Why, after 2 years, is Barrage still horrible?
By
Aett_Thorn,
Posted on: 2006-02-10 13:24 in Tankers
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A buff for EM?
Did I log into the Praetorian dimension or something?
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LOL, my thoughts exactly. You KNOW that 100s of EM board reading tanks are just sitting there SHOUTING at their monitor for this topic to dry up and go away without getting nerf bat aggro.
And in other news Stalkers are complaining that AS doesn't do enough damage. 
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If the things Blasters and Stalkers can do with EM haven't made us Nerf EM yet, absolutely nothing said here will. Carry on.
EDIT: Said Scrappers, meant Stalkers.
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One time, my tanker used Total Focus, and the apartment building I live in exploded.
Its true.
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Ok Since I cant get rid of Barrage should I get rid of Energy Punch for Whirling hands or Taunt for Whirling hands. I just feel lame without an AOE.
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I'd say drop Energy Punch. On my EM Tank, I have three heavy hitters: Bonesmasher, ET and TF - Energy Punch is just outclassed by them so it would never get used. Whirling Hands isn't the best AOE, but it's great for keeping aggro and filling out an attack chain.
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A buff for EM?
Did I log into the Praetorian dimension or something?
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LOL, my thoughts exactly. You KNOW that 100s of EM board reading tanks are just sitting there SHOUTING at their monitor for this topic to dry up and go away without getting nerf bat aggro.
And in other news Stalkers are complaining that AS doesn't do enough damage.
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If the things Blasters and Stalkers can do with EM haven't made us Nerf EM yet, absolutely nothing said here will. Carry on.
EDIT: Said Scrappers, meant Stalkers.
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Bah, there goes Castle ruining my fun poking nerf bat taunts at my EM buddies. As I said in a previous thread - nerf Castle he is obviously over-productive and way to Uber. 
Have you guys looked at the dev digest?
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Have you guys looked at the dev digest?
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Yeah, that Castle is waaaaaay too efficient. He is the type of guy that I would always point out in staff meetings to help set an example to his peers. Of course the same guy would usually meet with an "accident" in the parking lot by a runaway car whose description vaguely matched one of his co-workers.
May suck for tanks, but for brutes it's farking glorious. And since it's the basis for the new swipe animation, I'm giddy as a schoolgirl.
Obviously, barrage can't have been the worst 1st tier attack power... swipe had to be moved UP to be as good as barrage. 
Be well, people of CoH.
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May suck for tanks, but for brutes it's farking glorious. And since it's the basis for the new swipe animation, I'm giddy as a schoolgirl.
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Doubt it is.
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A buff for EM?
Did I log into the Praetorian dimension or something?
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LOL, my thoughts exactly. You KNOW that 100s of EM board reading tanks are just sitting there SHOUTING at their monitor for this topic to dry up and go away without getting nerf bat aggro.
And in other news Stalkers are complaining that AS doesn't do enough damage.
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If the things Blasters and Stalkers can do with EM haven't made us Nerf EM yet, absolutely nothing said here will. Carry on.
EDIT: Said Scrappers, meant Stalkers.
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Unless you want to "small tweak" them like you did to Regen.
>
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I want to be able to link to this in-game after I take down a Regen Scrapper (Non-Dull Pain) with Build Up, Assassin Strike, Energy Transfer.
Never do you hear the word 'nerf' more than when an FotM Spine/Regen goes down.
[/ QUOTE ]An EM stalker calling Spines FOTM?
That's just precious.
I'd love to see Barrage turned into many individual attacks. Instead of hitting all-or-nothing with 4 shots of damage, have it make 4 to-hit rolls. This would make the power almost always hit (given the usual Acc numbers) - it just might hit for only 25% or 50% of the full damage it's capable of. That unique effect would be a good balance for the long activation / slightly low damage numbers.
Same applies for other "multi-hit" attacks like Swipe, Flurry, Proton Volley, Frost Breath, etc. This isn't radical, Rain powers work this way already. Just don't confuse this with single-hit damage over time attacks, such as Fireball.
Until you have access to the last 3 powers in the set, EM is, IMO, the weakest Tanker Secondary. However, once you do earn the ability to use the jewels of the set, Build Up, Energy Transfer and Total Focus, you become a single target beast.
Guys when are you noobs going to learn that not all powers are meant to be a one shot kill. I mean every At has atleast one power that can become a one shot kill, but the key to gaming is not the powers in your set, but how you play with what you rolled. Unless you are a blaster at one point or another your toon has undergone some changes it is time to deal with it, or simply stop playing. And I enjoy a power like barrage that I don't have to slot for damage rather i can slot it for the disorient bous it gives you hasten+barrage slotted with acc disorient and attack recharges does great to keep your opponent dizzy while you lay the smackdown on some poor jabroni!
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I got a question. Im now level 35 and I have barrage but not Whirling Hands. Next attack I get is Total Focus and I really want it but I also like Whirling hands. Should I swap Barrage with Whirling hands with respec? If so reasons would be appreciated.
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Barrage has to be taken, you can't respec out of it.
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My Brute didn't take it till lvl 26. 
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There's just no excuse for this power to be so lame.
Act: 2
BI: 1.3888 sm/.5 en (1.8888 total)
Horrible.
Let's look at comparable powers, either pool powers available without prerequisites or first powers for other tanker primaries:
Gash is better
Scorch is better
Frozen Fists is better
Stone Fist is better
Jab is better (Although jab is as weak, but has a much faster activation)
Bash is better
Air Superiority is better
Boxing and Kick: both better
Flurry, believe it or not, is better from a dps standpoint (act 3/bi 3.18)
In short: Barrage is the worst attack in the entire game. Fix it, please.
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While I agree it sucks I would rather have the choice not to take it, however, the arguement it is the worst power in the game is based on what exactly the BI? Well just by quoting BI you are saying it is higher than brawl, the activation? Play a rad, once you get up in level you dont ned it anyways, you are looking at one power in the entire set... the hifhest dps attack in stone and SS are both BI of 9.9 yet EM gets a 9.9 and a 12.2 with BU and slots that is a melee power with a fast activacation quick recharge and a BI of 34.8... plus it is energy damage not crappy lethal or smashing. You wanna talk a crappy set? Try ice secondary, I havent played my fire/ice tank much since they killed burn cause he cant do much of anything he has no damage. Why dont you take the BI and activations times then average it for each set calculate in all the res out there in the game and give a ratio as to whats set has the best BI with least res... I think you may stop complaining a lil.
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If the things Blasters and Stalkers can do with EM haven't made us Nerf EM yet, absolutely nothing said here will. Carry on.
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Translation: "They're gonna NEED IT after we nerf the other stuff they do"
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EDIT: Said Scrappers, meant Stalkers.
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[insert Froidian referrence to /Regen]
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May suck for tanks, but for brutes it's farking glorious. And since it's the basis for the new swipe animation, I'm giddy as a schoolgirl.
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Doubt it is.
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Go back an reread that. I'm not Mieux. He quoted me, then did the *cough* business, implying that I was right. He THEN goes on to explain to Mieux that swipe's animation, although fun looking, needed to be changed because they couldn't multiply thedamage by 6, which is what would have been needed to balance it with the current animation.
Be well, people of CoH.
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I got a question. Im now level 35 and I have barrage but not Whirling Hands. Next attack I get is Total Focus and I really want it but I also like Whirling hands. Should I swap Barrage with Whirling hands with respec? If so reasons would be appreciated.
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Barrage has to be taken, you can't respec out of it.
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My Brute didn't take it till lvl 26.
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Oh, I'm sorry. I thought we were on the Tanker forum.
Gothika (Grav/Kin) Marionette (Ill/Rad) Terra Firma (Earth/Storm) Alana Dale (Arch/Nrg)
Iceblink (Ice/Dark) Fantasia (Mind/Fire) Shadow Minx (Claws/Nin)
--Virtue
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If the things Blasters and Stalkers can do with EM haven't made us Nerf EM yet, absolutely nothing said here will. Carry on.
EDIT: Said Scrappers, meant Stalkers.
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I want to be able to link to this in-game after I take down a Regen Scrapper (Non-Dull Pain) with Build Up, Assassin Strike, Energy Transfer.
Never do you hear the word 'nerf' more than when an FotM Spine/Regen goes down.
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whiney b*tches are hardly the province of scrappers. theres plenty playing stalkers too.
Level 50 is a journey, not a destination.
▲Scrapper Issues List - Going Rogue Edition▲
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whiney b*tches are hardly the province of scrappers. theres plenty playing stalkers too.
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And tanks, and defenders, and dominators....
Seems Kheldians are a pretty happy bunch, though.
Be well, people of CoH.
It is horrible for the exact same reason that frozen aura is horrible from Ice Melee. I have never found a use for that power except for logging into the test server and remembering why I will never take that power. At least barage does damage, not much - but some, and is not your final power of the set.
YMMV---IMO
Ice Ember
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If the things Blasters and Stalkers can do with EM haven't made us Nerf EM yet, absolutely nothing said here will. Carry on.
EDIT: Said Scrappers, meant Stalkers.
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Quoted for Truth
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What is so hard to belive that a LvL 1 power is not nor will it ever be uber.
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I suppose you've never used or had used on you, Web Grenade. When it hits you or the mobs, whether it webs and immobilizes you or not, it slows your run speed, stops you from flying, AND slows your recharge. And web grenade is the level 1 devices power. It is uber as hell
Barrage isn't horrible- the fact that you can't skip it if your build doesn't call for it, that is what is horrible.
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And your comment about Seismic Smash being better than anything but ET is incorrect. Seismic Smash was recently buffed so that it would be brought up to the same level as Total Focus, before that it was worse. It still is if you consider that Total Focus is half energy dmg while Seismic Smash is purely smashing dmg. And then Energy melee still has ET on top of that. The energy melee set has *two single target attacks that are arguably better than anything in all of Stone melee, and most other sets as well.
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Seismic Smash currently does raw damage equal to KO Blow and Total Focus.
Seismic Smash uses the same animation as Haymaker, Bonesmasher, and Air Superiority. This gives it a much faster animation time than KO Blow or Total Focus. KO Blow gets Rage, though, and TF gets to do energy/smashing damage.
However, I think the activation time is a distinct advantage.
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Ok Since I cant get rid of Barrage should I get rid of Energy Punch for Whirling hands or Taunt for Whirling hands. I just feel lame without an AOE.