So... Power Proliferation...?

Does anyone remember when the Devs said that there would never be more than one issue without Proliferation at a time? That kinda gave the impression of having it every OTHER issue, didn't it?

Now please, Devs, don't get me wrong! I call Issue 13 'Issue 12.5' because, to me, there just wasn't too much content. The big thing was Shields, if you ask me. So, let's just clump I13 and I14 together, and say 1 issue has passed. No harm, no foul. After all, I14 was a MASSIVE project, was it not?! I mean, it was incredible!

But looking at Issue 15, there's no mention of Proliferation...

Think about it! This is RIPE for roleplaying reasons why Proliferation would exist! Fifth Column using a biological weapon to give Heroes/Villains different powers, The Reichsman using some sort of Tachyon Aura to induce these effects... The possibilities go on.

Please don't give up on what you're looking to bring forward, but if you're going to have to let all of these issues pass, then just say 'Maybe we were wrong, Proliferation is a rare occurrence, and we try to get around to it."

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But looking at Issue 15, there's no mention of Proliferation...

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Is there a mention of ANYTHING other than new faces? I haven't heard anything about I15, other than that it might go on Test somewhere within the next month. What do we know about it?

That said, yes, I do agree with more powerset proliferation. I'd really like to see Blasters get Rad or Dark, as well as Scrappers get Axe and Mace. Among other things, of course. Definitely time for more proliferation. Come on, guys, it's the next best thing to new powersets

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Actually, I think Pain Domination is supposed to be the proliferation of empathy, in a way.

But while we're talking about more proliferation, I second radiation blasters, and let's see some fire mastery for scrappers! They need a fourth one anyhow, and I'd love for my Fire/SR scrapper to chuck some fireballs.

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Epics are actually another thing I've wanted to see more of for years. That's not an exaggeration. We got the Epics we have now in I2. That's sometime around mid 2004. It's 2009 now and we have not seen a SINGLE extra Epic pool, period. We got a few more powers in existing pools, which I think was GREAT! But the fact remains that Scrappers still only have three and Blasters still lack Psi Mastery, among other things.

And that's not even looking at villains, who don't have generic Epics AT ALL.

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A bit of a tangent here, but I'm curious how epic sets work into Going Rogue. Can't exactly have a patron hero, can we?

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A bit of a tangent here, but I'm curious how epic sets work into Going Rogue. Can't exactly have a patron hero, can we?

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This and probably a hundred other questions are probably what's kept this concept off the table until now. Jack, if I remember correctly, actually vetoed this idea out of hand once upon a time. There are Epics/Patrons, SG affiliations, badges, contact trees and so on and so forth. I'd like to know, myself

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Does anyone remember when the Devs said that there would never be more than one issue without Proliferation at a time?

[/ QUOTE ]No?

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No more prolif. Keep each AT unique - or as unique as you can now. Everyone having the same thing is lame and reduces the desire to try various ATs.

The MA really shows this. When creating toons in MA we can picks a variety of powers. Looks like a lot but not really. Can we say redundant much? I knew we could

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No more prolif. Keep each AT unique - or as unique as you can now. Everyone having the same thing is lame and reduces the desire to try various ATs.

The MA really shows this. When creating toons in MA we can picks a variety of powers. Looks like a lot but not really. Can we say redundant much? I knew we could

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Look into a booklet on CoH when it first came out. Every power was essentially unique to the AT... Granted, Defender still had some Blaster/Controller powers, but a lot of it's own powers, too... Dark? Mind? Both Defender-specific.

The game expands, it's just the natural order of things. That's why toons are given epic powers, and thensome... To give them more options.

More options are ALWAYS good, and Powerset Proliferation gives it to us easily... Well, easiER.

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No more prolif. Keep each AT unique - or as unique as you can now. Everyone having the same thing is lame and reduces the desire to try various ATs.

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I HAVE no desire to play various ATs, but I would very much enjoy being able to play their powersets. I'm not enough of a fool to get suckered into playing an AT I don't enjoy. I've been burned by that enough in the past five years, so the net result is that I don't have access to parts of the game. Proliferating the sets to ATs I enjoy means I get, in essence, brand new powersets. To me, Battle Axe was new when it was proliferated as Dual Blades was when it was added to the game.

If the ONLY reason to play certain ATs is because they have powersets no others have, then that's a direct result of those ATs being terrible on their own rights and requiring that players be bribed and bought into playing them. Driving players into playing things they don't enjoy is an inferior practice to allowing players to play what they enjoy AND giving them what they want, within reason. I'm not going to play a Tanker. Ever. But that's OK, because I'm still not missing much of the game, as I can get most Tanker sets on a Brute. I didn't play a Tanker before CoV came out, and I would never have played one even if it hadn't.

The different ATs are unique enough on their own AT structure. Brutes and Scrappers share almost the same powersets in the same order - melee then defence. Ask anyone who plays them and they'll tell you the ATs play very much differently, even with the exact same sets and builds. That's difference enough. The nature of an AT is both integral to it, and it defines the AT itself, so is inseparable from it. Being able to shoot radiation, however, is in no way integral to being a Defender or a Corrupter. They are defined by WHAT they do, not HOW they do it. The same logic extends to all Proliferation.

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Does anyone remember when the Devs said that there would never be more than one issue without Proliferation at a time? That kinda gave the impression of having it every OTHER issue, didn't it?

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I think they said that about Proliferation and new IO sets together, as in we'd have one or the other fairly regularly.

I expect some proliferation in i16, though. If they're getting ready for characters to cross sides, they'll be taking a look at the ATs and powersets to make sure nothing outperforms or underperforms enough to be a problem. That's also one of the first steps in transfering the powersets from one AT to another, so I suspect that they'll take it the rest of the way with a few sets.

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"I do so love taking a nice, well thought out character and putting them through hell. It's like tossing a Faberge Egg onto the stage during a Gallagher concert." - me

@Palador / @Rabid Unicorn

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But looking at Issue 15, there's no mention of Proliferation...

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Is there a mention of ANYTHING other than new faces? I haven't heard anything about I15, other than that it might go on Test somewhere within the next month. What do we know about it?

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This. And that the Dominator changes/buffs are probably included.

As far as why no Proliferation recently ? Shield and Pain Dom as new and semi-new powersets, and Mission Architect. Balancing & debugging and so forth all those custom NPC powers must have eaten up a lot of time.

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Arc #40529 : The Furies of the Earth

I'm hoping for some simple ports-

1) Axe/Mace for Scrappers
2) BS for Brutes
3) Thermal/Fire Blast for Defenders (PUULEEZE!!)
4) Sonic for MMs
5) Archery/TA for Corrs

These should be minimal work to Proliferate. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

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"Well, there's going to be some light music and a short note of apology saying, 'The universe ended last week, we're really sorry, we don't know what you're doing here, didn't you get the message?'"- Steve Moffat

Positron is committed to Proliferation. But he doesn't want his powers team committed to a hospital from exhaustion. The MA has diverted much of the powers team time and attention. Custom Critters were never intended to have selectable levels of difficulty, but that was included during Beta upon player request. And because of player request, they'll be refining that even more for I15 in selecting individual powers for Custom Critters.

In a way, the MA gave us power proliferation for the NPCs we create for the MA. Almost every powerset is proliferated to a any critter we want to create for MA arcs.

Once the MA stops demanding so much un-allotted and unexpected resources from the powers team, and they have everything on track for the new powersets (or even new ATs) for I16, then they'll get back to proliferation.

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Speeding Through New DA Repeatables || Spreadsheet o' Enhancements || Zombie Skins: better skins for these forums || Guide to Guides

Dark/dark dominators. Nuff said. They make those, I will be on one like white on rice.

As for patron heroes, I don't know... I could get behind the idea of taking one of the Surviving Eight as a patron - especially if you get to do the whole 'stomping on your patron as a test of your readiness' gig.

Statesman: "Now, then, you young upstart hero, let us see how much you have learned-"
*SMACKDOWN*
Statesman: "That... was adequate."

Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite

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Dark/dark dominators. Nuff said. They make those, I will be on one like white on rice.

As for patron heroes, I don't know... I could get behind the idea of taking one of the Surviving Eight as a patron - especially if you get to do the whole 'stomping on your patron as a test of your readiness' gig.

Statesman: "Now, then, you young upstart hero, let us see how much you have learned-"
*SMACKDOWN*
Statesman: "That... was adequate."

Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite

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This.. a thousand times this!!!! I've actually boycotted playing Doms till they get Dark/Dark.. but those I15 buffs are tempting....

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"Well, there's going to be some light music and a short note of apology saying, 'The universe ended last week, we're really sorry, we don't know what you're doing here, didn't you get the message?'"- Steve Moffat

<. .> If it can be proliferated, it should be. That really is all there is to it in my mind; just from a logic standpoint.

There's no reasons an artificial construct (AT) that no one in the game world itself is aware of in the way we are should determine what powers you can or can't have. (Doubly true for weapon sets.)

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A Warrior's Friend: ID 335212 - Help Infernal save Valkyrie from Battle Maiden.
Above Mars Part 1: The Wellington: ID 159769 - Save Mars by destroying a monstrous battleship from the inside!
>.> My DA page, where I attempt to art.

If only nobody in the game world was unaware of all the meta-game stuff we think they aren't aware of...

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Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522

EDIT: Never mind...

Pain and Shields were i13 huh?

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I'm still waiting for my /Fire Defenders and /Elec Scrappers.

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Storm Summoning is great because it makes you better than everyone else in the game. - Camma

Knockback is mitigation. It won't be removed just because meleers ***** and moan. - Chaos Creator

I find it rather fun to imagine things that *aren't* going to be proliferated.

-- Icy Melee for Brutes. Yes, make the enemies stop attacking you.
-- Fire Blast for Defenders. I think there is some dev-chosen flavor beind this, actually. Defenders are not considered offense hogs. Fire Blast is an offense hog.
-- Dark Miasma (support) for Controllers. Why? Tier 9 Pet- I don't think they want controllers to have two permapets at once.
-- Illusion Control for Dominators. Sorry. It just doesn't mesh well with their inherent. And it's just not personal enough for a Dom. :3
-- Super Reflexes for Tankers. You do realize how big Tanker defense values are, right? We're talking "beyond soft-capped while solo with no pools or IOs or T9" here. Also, a defense set with NO other survival tools seems very un-tanker.
-- Broadsword/Katana for Tankers. They wouldn't dare remove Parry/DA. And they wouldn't dare keep it in.


I know there are more, but I'm done for the moment. Isn't it fun?!

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Super Reflexes for Tankers. You do realize how big Tanker defense values are, right? We're talking "beyond soft-capped while solo with no pools or IOs or T9" here. Also, a defense set with NO other survival tools seems very un-tanker.

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Scrap Toggle: 13.875 base
Scrap Passive: 5.625 base

Tank Toggle: 18.5
Tank Toggle: 7.5

Total Defense to each position for a tank: 26. Slotted: 40.56% defense to each position after slotting for a tank.

Add slotted combat jumping and we hit 44.46

Close enough to the softcap to call it done. The tank then gets far more benefit from the passive scaling damage resistance.

Where the scrapper's won't even turn on until he's down to 803.16 HP at lvl 50, the tank's starts scaling up when he's down to 1124.46.

The tank will benefit more from health. The tank will benefit more from HP buffs from setIOs.

Matter of fact, since the SR tank won't be worried about how to get to the softcap, he'll be able to concentrate his IO slotting more towards other areas of mitigation and even damage.

Tanks should get SR just as they should get any other mitigation powerset.

Course... I still won't play tanks, but that's a different story.

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Be well, people of CoH.

I have to say frankly I disagree on most of those things you listed.

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I find it rather fun to imagine things that *aren't* going to be proliferated.

-- Icy Melee for Brutes. Yes, make the enemies stop attacking you.


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Dark Armor is already available to brutes and has TWO toggles that virtually completely shut down enemy attacks on you.

SLOWING attacks is hardly as crippling to fury generation.

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-- Dark Miasma (support) for Controllers. Why? Tier 9 Pet- I don't think they want controllers to have two permapets at once.


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Dark Servant isn't permanent (lasts for 240seconds per summon), and would likely get modified the same way that it was for Masterminds (Recharge Increase to 500seconds) meaning it couldn't even be made permanent without Heavy recharge slotting and recharge buffs (hasten/sets/outside buffs).

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-- Broadsword/Katana for Tankers. They wouldn't dare remove Parry/DA. And they wouldn't dare keep it in.


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I don't agree. Siphon Life is total mitigation (via HP recovery) where Parry/DA are only partial mitigation (Melee and lethal), but Dark Melee got ported to tankers.

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This is the only one that I fully agree with:
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-- Illusion Control for Dominators. Sorry. It just doesn't mesh well with their inherent. And it's just not personal enough for a Dom. :3


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Illusion would be a craptacular set for Dominators, and as soon as the new Shiny Shiny wore off, people would start screaming for the devs to "fix" it.

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Illusion would be a craptacular set for Dominators, and as soon as the new Shiny Shiny wore off, people would start screaming for the devs to "fix" it.

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Illusion as it is now, I agree... but an illusion set for Dominators, I think'd be pretty cool. It'd be a practically new set, though.

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bababadalgharaghtakamminarronnkonnbronntonner-
ronntuonnthunntrovarrhounawnskawntoohoohoordenenth ur-
nuk!

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Does anyone remember when the Devs said that there would never be more Proliferation?

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Fix't

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"Where does he get those wonderful toys?" - The Joker