Not once, not twice, but three times...
By
008Zulu,
Posted on: 2006-01-10 16:26 in Developers' Corner
This means no suppression either, right? That would incur most of the same problems the original nerf brought, so I hope we're sticking with stealth as-is.
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I may be in the minority here, but I like the way AVs currently spawn. I have so much more fun fighting AVs to the edge with just two players, then gangbanging them with a team of 8. If I can't duo AVs, all the challenge is taken out of the game.
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But you can. Just turn your difficulty up to the point where a duo will spawn one.
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I understand your point, but that's not the same thing. Now the AV is +3 which is a lot tougher for a duo than an even-con AV or even +1 AV.
That's like going back to square one and requiring soloists to "Gain 3 more levels before you trying fighting your AV."
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Unyielding - the fourth level - will spawn +1 or +2, not +3. It'll also spawn AVs for a duo.
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
Thanks again! *smooches and hugs*
All of that sounds really great!
And.... Will we be hearing something about a newspaper mission and collaborative missions for CoH soon, too? *fingers and toes crossed hopefully*
You mean AV's will actually be worth something now?
I think I love you.
An obvious suggestion, but one I think that has great merit:
Make the AV reward be an SO for *every* team member, instead of one chosen randomly. I'm in a pretty close-knit supergroup, and while none of us complains about this, I think we all (even or especially the lucky one who gets the SO) feel a little disappointed when only one of us gets the SO.
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You mean AV's will actually be worth something now?
I think I love you.
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Hell, Simian would have your babies too.
...If he wasn't afraid you'd eat them, or use them as a muffler, or throw them at passing cars or something.
Sounds good to me, I think I can solo most Elite Bosses...maybe 
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Y'know, at first I thought it was kinda sickening the way people are falling all over themselves with joy over this. After all, none of these are really that big of a deal. Yeah, the AV one is great for soloers, but getting AV teams was never really that tough. GOOD AV teams? A bit tougher, I admit, but hardly impossible.
But these are certainly not worth offering one's firstborn for...
But then it occurred to me that maybe this just shows how starved for something positive the players of this game really are. These reactions are not unlike giving food to a starving man, or water to someone that has just walked across a desert. Maybe you should take this as a sign to give some positive changes to this community rather than nerf on top of nerf.
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To be honest, one of the factors that strongly contributed to my decision to let CoH lapse while still paying for WoW was the decision to replace several elite bosses with AVs/Heroes in CoV. Since that is getting changed in a manner that I like, I think it is pretty positive. I think this will have a fairly large impact on higher-level play.
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)
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I understand your point, but that's not the same thing. Now the AV is +3 which is a lot tougher for a duo than an even-con AV or even +1 AV.
That's like going back to square one and requiring soloists to "Gain 3 more levels before you trying fighting your AV."
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Oh... well in that case... ...look at the brightside!
You can just respawn in your base instead of riding all the way back to the hospital in the WAAAHMBULANCE
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AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss.
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This is the best change ever in CoH.
It's like X-mas. Part 2!! 
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'
Ummm no. Hell no! repealing ED would be the best Re-change for Co/x.
none of these changes have effected me not nearly as hard as ED has. 
i must have hit the "magic" contacts since i have not yet even pulled my first AV in cov, i have helped others fight theirs but none of my own.
.:Brmstone's BLOG:.
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First...I confirm that we're working on right now (as in pohsyb in the next room) to add CoV costume parts into CoH if you own both games....
Then we repeal the hated stealth nerf. The reason why: many well reasoned posts. It's that simple. You guys pointed out the problems.
AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss. If the mission is set on the first two levels of difficulty, it takes 4 heroes or more to spawn an Arch Villain. On the third level, 3 heroes or more. On the fourth level, 2 heroes. On the highest (Invincible), a solo hero will spawn an AV. Note this works in BOTH City of Heroes and Villains.
In order to incentivize larger teams, Positron is going to add a bonus to AV rewards!
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That sounds like a smart implementation, but when you say an Elite Boss, I hope you don't mean that the AV will spawn as an Elite Boss.
AVs are supposed to be special. I would prefer that when my group size is too small, etc. that they AV not be in the mission, but at least I got one of the factiosn bosses.
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First...I confirm that we're working on right now (as in pohsyb in the next room) to add CoV costume parts into CoH if you own both games....
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Does this mean "All" costume parts or just some? One of the prevailing reasons I bought COV was to develop and interact with unique costume themes. I own both COH and COV, but it would kill me to see a Super Hero wearing what may be clearly be in some case "villain" gear.
I can't superman getting the same responses he normally gets while sporting a fat metal skull on his chest, protruding spikes from his torso, hooves and barbed wire around his arms...
Keeping key elements thematically separate is critical to immersion in my eyes. (Fish stockings, sure..sewn eyes...no)
E tu Lois?
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First...I confirm that we're working on right now (as in pohsyb in the next room) to add CoV costume parts into CoH if you own both games....
Then we repeal the hated stealth nerf. The reason why: many well reasoned posts. It's that simple. You guys pointed out the problems.
AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss. If the mission is set on the first two levels of difficulty, it takes 4 heroes or more to spawn an Arch Villain. On the third level, 3 heroes or more. On the fourth level, 2 heroes. On the highest (Invincible), a solo hero will spawn an AV. Note this works in BOTH City of Heroes and Villains.
In order to incentivize larger teams, Positron is going to add a bonus to AV rewards!
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That sounds like a smart implementation, but when you say an Elite Boss, I hope you don't mean that the AV will spawn as an Elite Boss.
AVs are supposed to be special. I would prefer that when my group size is too small, etc. that they AV not be in the mission, but at least I got one of the factiosn bosses.
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AVs are a fiction. Only the fact that the devs defined it that way makes an EB inferior to an AV. There is no reason that say Mynx, can't be an Elite Boss, or a Lt. or even a minion. It's the encounter with a unique character that makes it special, not some silly rank that amounts to a 2000% HP buff and a 100% damage buff to the mob.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
Wow... looks like time to pick up more timecards.
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First...I confirm that we're working on right now (as in pohsyb in the next room) to add CoV costume parts into CoH if you own both games....
Then we repeal the hated stealth nerf. The reason why: many well reasoned posts. It's that simple. You guys pointed out the problems.
AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss. If the mission is set on the first two levels of difficulty, it takes 4 heroes or more to spawn an Arch Villain. On the third level, 3 heroes or more. On the fourth level, 2 heroes. On the highest (Invincible), a solo hero will spawn an AV. Note this works in BOTH City of Heroes and Villains.
In order to incentivize larger teams, Positron is going to add a bonus to AV rewards!
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It's like somebody set the Wayback Machine to 2004!
The AV changes are simply fantastic. Thanks so much for listening to us on that, especially. Elite Bosses are a great option for challenging high level soloists, and AVs are great fun to fight in teams.
Really. This is great. I'm also thrilled that you are rethinking the stealth change, and glad for the confirmation on the CoV costume options.
Please try my custom mission arcs!
Legacy of a Rogue (ID 459586, Entry for Dr. Aeon's Third Challenge)
Death for Dollars! (ID 1050)
Dr. Duplicate's Dastardly Dare (ID 1218)
Win the Past, Own the Future (ID 1429)
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First...I confirm that we're working on right now (as in pohsyb in the next room) to add CoV costume parts into CoH if you own both games....
Then we repeal the hated stealth nerf. The reason why: many well reasoned posts. It's that simple. You guys pointed out the problems.
AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss. If the mission is set on the first two levels of difficulty, it takes 4 heroes or more to spawn an Arch Villain. On the third level, 3 heroes or more. On the fourth level, 2 heroes. On the highest (Invincible), a solo hero will spawn an AV. Note this works in BOTH City of Heroes and Villains.
In order to incentivize larger teams, Positron is going to add a bonus to AV rewards!
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Just to calrify: The Archvillain thing is ONLY for Mission AV's, Archvillains in Task Forces/Strike Forces and World Spawns will not be changed.
In City of Villains, Archvillain-class enemies are called "Heroes" and this change applies to them as well. (With the exception of Strike Forces and World Spawns of course).
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Just wanted to add, probably for the umpteenth time in this particular forum:
THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH!
This means I don't have to dread the 40's anymore on CoH, I can still solo (as I like to do). It also means that a more common-sense approach to the whole 'stealth-clickee-xp' dilemma will be implemented-I'm just glad to see that you guys noticed when we cried out in agony this time around. Thank you very much.
Basically too many 50's to count, but I'm generally a brute/scrapper/tank kind of guy.
Wow, I didn't see that AV/Hero one coming at all, nice! Again, thank you! That is really cool. Would the Elite Boss still be the same one? I.e. the mission calls for AV named Fred, we get the same Fred, but Elite Boss Fred instead?
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AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss. If the mission is set on the first two levels of difficulty, it takes 4 heroes or more to spawn an Arch Villain. On the third level, 3 heroes or more. On the fourth level, 2 heroes. On the highest (Invincible), a solo hero will spawn an AV.
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To quote the beer commercial: BRILLIANT!
I likes it a lot!
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First...I confirm that we're working on right now (as in pohsyb in the next room) to add CoV costume parts into CoH if you own both games....
Then we repeal the hated stealth nerf. The reason why: many well reasoned posts. It's that simple. You guys pointed out the problems.
AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss. If the mission is set on the first two levels of difficulty, it takes 4 heroes or more to spawn an Arch Villain. On the third level, 3 heroes or more. On the fourth level, 2 heroes. On the highest (Invincible), a solo hero will spawn an AV. Note this works in BOTH City of Heroes and Villains.
In order to incentivize larger teams, Positron is going to add a bonus to AV rewards!
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I want to thank you guys for making use of forum ideas on these two things. Especially the AV one. On the face of it that sounds pretty darn good.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Glad you coh/cov owners will get the costume bits. us Old school CoH'rs get hosed 
. And yeah i know i could get it but Im just not buying it for costumes sorry ;/.
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Frostfire as an AV would rule.
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*SHUDDER* ye gods NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
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I may be in the minority here, but I like the way AVs currently spawn. I have so much more fun fighting AVs to the edge with just two players, then gangbanging them with a team of 8. If I can't duo AVs, all the challenge is taken out of the game.
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But you can. Just turn your difficulty up to the point where a duo will spawn one.
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I understand your point, but that's not the same thing. Now the AV is +3 which is a lot tougher for a duo than an even-con AV or even +1 AV.
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No it isn't. It won't spawn higher than +2 on the fourth difficulty setting (which is where it'll spawn AV instead of EB for a duo). And sometimes it'll spawn +1.
One extra level. Not really that much harder. If you're looking for a challenge by fighting AVs in a duo, I honestly don't see why such a small increase to the challenge is a big deal.
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That's like going back to square one and requiring soloists to "Gain 3 more levels before you trying fighting your AV."
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No, it's entirely unlike that. Because you can choose whether to seek the challenge of fighting that AV or just pick off an elite boss instead. You aren't stuck with a mission in your tray that you can't complete for several levels (and then probably get another one just like it and repeat the process).
The soloist will now be able to choose between doing that (Invincible) and fighting a challenging-but-not-impossible elite boss (anything else).
An option to allow or disallow AVs in missions altogether might be more convenient, sure. But given that the common suggestion was to disable them for solo Heroic characters, I think this implementation (tying it to difficulty and team size) is a fine idea.
I think it would be even more epic if you went the extra 10 yards and got rid've AV's altogether. Have them ALL at Elite Boss status and have them fight with allies. Example being:
1-3 Heroes: 1 Elite Boss
You fight against Ghost Widow
4-6 Heroes: 2 Elite Bosses
You fight against Ghost Widow and Wretch
7-8 Heroes: 3 Elite Bosses
You fight against Ghost Widow, Wretch, and Scirocco
I just always thought that would be cool, the enemies could work as a team, healing, buffing, etc.
I didn't think this change was ever going to happen, and because of that, I have really started losing interest in this game. To say the least, I am very happy with the proposed AV/Hero change, and I find myself eager to continue playing my level 37 scrapper (which I stopped playing because of the dreaded 40-50 level rich AV game).
Thank you Devs. I for one appreciate the coming change.
50's
Darth Keiv DM/Reg, Crack'ed Justice BS/Reg, Crack'ling Cage Fire/Rad,
Crack'ed Earth SS/Stone, Crack'ed Brawler DM/WP, Crack'ed Legend Axe/WP,
Crack'ed Current SS/Elec,Crack'ed Ice Ice/Kin, Crack'ed Cacophony Son/Son,
Crack'ed Widow SOA, Crack'ed Bully Thugs/Dark, Broil-O Fire/Kin, iCrack'ed DB/WP.
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WOW!! OMG!!! YOUARETEHBEST!!!
PvP is still awful compared to the other PvP choices out there(5 million customers=doing something right).
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Umm? I've played the "5 MILLION CUSTOMER" game, and neither the PvE or PvP can compare. Can you transform into a flying squid while your opponent jumps 100m in the air and a third person irradiates you while running 80mph?
No?
Not as good, sorry.
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Can a mage punch my warrior's armor clean off?
No?
Then CoH's PVP can't be as good, can it?
Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)