Official Thread: Travel Power Changes
By
absinthe182,
Posted on: 2006-11-14 20:49 in Developers' Corner
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No comment there. I thought that was just me now I know I am not alone.
List of things NPC's have to outshine players:
Bane Spider scouts have old school placate
Tsoo Sorcerors & Sky raider Porters TP through objects
All flyers ignore travel supression after they attack
and the list goes on.....
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Dont forget infinate range!
High Beam - 50 Blaster Energy/Ice - 1228 Badges
Munitions Mistress - 50 Mercs/Traps
Many Other 50's, Too Many Alts, All On Freedom
Just Because You Can, Doesn't Mean You Should!
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Please bring back the hover animation for hover. Using the fly animation for hover is just lame. You should hover around like magneto not take flight pose like superman and then fly at 7mph.
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I couldn't agree more but the devs sure have their minds made up about that one so it = dead horse. I wonder though since they don't like the ghost hover if there is any possibility that they could come up with a new animation for hover that would be vertical?
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No comment there. I thought that was just me now I know I am not alone.
List of things NPC's have to outshine players:
Bane Spider scouts have old school placate
Tsoo Sorcerors & Sky raider Porters TP through objects
All flyers ignore travel supression after they attack
and the list goes on.....
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Dont forget infinate range!
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Oh yes and I forgot infinte range 
First off, mobs DON'T have infinite range, it's often quite long, but never infinite. Even Hami and Rikti Pylons have limits to their range.
Second, you listed some ways that NPCs outshine players, but did you think about the ways players outshine NPCs?
We have waaay more powers, generally we have better accuracy, our Intelligence is way beyond theirs (well, usually), etc.
Wavicle, Energy/Energy Blaster, dinged 50 in Issue 4, summer of 2005.
@Wavicle, mostly on the Justice server.
I have an idea. Lets make those same cheating NPCs as smart as the players, give them 2 dozen powers to chose from intuitively and set them loose. Whenever you complain about how some mob has an ability the player doesn't, remember they are dumb as posts and follow the same fight or flight patterns every time. They could be as smart as the AI in FEAR and hunt you down like dogs.
"Samual_Tow - Be disappointed all you want, people. You just don't appreciate the miracles that are taking place here."
Actually, the only thing that bothers me is how fast they move when stunned.
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First off, mobs DON'T have infinite range, it's often quite long, but never infinite. Even Hami and Rikti Pylons have limits to their range.
Second, you listed some ways that NPCs outshine players, but did you think about the ways players outshine NPCs?
We have waaay more powers, generally we have better accuracy, our Intelligence is way beyond theirs (well, usually), etc.
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Tell ya what....
Kick back and relax, perhaps read the thread in its entirety before doing your 1, 2, 3's . And also some of it is exaggeration (like infinite range).
If anything I'd rather see travel power suppression on enemy mobs, my tanker buddies and I are tired of flying mobs that hit and fly away then come back and hit then fly away ad infinium. It's especially annoying when you don't have Fly, I'm a Fire/Fire Tank so my travel powers are limited to SJ due to Acrobatics being my only Knockdown/Knockback protection.
Dear Devs,
I understand you guys get a lot of crazy requests for travel powers, but that's due to the lack of balance between them. Players should be able to take any of the powers for their characters because it fits their concept instead of which they find less annoying. I understand you guys worry that everyone will take Fly, but if you let each power shine instead of giving them almost all of them their own gimps, this won't be a problem.
Fly
- Base Speed: 49.7 fps
- Max Speed: 86 fps (5 slotted Fly and 3 slotted Swift)
The slotting necessary to achieve the cap is not an error. I've checked it with Mids' Hero Designer. No one should have to put that many slots into two different powers to hit their speed cap. Like Super Jump and Super Speed, it needs to be able to attain it's cap in no more than two slots. Personally, I believe Fly needs to able to achieve Super Speed's base speed at it's max, but AT LEAST fix that. I mean c'mon, 6 slots?!
Super Jump
- Base Speed: 73.3 fps
- Max Speed: 114.4 (2 slotted SJ OR 1 slotted SJ and 1 slotted Hurdle)
Whoever complains about abilities of this power needs mental help. Hands down, it is the best of the four. You get great vertical and forward movement. It provides limited steering in the air to the point that landing on a mob shouldn't occur. I can almost always see the adjustments I may or may not need to make at the height of my jump. Leave it alone.
Super Speed
- Base Speed: 94.5 fps
- Max Speed: 135.7 fps (2 slotted SS OR 1 slotted SS and 1 slotted Swift)
The only power with zero vertical movement and it doesn't even have the fastest forward movement. Paragon City has A LOT of obstacles in it and Super Speed's inability to get around things simply isn't fair. The Flash doesn't have that problem. Speedsters should be able to run UP objects. By pressing CTRL, a teleport like ring should appear, allowing the character's feet to be attached to that surface, enabling vertical movement. This power should be able to picked without the user fearing zones like Skyway City and The Hollows (falling into one of those big holes from the damage done to the area = boned).
Teleport
- Base Speed: 300 ft. per click
- Max Speed: Not sure, but I've reached 459 ft. per click with 3 range IOs.
No other travel power virtually requires a power from another travel pool to make it function properly. Ignoring the fact that lag can be a real annoyance with this power is unfair to those who use it. One can easily plummet out of the sky as the result of lag and that's just not right. People should not be required to take hover to fix this. As suggested earlier by The_Alt_oholic, Teleport should be made a toggle with a built-in non-moving hover so people are no longer falling out of the air. This would also allow people to finally get rid of that annoying hover post-landing. They could just shut it off.
Virtue: The-Invictus (Blue)
The Emissary of Justice - Level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
The Emissary of Justice. - Level 50 WP/Fire Tanker
Mesmerius - Level 50 Psi/Mental Blaster
Nucleoa - Level 50 Rad/Son Defender
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Fly
- Base Speed: 49.7 fps
- Max Speed: 86 fps (5 slotted Fly and 3 slotted Swift)
Personally, I believe Fly needs to able to achieve Super Speed's base speed at it's max, but AT LEAST fix that. I mean c'mon, 6 slots?!
Super Speed
- Base Speed: 94.5 fps
- Max Speed: 135.7 fps (2 slotted SS OR 1 slotted SS and 1 slotted Swift)
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I think it might be nice if we could, perhaps, slightly exceed super speed's base speed as a max speed, and get up to - say - a nice round 100 fps. But I agree with it not taking so many slots to do.
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Teleport
Ignoring the fact that lag can be a real annoyance with this power is unfair to those who use it. One can easily plummet out of the sky as the result of lag and that's just not right.
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It's not just lag - it's also the "red rings of death" caused, in some areas, by building or other texture skins that simply will not allow teleport rings to focus on them. This can be a particular problem in Steel Canyon and parts of Faultline, at least. Trying to find a new target area while one is falling out of the sky can be a challenge, at best.
Prophecy & Dreams | Prophecy & Dreams Discussion
Nerd Flirting | More Nerd Flirting | Nerds Talking About Flirting
Unbidden | Star Patrol | Real World Hero
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Teleport
Ignoring the fact that lag can be a real annoyance with this power is unfair to those who use it. One can easily plummet out of the sky as the result of lag and that's just not right.
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It's not just lag - it's also the "red rings of death" caused, in some areas, by building or other texture skins that simply will not allow teleport rings to focus on them. This can be a particular problem in Steel Canyon and parts of Faultline, at least. Trying to find a new target area while one is falling out of the sky can be a challenge, at best.
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While I agree with you guys on the principal here of Teleport, there is a reason it's set up as it is. Back before Issue 1, Teleport used to have a longer hover time. That was severely reduced because of player abuses. At first it allowed some movement (which was removed due to player abuses in using short teleports to give themselves a literal hover power) and had a longer hover (which was removed due to player abuse in again, using it as a hover power to attack mobs during that time).
In short, the proposed changes, while I agree with them personally, won't happen because it was already proven that the player base will abuse them in all the ways the devs don't want them to. The current set up is thanks to player abuses, much like the alterations of Super Speed and Flight to prevent "jousting".
- Polecat
A hover without movement isn't exactly unfair. Being able to move is rather important during combat and my Teleport suggestion wouldn't have that. My request is rather fair in that regard. It could also be easily explained logically in that the user is simply teleporting to the same location to stay at his current position and that there's no viewable effect because it requires far less energy to do so.
Virtue: The-Invictus (Blue)
The Emissary of Justice - Level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
The Emissary of Justice. - Level 50 WP/Fire Tanker
Mesmerius - Level 50 Psi/Mental Blaster
Nucleoa - Level 50 Rad/Son Defender
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A hover without movement isn't exactly unfair. Being able to move is rather important during combat and my Teleport suggestion wouldn't have that. My request is rather fair in that regard. It could also be easily explained logically in that the user is simply teleporting to the same location to stay at his current position and that there's no viewable effect because it requires far less energy to do so.
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Again, I personally agree with you. But at the time it happened, the Devs shot down this idea because it would be, in essence, gaining the hover ability for free (of course, back then, Hover was incredibly slow flying around. it's 2 or 3 times faster now). I personally would like to see what the devs say now about it, but because of the past events/abuses, I wouldn't be holding my breath on something even remotely close to this happening.
- Polecat
No one would be gaining the hover power for free. People wouldn't actually be capable of non-teleporting movement while in that state unless they actually took flight or hover.
Virtue: The-Invictus (Blue)
The Emissary of Justice - Level 50 Fire/Fire Blaster
The Emissary of Justice. - Level 50 WP/Fire Tanker
Mesmerius - Level 50 Psi/Mental Blaster
Nucleoa - Level 50 Rad/Son Defender
I don't know if anyone else suggested this, but have you thought of having a list of different animations for flight that a player can choose from?
What if a player can choose from a list of flight patterns to by typing for example: /flight pattern 02 and be able to change the look of their characters flight? Some characters might fly upright, with their arms folded. Some might fly with one arm extended. Some characters might spin around as they hover. The possiblities are endless.
I don't know how complicated that would be, but it would be cool.
There are already flypose emotes in the game. Try flypose1 through 4 while moving in flight. It's not perfect but it does give you some choice.
Thanks for your quick response. I just tried it and it comes as Unknown Command. Let me know if I'm doing something wrong.
Activate Fly (or Hover, it seems to work with that one too) and press R to move forward automatically. Then type /em flypose1 (there are four different poses, just change the number at the end to 1-4) and it will change your pose.
You can bind this to any key you want, too. ParagonWiki explains how you can bind it in their Flight pose guide.
I would still really like to see the added lag removed from the movement powers.
I know it's to prevent "jousting" but it didn't work as it can still be done, so might as well take out the added lag.
In line with what Zeus stated above, I would like to see some level of variance in power pools. Some pools just can't be made to match origins. Such as the medicine pool, its obviously technology based. I would really like to see some customization here as was implemented with weapons, basically a selectable style that will play a certain animation with your costume, so you can select one to match your character. This could even be fixed via origin, so as to make that option a little more meaningful. Having jet packs of varying sizes and shapes would be nice as a back costume option as well and would help explain our natural origin characters ability to fly around.
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In line with what Zeus stated above, I would like to see some level of variance in power pools. Some pools just can't be made to match origins. Such as the medicine pool, its obviously technology based. I would really like to see some customization here as was implemented with weapons, basically a selectable style that will play a certain animation with your costume, so you can select one to match your character. This could even be fixed via origin, so as to make that option a little more meaningful. Having jet packs of varying sizes and shapes would be nice as a back costume option as well and would help explain our natural origin characters ability to fly around.
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Except that the weapon customization is NOT changing animations. At all. Castle and Back Alley Brawler have both repeatedly explained why animation changes are a lot more work and fall under the category of "Power customization" which is not currently on their schedule. At all.
Sorry to jump down your throat, but suggestions about alternate colors or animations occur repeatedly as if it were trivial. It's apparently not trivial and has been determined not to be worth the time.
i think they should ad a new type of pool/travel power like wall climbing set or riding someting like a bike
they should have power customzation, i cant spell, but i know it takes alot of hard long work but that would be something to think about for later issues
oh and i like your signiture saying thingy i hate people like that
Hmm, I wonder if all the mobs should start singing.
I could wile away the hours
Conferrin' with the flowers
Consultin' with the rain
And my head I'd be scratchin'
While my thoughts were busy hatchin'
If I only had a brain
I'd unravel any riddle
For any individ'le
In trouble or in pain
Thorizdin
Lords of the Dead
Old School Legends