That's quite obviously false - if there was absolutely no reason whatsoever for it not to be done, then it would have been done already. As it hasn't then there must be, in fact, at least one reason to not have done it by now.
@Jay Leon Hart
Kerensky: this has nothing to do with underwear
Zwillinger: I put on my robe and wizard hat...
Synapse: I had to resist starting my last post off with "Yo dawg!"
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they first made spiderman, later on you got spiderwoman...in the same suet
also, if you look at camelion he uses shapeshifting and sex change fir getting in and out of highly securitive places without any problem, only with a spider sense like spiderman it's possible to sense him, but even then you first need to find him.
o and yes, there is absolutely no argument if not doing it.
there is lately a pretty simple thing in the MMO world, don't like it?, don't use it.
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It breaks immersion for some people.
It's all fine and dandy to say, "Don't like it? Don't use it.", but I sure hope our team of developers does'nt think like that, and I highly doubt that they do, or they'd lose alot of subscribers very fast.
Don't even think of saying, "there's no argument for why it should'nt be implemented", because you're wrong. And what you're saying is completely different, Spiderman and Spiderwoman are two different people, he didn't get his reproductive organs changed.
It would just (in my opinion), be far too strange.
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Guy Gardener the manliest of the green lanterns got changed into 'Gal' Gardner for ages.
Batman and superman recently got changed into the bodies of Powergirl and Huntress.
Being changed into things is like one of the classic things from comics.
Gender,species, items at some point any super hero from a pre-ninteies era will of been changed into at least one of the above.
And that's not counting the various multi verse versions etc
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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It breaks immersion for some people.
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... I recently went through an RP plotline where my main - who's male - got turned into a woman by a witch he managed to tick off. Dr. Mechano's main hero even experimented with gender-switching recently (with kinda funny in-character results. 
)... That's somehow immersion-breaking? 
Sam: "My mind is a swirling miasma of scintillating thoughts and turgid ideas."
Max: "Me too."
Stuff
I think you missed the "some people".
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I think you missed the "some people".
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This may just me getting the wrong end of the stick but...
You've got people who accept this as a comic universe and thus accept things like death rays, gender changing and super animals etc as just being part of everyday stuff
((heavy or light Role Players))
Or
You've got people who just take it at face value and see it as being a game and thus don't get immersed in it any way?
((normal player))
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
If you're assuming those are the only two types of players, then yes you have the wrong end of the stick. In fact, that's not a stick, that's an iron bar.
"Normal players" can get immersed in the game as well as, sometimes more than, any roleplayer. The story arcs are like reading books, and you don't need to be a roleplayer to read a book; not to mention, not having a set timeline of events for your character (i.e. allowing a greater deal of sway), can mean it's easier to become immersed in a storyline than if your character wouldn't be doing the tasks given to you, say.
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If you're assuming those are the only two types of players, then yes you have the wrong end of the stick. In fact, that's not a stick, that's an iron bar.
"Normal players" can get immersed in the game as well as, sometimes more than, any roleplayer. The story arcs are like reading books, and you don't need to be a roleplayer to read a book; not to mention, not having a set timeline of events for your character (i.e. allowing a greater deal of sway), can mean it's easier to become immersed in a storyline than if your character wouldn't be doing the tasks given to you, say.
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If you're not doing it in character aka playing it as an RPEr accepting its a comic universe and thus not like the real one.
How do you maintain immersion when meanwhile you're team mates are disscusing say Big Brother or current sporting events?
Unless you mean soloing through story arcs ((Something I do myself)) in which case why is the ability to change genders in fact it's not really genders is it, the ability to change body setting since it's male,huge and female rather than just male/female choices affecting you're imersion at all?
In fact would that not make it more imersive it'd allow for the transforming characters, anything from visionaries to Iron Man, from the Hulk to Bannana Man.
Also y'know shape shifting characters etc
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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and one that may not make sense.
[/ QUOTE ]Why in the name of sanity do people keep bringing up this 'argument' in fantasy or otherwise supernaturally themed MMORPGs? It's absolutely worthless, a waste of the keys used to type it.
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Shape changing =/= gender swapping.
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As far as comics go, there's no difference.
The feeble "IT'S NOT NORMAL 
((((((" argument holds no merit. Lots of things aren't normal, and gender swapping has gotten a lot of mileage in the comics (Mystique and countless What Ifs immediatly spring to mind).
If you don't want the idea, fine, just use better reasoning than "IT'S NOT NORMAL ((((".
Oh, and costumes in and out of themselves don't serve a purpose. No more customisation options plx.
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You're right, lots of things aren't normal in the comic world. But that's not our argument, we're saying that a transgender system would be COMPLETELY out of place and unorthodox in such an environment. Mystique shape changes, I personally, forgive me if I'm wrong; can't recall a hero who has went into a surgery and had a sex change.
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Guy Gardener thought there was also a resurrection and an alien race that didn't like him but owed him one in there as well.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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they first made spiderman, later on you got spiderwoman...in the same suet
also, if you look at camelion he uses shapeshifting and sex change fir getting in and out of highly securitive places without any problem, only with a spider sense like spiderman it's possible to sense him, but even then you first need to find him.
o and yes, there is absolutely no argument if not doing it.
there is lately a pretty simple thing in the MMO world, don't like it?, don't use it.
[/ QUOTE ]
It breaks immersion for some people.
It's all fine and dandy to say, "Don't like it? Don't use it.", but I sure hope our team of developers does'nt think like that, and I highly doubt that they do, or they'd lose alot of subscribers very fast.
Don't even think of saying, "there's no argument for why it should'nt be implemented", because you're wrong. And what you're saying is completely different, Spiderman and Spiderwoman are two different people, he didn't get his reproductive organs changed.
It would just (in my opinion), be far too strange.
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Say what? it brakes immersion thats the lamest argument aghenst yet.
how is changing from male to female, female to male, etc any difrent from switching from a robot to a winged deamon?
dose it go somthin like oh god i cant play amy more cause that hot chick i was playing with has sudely transformed into a hulking great warebeast?
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I'm against this, it'd make the game too bizarre.
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You're playing a game where people can fly, teleport, fire energy beams from their hands, turn invisible, and perform moves like Head Splitter without actually killing the target.
And you think changing sex is too bizarre?
There's a HUGE number of quite valid reasons for being able to do this, most of which have been mentioned already. It doesn't hurt anyone, so why not?
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You're telling me, if Superman, or Spiderman got his bits swapped, and started sporting a pair of breasts, you WOULD'NT find that odd? Or bizarre?
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Well yes it would be a tad bizzar but then its no more bizzae than them chucking cars about and wall crawling
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Not really, that's part of the comic world, it's like mixing a western and a space film. Transgender ideas belong in a more indie kind of culture. Certain things are ordinary in certain cultures, but when you mix them, the results are odd. Like a monkey living underwater; people would be baffled!
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Except as several people have pointed out, you included, this isn't real life, changing your body type is not transvestism or transgenderism, its just changing your body type.
As for whether or not the issue is trivial I don't think anyone here, programmers included, knows exactly how the game works internally, it may just be a simple change or something that is horrendously complicated. Saying that the idea is not good based on how much work it might take to implement is pointless, we don't know.
I really don't see why some are being so objective to this idea, I think its brilliant!!
The male/female - huge and height slider are probably easy to implement. The male - female/female - male probably not so easy. But with the amount of RP value you can get from it all is big.!
Think of it like this. If its implemented and you don't want it. You don't have to use it. 
Think of it like this, Thorny Devil: If time and money is spent implementing it - things much more useful, much more exciting and much more understandable may have to be pushed back on the roster.
As for those who're getting their hackles up at the "it doesn't make sense" argument: In many cases, it doesn't. Batman changing into a woman doesn't make sense, either - even if they did do it. Same goes for Superman. Just because it was done, doesn't mean it makes the slightest bit of sense.
Shapeshifters make sense. But that is a power, changing gender in CoH would offer no benefit (beyond perhaps a wider range of costume options) to the vast majority of people. I would much, much rather have a new powerset that allowed various disguises to fit in with the shapeshifting idea.
I don't for a moment believe this would be easy to implement. For instance, when they first introduced gender specific text on the badges, it took a few attempts to get it to work - and that, apparently, is just changing some text and an ID number.
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Shapeshifters make sense.
[/ QUOTE ]Not the slightest bit more than shifting from male to female. Both are common in comic books, neither are possible in reality. Genderswapping actually falls under the shapeshifting category itself.
I'm pretty dang sure you just don't want it in-game because the thought bothers you and conflicts with personal beliefs or something, because all the other reasons you give aren't good reasons at all, except for "it would take time".
I could say the idea of Nazis bothers me and conflict with personal beliefs, and don't make sense because secretive paramilitary nazi super-soldier armies with robots and werewolves and dark energy aliens don't exist in reality.
Should the 5th Column be removed from the game -again- just because of that?
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I'm pretty dang sure you just don't want it in-game because the thought bothers you and conflicts with personal beliefs or something.
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Ahahahahahahahahaha.
Please go back a few pages and take note of the post made by me, stating I am not against the idea - I just don't think it likely, or worth the time and effort.
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I'm pretty dang sure you just don't want it in-game because the thought bothers you and conflicts with personal beliefs or something.
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Ahahahahahahahahaha.
Please go back a few pages and take note of the post made by me, stating I am not against the idea - I just don't think it likely, or worth the time and effort.
[/ QUOTE ]Oh yes, the other post full of absolute gems of objectivity and wisdom.
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This, I believe, is why it would be unlikely that controversial subjects like transgenderism, homosexuality etc. etc. are going to be covered to any great degree in a game rated suitable for younger people. Books and films, maybe - likely, in fact - but books and films are more likely to be educational than computer games; they have that loophole.
[/ QUOTE ]And you're worried about something like this in a game where you can play a sadistic murderer. Go read up on some Villain arcs and you'll find tons more "controversial" material than Presto-Changeo-Man magically changing into a woman. In a game. With superheroes/villains who can fart laserbeams out of their [censored], which is obviously more natural than homosexuality or trangenderism.
I'm not even sure where you were going with the "Books and films may include homosexuality or transgenderism but are more educational" bit, but it's early in the morning. Reading that sentence at the moment brings an image into my mind of a short educational picture book by Disney named "Mickey Mouse Teaches Homosexualism".
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you'll find tons more "controversial" material than Presto-Changeo-Man magically changing into a woman.
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I very much doubt the American developers and market would think the same way, though.
It wouldn't be bad if they put this in, if they do it then hey, it's another thing to play with for some people. That's great. It's more likely that if we get anything new aside from costume pieces for character customisation, it'll be the ability to change Height at Icon/Face.
Personally though I'd rather concentrate on some solid content.
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you'll find tons more "controversial" material than Presto-Changeo-Man magically changing into a woman.
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I very much doubt the American developers and market would think the same way, though.
It wouldn't be bad if they put this in, if they do it then hey, it's another thing to play with for some people. That's great. It's more likely that if we get anything new aside from costume pieces for character customisation, it'll be the ability to change Height at Icon/Face.
Personally though I'd rather concentrate on some solid content.
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Being turned into the opposite sex is a staple of American cartoons usually the character ends up learning that girls aren't icky or boys aren't stupid.
the type of people who'd get offended and quit probably already did after they met their first lesbian cat girl any way so no big deal.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
I don't see anything in that post about me being worried about it. What I do see, is me explaining why transgenderism can be seen as a mature subject, because it was already mentioned and the original poster had been accused of being narrow minded. I didn't relate that post to CoH/V, I related it to games targetted at a young audience. Please also note the "to any great degree". Mystique, for instance, does not cover transgenderism (or even homosexuality) to any great degree, whereas a character with a storyline covering the ins and outs of transgenderism would.
It is therefore, in my opinion, unlikely any game targetted at a young audience would have subject matter like this - whereas books and films have the loophole of being educational (i.e. not just for lols), and are more likely to cover mature or controversial subjects.
To give a related but not identical example: Lord Of The Flies is seen as a fantastic piece of literature, whereas the game Bully is seen as glamourising violence.
Superheroes are likely to be able to "fart laserbeams", as whilst obviously tricky, this can be used as a power. Shapeshifting also, is a power - being able to mimic the appearance of anyone (and in certain cases, anything)? Fantastic - that can be used to your advantage.
Changing gender, however, as it is (and this is very important) limited to a simple changing of the sex, does not, in my opinion (also a very important word), offer any benefit to a hero or villain whatsoever - bar maybe moonlighting. Moonlighting, of course, being possible with a secret identity.
Now, Kheldians - as they can already change form, gender changing would make sense for them. Not much sense, as again it would be just a cosmetic change, but with clever writing, it can mesh with the character. Same goes for having male and female characters swap to the huge bodytype - this makes sense in a Hulk like (or steroid use) way. Male to female for anyone, does not - storywise, make an awful lot of sense to me. A woman can disguise herself, or portray herself as a man and vice versa, without any need for a sex change. Granted this is not as easy with the costume creator, but that's where imagination comes in.
So, it is for this reason, and not my obvious prejudism, that I do not believe this QoL change to be useful or worth the time and effort needed to implement.
To be honest, I did forget that these days, you're not allowed to have an opinion differing from "EVERYTHING TABOO IS AWESOME" or you're a Nazi.
You'd think it was Saturday or something...
"Idealism is such a wonderful thing. All you really need is someone rational to put it to proper use." - Kerr Avon
Myopic Aardvark on Twitter
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((((((" argument holds no merit. Lots of things aren't normal, and gender swapping has gotten a lot of mileage in the comics (Mystique and countless What Ifs immediatly spring to mind).
((((".
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Shape changing =/= gender swapping.
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As far as comics go, there's no difference.
The feeble "IT'S NOT NORMAL
If you don't want the idea, fine, just use better reasoning than "IT'S NOT NORMAL
Oh, and costumes in and out of themselves don't serve a purpose. No more customisation options plx.
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You're right, lots of things aren't normal in the comic world. But that's not our argument, we're saying that a transgender system would be COMPLETELY out of place and unorthodox in such an environment. Mystique shape changes, I personally, forgive me if I'm wrong; can't recall a hero who has went into a surgery and had a sex change.
[/ QUOTE ]Not so sure about surgery (but nobody ever said anything about surgery before you just did anyway), but /characters/index.php]here's some transgendered heroes for you. Scroll to bottom, left side.
*edit* Bloody censor filters messing up the link.