End usage on lowbies, please revise
By
Ad Astra,
Posted on: 2009-06-11 18:49 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
Other than the Dominator changes on Test - have there been any large scale changes to Endurance usage?
I can't recall any and I'm making new alts every month. Perhaps I'm just used to knowing that lowbie End is something to struggle with. I know that it's better to slot my lowbie alts with End Redux & Recharge (but not too much Recharge or I won't have the End to use the power) instead of slotting Damage and Accuracy. I know which powers are sucking down the End more and slot accordingly. I know not to keep Sprint on while fighting. I know which toggles are used for which foes and turn the others off to save End.
I guess my point is that it's easy to forget all these little tools when you haven't played a lowbie in a while, but knowing them is part of knowing how to play the lowbie alt.
Oh, and BTW - you do know that Castle really isn't the guy to ask for more content from, right? Different Devs have different roles on the team.
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Originally Posted by SpyralPegacyon
"You gave us a world where we could fly. I can't thank you enough for that."
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I find that after using my powers twice, I do not have enough endurance to do anything else and at first I thought that my imagination was playing tricks on me until everyone else started saying the same thing.
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What powers do you have? Do they really cost 34 endurance each?
And when do you think this "change" occurred? Because I create alts all the time (almost quite literally) and while yes, Endurance is an issue for most low level characters, it's not exactly NEW. In fact, except for the time they applied a solid across-the-board endurance reduction (back in I5? I6?) they haven't exactly altered endurance costs for really... anything. (until the new Dominator changes, which seems to be a work in progress)
So strike me as amused and confused by your little rant.
It's always rough after playing a high level character for a long time, and then starting over from scratch. Things seem to go a LOT slower that you're used to. However, to the best of my knowledge, the devs haven't made any sweeping increases to the amount of endurance our powers use lately. In fact, endurance costs were cut across the board a few years ago, while cookies & Kool-Aid were passed out to the first 100 players who skipped Stamina. Don't quote me on that though.
Also, they gave us "Beginner's Luck", which makes it much easier to hit stuff at earlier levels. And since we're hitting more often, we don't need to light off as many attacks before arresting a bad guy - which means we're burning less endurance! I don't mean to sound like a suck [censored], but the devs really are a bunch of sweathearts!
The endurance crunch at the earlier levels has always sucked compared to later on. But that just makes those higher levels all the more satisfying to reach!
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Yeah, endurance usage hasn't changed, but the contrast after playing a high-level character can be jarring. Since you have Beginner's Luck before level 20, I often slot endurance reduction primarily, with things like accuracy, damage and recharge coming second. That usually changes when I have access to SOs and Stamina in the 20s, but I'd recommend slotting heavily for EndRedux and using toggles selectively in the low levels.
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Other than the Dominator changes on Test - have there been any large scale changes to Endurance usage?
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... well, in issue 6 they dropped base endurance for everything by 15% or so, because you could no longer 6-slot Stamina. That improved life for lowbies by 15% or so.
Yeah, that was about 4 years ago.
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
I have two low leveled characters 5 and under that I have been playing lately. I can't say that I have noticed any additional end drag on powers or being unable to make more than two attacks.
I tend to fight groups with reds and oranges often by myself at that level and I'm not seeing the end problems that you are talking about...and that's even with using vet powers.... I do not, however, use Sands of Mu - that sucks a lot of end, but it is a cone attack which can hit a good number of foes at once if it is successful.
I have to Rest more during the lower levels, but that doesn't really curtail play, it just makes it more strategic as you have to be careful about running out of energy mid fight and planning attack sequences based on end usage.
I also don't know how you are slotting your enhancements at the lower levels.
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Other than the Dominator changes on Test - have there been any large scale changes to Endurance usage?
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... well, in issue 6 they dropped base endurance for everything by 15% or so, because you could no longer 6-slot Stamina. That improved life for lowbies by 15% or so.
Yeah, that was about 4 years ago.
[/ QUOTE ]I believe they reduced the endurance costs of Defender and Tanker powers a long time ago as well, to compensate for their low damage.
Other than the Dominator changes on Test and a few individual powers, I don't think they've ever increased endurance usage; and in those cases where endurance costs go up, it's because the damage went up.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Did you remember to turn off Sprint?
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Did you remember to turn off Sprint?
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That's usually what hoses me in the early levels, yep.
Actually, what powersets are you using, I'm curious.
Currently playing:
The Domestic: Broom/WP
Shadowhex: Dark Control/Dark Affinity
Defenestration Lass: Grav/Kin
"See, this is what happens when you have to shove all this stuff into your pockets: it's easy to misplace a suborbital warhead." -Arcanaville, on how crowded our power trays are getting lately
The other question being "What was the character you usually played before this?"
I know some people who started the game on Regen scrappers who don't EVER believe they should have endurance problems.
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
arent the devs nerfing acc this issue?
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arent the devs nerfing acc this issue?
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Man, after 14 issues of nerfing accuracy i'd hope they'd be tired of doing that. 
i remember when the Devs reduced end costs across the board, it made things so much easier at the low levels. As someone who regularly creates and plays lowbies i will testify that going from playing an IO'd out 50 to a level 5 can be a bit jarring. Still, i find lowbies are perfectly playable after a brief adjustment period of play style.
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No end usage problems. Nothing has changed at all to my knowledge. I think you are just used to playing your high level (maybe tricked out) characters, so it seems higher in comparison.
It's kind of like being used to a Formula 1 car and then getting into a Corvette and saying: "Man, this thing is SLOW!"
If you're playing a Dark Armor anything, try not to use Dark Regen too often 
That one IS an end bar killer.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Did you remember to turn off Sprint?
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This
@Mojo-
Proud Member of Fusion Force.
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Today I decided to create a new alt on freedom, and I have to say that the endurance usage has gone through the roof.
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no it hasn't.
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Slot acc till you're hitting consistently (shouldn't need much at lower levels thanks to Beginner's Luck), then slot damage. It's about as efficient DPE-wise as slotting endredux, but has the added bonus of adding mitigation through faster defeats.
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arent the devs nerfing acc this issue?
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That's standard protocol. Every time a new issue gets released, dark melee's accuracy goes down by 1% every hour until someone posts about it on the forums. The devs have a betting pool for how long it takes for that post to show up.
The Bacon Compels You.
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Today I decided to create a new alt on freedom, and I have to say that the endurance usage has gone through the roof.
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no it hasn't.
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Well technically, if he re-rolled the same powersets but didn't slot the same endredux in powers as he had on the original then, yes, his personal use of endurance is larger! 
LOL Johnny. /dark needs an accuracy boost imo. I've made 2 brand new toons. Both blasters. Elec/elec and ice/mental. I can attack with all 4 powers several times and still have blue. I don't know any powers ive made lately that only get 2 attacks and done.
They should fix everything -- endurance, damage, defense, recharge -- so all brand-new level 1 characters work just like a purpled-out level 50. That way no one is disappointed! Of course, there's nothing to look forward to either.
If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
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The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog
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Today I decided to create a new alt on freedom, and I have to say that the endurance usage has gone through the roof.
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no it hasn't.
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Well technically, if he re-rolled the same powersets but didn't slot the same endredux in powers as he had on the original then, yes, his personal use of endurance is larger!
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har!
and a revision to reflect dom changes:
No it hasn't (unless you're playing a dominator).
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
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I have played this game now for over 5 years...
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Do you have/use a lot of the vet rewards attacks in your attack chain?
Now, either remove the gun from my spine or engage the safety please.
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Today I decided to create a new alt on freedom, and I have to say that the endurance usage has gone through the roof.
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no it hasn't.
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Well technically, if he re-rolled the same powersets but didn't slot the same endredux in powers as he had on the original then, yes, his personal use of endurance is larger!
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har!
and a revision to reflect dom changes:
No it hasn't (unless you're playing a dominator).
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Well the endurance used per attack has generally increased, but if most of the feedback is at all plausible the endurance used per point of damage is generally the same or lower.
My personal experience using pre-level 25 Doms (my highest level Dom is 23) on test is that they defeat enemies quite a bit faster while building Domination slower, so i can't rely on replenishing my endurance by triggering Domination as often. My Mind/Thorn Dom already had Stamina to make using TK easier and hasn't had any endurance issues. Then again i'm using TK less since enemies tend to die much quicker.
Still only on test, so the OP's whinging is still irrelevant/incorrect.
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
Accuracy should always be slotted first, then end cost IMO - and I mean double slotting acc for the most part.
Damage would be last depending on the AT - blasters can go for damage a bit more IMO.
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I have played this game now for over 5 years and I have seen many changes come and go, some good, but so many I feel are so bad and are really hurting this game in many ways.
Today I decided to create a new alt on freedom, and I have to say that the endurance usage has gone through the roof. I find that after using my powers twice, I do not have enough endurance to do anything else and at first I thought that my imagination was playing tricks on me until everyone else started saying the same thing.
I know that being a lowbie alt should be hard and I accept that, but I really have to say that all this power balancing every issue and patch is now beginning to get me down with this game. It seems Castle you are just not intent on balancing, re-balancing and then changing your mind again, it really begins to seem that you are just changing powers for the sake of changing them and nothing more.
Personally, rather than reducing everyones alts into blandness, maybe you guys could actually spend a little more time on content, bug fixing and other little things that might make playing this game more enjoyable rather than what we have right now. In 5 years, I have never seen this game as buggy and as horrible as it is now to play.
/rant off