AE stopping the farming


Adult_Swim

 

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Originally Posted by Shadow_Wail View Post
I think that the XP should be removed or given to the authors to decide if they want their arcs to grant XP.
No. I decide for MYSELF whether I get XP or not. PERIOD.

By removing the XP from the arcs on the authors side we do two things:

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1. those that do not want to have their arcs as Farm's/PL's PuGs can do so at their will.
2. It gives us the first line of defense against this issue.
How about NO.

If wroters don't want their missions used as farms DO NOT BUILD THEM LIKE YOU'D BUILD A FARM.

I could swear that something like this is intuitively obvious. But I'm also the type who eats when hungry, poops when necessary, and tries really hard to breath regularly.

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It gives us a solid solution..."Do it on your own terms" Since the Devs wont remove XP because the marketting dept is a bunch on heffers they can easily implement the option to disable xp from arcs on the authors request.
No, it simply patches symptoms and doesn't have any real affect on the root causes. Nor the outcome. People will still build farms.

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As to my other posts on other threads, IN MY PERSONAL OPINION (which may or may not reflect reality) AE has ruined the game for me in the fact that it DOES do the things that other people are clamining.
Fixed for you.

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I don't know everyone on this thread, I might have played with you on champion or on freedom or virtue but I know on champ redside that teams and limited...I often solo my villains. the experience from people on big servers is very diff than those on smaller servers. but I can say that what I have seen is not good.
So a confluence of:

Redside being more sparsely populated than blue-side
A portion of the population being diverted by AE
And your inability to team more aggressively

...is being blamed SOLELY on AE?



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Originally Posted by Shadow_Wail View Post
Saying that we should show the AE-Noobs the RC that the game has is not so easy...they are for most part fixed on parking themselves down in the AE buildings and ararely leaving. I have lead level 1-15 AE-Conversion run...kinda like the whole born again christian thing or the jehovah's whitness thing...but with RC. The responses I got from them is that the stories are nice but the XP is slow. I love the kalinda and Doc Creed arc and I love alot of the unlockable content in CoV ( BTW, have we ever gotten any sort of update on that system of NPCs? The Devs constantly add new badges but no new badge related contacts)
I quoted the whole paragraph for in-context purposes. I must say that I applaud you for getting some of the "AE babies" out of AE. Even if it didn't work. They should get bored with AE eventually, and, when they do, they will hopefully remember your RC tour and decide to check out the other, non-AE aspects of the game rather than just quitting altogehter. At least they enjoyed the stories. For those players who believe that the story is more important, finding out that there actually ARE non-AE stories in CoX is a kind of revelation (it also helps them understand the AE story arcs' humor/history).

As for the ease of getting the AE-only players out of AE... it varies. I play almost exclusively on Infinity, so I haven't had too hard a time with that. From what I've heard from multi-server players, it varies a LOT depending on what server you're on. The players who are determined to stick with AE forever are, in my opinion, just as narrow-minded as those who want to destroy AE/nerf it into insignificance/change it to benefit their personal playstyle. This is their problem, not yours. It affects you, but that doesn't make it your personal problem. It just makes it another aspect of the player base that you must adapt to.

Also, what was your general attitude towards AE when giving this RC tour? If it was along the lines of "You're being ignorant and I'm going to educate you," then some of the "AE-Noobs" could have been offended. They already got through/are in school, and this game is about relaxing and having fun, not sitting through another lesson. I prefer the "Let me show you something fun!" attitude, with an added, "let me know if you have any questions about anything at all." While this seems to be sending the same message as the first approach, it is decidedly more friendly and encourages the "AE-Noob" to have an active interest and ask more questions instead of sit in the back of the class and daydream about summer vacation.

I tend to be pretty upbeat and easygoing while playing, but maybe that's just me. If you have a different opinion about what I've said, please let me know. My opinion undergoes constant revisions (daily, if not hourly or minute-ly) based on people's responses, but my goal has been pretty consistant so far: Show new players that there's more to the game than just AE in a nice, positive way.

Another side-note; since this game is based largely on individual choice, I tend to analyze my choices before saying something is a built-in problem. Saying that I suggest you do the same would be counterproductive to my "tolerate differences" message, but I think that more people would benefit from considering that they might be at fault rather than the game itself (yes, I read that one thread that Ultimo_ started and Moderator_8 shut down, which is why I'm bothering to touch on this subject at all). If your perspective is different, I can deal with it, and maybe even learn from it. I'm willing to do that at least (ego alert).

By now, I'm completely off the subject of the original post, but I think I've made some valid points so far. As always, feel free to show your disagreements. I'll take them into account as I've done before (another ego alert).

Oh, I'm sorry if I wasn't offensive enough for you before. I'll try to do better next time.


 

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I'm still of the opinion that AE should have a required tutorial that is, in itself a story arc that allows the new players a chance at dev created content, gives information and tutorial-related information while intergrating the funnest part of RC. Then, once they finish the story arc, they have the choice of AE or RC.


I am a farmer, I farm MA, I farm RC, when I factor in purple drops, I find running RC farms more profitable, but more unpredictable due to the "Am I going to get a hecatomb? or a fort hypno?"

Seriously. yell more, I want to read more raged and stupid altoholic posts, he's my favorite poster due to the utter lack of logic and reason.


 

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Originally Posted by Not_Epsilon View Post
I'm still of the opinion that AE should have a required tutorial that is, in itself a story arc that allows the new players a chance at dev created content, gives information and tutorial-related information while intergrating the funnest part of RC. Then, once they finish the story arc, they have the choice of AE or RC.
I actually like that idea!


 

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Originally Posted by Bright_Shadow View Post
I actually like that idea!

Quite a few do, but Holy Anti-Farm preachers would rather blindly pursue the complete destruction of any way to farm MA, then come to an understandable solution.


 

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Originally Posted by Not_Epsilon View Post
Quite a few do, but Holy Anti-Farm preachers would rather blindly pursue the complete destruction of any way to farm MA, then come to an understandable solution.
The problem is, there is no solution. We cannot decide anything. It's up to the developers to decide what should be done with their game. And that is what I'm trying to squeeze into the brain of the anti-AE community. It's not working!


 

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Square peg, round hole bright, square, round, it doesn't work, I've tried. It just ends up with me on alt's ignore and him continueing to spew utter nonsense.


 

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If I can deviate for a second....

I got one of those anonymous remarks you can give now that deal with reputation or something. Apparently for the post I made where I illustrated some game concepts a new player wouldn't intuitively know (how enhancements work, positional versus typed defense, etc), I received the following remark:

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An opinion backed with facts that are nothing more then more opinions and false facts is indeed false. I would prefer an uninformed answer then an wrong opinion. Stay out of threads if you haven't left AE yet, stop farming, AE Noob.
Uh.... are you sure you were directing that to the right person? I rarely use AE, don't farm it when I do, and I've been playing for over five years. I'm definitely not an "AE Noob". Whoever you are, there's no reason to be rude just because you can do it anonymously (that's a poor character trait), but if you positively must, then at least direct it to the right person.


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Originally Posted by Barata View Post
If I can deviate for a second....

I got one of those anonymous remarks you can give now that deal with reputation or something. Apparently for the post I made where I illustrated some game concepts a new player wouldn't intuitively know (how enhancements work, positional versus typed defense, etc), I received the following remark:

Uh.... are you sure you were directing that to the right person? I rarely use AE, don't farm it when I do, and I've been playing for over five years. I'm definitely not an "AE Noob". Whoever you are, there's no reason to be rude just because you can do it anonymously (that's a poor character trait), but if you positively must, then at least direct it to the right person.
I don't wanna speculate. But that's a perfect example of some of the anti-farmer crowd that I've witnessed in these threads.

Regardless, don't care about rep too much.


 

Posted

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Originally Posted by Barata View Post
If I can deviate for a second....

I got one of those anonymous remarks you can give now that deal with reputation or something. Apparently for the post I made where I illustrated some game concepts a new player wouldn't intuitively know (how enhancements work, positional versus typed defense, etc), I received the following remark:



Uh.... are you sure you were directing that to the right person? I rarely use AE, don't farm it when I do, and I've been playing for over five years. I'm definitely not an "AE Noob". Whoever you are, there's no reason to be rude just because you can do it anonymously (that's a poor character trait), but if you positively must, then at least direct it to the right person.

Lulz, ask alt, i got something like that on mah rep, but ignored it cuz stupid is stupid

"Use of W T F" -Some kind of rep

"Useless troll" - Bad Rep

"Exploiting cheater" - Bad Rep

"Good idea" - Good Rep


 

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Originally Posted by Bright_Shadow View Post
I don't wanna speculate. But that's a perfect example of some of the anti-farmer crowd that I've witnessed in these threads.

Regardless, don't care about rep too much.

I don't want to speculate either, but at least that one was a complete sentence that makes sense in an of itself.

Here is what some brainiac repped me negatively for:

'your as dumb as alt'

I'm leaving mine on if I can get some more of those, that one is priceless.


 

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I dont like the anonmous(splol) part of it, i sign mine -Epsilon, cuz i aint afraid of u ethugs! :P


 

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Originally Posted by Hugginator View Post
I don't want to speculate either, but at least that one was a complete sentence that makes sense in an of itself.

Here is what some brainiac repped me negatively for:

'your as dumb as alt'

I'm leaving mine on if I can get some more of those, that one is priceless.
Both sides of the fence have their fair share of idiots.

Both sides have the same valid arguments.

Both sides are being stupid.

That's the gist of it all. That's why I haven't explicitly taken any sides! I'm a free girl! Woooo!


 

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Originally Posted by Bright_Shadow View Post
Both sides of the fence have their fair share of idiots.
Yes

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Originally Posted by Bright_Shadow View Post
Both sides have the same valid arguments.
Yes

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Originally Posted by Bright_Shadow View Post
Both sides are being stupid.
Possibly

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Originally Posted by Bright_Shadow View Post
That's the gist of it all. That's why I haven't explicitly taken any sides! I'm a free girl! Woooo!
LIIIIIEEEEEEEEESSSS


 

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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike View Post
Emphasis on the thing that makes this statement demonstrably false.
So I used the word ALL and you want to take me to task on it. OK, how about 97% of the nerfs are caused by Farmers/PL'rs and PVP? Now do you want to argue that its actually 93.2% not 97%? Obviously its not all, but its close enough.


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I'm suggesting that they released a significantly imperfect addition to the game, on top of that their happy happy idea that no one would abuse the addition was a serious mistake, on top of that, the completely lackluster enforcement of their own rules ergo 1 week or more to fix HUGE exploits like Comm officers and Mitos', thats egregious in the extreme, a person could have created 2 lvl 50's per day, so in the extreme 14 lvl 50 characters, THEN! they take a week or more to punish people for using what they have created is so ridiculous as to defy imagination!
No offense. But you're throwing rocks at people trying to manage a very large software project. A one week turnaround time for something like that is EXCELLENT. It's not as simple as clicking "File, Edit, Delete, Mito".

As to your position on punishing people who utilized an exploit once it became known? Are you SERIOUS?
I completely disagree, i'm throwing rocks at people mismanaging a very large software project, furthermore, I more than completely disagree, 1 Week is abysmal, a couple of them were more like 2 weeks, 1 day is reasonable, 2 days is unreasonable, for all of it, the fixes and punishment.

They need to apply immediate pot bellied stove to any punishments, waiting a week is abusive and confusing to players.

There are many strategies they could have employed to handle the exploits in a timely manner, yes they could have instantly temporarily disabled Mito's then applied a comprehensive fix later, that would be OK, waiting 2 weeks to do anything at all isn't.


 

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K, I didn't bother to read all 16 pages, but to put it simply, if you wanna stop people from farming in AE, limit them from getting any rewards after they've earned 10 bars worth of XP (even at 50, count up what it would be for 10 bars), and then cut them off from all rewards... no XP, no Inf., no Tix, nothing... well, they can still get inspirations I guess. Then, reset this counter once per day, at an arbitrary time. If people decide they want to farm, then they're done in half an hour, and have to leave the building if they want to make real progress, or wait until the next reset time.

Something like this would cover all the marketing points on the box on shelves in stores: a player could still level from 1 to 50 using only AE, and they can still use it starting at level 1.

IF that's too harsh, give "double-XP" credit similar to Patrol XP (could even have it stack with patrol XP-- giving 3x XP... normal once, patrol second, AE bank third) after the cap has been met for the day (but still no inf. or tix). I'd say this doubleing effect could count while earning real XP in while playing in AE, but the doubled part should count against that day's cap before they just start earning more banked XP again (so theoretically, if someone spends 30 minutes hitting the cap one day by farming, then keep farming and earn another 10 bars of banked XP, then come back the next day and farm again and do the same farm, they'll actually be done farming in 15 min before they just start banking XP again).

The idea here is to discourage the ridiculously fast XP/inf. gain and promote playing actual story arcs, which is what the AE was meant for. Typically we don't gain a full level by playing 2-3, even 4 arcs, depending on the level of the arc, especially with no end-of-mission bonuses, so it really won't hamper people who are creating/playing real arcs.

To balance all this, lower the price of tickets needed for rolls as people would be getting fewer per day.


 

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Originally Posted by Hugginator View Post
So I used the word ALL and you want to take me to task on it.
Yes. Because the truth is, you're speaking for YOURSELF, and trying to ad populum yourself into authority.

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OK, how about 97% of the nerfs are caused by Farmers/PL'rs and PVP?
Again, you can't prove this. It's simply another number out of the RNG (Rectal Number Generator). It's a supposition.

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Now do you want to argue that its actually 93.2% not 97%? Obviously its not all, but its close enough.
The problem is, the only ones who can tell you how many of these nerfs are because of PL/Farm/PVP are the devs. You, OTOH, are merely thrashing around attempting to fix blame to someone.


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I completely disagree, i'm throwing rocks at people mismanaging a very large software project, furthermore, I more than completely disagree, 1 Week is abysmal, a couple of them were more like 2 weeks, 1 day is reasonable, 2 days is unreasonable, for all of it, the fixes and punishment.
All I can say is that you don't have any clue as the the magnitude of the undertaking of this project. Having done software development, version and change tracking, I do. Again, you don't simply have Posi drop in, edit a single line of code and fix everything.

Seeing as you're demonstrating a complete ignorance of this issue, I'll leave it there. Arguing about something with someone who not only doesn't know what they're talking about, but militantly refuses to understand or admit that they don't isn't productive.

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There are many strategies they could have employed to handle the exploits in a timely manner, yes they could have instantly temporarily disabled Mito's then applied a comprehensive fix later, that would be OK, waiting 2 weeks to do anything at all isn't.
They DID temporarily disable Mitos. Granted, temporary could be "indefinite". You're basically arguing an arbitrary timetable, based on lack of understanding of the change process in a software project.



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NExt person who deviates from this threads obvious topic of the discussion of silly lolrep comments is going to get sum srs bad lolrep rage comment.


 

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Originally Posted by Hugginator View Post
So I used the word ALL and you want to take me to task on it. OK, how about 97% of the nerfs are caused by Farmers/PL'rs and PVP? Now do you want to argue that its actually 93.2% not 97%? Obviously its not all, but its close enough.
I can't believe I actually read that...

This has got to the most empty, unthoughtful, and out of the blue thing I have ever read on these threads. Seriously.


 

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Originally Posted by Bright_Shadow View Post
I can't believe I actually read that...

This has got to the most empty, unthoughtful, and out of the blue thing I have ever read on these threads. Seriously.
Remember, the first rule of a lousy argument. Pull a statistic out of someplace dark and smelling of feces.



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Posted

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Originally Posted by Hugginator View Post
So I used the word ALL and you want to take me to task on it. OK, how about 97% of the nerfs are caused by Farmers/PL'rs and PVP? Now do you want to argue that its actually 93.2% not 97%? Obviously its not all, but its close enough.
How bout 0% .... People report bugs which cause the dev's to fix these bugs. Imbalanced game mechanics cause nerfs, not farmers.


 

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Originally Posted by bricktop View Post
That is the point of sewer teams. Fast leveling and easy rewards.
If you had to choose today to change only one: AE or The Sewers, so that it can be enjoyed in a more responsible manner, which would you choose?

I'd be delusional if I thought we could stop the farming entirely. If they are driven enough, they will find some way and be joyous in exploiting the system. This is nothing new and it is evidenced not only in online games, but in everyday life.

The Sewers are not without their faults, but it has graces as well. I find The Sewers a far lesser evil than the AE farming that goes on. There is even a taskforce exclusively for the Sewers!

You don't get salvage in the lowbie Sewers. You do speed through the first 6-7 levels, but then you and you team get bored, die, or have other things to do, and leave to catch a real team in King's Row, usually to get a Raptor Pack. And you don't get tickets to buy recipies or salvage or enhancements without having to spend precious influence.

While I am sorry to offend, I still stand by my statement. I personally would far rather endorse The Sewers than AE.


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Originally Posted by Maleficent View Post
If you had to choose today to change only one: AE or The Sewers, so that it can be enjoyed in a more responsible manner, which would you choose?

I'd be delusional if I thought we could stop the farming entirely. If they are driven enough, they will find some way and be joyous in exploiting the system. This is nothing new and it is evidenced not only in online games, but in everyday life.

The Sewers are not without their faults, but it has graces as well. I find The Sewers a far lesser evil than the AE farming that goes on. There is even a taskforce exclusively for the Sewers!

You don't get salvage in the lowbie Sewers. You do speed through the first 6-7 levels, but then you and you team get bored, die, or have other things to do, and leave to catch a real team in King's Row, usually to get a Raptor Pack. And you don't get tickets to buy recipies or salvage or enhancements without having to spend precious influence.

While I am sorry to offend, I still stand by my statement. I personally would far rather endorse The Sewers than AE.
No difference between sewers, AE, or radios/newspapers, as all are content done to avoid the boring stale dev content misisons that aren't tfs.

I see nothing wrong in wanting to avoid doing something you'd done 1323134 times, if you find something else in game fun.


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Posted

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Originally Posted by Maleficent View Post
If you had to choose today to change only one: AE or The Sewers, so that it can be enjoyed in a more responsible manner, which would you choose?
What is responsible in game is just a matter of opinion. I don't see people's responsiblities in game as anything more than not hitting up people in /b for cyber, or talking smack about how much better CO is in /help, and making sure their SG/Coalition mates are getting teams.

AE hands down. No other teams complaining we are kill stealing. No one running there lvl 50 behind us on auto heal. No random high lvl blasters showing up and nuking every mob we were trying to fight.

And the usual run was sewers till 7, Kings Row radio till you get the raptor pack, Hollows till you run Frostfire usually 2 times, then if you have a good team head to Faultline.