Stupid_Fanboy, if ya want any help leveling, PM me with server I can make a Thermal corruptor on. lol. Anyways.
Damage Proc Mini-FAQ
Just noticed Damage Proc Mini-FAQ wasn't working with new forums, it's been updated.
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For the defense case, I have to be hit 10 (or more) out of 20 times. The chance of that happening is around 1 in 100, which is an astounding 10,000 times more likely than the resistance case.
So, if you the question you are asking is "what is the average damage taken?" 25% defense is the same as 50% resistance. However, if the question you ask is "how likely am I to die?" then 25% defense is no where near as good as 50% resistance.
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You're going to drag us all through binomial theory aren't you.
truly thou art evil!
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Average lifetime analysis is a Markov Chain analysis, not so much binomial theory. Last time I said that, someone actually did it. I'm pseudo-lazy: I didn't want to calculate it, but I was willing to write a simulator to model it.
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I have been using 1D random-walk theory, but in the world where there are only two possible outcomes (hit or miss), Markov chains, binomials, and random-walks all work out to be the same thing so it ends up not mattering which notation you use.
The trick I am using to vastly simplify the caculations is to approximate the damage distribution as a gaussian. That way all I need to keep track of is an average damage and a standard deviation. The method may be a tad mathematical for these forums, but if you can handle a square root, you can use the results.
On a side note:
Yes the range of possibilities for a defense build is much wider than for a resistance build. While you will sometimes die in a situation where a resistance build never would, if you get lucky you can do things that are impossible for a resistance build. One particular event triggered my investigation down this road:
I went into a mission to fight Luimary. This is the Elite Boss version not the Hero version (after the patch). The first time I faced her, she downed me in seconds. I came back from the hospital to try again and I took her down with barely a scratch. The difference in the two attempts was so striking that is really piqued my interest in the topic.
Of couse, the second reason I have been doing this investigation is to answer the question many people have asked: Are the EA passives worth taking?
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And the answer is?
Inquiring minds want to know.
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Energy protection is not. Dampening field is a good power IMO, it's not crazy good like energy drain or a must-have like the defense toggles but it's a solid choice. Some people disagree and think it's crap, but I'm reasonably happy with it.
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I put together a Markov model to go along with my Gaussian model. They both come to the same conclusion: Under most circumstances, picking up either Combat Jumping or Manuvers is better than Dampening Field even when all the damage you are taking is Smashing or Lethal.
The exceptions are:
1. You have taken and slotted Tough from the Fighting Pool.
2. You are already hitting the accuracy cap (either with help from a Corruptor or via DM/Touch of Fear).
3. You are in a situation where your Toggles are likely to drop (like PvP or Sappers).
For S/L damage the difference is really very minor. In practice, you will only notice the advantage of Combat Jumping over Dampening Field when then damage is not S/L.
Edit: Forgot to mention that all my models use I7 accuracy/defense scaling. Using the to-hit calculations that currently on the live servers, Dampening Field is considerably better than Combat Jumping. That will change when I7 goes live.
More numbers! This time for Energy cloak.
test was me in front of a minion using brawl. I used EC and Kin, neither has def slotted.
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Hits skipped after 6 missed: 210
Total counted attacks: 6671
Hits: 2206
Miss: 4465
Hit %: 33.07
Miss Streaks: 1:523 2:349 3:256 4:154 5:120 6:210
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now subtract out 210 hits for the streakbreaker, and we get 1996/6671 = 29.92% hit rate, or 20.08% defense.
Kin shield is definitely 12.75%. castle said it and my earlier tested comfirmed it within 0.4%
20.08 - 12.75 = 7.33% base def for Energy Cloak
So it looks like Energy Cloak is 7.5% defense to all.
there, now no one has a reason to skip it.
here's the base numbers as tested
kin: 12.75% S/L, ??% E
pow: 15% E,F/C, 10.5% N
cloak: 7.5% S/L,F/C,E/N,P M/R/A
and end result from slotting.
S/L : 31.59%
F/C : 35.10%
E : 35.10% +??% from Kin
N : 28.08%
Psy : 11.7%
Positional: 11.7%
as soon as i get a mission that has minion with pure energy attacks, I'll use that to test the combined Energy defense of Kinetic, Power and Cloak.
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t-minus 70
Level 50 is a journey, not a destination.
▲Scrapper Issues List - Going Rogue Edition▲
Now if he would only get back to me with the -acc debuff duration and percentages for Brute's Dark Melee...
Come on _Castle_, my read receipt says you been puttin me off!
I'm in the same boat. 
Different person though.
Whatever they are, my DM/EA is fast becoming my fave toon
Repeat Offenders
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More numbers! This time for Energy cloak.
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Awesome research, Fanboy.
Wow, that's near Tanker level damage mitigation. I can see myself building a flying, super-jumping EM/EA Brute in the near future. Then convince my wife to make a /cold Corruptor. MUAHAHCOUGHCOUGHCOUGHHAKSPIT *gasp* *gasp* Sorry.
wow, thanks much, that's great info to have,
and...
YOIKS that's a wicked power. It's arugably the best shield in the set.
I've never skipped it, but I can't imagine skipping it now.
This explains why I feel soooo much squishier when I lower that shield to grab more aggro...
The cake is a lie! The cake is a lie!
Wow. 7.5% seems waaaay too good to me. Here is a theory: Energy Cloak actually does suppress when you attack (like most stealth powers do) to 1/2 of its defense. If is is 7.5% unsuppressed, it would be 3.75% suppressed which is the value you would expect to put EA on a par with SR. One thing that might be worth trying is put Brawl on auto-fire when you run the test. This would test to see if there really is suppression or not. I am also tempted to go into the arena to test the -visibility property of Energy Cloak.
Thanks Stupid_Fanboy for running all these tests.
Ok, just a quick reality check here, but unless I'm out to lunch, these numbers have to be temporary. They have to fall for I7.
Here's why It looks like they'd have to:
Kinetic: 12.75
Cloak: 7.5
CJ: 2.5
Weave: 3.25
Manoeuvers: (not totally sure): 2.5% ??? even if it's lower, I think you still get something odd)
That woud total 28.5 without slots.
Add in some SOs and you get over 44%
With the new I 7 def system, that really would be around 88% damage mitigation...
Even with just CJ and Weave you still get nearly 41% def, that's almost 82% mitigation.
And with Drain, and CP, you'd have the end to pay for all those toggles...
Yes this devotes a lot of slots to defence, quite a lot, but it's not over the top, and you could still make a very destructive toon this way.
As long as you have ET, TF, barrage, EP and brawl you can have fun. You'll have room for lots more than that.
Ok, you probably can't fit in hasten to speed up overload, but WOULD YOU NEED IT?
The cake is a lie! The cake is a lie!
Wow, that's some good numbers on energy cloak. I'm glad I slotted that sucker up now. 
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Ok, you probably can't fit in hasten to speed up overload, but WOULD YOU NEED IT?
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You need Overload. A level 50 Hero does almost 1700 points of damage with Knockout Blow (think Statesman). If you have Dampening Field with the base slot in it, that still leaves about 1550. A level 50 Brute has only 1500 health. Without Overload to buff your health, you will get one-shotted (ok, left with 1% HP) if KO Blow gets through.
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Ok, you probably can't fit in hasten to speed up overload, but WOULD YOU NEED IT?
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You need Overload. A level 50 Hero does almost 1700 points of damage with Knockout Blow (think Statesman). If you have Dampening Field with the base slot in it, that still leaves about 1550. A level 50 Brute has only 1500 health. Without Overload to buff your health, you will get one-shotted (ok, left with 1% HP) if KO Blow gets through.
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I think he means "Why would you need hasten to speed up overload?" I don't think he's suggesting leaving overload out completely. Though your argument is a pretty good one in favor of keeping hasten, as well. Being overloaded more often is good.
I agree you're both right on both counts, I"M NOT ADVOCATING DROPPING OVERLOAD lol!
However, right now, I use overload as a way of life, I punch it prety much as soon as it's charged.
I use hasten on auto, not to speed up my attacks, but to shorten the overload cycle.
If the numbers were not reduced, If you really could have 88% mitigation plus passives, plus tough, I don't forsee the need for overload on a regular basis,
Instead I see it as a situational power for AVs, for toggle droppers, and for rampant insanity.
All this said, I'd still keep hasten if I could figure out a way to keep it in there. Dropping the fitness pool might be worth it, but I do like swift...
Oh well, this is prety speculative. We'll get the numbers we get. I just really hope they tell us what they are if they change them...
The cake is a lie! The cake is a lie!
Okay, please don't throw anything at me. I made a mistake.
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Hits skipped after 6 missed: 210
Total counted attacks: 6671
Hits: 2206
Miss: 4465
Hit %: 33.07
Miss Streaks: 1:523 2:349 3:256 4:154 5:120 6:210
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i regretably and accidentally overcompensated for the streakbreaker based on a misunderstanding on my part.
those numbers there already take the streakbreaker into account. so in my earlier post, when i subtracted the 210 atttacks, i was incorrect.
the real defense being given by Kin +EC is (50% - 33.07%) or 16.93, not 20.08
so 16.93 - 12.75 = 4.18% def for EC.
and, since i PM'd this to Castle and he agreed the result was too high and said the real number for EC is actually 3.75%, I think this test agrees with that.
I'm really sorry to get your hopes up and for confusing anyone. I try to not make mistakes like this. Sorry.
These final numbers then are the tested and confirmed EA numbers, much thanks to TopDoc for correcting me.
Kinetic shield: 12.75% S/L, ??% E
Power shield: 15% F/C/E, 10.5% N
Energy cloak: 3.75% all.
Again, I'm sorry for giving faulty numbers.
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t-minus 68
Level 50 is a journey, not a destination.
▲Scrapper Issues List - Going Rogue Edition▲
actually, in a strange way, that's good. It means we probably get to keep those numbers for I7
and those numbers will still be prety solid.
Though I won't be dropping fitness for leadership anytime soon
The cake is a lie! The cake is a lie!
Oh. Finished reading further down. The 3.75% sucks [censored]. BUT, thanks a bunch for diggin up the dirt for us, S_F.
Be well, people of CoH.
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Okay, please don't throw anything at me. I made a mistake.
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Hits skipped after 6 missed: 210
Total counted attacks: 6671
Hits: 2206
Miss: 4465
Hit %: 33.07
Miss Streaks: 1:523 2:349 3:256 4:154 5:120 6:210
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i regretably and accidentally overcompensated for the streakbreaker based on a misunderstanding on my part.
those numbers there already take the streakbreaker into account. so in my earlier post, when i subtracted the 210 atttacks, i was incorrect.
the real defense being given by Kin +EC is (50% - 33.07%) or 16.93, not 20.08
so 16.93 - 12.75 = 4.18% def for EC.
and, since i PM'd this to Castle and he agreed the result was too high and said the real number for EC is actually 3.75%, I think this test agrees with that.
I'm really sorry to get your hopes up and for confusing anyone. I try to not make mistakes like this. Sorry.
These final numbers then are the tested and confirmed EA numbers, much thanks to TopDoc for correcting me.
Kinetic shield: 12.75% S/L, ??% E
Power shield: 15% F/C/E, 10.5% N
Energy cloak: 3.75% all.
Again, I'm sorry for giving faulty numbers.
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t-minus 68
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If I could remove and lift my kitchen sink then I would throw THAT at you too! 
Repeat Offenders
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These final numbers then are the tested and confirmed EA numbers, much thanks to TopDoc for correcting me.
Kinetic shield: 12.75% S/L, ??% E
Power shield: 15% F/C/E, 10.5% N
Energy cloak: 3.75% all.
Again, I'm sorry for giving faulty numbers.
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NP. Thanks for doing the research, posting it, & then correcting it in a timely manner. 3.75% DEF for EC was what I was expecting, albeit not what I was hoping. Still, it is a decent amount to stack on top of the other DEF in the set, it applies to EVERYTHING, & is in a power that performs another useful purpose - stealth. So Energy Cloak is a good power - worth taking, worth using, & worth slotting (to ~6% DEF to all) eventually.
Thanks S_F - & thanks to _Castle_ for confirming the numbers.
Liberty
Mister Mass - 50 Inv/SS/NRG Mut Tank [1236]
Doc Willpower - 50 Grav/FF/Psi Mag Controller
Baron Wonder - 50 SS/Elec/Mu Mag Brute
Sound Bight - 50 Son/Son/Mu Tech Corrupter
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actually, in a strange way, that's good. It means we probably get to keep those numbers for I7
and those numbers will still be prety solid.
Though I won't be dropping fitness for leadership anytime soon
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Agreed. That's a drag about EC, but 3.75% is still very respectable for defense against everything and 8% would have been a nerf magnet as soon as the other AT forums found out about it. It's still worth the slots to me, just to scrounge up a little defense against psi.
No apology necessary: it happens to us all.
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
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No apology necessary: it happens to us all.
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LIES!!! I have NEVER been wrong!!!
/em suddenly remembers the shader 3.0 debacle...
Oh... oh yea. It does happen to us all.
Be well, people of CoH.
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No apology necessary: it happens to us all.
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LIES!!! I have NEVER been wrong!!!
/em suddenly remembers the shader 3.0 debacle...
Oh... oh yea. It does happen to us all.
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Am I remembering wrong, or did a Cryptic staff member tell you specifically about the shader 3.0 thing?
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No apology necessary: it happens to us all.
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LIES!!! I have NEVER been wrong!!!
/em suddenly remembers the shader 3.0 debacle...
Oh... oh yea. It does happen to us all.
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Am I remembering wrong, or did a Cryptic staff member tell you specifically about the shader 3.0 thing?
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Wraith PMed me that Cryptic does not use shader 3.0 for the HDR effects, or for anything else for that matter. And I am still very greatful that he did, because it allowed to me more properly understand and explain what's been going down.
Be well, people of CoH.
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That said, I really do hope that lucks get nerfed, the defense cap gets lowered, and all defense giving powers get bumped to balance it back out.
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As much as I hate to admit, I hope this happens too. IF defense really is supposed to be 1 def = 2 resist, that means Lucks should be 2.5% and not 25% that they currently are. (Or it means Sturdy's should be 50% instead of 5%).
I dunno why, but I enjoy Defense based sets more than I enjoy Resist sets. Even when it gets frustrating that the "dice" roll badly, and I face-plant to a mob when the 100+ times I fought that same group I handle it with little to no problem.
Damage Proc Mini-FAQ
Just noticed Damage Proc Mini-FAQ wasn't working with new forums, it's been updated.