Tough from the fighting pool???
It only adds 11.25% def at base. Three sloting it with standard def IO's, it would provide about 15% resistance.
You have got your numbers wrong somehow. I'm not a Mid's user much so you would need to ask someone else on how you possibly got your numbers wrong.
There are many irritating features on Mids that sometimes sneakily get your numbers wrong. EG: The average damage feature.
His numbers are correct.
Slotting 3 level 50 Resist IOs provides a bonus of 58.48%.
Here are the Brute's number breakdown:
26.25 (charged armor) + 11.25 (tough) = 37.5
37.5 * 1.5848 = 59.43
You also have to consider caps and base health.
Oh sorry.
I thought he was saying that he got all of that resistance from Tough alone. lol. My bad :P
Tough Base #:
15%-- Tankers, Defenders, Controllers, Masterminds, & SoAs
12.8%-- Dominators
11.3%-- Scrappers, Khelds, Brute, Corrupter, & Stalker
10.5%-- Blaster
Now, if you take SoA's out of the picture, you could infer that the most damaging ATs get the lesser benefit from the fighting pool generally. Of course there are exceptions- some powersets perform better than others on each AT. SO is it fair? NO. Sometimes your best protection is to kill as fast as you can.
I think what's confusing the OP is "the role of a Brute". Seems a lot of people look at their powers and assume that brutes are tanks because they share certain powersets (I'm looking at you Stone Armor!).
Think of a brute as a scrapper and you'll be a lot happier with it. That is what their role really is.
@Roderick
I do think of Brutes as scrappers, except everyone else expects Brutes to Tank.
Virtue: The-Invictus (Blue)
The Emissary of Justice - Level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
The Emissary of Justice. - Level 50 WP/Fire Tanker
Mesmerius - Level 50 Psi/Mental Blaster
Nucleoa - Level 50 Rad/Son Defender
[ QUOTE ]
I do think of Brutes as scrappers, except everyone else expects Brutes to Tank.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's sad but true. In reality, the tanks of Villains are supposed to be the Master Minds. A strange, twisted version, mind you.... but they are the one who were supposed to be able to handle taking alpha the easiest.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I do think of Brutes as scrappers, except everyone else expects Brutes to Tank.
[/ QUOTE ]
It's sad but true. In reality, the tanks of Villains are supposed to be the Master Minds. A strange, twisted version, mind you.... but they are the one who were supposed to be able to handle taking alpha the easiest.
[/ QUOTE ]
I have built a Tankermind and they do ok, they would be better with taunt though. Presence pool is a weak taunt.
All brutes tank fine. But their builds have to be tighter. There has to be a trade off for that 750% damage cap.
I'm not sure I see the relevance of the blaster/defender comparison. No brutes I know would wait until level 41+ to take armours, and based on only the quoted S/L resists, defenders and blasters can't perform the "role of a brute" either.
There are no hard iTrials, only hard peo-... er... wait.
The relevance of the defender/blaster comparison is simple. The Brute AT is designed to hold aggro, but lacks the tools on it's own to survive it (excluding Stone). The job of a Blaster is to kill. The job of a Defender is to protect the team. Considering the benefits the two get from Tough (especially Defenders), an AT designed to hold aggro should get a higher benefit from Tough to help it survive. A 17.8 boost is pathetic by comparison.
Virtue: The-Invictus (Blue)
The Emissary of Justice - Level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
The Emissary of Justice. - Level 50 WP/Fire Tanker
Mesmerius - Level 50 Psi/Mental Blaster
Nucleoa - Level 50 Rad/Son Defender
[ QUOTE ]
The relevance of the defender/blaster comparison is simple. The Brute AT is designed to hold aggro, but lacks the tools on it's own to survive it (excluding Stone). The job of a Blaster is to kill. The job of a Defender is to protect the team. Considering the benefits the two get from Tough (especially Defenders), an AT designed to hold aggro should get a higher benefit from Tough to help it survive. A 17.8 boost is pathetic by comparison.
[/ QUOTE ]
Honestly.. Even stone armor seems sub par. The resistance/defense gained from granite are good, but not wade into a huge group of high level baddies and come out alive.
At least not without tough and weave also backing up the stoner.. And certainly just about anything outside of granite is pretty cruddy too.. My stone tank doesn't really need granite that often, my brute seems like he'd die if I tried to do anything but granite anymore.
Meanwhile, my /SR brute does more damage, attacks faster, and ends up taking a lot less damage, thanks to the soft cap, which is ~15 % off for the stoner..
50s:
White Valkyrie - BS/Regen Scrap
Fear of Silence - Ninja/Dark MM
Corporate Zombie - Necro/Poison MM
Ardent Cataclysm - Stone/Fire Tank
Angelic Heart - Peacebringer
Maelstrom - Elec/Elec Brute
Novastar - Energy/Fire Blaster
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The relevance of the defender/blaster comparison is simple. The Brute AT is designed to hold aggro, but lacks the tools on it's own to survive it (excluding Stone). The job of a Blaster is to kill. The job of a Defender is to protect the team. Considering the benefits the two get from Tough (especially Defenders), an AT designed to hold aggro should get a higher benefit from Tough to help it survive. A 17.8 boost is pathetic by comparison.
[/ QUOTE ]
Honestly.. Even stone armor seems sub par. The resistance/defense gained from granite are good, but not wade into a huge group of high level baddies and come out alive.
At least not without tough and weave also backing up the stoner.. And certainly just about anything outside of granite is pretty cruddy too.. My stone tank doesn't really need granite that often, my brute seems like he'd die if I tried to do anything but granite anymore.
Meanwhile, my /SR brute does more damage, attacks faster, and ends up taking a lot less damage, thanks to the soft cap, which is ~15 % off for the stoner..
[/ QUOTE ]
These reasons right here is why i refuse to play my stone brute. He is way too slow and the cost just does not equal the gain (IMO). I die rather easily with my brute (not slotted with MILLIONS of IOS) and i just cant stand to play it.
" I don't let me kids play on the Freedom Server" -Oya
[ QUOTE ]
These reasons right here is why i refuse to play my stone brute. He is way too slow and the cost just does not equal the gain (IMO). I die rather easily with my brute (not slotted with MILLIONS of IOS) and i just cant stand to play it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah.. When I compare it so some of the other brute secondaries I can play, I can get more or an equal amount of mitigation through other sets without the negatives.. Really I want to see something that's up there for damage resistance and can run missions on challenge 4 or 5 with no problems.
But my stoner really can't.. And that makes me sad. It actually makes me want to re-roll my character as a tanker. :-/
50s:
White Valkyrie - BS/Regen Scrap
Fear of Silence - Ninja/Dark MM
Corporate Zombie - Necro/Poison MM
Ardent Cataclysm - Stone/Fire Tank
Angelic Heart - Peacebringer
Maelstrom - Elec/Elec Brute
Novastar - Energy/Fire Blaster
you can't slot tough for def, only resist.
You can get tough up to about 18.14% (titanium coating:resistance, resistance/endo, resistance/rech, resistance/rech/endo and then 2 lvl 50 resist IOs)
[ QUOTE ]
The relevance of the defender/blaster comparison is simple. The Brute AT is designed to hold aggro, but lacks the tools on it's own to survive it (excluding Stone). The job of a Blaster is to kill. The job of a Defender is to protect the team. Considering the benefits the two get from Tough (especially Defenders), an AT designed to hold aggro should get a higher benefit from Tough to help it survive. A 17.8 boost is pathetic by comparison.
[/ QUOTE ]
I disagree that the Brute AT is designed to hold aggro. Its designed to SMASH and do damage.
Brutes are not tanks they are Brutes and going on a Fury fueled rampage is what they do best.
Pinnacle
Arch light L50 INV/SS
Psiberia L50 Kin/Psi
Screaming Mentallica L50 Sonic/MM
Infinity
Arc Voltinator L50 SS/Elec
Mind Fire Kinesis L50 Fire/Kin
Flaming Screamer L50 Fire/Sonic
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The relevance of the defender/blaster comparison is simple. The Brute AT is designed to hold aggro, but lacks the tools on it's own to survive it (excluding Stone). The job of a Blaster is to kill. The job of a Defender is to protect the team. Considering the benefits the two get from Tough (especially Defenders), an AT designed to hold aggro should get a higher benefit from Tough to help it survive. A 17.8 boost is pathetic by comparison.
[/ QUOTE ]
I disagree that the Brute AT is designed to hold aggro. Its designed to SMASH and do damage.
Brutes are not tanks they are Brutes and going on a Fury fueled rampage is what they do best.
[/ QUOTE ]
ah i see. i guess that explains why they put a taunt aura in evasion, brutes having tank level taunt auras. tanker TAUNT power and single target punchvoke in every attack.
So they can build fury, not hold aggro. Tanks "control" aggro while brutes just want it for Fury. It's not the same thing or playstyle.
[ QUOTE ]
ah i see. i guess that explains why they put a taunt aura in evasion, brutes having tank level taunt auras. tanker TAUNT power and single target punchvoke in every attack.
[/ QUOTE ]
Scrappers have every level of taunt except from /SR
/WP
/Inv
/Shield
All have taunt auras
Scrapper melee attacks have a single target taunt as well
[ QUOTE ]
So they can build fury, not hold aggro. Tanks "control" aggro while brutes just want it for Fury. It's not the same thing or playstyle.
[/ QUOTE ]
yawn...
a properly played brute builds fury just fine without the need to taunt anything. i call it - 'attack chains'
brutes have the tanker hp cap, higher hp than scrappers, punch voke and taunt auras to help deal with the dmg they will be soaking up because they will be taunting everything and keeping it on them.
wow...isnt....isnt that tanking?
[ QUOTE ]
a properly played brute builds fury just fine without the need to taunt anything. i call it - 'attack chains'
[/ QUOTE ]
I asee the issue now. You must mainly solo.
[ QUOTE ]
brutes have the tanker hp cap, higher hp than scrappers, punch voke and taunt auras to help deal with the dmg they will be soaking up because they will be taunting everything and keeping it on them.
wow...isnt....isnt that tanking?
[/ QUOTE ]
No, that's not the role a Tank plays.
Like I said, tanks control aggro by directing it away from squsihies, etc. They sometimes forego offense for better defense. During normal missions, my tank doesn't even have an attack chain. I absorb alpha and then constantly move around the mob to ensure aggro control. I'll attack here and there to maintain control and provide some DPS. That's nothing like how I play a Brute.
None of my Brutes have Taunt, all my tanks have Taunt.
My Brute enters a mob with a chip on his shoulder and immediately attacks the biggest baddest critter in that mob. I tab to the next, the next and the last. I'm not worried about controlling anything other then pissing off the mobs around me to fuel my need to SMASH.
[ QUOTE ]
Scrappers have every level of taunt except from /SR
/WP
/Inv
/Shield
All have taunt auras
[/ QUOTE ]
Dark Armor: Death Shroud / Cloak of Fear / Oppressive Gloom don't taunt for Scrapper
Fiery Aura: Blazing Aura does not taunt for a Scrapper
[ QUOTE ]
Scrapper melee attacks have a single target taunt as well
[/ QUOTE ]
No they don't; Scrappes have an above average threat mod (3 vs 4 for Brutes/Tanks), but their attacks don't have any taunt component at all.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
a properly played brute builds fury just fine without the need to taunt anything. i call it - 'attack chains'
[/ QUOTE ]
I asee the issue now. You must mainly solo.
[ QUOTE ]
brutes have the tanker hp cap, higher hp than scrappers, punch voke and taunt auras to help deal with the dmg they will be soaking up because they will be taunting everything and keeping it on them.
wow...isnt....isnt that tanking?
[/ QUOTE ]
No, that's not the role a Tank plays.
Like I said, tanks control aggro by directing it away from squsihies, etc. They sometimes forego offense for better defense. During normal missions, my tank doesn't even have an attack chain. I absorb alpha and then constantly move around the mob to ensure aggro control. I'll attack here and there to maintain control and provide some DPS. That's nothing like how I play a Brute.
None of my Brutes have Taunt, all my tanks have Taunt.
My Brute enters a mob with a chip on his shoulder and immediately attacks the biggest baddest critter in that mob. I tab to the next, the next and the last. I'm not worried about controlling anything other then pissing off the mobs around me to fuel my need to SMASH.
[/ QUOTE ]
actually i mostly team, and guess what i'm doing for that team?
absorbing alpha = tanking
keeping the spawn on me and living = tanking
whether you run around doing nothing but using taunt itself, or taunt with aoe's - you ARE TANKING
there is no hair to split here, bub.
Taking the alpha and surviving is not tanking. If saying it does makes you feel better about being a terrible Brute and an even worse Tank, then more power to you.
Using Level 50 IOs in Mids Hero Designer...
Tanker:
Fire Armor: 47.2 S/L Resistance
+ Tough: 70.1 S/L Resistance
Defender:
Charged Armor: 43.6 S/L Resistance
+ Tough: 67.4 S/L Resistance
Brute:
Charged Armor: 41.6 S/L Resistance
+ Tough: 59.4 S/L Resistance
Blaster:
Charged Armor: 30.3 S/L Resistance
+ Tough: 46.9 S/L Resistance
Does this seem odd to anyone considering the role of a Brute or is it just me?
Virtue: The-Invictus (Blue)
The Emissary of Justice - Level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
The Emissary of Justice. - Level 50 WP/Fire Tanker
Mesmerius - Level 50 Psi/Mental Blaster
Nucleoa - Level 50 Rad/Son Defender