Disappointment in the Update Schedule

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Is there even going to be a Winter Event this year?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, there is.

[/ QUOTE ]
I know. They've said so in the past.

See, if you include the contextual sentences around the quote you pulled, there's a gag about how we've heard more about something coming in 6 months than something that historically should be cropping up in the next 30-40 days.

There's a 'tongue sticking out' emoticon, but a 'tongue in cheek' emoticon would have been handy earlier, I suppose.

Or we could, y'know, just shuttup and play the game and be excited when a new issue comes our way rather than going on and on endlessly about how some of us think we know better.

[ QUOTE ]
Or we could, y'know, just shuttup and play the game and be excited when a new issue comes our way rather than going on and on endlessly about how some of us think we know better.

[/ QUOTE ]

If thats your opinion, why the hell are you reading a feedback forum? Seriously, can we follow you around and post "shut up and play" after everything you say?

Excitment is one of the problems with this glacial update schedule. Six months between updates sucks excitement out of the playerbase.

[ QUOTE ]
After digesting this thread for a little while and thinking about it fully, I've come to a conclusion.

The Playerbase really doesn't know what it wants.

[/ QUOTE ]

Now, this will apparantly come as a shock (hur hur) to you, but the Playerbase is not some gestalt entity with a hive mind. Did you think that the 170,000 some odd players were all members of the Borg or something? Are you actually suprised that a group made up of thousands of individuals has conflicting priorities and viewpoints?

This is basic human nature stuff. I'm at a loss to understand how you may have missed learning this rather basic fact of life.

We are the Borg, you will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
After digesting this thread for a little while and thinking about it fully, I've come to a conclusion.

The Playerbase really doesn't know what it wants.

[/ QUOTE ]

Now, this will apparantly come as a shock (hur hur) to you, but the Playerbase is not some gestalt entity with a hive mind. Did you think that the 170,000 some odd players were all members of the Borg or something? Are you actually suprised that a group made up of thousands of individuals has conflicting priorities and viewpoints?

This is basic human nature stuff. I'm at a loss to understand how you may have missed learning this rather basic fact of life.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, you've been around for two and a half years, look at who you're talking to... seriously...

[ QUOTE ]
We are the Borg, you will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.

[/ QUOTE ]

You forget the; 'You technological and biological distinctiveness will be addes to our own'.

I think that was the line. Shame the borg were made into wimps in Voyager. They used to be so cool and kick-buttity.

=^ ^=

*Joins Colletive willingly*

Wheee... Assimulation tickles!

[ QUOTE ]
We are the Borg, you will be assimilated. Resistance is futile.

[/ QUOTE ]

If HexGirl is the Borg?

I'll gladly be 'assimilated'.

[ QUOTE ]
Now, this will apparantly come as a shock (hur hur) to you, but the Playerbase is not some gestalt entity with a hive mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

One of us...

One of us...

[ QUOTE ]
But is what you want feasible?

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I guess that's up to the Devs to decide. They control the money and the staffing. I'm just a player.

[ QUOTE ]
people seem to be overlooking the fact that right now we're playing a 3-4 gig beast when the original CoH was a little gig baby. We're dealing with a LOT of code that takes a LOT of testing to get new content added. And we're also dealing with a far more critical playerbase right now than we were at launch. If something goes on test that isn't 100% perfect (Flight poses, looking at you), you can be sure there'll be protests.

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't take this the wrong way, but to me, this just sounds like an excuse. I played Asheron's Call for 4 years, and they had an update out every month with very few exceptions. Some of them were freaking huge updates too. From what I hear, after seven years, they're still cranking them out over there on a shoestring budget. I'm in no way saying that AC is better than CoH, but I am saying that there's no reason why a game that is maybe three years old should be unable to keep updates on a schedule. This is a business after all.

[ QUOTE ]
While the general idea of "Give us more more more NOW NOW NOW" is okay if you want to be disappointed every issue, the big picture cannot be ignored. We're dealing with a game that literally has hundreds of thousands of missions for their hundreds of thousands of players. And we've already been shown in the past with new content that the playerbase is not above writing it all off as "just more fighting in a different map."

[/ QUOTE ]

It may be that it is just more fighting on a different map. There are very VERY few missions in this game that can be completed without direct combat.

As far as the I want it now now now stuff...I think it comes down to this. The Devs mention the stuff and then use words like "soon". A year later, it's still coming "soon". Personally, I've quit listening to the devs when they talk about what's coming out in future issues. I've taken the "I'll believe it when I can play it" attitude. It's saved me a lot of aggravation.

[ QUOTE ]
So tell me, Deathstrike, what does the playerbase want right now?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm hardly a spokesperson for the playerbase, but if I had to guess, I'd say they want:

1. An update schedule that they can count on. If it's going to be quarterly, it should be quarterly. If it's every six months, that's fine, but make darn sure it's ready to go at six months. A week late is fine. 2-3 months late? Not so fine.

2. Better quality control. Major bugs seem to follow each update lately. Massive lag, random disconnects, etc. seem to hit a lot of people with each release.

If they can just get these two things right, it'd be a huge step in the right direction.

As far as people complaining about all the other stuff, welcome to the boards. Newsflash -- it's what we do here. We argue every little point, and when we run out of stuff to argue about, we make stuff up.

With 100,000 + people playing the game, you won't please everyone on every little thing, but that's not a reason to release late and/or buggy updates. Our devs can do better than that.

Hmm, read the whole thread, and I know i'm coming late, but I wanted to toss out my thoughts, but first a bit of my history.
I've been here since a week after launch, and was I excited! A game where I could live out my childhood fanatsies, awesome! I had always been warry of pay as you go MMOs as I had seen some of my friend get hoodwinked (galaxies), and other's lives get sucked out (EQ). I took the chance anyhow and singed up.
I0-I2 were great, and I was excited for every single issue. They were in rapid fire succession, and I was having a blast, I had a solid SG, with a decent friend list, and played a ton.
I3 and I4 brought some changes to powers and balancing, and many of my fairweather in game friends left, however I was left with a nice core group, and started trying some alts. A little of my excitement for the next issue was lost as I felt while some of the changes were justified and some good (thank you so much for stopping tele-tanking), some came off a bit heavy handed.
Then came I5 and I6, which we have all heard way too much about. At the time I was going through some personal stuff as well, and combined I couldn't really take it, so while I didn't deactivate my account, I would go up to a month without logging in, and went off an played another MMORPG, FFXI.
Why did I play FFXI? Mostly for 3 things that are sorely missing in this game, crafting, a trading and bartering economy, and out of combat activities. Eventually the grind of camping for loot, and killing my 10 thousanth crawler of some type wore on me as did their rediculus death penalties. I wandered back to CoH somewhere around I7, but for me since I barely played CoV (my highest villain at this time is only lv 29), I7 really didn't hold much for me.
This takes us up to the present, and I8. Why am I growing impatient? Simple, this is the first content update that I have been whole heartedly looking forward too since I2 (maybe I3). It has been a very, VERY long nearly 2 years since I was this excited about a patch.
Going back to the topic of not knowing what we want or where to go with the game. I think the key word that was used was innovation. CoH has always stood out because in a world of fantasy (elves and so forth) MMORPGs speckled with the occasional scifi one (Earth and Beyond, EVE), it was truly a gamble, and seems to have paid off. So again, be innovative. The invention system seems to be perfectly up that ally, and will (i'm hoping) bring many of those things that I left CoH briefly and went to FFXI for.
Just my 2 inf on the subject as a whole.

What I would still like to see
-Out of combat system, we are heroes, and in some of my favorite books the heroes and villains respectively have grown more in power by going off and training, or seaking a guru/master/scientist/whatever to augment their powers. I believe something of this nature could be implemented, and add a whole new level of depth.
-Power customization is huge for me. Could be colors, could be animations, whatever.
-New mission types and textures/zones. Mayhem and safeguard missions are a solid start, and the physX opens up alot of possiblities. Have the Rikti knock an asteroid towards earth, and you have to go on it, and set bombs to break it up before it hits Paragon. You can even play a rip off of that Aerosmith song for the mission music :O)
Just pulled that last one out of my rear, but you get the idea. Be innovative, break some new ground, think outside the MMO box, that is how you will maintain, and heck probably gain subscribers.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
After digesting this thread for a little while and thinking about it fully, I've come to a conclusion.

The Playerbase really doesn't know what it wants.

[/ QUOTE ]

Now, this will apparantly come as a shock (hur hur) to you, but the Playerbase is not some gestalt entity with a hive mind. Did you think that the 170,000 some odd players were all members of the Borg or something? Are you actually suprised that a group made up of thousands of individuals has conflicting priorities and viewpoints?

This is basic human nature stuff. I'm at a loss to understand how you may have missed learning this rather basic fact of life.

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, you've been around for two and a half years, look at who you're talking to... seriously...

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true. Just trying to illustrate the absurdity of the complaint I suppose.

[ QUOTE ]
Our devs can do better than that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not even Blizzard, a company highly regarded for it's quality of games, can do the things you ask.

I read the UK boards today , sounds like it's just the system that calculates Veteran Rewards is the thing holding everything back.

Anyways , I hope next year is better , because like I said before they have to keep players motivated to invest in this game.

[ QUOTE ]
After digesting this thread for a little while and thinking about it fully, I've come to a conclusion.

The Playerbase really doesn't know what it wants.

Reason: Look around this thread. Then look around the training room forum. How many posts do you see where someone says "Put I8 on live now!" versus how many you see that say "Wait and fix all the bugs first!" How many times over the past year have we heard the "I'd take a whole issue of just bug fixes" hogwash versus how many people claiming there's not enough in an issue to warrant its development? Or the people claiming they want smaller updates faster versus those who say there isn't enough in each update?

So, going by what the forums have stated they want, we can make this list of demands:

* More stuff in each update
* Less stuff in each update
* Wait until all bugs are fixed
* Push it live now and worry about bugs later
* Give us more missions and content for level 50s
* Give us more missions and content for every other level for my alts
* Give us more costume pieces
* Stop wasting time developing costume pieces
* Just give us an entire issue of bug fixes
* Bug fixes are not content and shouldn't be wasted on an issue
* Give us faster updates with new content
* Take your time and finalize content, don't just give us halfbaked new stuff

See where the problem comes here?

[/ QUOTE ]

And this surprises anyone? You take over 100,000 different people, ask their opinion and expect them to agree?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Our devs can do better than that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not even Blizzard, a company highly regarded for it's quality of games, can do the things you ask.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's very easy to produce quality games when you produce them years behind schedule/release dates.

Star Craft Ghost anyone? Release date, November 2004, shelved until further notice.

[ QUOTE ]
Why could it be happening?

* CoX staff reductions to concentrate efforts more on newer titles (ie, the Marvel game)
* Increased game complexity (that is, issues contain features for both Heroes and Villains; also may include bugs caused by enhancing engine features, such as PhysX support and advanced graphics)
* Larger issues. (Although I'd say the issues have gotten smaller, not larger, saving the villain content of I7)
* Less "precoded" - that is, I have the feeling a lot of features, and perhaps even areas, were half-baked into the game and cut from the release scheduled and rolled into areas. For example, I'd bet that the Hollows and possibly the Shadow Shard were being worked on at least in part pre-release. Obviously PI and the RCS were. Of course capes were a work in progress even pre-release


[/ QUOTE ]

My theory has always been that CoV spread them too thin. Creating an "expanshalone" was innovative and unique, but rather than adding new content on the game, it just created an entirely new game instead. So, now you have those people who were writing missions for CoH having to do it for CoH and CoV, because missions made for CoH can't be played by villains and vice versa. That either means having fewer people concentrating on CoH or having the same group spend fewer hours on CoH so they can do CoV too. Seems to be fairly evident that this change in Issue release speed came after CoV's launch.

Sort of sad though. I remember a time where you'd get one Issue and not even be done enjoying it when the next Issue started getting hyped. Now they're spread out so far, that I get bored between Issues and my eye starts to wander. I really hope they can pick up the pace.

[ QUOTE ]
Didn't Cricket mention something about getting releases on a quicker schedule? What that translates into considering the release schedule of I7 & I8, I don't know.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, and previously CuppaJo said we'd have bigger, further apart issues. So far, I don't think we've seen either...

[ QUOTE ]
Serious question here. Is the company making roughly the same amount of money each month as it has in the past? If so, why do we have fewer devs? I've heard that our subscription numbers are not down, so what's the deal? Does all the money spent on CoH/V go back into CoH/V (and of course the expenses associated with the game) or do they get diverted into other projects like MUO or Auto Assault? Could poorly performing side projects be draining money from our game?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd say it's the side projects thing. They have "multiple" MMOGs in the works. Obviously they're not going to rely entirely on new people for these MMOGs, so they'll pull people from CoH knowing they're experienced and can do the job. But maybe those slots don't get refilled. After all, CoH is already making them money, so why not cut back a little and use that excess to make their new, potentially more successful MMOG better? Saw the same thing with EQ when EQII was in development.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But is what you want feasible?

[/ QUOTE ]

World of Warcraft seems to handle it just fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

*falls out of chair laughing*

Oh man my poor keyboard.

BWAHAHAHAHA

[/ QUOTE ]

Why is this so funny? Could you please explain? I've played WoW a couple times(only 1 month when I first bought and just recently). It's not my particular cup of tea but my friends like it a lot and that's mainly the reason I play it. I like playing with RL friends where possible. I'm here because I love superheroes but even the current release schedule is getting to me. I didn't find WoW a bad game and there was certainly a LOT to do and according to one friend, he was quite happy with the content/frequency of the updates. I don't understand that in all non-WoW forums, there is nothing but hate and the spurning of it's success especially if the two games are compared.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Or we could, y'know, just shuttup and play the game and be excited when a new issue comes our way rather than going on and on endlessly about how some of us think we know better.

[/ QUOTE ]

If thats your opinion, why the hell are you reading a feedback forum? Seriously, can we follow you around and post "shut up and play" after everything you say?

Excitment is one of the problems with this glacial update schedule. Six months between updates sucks excitement out of the playerbase.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whatever. Just tired of this "WE WANT IT PERFECT AND NOW." BS.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
But is what you want feasible?

[/ QUOTE ]

World of Warcraft seems to handle it just fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

*falls out of chair laughing*

Oh man my poor keyboard.

BWAHAHAHAHA

[/ QUOTE ]

Why is this so funny? Could you please explain? I've played WoW a couple times(only 1 month when I first bought and just recently). It's not my particular cup of tea but my friends like it a lot and that's mainly the reason I play it. I like playing with RL friends where possible. I'm here because I love superheroes but even the current release schedule is getting to me. I didn't find WoW a bad game and there was certainly a LOT to do and according to one friend, he was quite happy with the content/frequency of the updates. I don't understand that in all non-WoW forums, there is nothing but hate and the spurning of it's success especially if the two games are compared.

[/ QUOTE ]

I played WoW for a few months. I ran out of things to do, I played a few character to high levels, both sides.

The reason why it is so funny is because Blizzard is HORRIBLE at keeping their schedules. We aren't talking weeks or months off, but years.

Ok, I guess I will take your word for it. None of my friends have mentioned any complaints over delays. But then again, these are friends that would not play CoH even though they were friends that collected comics as much as I did.

[ QUOTE ]
Release: 4/27/04
Issue #1: Through the Looking Glass (June 29, 2004)
Issue #2: Shadows of the Past (September 16, 2004)
Issue #3: A Council of War (January 4, 2005)
Issue #4: Colosseum (May 4, 2005)
Issue #5: Forest of Dread (August 31, 2005)
Issue #6: Along Came a Spider (October 27, 2005)
(City of Villains (released October 31, 2005))
Issue #7: Destiny Manifest (June 6, 2006)
Issue 8 - late Nov/Early Dec.

I wonder if this is the face of things to come? Updates were pretty consistent, pre-CoV. Despite massive rebalancing, power fixing, powerset changes, and so on, Issues rolled out every 3 months.

[/ QUOTE ]

3-4 months timeframe is in line with the pricing model for CoX:

45-60$ for an update

We see plenty of complaints about how complicated things are, yet, looking at the timeframe for COV i6, it is clear that complicated things can be done with the proper staffing.

In engineering they say you can have it good, fast, and cheap: pick two.

i7(large issue) wasn't fast, and it wasn't good (bug-wise), and it wasn't cheap at 8x15= 120$ in subscription fees.

i8 (small issue) isn't fast and isn't cheap at 5x15= 75$ in subscription fees

So I think it's only right to ask why we aren't recieving issues that are good and fast every 3 mo., because it's not cheap at 45$, which is the cost of a new game.

[ QUOTE ]

So I think it's only right to ask why we aren't recieving issues that are good and fast every 3 mo., because it's not cheap at 45$, which is the cost of a new game.

[/ QUOTE ]

Heck, thats what I was about to say, and for sure if I drop my credit card on a 6-month sub I want to be certain that there will be an update before the last day. Not so sure at the moment. I9 in May? *shudders*

Someone is watching this thread closely, it seems. A bunch of posts got deleted when Friggin Taser had a momentary lapse in logic.

EDIT: it's ok Taser, ur still awsome.

I still want my dessert wine though -.-