Kruunch faded after my post (that he did not read) noted clearly how "gauntlet" accuracy is enhanceable. By this point he may had already labeled the entire thread pure minutia and walked away.
Lacrymosa may eventually post replying only to BrimstoneBruce and claim the only reason it works for mud pots is because it does damage, he wont bother checking Sarrate's demo records.
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I'm still speculating whether it happens because of threat decay, because a server tick is missed, or because server ticks, as Arcanaville measured them, are .132 seconds instead of the supposed .125 seconds
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Just a note: that number is the combat action clock that governs player commands (like activating a power). There are other clocks: the 1/30 sec animation frame clock for example. There also appears to be a 0.125 second internal clock that relates to things like DoT ticking, although that is *extremely* difficult to determine as the other clocks blur attempts to measure this (one way to attempt to measure the clock that governs effects such as that is to record such activity and look for "aliasing" where multiple ticks happen simultaneously, which implies a case where the animation clocks and the internal clocks misaligned, giving a hint as to the structure of the internal clock). And I have hints of a 0.5 second (or multiple thereof) clock governing AI decisions.
When the IWill bug occured, I was able to measure the rapidfire heals as occuring at 0.118 second intervals, plus or minus 0.01 seconds. That's consistent with a 0.125 clock, and the IWill bug was likely pushing the internal attribmod clock to its limit.
(The Iwill bug essentially created a situation where a power granted a heal with a duration which essentially told the game engine "heal that character, constantly." The fact that the heal pulses occured at 0.118 second intervals suggests that is as fast as the game engine can apply ticks of things, at least where it involves power effects).
In any case, there are multiple clocks that govern different things, so the 0.132 second clock isn't likely to be responsible for oddities unrelated to player activity. But other clocks, like the 0.125 second clock, might.
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Following the clock tangent...
How would that work with a power like Phalanx Fighting? Reason I ask:
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Activate period 1 seconds
* DEF(Melee, Ranged, AOE) +3% for 0.81s
* DEF(Melee, Ranged, AOE) +5% for 1.25s [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
[/i]Effect does not stack from same caster[/i]
[/ QUOTE ]
That looks like it's not perma, but if you ArcanaTime it (did I honestly just make that a verb?) it comes out to 1.056s - scraping the bare minimum to be considered perma. (I keep forgetting to test in game if PF twitches like Invincibility does - and that has an activation period of 1s and the stacking def component lasts 1s. That'd be a 0.188s stack if it uses the 0.132s clock.)
[edit: Huh, CoT Behemoth Invincibility has a 0.5s activation period and a 0.33s duration - or 0.528s duration on the 0.132s clock.]
[edit: Oops, I mean 0.132s clock. Fixed.]
[ QUOTE ]
Following the clock tangent...
How would that work with a power like Phalanx Fighting? Reason I ask:
[ QUOTE ]
Activate period 1 seconds
* DEF(Melee, Ranged, AOE) +3% for 0.81s
* DEF(Melee, Ranged, AOE) +5% for 1.25s [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
[/i]Effect does not stack from same caster[/i]
[/ QUOTE ]
That looks like it's not perma, but if you ArcanaTime it (did I honestly just make that a verb?) it comes out to 1.056s - scraping the bare minimum to be considered perma. (I keep forgetting to test in game if PF twitches like Invincibility does - and that has an activation period of 1s and the stacking def component lasts 1s. That'd be a 0.188s stack if it uses the 0.125s clock.)
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Well, keep in mind "ArcanaTime" factors two things in: the cast time expiration, followed by a clock delay before the next attack can fire. Presumably, even if Phalanx Fighting obeyed ArcanaTime clocks, it wouldn't have to wait for a clock for something else to happen, because nothing else is going to happen. So the power would really last for RoundUp(0.81/0.132)*0.132 = 0.924 without the "+1" delay.
Moreover, the 0.132 ArcanaTime clock is probably a representation of the game engine's attempt to align player actions to the animation clock, which might not need to be true for attribmod ticks (in fact, I know its not true based on the behavior of very fast DoTs). So really, its more likely that the "true" duration of that effect is closer to RoundUp(0.81/.125)*0.125 = 0.875 seconds.
What would be interesting would be to see if a power that lasts 0.9 seconds and ticks at 1.0 seconds is actually perma. If it is, it suggests that durations obey a faster clock, probably the 1/30th second clock. I'm not sure if there is a power like that off the top of my head (or something with similar circumstances).
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What IF the game is actually a loop that is set to trigger once every .125 seconds. (Most modern games are basically designed this way)
What IF nothing gets changed in between those cycles other than, off course, ongoing processing of the previous cycle.
What if the DoT is explained by the cycle clock simply saying "this many ticks will go on during this cycle, send the client the time stamps it should display them at"?
Okay, someone bring me up to speed. What are we debating here? The OP was asking which aspect of that taunt was enhanced, correct?
"I am a Tank. I am your first choice, I am your last hope." -- Rune Bull
"Durability is the quintessential super-power. " -- Sailboat
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Okay, someone bring me up to speed. What are we debating here? The OP was asking which aspect of that taunt was enhanced, correct?
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That question was so five days ago. Since then, we've covered threat calculations, epeen measurements, aggro auras, and the game's internal clocks. Do try to keep up. 
Victory: @Brimstone Bruce
Brimstone Bruce (lvl50 Stone/Fire Tanker) Broadside Bruce (lvl50 Shield/WM Tanker)
Ultionis (lvl50 Dark/Dark Defender) Cortex Crusher (lvl50 Mind/Kin Controller)
Patronox (lvl50 Kat/Dark Scrapper) Harbinger Mk.7 (lvl50 Bots/FF MM)
NightShift for Life.
[ QUOTE ]
What IF the game is actually a loop that is set to trigger once every .125 seconds. (Most modern games are basically designed this way)
What IF nothing gets changed in between those cycles other than, off course, ongoing processing of the previous cycle.
What if the DoT is explained by the cycle clock simply saying "this many ticks will go on during this cycle, send the client the time stamps it should display them at"?
[/ QUOTE ]
Its possible and probable, given the evidence. However, I haven't ruled out faster clocks yet. In theory, there is a way to do so that's on my todo list, but haven't gotten around to yet. I have demorecords of oldschool Hamidon raids, which operated under a wide range of server lag and clock distortion. Such clock distortions should provide evidence of the size of the clock quantum under certain circumstances. It just hasn't been a priority to investigate that particular element of it yet.
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Brimstone's first vid proves my point. About 38sec's in you see the Granite tank loose aggro. He has to reestablish more than a few times, and the mob wasn't even that big. And this is with an Elec blaster. Imagine a fire blaster or an Ice.
On that note , I'd like to thank BrimstoneBruce for the vids and would loved if you kept them up as I wish to use them as further evidence.
Fact; Gauntlet is broken
Aura's arent as strong as most think they are.
If a Blaster can take aggro away, a scrapper should have no problem.
Taunt is needed.
"If you can make a girl laugh, you can make her do anything"
"You're like Giraffe's, the way you look down on me, with your vegetarian scorn."
[ QUOTE ]
Okay, someone bring me up to speed. What are we debating here? The OP was asking which aspect of that taunt was enhanced, correct?
[/ QUOTE ]
Generally duration. However (and I don't know if this was covered originally) whether the magnitude or the duration of an effect is enhanced by enhancements or other buffs is not "baked into" the game engine directly. Its actually a function of how the power is designed.
By convention, for example, hold duration is enhanced for hold powers, because that is how all hold powers are designed. However, interestingly its actually hold *magnitude* that is (theoretically) enhanceable in mez protection powers. Keep in mind a mez protection power is nothing more than a power that applies a mez to yourself, but with negative magnitude. If you could somehow slot practiced brawler with hold, it would increase the hold magnitude of the protection, not the duration.
One way to see this in action is to note that when mez protection powers are under the effects of a mez strength debuff (such as benumb) it actually reduces magnitude protection, not duration.
Colloquially, enhancing taunt always increases duration of taunt (indirectly, that affects the strength of the taunt anyway due to taunt mechanics). But its always *possible* that the devs could create a taunt effect that enhancement would increase magnitude instead of duration, so this rule should be applied carefully when talking about potential bugs or new in-game effects.
(This is either-or. You cannot make an effect that enhancements will boost *both* duration and magnitude of. Its not possible because that is essentially a radio button in the devs powers design: there's no way to say "both" at the moment).
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[ QUOTE ]
Brimstone's first vid proves my point. About 38sec's in you see the Granite tank loose aggro. He has to reestablish more than a few times, and the mob wasn't even that big. And this is with an Elec blaster. Imagine a fire blaster or an Ice.
On that note , I'd like to thank BrimstoneBruce for the vids and would loved if you kept them up as I wish to use them as further evidence.
Fact; Gauntlet is broken
Aura's arent as strong as most think they are.
If a Blaster can take aggro away, a scrapper should have no problem.
Taunt is needed.
[/ QUOTE ]
*headdesk*
Lets ignore that those were out of range, shall we?
Heck here: a blank page. I bet it will be equally usefull to your sack of evidence.
This is off subject but.....wouldn't it be nice if taunt (the actual power) was an inherit? =p
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Brimstone's first vid proves my point. About 38sec's in you see the Granite tank loose aggro. He has to reestablish more than a few times, and the mob wasn't even that big. And this is with an Elec blaster. Imagine a fire blaster or an Ice.
On that note , I'd like to thank BrimstoneBruce for the vids and would loved if you kept them up as I wish to use them as further evidence.
Fact; Gauntlet is broken
Aura's arent as strong as most think they are.
If a Blaster can take aggro away, a scrapper should have no problem.
Taunt is needed.
[/ QUOTE ]
Kruunch's main point was
[ QUOTE ]
Taunt Aura + Gauntlet effect will allow you to control agro very well in melee range. Taunt auras by themselves will not.
[/ QUOTE ]
Everything that was in range of Mud Pots was aggroed, and stayed aggroed. Everything that wasn't was anybody's guess.
EDIT: And when did this turn into a debate on whether or not taunt was needed? That includes so many other variables that are far beyond the scope of the vids I made. My vids were to address the question of whether or not aggro auras were strong enough to maintain aggro on the mobs they were affecting. In the case of my experiments, that was shown to be true.
Victory: @Brimstone Bruce
Brimstone Bruce (lvl50 Stone/Fire Tanker) Broadside Bruce (lvl50 Shield/WM Tanker)
Ultionis (lvl50 Dark/Dark Defender) Cortex Crusher (lvl50 Mind/Kin Controller)
Patronox (lvl50 Kat/Dark Scrapper) Harbinger Mk.7 (lvl50 Bots/FF MM)
NightShift for Life.
[ QUOTE ]
This is off subject but.....wouldn't it be nice if taunt (the actual power) was an inherit? =p
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't think I have not proposed this many times.
I would love Taunt being made an inherent (slottable inherent) but (good thing) it would have to be replaced by some power in every set and thats a lot of work (bad thing.)
[ QUOTE ]
EDIT: And when did this turn into a debate on whether or not taunt was needed? That includes so many other variables that are far beyond the scope of the vids I made.
[/ QUOTE ]
It didn't, the guy noted he was Off topic. Still would be nice for it to be, given how the power is identical across all power sets.
Edit: Stop editing!!!!
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[ QUOTE ]
EDIT: And when did this turn into a debate on whether or not taunt was needed? That includes so many other variables that are far beyond the scope of the vids I made.
[/ QUOTE ]
It didn't, the guy noted he was Off topic. Still would be nice for it to be, given how the power is identical across all power sets.
Edit: Stop editing!!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
I think the question on Taunt was focsed on Lac's comment that because we can't hold Agro with Taunt Auras (which is blatantly false, as demonstrated by the recordings posted), a Tank needs to have Taunt.
Oh right, that post was so lacking I entirely forgot about it containing the word Taunt in it.
*Double-post deleted... stupid work connection.*
Victory: @Brimstone Bruce
Brimstone Bruce (lvl50 Stone/Fire Tanker) Broadside Bruce (lvl50 Shield/WM Tanker)
Ultionis (lvl50 Dark/Dark Defender) Cortex Crusher (lvl50 Mind/Kin Controller)
Patronox (lvl50 Kat/Dark Scrapper) Harbinger Mk.7 (lvl50 Bots/FF MM)
NightShift for Life.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
EDIT: And when did this turn into a debate on whether or not taunt was needed? That includes so many other variables that are far beyond the scope of the vids I made.
[/ QUOTE ]
It didn't, the guy noted he was Off topic. Still would be nice for it to be, given how the power is identical across all power sets.
Edit: Stop editing!!!!
[/ QUOTE ]
I think the question on Taunt was focsed on Lac's comment that because we can't hold Agro with Taunt Auras (which is blatantly false, as demonstrated by the recordings posted), a Tank needs to have Taunt.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yar, this. Wasn't directed at you Rinkoz. 
And sorry for the editing... I can never seem to make my entire point at once.
Victory: @Brimstone Bruce
Brimstone Bruce (lvl50 Stone/Fire Tanker) Broadside Bruce (lvl50 Shield/WM Tanker)
Ultionis (lvl50 Dark/Dark Defender) Cortex Crusher (lvl50 Mind/Kin Controller)
Patronox (lvl50 Kat/Dark Scrapper) Harbinger Mk.7 (lvl50 Bots/FF MM)
NightShift for Life.
[ QUOTE ]
Fact; Gauntlet is broken
[/ QUOTE ]
Broken in what way specifically? As far as I can tell, Gauntlet works in exactly the way I believe its designed to work.
By the way, since I'm not sure this was ever directly touched upon, Gauntlet isn't actually a "special" effect. Actually, all single target tanker attacks are designed to be AoE taunts. What's special about them is actually the *damage* that is specially coded to affect only the dead center of the AoE which is presumed to be the targetted foe.
Well, there's also that odd 20% penalty for certain kinds of targets, but I've never specifically gone out of my way to figure out which kinds of critters are appropriately tagged.
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So, where did Kruunch and Lacrymosa go?
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
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