Virusman

Exalted has a lot of completely new players.

They follow the examples of others, as some believe that the VIP server will have a lot of veterans. Some may have had doubts that "Help" = "Global Chat about what you had for breakfast" but they follow examples put forth.

As you can see this tends to spiral out of control very quickly, as a couple of very loud long-time players who should know better can bring a lot of players who simply don't know any better into the /help chat very quickly to debate who, exactly, would have jurisdiction on the moon for hours at a time.

With that said I have yet to see a question go unanswered in an eventual helpful manner, so while there may be "lolnoob" responses and a lot of chatter when somebody is trying to ask a question - the only time I've seen somebody get mad over not getting an answer, people were actually already helping somebody else who had asked a complicated question prior to the other guy, who also eventually got help.

I can understand their intentions to create MA to be supplemental content - but initially, it was completely and utterly doomed to fail in this regard.

Enemies do not scale down at all. This means that to make a supplemental arc that lower-level players could contribute, you'd have to cap THE ENTIRE THING at a lower level, or risk overwhelming underdeveloped toons. This also meant that anybody above that line would cease to get XP from it. Unless you had a higher level friend, and ran arcs that they were capable of doing.. in which case, you would also have been fine to go and farm some dev-provided missions, which are still the best way to farm. Add this to the fact that most "non-farm" arcs that I've ever played (since I farm a lot in AE, I had to try some. You're welcome, people who hate farms.) are incredibly and ridiculously difficult, they become one of the worst ways to get XP that I am aware of. There's your alternate progression! The solution, I think, would be to add an enemy group modifier - when people design an arc that includes EVERY FRIGGIN DAMAGE TYPE IN A SINGLE GROUP it should not be worth a simple 100% fire-farm-everything-does-fire-lol. Hell, a lot of the enemies I see with psionic and even friggin HOLDS aren't even worth 100%. /rant

I will grant you, on your third statement, that things like the hamidon farm were wrong. Would you consider utilizing game knowledge and setting up an environment that is beneficial to your chosen build - i.e. "Exploitation" of knowledge and/or ability, to be an exploit worthy of nerfing in some fashion? But, I must say, I have yet to hear it stated definitively that any type of fire farm, S/L farm, etc - are wrong, or bad, or frowned upon by anybody of any importance. Sure, they've received nerfs, some aimed at them, but nothing specifically was ever stated along the way along the lines of "Hey, we're nerfing this guys, don't let us see you doing this again." in fact I pretty much get the message "Well it looks good enough to me, proceed with what we've done to it." I'm not 7 like last year, I'm pretty sure I'm old enough to handle it if the devs say "NO, bad guy, no farming!" so you know all around a pretty cool kid.

And this is the problem- we're not getting anything from the devs, other than "Well, MARTy isn't aimed at any particular playstyle" so unless that's a blanket statement that just means "Except we're trying to curb anybody who farms through any gameplay means" and separating farmers in AE, farmers in regular missions, people who kill very quickly in TFs into their own categories, I don't see how that's a true statement, when people refer to MARTy as attempting to kill farming.


Where is this miniscule line?

I can not design an AE arc which is "the equivalent of one-shotting the entire zone of Perez Park" (Unless you're talking terms of relative XP, in which case, how much XP is the Kraken worth?) but I was still able to trip MARTy last I checked.

MARTy was not aimed at any one specific playstyle, and yet we've basically seen the removal of revive powers in AE. Does utilizing knowledge of your build and high AoE damage constitute "Exploiting" and then, how? Are you exploiting your knowledge, or exploiting broken game mechanics? How long have these mechanics been broken?

Jagged for Paragon City President.

Well said.


Here we will have to disagree. The forums would be used just as much as they are currently for non-farm arcs, undoubtedly even LESS so.

I don't think anybody appreciates the VOLUME of players farms bring into AE. They are people you hate, and yet, I can tell you personally of at least 30 players who now play the ARCS in AE, after farms brought them there. That's like orders of magnitude over the amount of people who actually post on the forums about them. And yet "serious AE authors" hate these people. I myself belong in that category, though I rarely play the arcs because most of them are less creative than farms. Like, seriously - one of the ones that was near the top was like "sum counsul got ure hat" for the mission intro dialogue. At least some of the farms are very in-depth about stopping "Crey's new line of flame-tech battle suits.."

.. and it will be a very long time before he gets one that meet YOUR Criteria. Thanks for trying to get the OP to conform to your standards. Did you even read his post?

Hold on now. Using the system as it was intended is now exploiting? It seems like you're creating the dividing line here - it's okay to use the enemy creation tool if you purposefully make the enemy groups more difficult than regular enemies, possibly even directly opposed to your armor set - but it's not when you make them something you can handle? That's realistically the only exploit here, and it's really just an exploit of your armor set.. don't really think that counts, or else stone tankers should be really worried right about now.

Well aren't we jaded?

Your brother sounds like he's basically a psychopath, so thank you for considering nearly everybody who actively uses AE to be mentally disturbed via your comparison.

Also - choosing to remain silent might have actually been the right answer here, as you're not contributing anything to the topic at hand or seemingly attempting to actually debate any point. I understand the underlying irony in that you wish us to not debate, because it's pointless to do so as nobody in an official position has yet come forth to reinforce either one side, but acknowledge that this was not the original intent of the thread.

The problem from this person was not "it's a waste of time" his problem was "we do it in the correct order on freedom" - he WANTED to kill the guns, but thought that the leader was stupid for killing them "in the wrong order" and said as much before he left.

Personally I do not like killing turrets, no matter the order or situation. But I understand that people do, and tolerate it. I also point out the irony that these speed demons are leaving bosses (worth the same as turrets, which have 2x the health) at 1/4 HP, where they may be AoEd with other bosses, in the facilities.

It's not logical to quit a trial over inefficiency in such a way - if you want to run a speed trial, you form it yourself and recruit people with similar intentions. This is never an issue of "well, darn, he started forming a regular run 30 seconds before I could have started my speed run, I guess my only recourse is to join his and then quit, stating my displeasure that he is not running things the way that I would like to run them, after never having opened my mouth." yes this will certainly show him.


I would agree with that - when your leader is actually detrimental to your success rate at the trial, and not simply asking people to do what is a pet peeve of yours, with no prior knowledge of that being a factor.

Quitting because you do not like killing turrets is not the equivalent of quitting because the leader is ruining the trial by his (or her. it's.) lack of coherent and logical directions.


These people, in my experience, are actually the problem. They are, at the very least, undoubtedly the cause of this thread existing.

I'm not saying it's everybody who has transferred - but a few bad apples spoil the bunch.

Ahh, I'll have to get in on it next week - had to take off shortly before the MSR began.

Had I put two and two together, I probably could have figured it out and found a way to stay.

(For some reason, when I read it on the forums, I was thinking it was a MO run of some SF - but I am also dead tired, so you know.)

I'm curious what time zone this is - are you running one Sunday 10/2?

If so, what time?


Was the Sat. 10/1 run just a warm-up?

I have actually encountered at least 6 people like this - the number would be closer to 9, but I think a few of them were actually the same person talking about different builds.

I don't doubt that they actually do have hundreds of billions of inf slotted on inactive toons but, really, who cares at this point?

Ahha! You know I think I may have actually been on that one, or one similar.

I do remember a run where people were essentially ragequitting for that reason, but it wasn't because the leader threatened to kick them, it was another one of those, "We do it the right way on Freedom," moments.

Ahha! Yes I have seen this as well, there was a Stalker that I grouped up with twice, who ignored people attempting to explain the badges to him - on the vahz boss, he always killed a minion (on a STALKER? .. use that strike on the boss!) and then went on the boss, and he'd use a bunch of reds and just pummel the Lost boss, next. I called him a troll on the second run after seeing that and he said "lol" and that was it.

I can understand people killing a minion via Disintegration but single-target damage like that? And it's not like he didn't already know, it was his routine to kill a vahz minion, and then ignore minions on The Lost - no reason for that unless you're causing grief. >_<

I can't help but wonder if that was me (Frank Horrigan) in my defense, I have yet to lead a failed trial, even with no incarnate powers on the league whatsoever. CG to all of you new folk!

with that said, I give people ample time to interject their own strategies (and even ask for them) and as you say - lots of captains in the same boat. There should be one captain (the LEADER) and you should do it his way, if you disagree, mention it to him but do not interject other strategies or commands, contrary to the leader's wish, as things are happening. This leads to simply confusing people, which is never good. With that said if something he plans is obviously going to fail, and you notice that it is, go ahead and correct the issue you see personally. If, however, everybody attempts to lead on a trial with 3 actual incarnates, it's going to fail, and thus has been in my experience.

Couldn't have said it better than this guy, though:

It was triggering crazy mad on the beta server, I myself managed to trigger it not only with somebody in my group and not doing anything, but also in about 20-30 seconds solo after a lengthy cooldown period.

I'm ASSUMING the MARTy threshold was increased considerably, as some quick numbers were tested before I21 launch.

They've also, basically, said that it's inevitable that people are going to be doing it, and that they were alright with it once all of the bugs and exploits (I.E. Hami farm ban wave) were dealt with.

I'm talking about their recent statement that MARTy was not aimed at AE farming, or "any playstyle," in regards to exploitative and cheating behavior.

Their stance is that anything that goes beyond what they feel we should be getting is a cheat and/or an exploit, even if it's completely within the design to accomplish it.

This has already begun to encroach on non-farm territory and will continue to do so, and yet farmers will always be generating more inf and drops than those who do not wish to farm. Everybody should be angry about MARTy... we're all playing in the same pool here.