My best suggestion to you, Dionon, is to head for the Mission Architect and run any mission you can find labeled as 'Heroic'. Pretend your character -is- a hero. Ge tother friends who'd like to play Brutes and Stalkers as Heroes and have them help.
There's no way the Mastermind will be ported over to Blue. The Villainside Community would -never- stand for it, wince the Mastermind is one of the great draws to Villainside. (And the amazing storylines, interesting depth, resolution of Heroside arcs, and the Cap Au SF which is the Cavern of Transcendence done right!)
-Rachel-
[ QUOTE ]
There's no way the Mastermind will be ported over to Blue. The Villainside Community would -never- stand for it
[/ QUOTE ]
I am not sure that is a definitive stopper on design decisions.
Back in the early days of this game people would orate that the "blaster community" or the "scrapper community" or what you will would not stand for some perceived infringement on something they regarded as their prerogative. As if, having created a scrapper, one could not and would not ever play anything else.
Especially with the elimination of the need to buy extra software to play either CoH or CoV, these are not separate game or communities, anymore than there is a Steel Canyon vs. a Dark Astoria community.
If players like playing one setting or another, good for them. If they wish to condition the options open to other players because of their preference, then bad for them.
There are a number of challenges to adding the Mastermind class to heroside - flavor counts for a lot. But the alleged wishes of a "villainside community' seems to me to count for nothing whatsoever.
My scrapper doesn't need an AoE. She IS an AoE.
There have been vague rumors that side switching might be coming down the pipes at some point. Not for i15 though or they would've mentioned it by now.
And for a while things were cold,
They were scared down in their holes
The forest that once was green
Was colored black by those killing machines
I'd rather they add more sets to MMs before any crossover or porting option for them.
Certainly a heroic MM would need some new sets.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
The problem is, BB, that fewer players play Villainside. This makes teaming far more sparse than it is heroside, especially on the lower population servers.
The two biggest 'draws' to villainside play are Masterminds and Stalkers. The former offers a totally unique way to play the game compared to all the other cases. The latter lets you be a Ninja.
To translate or transfer Masterminds to Heroside would be a big hit to the population Villainside. Why?
As a nation (heck, as a planet, generally speaking!) we are raised to hoist heroes up onto our shoulders. Whether they're celebrities or saved a few lives from a fire or plane crash. We're taught that heroes are the best of what we are. Shining exemplars of the greatest power that each and every one of us holds inside.
Meanwhile Villains are typically... well... villified. Or made to be humorous. Villains are the foil to the Hero. They are what makes the Hero shine so much more brightly by comparison. We are raised to hate villains (Adolf Hitler, Emporer Palpatine, Skeletor, Red Skull, Green Goblin, Lex Luthor). Sure we can -respect- a villain. Even fear him. But never truly love him or embrace him.
Often villains are made humorous by their attempts and exploits. To disarm us from backing away from the character. the Joker of the Batman Animated series was like this. Meanwhile the Joker in Dark Knight was a sociopathic homicidal maniac whom we all thought of as amazingly well done. But who here truly identifies with him as a person?
Then again... I'm on a Forum, so I'll probably get 3 or 4 people who identify with him *winks*
Ultimately we, as a culture, seek to see the villain stopped. Halted. Beaten. Sometimes it's even cathartic.
So, again, I'll say that putting Masterminds heroside would be a bad idea.
-Rachel-
/no
Masterminds are for Villains, as they should be, if you ask me.
Heroes have been given enough perks as is, and if they're given the one AT that REALLY makes the Villain-side shine, then you're taking away a serious core element of everything.
[ QUOTE ]
The problem is, BB, that fewer players play Villainside.
[/ QUOTE ]
But surely that is their problem. Even a real problem. But I don't see that this gives them license to make it anyone else's problem.
I think you admirably captured some of the reasons CoV has a lower population than CoH. I will add that I don't find the dystopian setting of Rogue Isles all that enjoyable for extended play. I do have villains, and I do enjoy playing them...when in the mood. But I am in a mood to be a hero more often than I am in the mood to be a villain - this despite my inordinate fondness for classic villains like Richard III, who tells us he is determined to prove a villain, and hate the idle pleasures of his day.
If we had a clean sheet of paper, a City of Villains where PvE ran rampant in Paragon City, committing crimes and advancing evil plots, would have been more satisfying than slaving away to make the grade in Recluse's gritty little enclave. But that is a whole other discussion.
But frankly stating the argument against an MM-style hero in terms that boil down to "If you want to play this kind of character, you have to come to MY favorite setting so you can team with ME, because otherwise no one will play with me!" sets up a fairly deep-seated reaction against your position.
Appeals to the wishes of a self-selected villainside community seem to boil down to that, or so it seems to me.
So this is not a compelling argument (for me) against the potential heroside Team Commander archetype - especially if one variant is a "Golden Guardian and the Newsboy Legion" type, where one can hurl endless waves of irritating kid sidekicks into the meat grinder of a tough mission, and call it heroic ;-)
My scrapper doesn't need an AoE. She IS an AoE.
Oh, don't get me wrong!
That whole post about how we're raised to despise villains? Yeah. That's me. I'm -all- over that.
I hate villains. Especially in CoV where everyone is just a pawn in Recluse's puzzle and MOST players seem to think that evil must be so darkitty dark dark bad that their characters must kick every puppy they come across and rip the heads off babies because they're -just- that evil.
That said.
It's one of the best lures to that side of the game. Because of all the reasons I've stated the Villainside economy is weaker, the game feels off, and overall there's not a whole lot of reason to play it in darkitty dark dark mode unless you're maladjusted (or a teenager!)
I, personally, play Heroes villainside. =-3 My characters are, almost universally, good people in the wrong place doing the right thing. I've got a Criminal character who doesn't kill but -does- rob the banks... That's as 'Villainous' as I get.
But the only thing separating heroside and villainside in the numbers game is the archetypes. They've got different playstles and different teaming abilities. And that's what -really- separates the two. Go to Contact. Get Mission. Go to Mission. Complete Objectives. Return to Contact. Repeat.
It's the way you accomplish the goals that's different.
So the lure of playing villainside just to be a Mastermind (or stalker) doesn't cut it for you? Developer investment. The Devs have been quite clear that they want their content to be played. That the work they did should be fun and amusing.
If there were no lures to go villainside (All ATs Proliferated) most of the villainside content would be left, untouched.
Even the Mastermind Only getting moved over would make a BIG dent in the population and how many people are using the zones.
-Rachel-
QR
I don't think it's a good idea to move MM's Heroside without also moving something from Heroside to Villainside.
Additionally this movement shouldn't be done until villainside is allowed to become more well rounded.
While some of the population discrepancy is because of what Rachel said, I think it's made worse because of the lack of story updates to the villain side.
i have always believed that the next epic set should be a squad leader. Since i read some place one of the dev's saying that the next epic they make would be open to both heros and villains i think this would kill 4-5 birds with one stone if done a certain way.
Make a class that's essentially a MM. On blue side you could have a longbow commander who summons various longbow units to fight for him. And his 2nd set can be a mix of AoE team buffs/heals. A real team support build. A guy who's sole purpose is to lay down some diversions with his minions and help support the team with various heals or buffs.
Red side can have the same thing only an arachnos arbiter or high ranking commander of some sort. This way the heroes get a taste of MM, the MM community get a new powerset,we get a new epic AT, and everyone gets more team support.
IMHO anyway 
It's not very heroic to spawn a bunch of minions to die for you.
Never argue with stupid people. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
@vanda1 and @nakoa2
[ QUOTE ]
I'd rather they add more sets to MMs before any crossover or porting option for them.
Certainly a heroic MM would need some new sets.
[/ QUOTE ]
Clowns anyone?
How about an Arachnos/PPD/Longbow (read Ballista) Mastermind?
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
[ QUOTE ]
QR
I don't think it's a good idea to move MM's Heroside without also moving something from Heroside to Villainside.
Additionally this movement shouldn't be done until villainside is allowed to become more well rounded.
While some of the population discrepancy is because of what Rachel said, I think it's made worse because of the lack of story updates to the villain side.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'd actually argue that the entire game has been lacking story updates for some time.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
[ QUOTE ]
It's not very heroic to spawn a bunch of minions to die for you.
[/ QUOTE ]
Actually if you like at the summoning animations it's more like calling you buddies for backup.
That can easily be roleplayed into a heroic mastermind.
For full disclosure, after all the time I've spent in this game, I personally wouldn't mind if they opened up EVERYTHING to both sides.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
I'd refute that and show that Hero side has had many story updates since I7.
Just a quick note
I8 had the revamped Faultline, which introduced Arachnos to heroes, and started showing hints of Rikti activity.
[ QUOTE ]
It's not very heroic to spawn a bunch of minions to die for you.
[/ QUOTE ]
you are not summoning minions to die for you. You are getting backup from your squad of highly trained soldiers. And as the squad commander its your job to not get them killed. As anyone who has ever watched a war movie knows, being a commander some times means sending good men to die so others can live.They knew the risks when they enlisted.
I have a question for you Dionon. The devs seem to want to keep the number of ATs available to each side balanced. What new AT do you propose Villains get to keep this balance if they do port Masterminds over?
The Abrams is one of the most effective war machines on the planet. - R. Lee Ermy.
Q: How do you wreck an Abrams?
A: You crash into another one.
Nictus? >.>
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
[ QUOTE ]
I hate villains. Especially in CoV where everyone is just a pawn in Recluse's puzzle and MOST players seem to think that evil must be so darkitty dark dark bad that their characters must kick every puppy they come across and rip the heads off babies because they're -just- that evil.
[/ QUOTE ]
Hmm. I've always felt that CoV was not so much dark, as inadequately lit.
[ QUOTE ]
I have a question for you Dionon. The devs seem to want to keep the number of ATs available to each side balanced. What new AT do you propose Villains get to keep this balance if they do port Masterminds over?
[/ QUOTE ]
Well, we're doing an AT-trade, right?
They can have Controllers. I mean, I'd be happy to give redside a non-EAT with a 'set type' they don't already have, since blueside's getting a non-EAT with a 'set type' (pets) none of its other ATs have... but there aren't any. The only set type that isn't currently shared is, in fact, pets.
So Controllers are the closest thing to something they don't have already. It'll help 'em generate more redside inf, and it might push Doms into something a bit more unique.
I mean, there could be a vote, or something, so if people disagreed with me another AT could be picked for redside. But I hardly ever see any "Port X to Villains!" threads -- Controller is the one I've seen most frequently, by which I mean, like, twice. So... there you go!
I'd poop the party but it seems just pointless by this stage.
Oh, and Jack, I think you're confusing the word 'unique' with the word 'extinct.'
All ATs; both sides
All zones; all ATs
If villain content isn't compelling to people, there's little sense in bribing them to it. Powers don't have an ethos. You can have reformed thugs, or Corrupters that want to draw people away from evil.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
One day they might do it, Geko, but every day they don't is another wonderful day where I get to watch a silly idea be ignored.
Because I forgot about this forum when I posted this originally lol...
[ QUOTE ]
So, I know it's been brought up before, but I'm bringing it up again because it's an issue near and dear to my heart.
Please CoX.... Make a Heroic version of the Mastermind.... Granted, you couldn't have certain powersets translate over, but you could have differing ones, like "Sidekicks" instead of "Thugs" or "Elementals" instead of Zombies...
I ask this because Mastermind is my favorite archtype, and I'd really like to play such on the heroic side of things.
[/ QUOTE ]