SpiderTeo_OC

I don't know where you get scaling resists for Widows. Widows tend to operate as something between a Claws/SR Scrapper and a Claws/SR Stalker (but with their own unique set of powers). /SR has scaling resists, but I have not heard of Widows having any kind of scaling resists, let alone be able to speculate which power would have them. You are the first person that I have seen bringing it up.

As for being accused of being a PowerLeveler, the accusation is sound. You say that you have two level 50 vllains, which is only available after obtaining a level 50 villain. That means you have at least 150 levels of experience to draw from. If you haven't learned much to be able to make an educated overall comparison between your two level 50 VEATs, then that means you PL'ed most of the way on your toons, you are unable to be aware enough to learn while playing, or you just basically didn't want to learn. There could be another explanation but then I would be just aimlessly speculating by that point.

I'd add that there are some mobs out there that can still hit you hard and often even if you have soft-capped defenses, due to high +To Hit and/or +Accuracy (Malta Gunslingers and Rularuu Watchers come to mind) and some non-positional attacks (usually found in psi attacks).

It's not so much that these buffs are bad idea, but that the premise to justify these buffs is faulty at best.

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In conclusion end game brings a lot of recharge and regeneration debuffs which players rely on both for damage mitigation so the solution is to grant regeneration recharge and regeneration debuff resistance. Regeneration is by no means a terrible power set, but a great one that needs a bit more polishing, I hope that you take into consideration my proposal and apply it to a future update.

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From his concluding paragraph, he assumes that this proposed solution is the solution to deal with such debuffs. He also makes the assumption that the set "needs a bit more polishing." For the rest of experienced /regen players, we know it's not the only solution. Hell, some defense would help mitigate against these debuffs (if it can't touch you, it can't hurt you). Soft-controlling is another option to deal with debuffing mobs. Or simply outlasting the enemy with regen's heals and the scrapper's primary function to open a can of whup-[censored].

The fact that he assumes the set "needs" some improvement sounds a bit egotistical and ignorant of the full-capacities of the Regeneration set. Sure, many /Regen players would love to see these buffs implemented, but many of us are also realistic enough to understand that these are more wishlist items than balance issues. These are probably considered "wishlist" items because /Regen is still a top performing set that doesn't need a buff.

That's why many of the forum vets are explaining to him (and others) that the basis of his justification is misdirected. The fact that the OP or anyone else agreeing with him has yet to make such a post on the Scrapper Issues List seems to suggest that the OP really isn't aware that many of the scrapper players here already know, that there is no trust in the Scrapper Issues List, of that there is just a casual disregard for anything else that has come before and everything that is still here.

Case in point, JusticeisServed has already made a post on 04/23/09 for the Scrappers Issue List for the exact same problem of -recharge. I haven't seen the OP or any of his adherents making a post there. It seems that this whole threat is just for Santorican to grandstand on the Scrapper forum. Hey, he already sent a PM. He didn't really need to show it to all of us. But he did, and he wanted feedback. And guess what? The mixed responses have demonstrated that even though the buffs are desired, their implementation is still not completely justified.

To the OP, Defense-based sets are always a craps shoot at best. Even at the soft-cap, you have at least a 1-in-20 chance of getting hit, which is better than some Vegas odds. I'll guess that you just got unlucky in that particular fight. Of course, going against +2 Bosses is going to be tough if you are not soft-capped in any case.

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I wish I could say the same about some other forums. I am looking for a good Huntsman build for Soldiers of Arachnos and I get so many conflicting things, most of which looks crazy.

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The problem with some other forums is that they only see just one or two ways of doing things as individuals. That tends to stagnate any real innovation that can come into play for these sets. I know for a Huntsman build, the only one real guide out there is for a perma-hasten build set for maximum recharge just to have perma-pets. I personally went with a soft-cap build, based on survivability rather than uncontested DPS.

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There are plenty of enemies in normal game that have -regeneration and -recharge, both of which are regenerations huge weaknesses.

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Yes, I will admit that, but there are a number of /regen players who are able to overcome such weaknesses. No big deal.

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This thread isn't about well if you need help then hop on a defender, it is about why Regeneration needs some debuff resistance.

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Yes it is. And many people have answered, "Regen does NOT need some debuff resistance." Sure, it would be NICE, it is WANTED, but it is NOT NEEDED.

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I continue to point out that ALL other secondaries have debuff resistance, and to your comment about getting knock back protection it is easy to acquire that with acrobatics, and I do believe that Castle mentioned his concern with having to take a power to be viable, back on topic, please show me a power that offers recharge debuff resistance or regeneration debuff resistance and then your argument will be valid.

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Maybe is not so much that you don't like the answers we are giving you, but rather the actual questions you should be asking.

"Oh, I get hit with -recharge or -regen. Please gimme debuff resistance please 'cuz I feel so noobisized without them!"

That is what it sounds like. But since you are expecting answers to be " Yes, we will give you that debuff resistance!" you almost immediately forsake other alternatives that make /Regen very viable and strong enough on its own.

So if I get hit with -regen, what does it means. It just means that I won't be gaining any passive "healing," that the HP stays the same. But what happens if I get damaged? Then I pop recon, Dull Pain, or even an inspiration. That solves the green issue until the debuff fades.

What about -recharge? Well, if I got Hasten, then my +recharge is still pretty decent after the debuff. Not optimal, but I'm sure I can get around it.

What you are doing is expecting only one answer to your own question, when there are other viable answers that work just fine. Sure, we would all like to have more buffs on our sets, but that doesn't mean we still need them. Hell, I would like to see Martial Arts get a minor buff like a -res secondary effect (since most of the other primary sets do have a sort of secondary effect), but I don't need them to still whup-[censored] on my MA/Regen. And if I still need help, then I could just ask someone here for any hints on overcoming these hurdles (BTW, my personal thanks to Werner, I would have sent a PM but your box is full).

If anything else, then make a post in the Scrapper Issues List by Stupid_Fanboy. There was one suggestion there already concerning the -recharge issue. You can add one for the -regen as well.

In regards to builds using SOs, which this game is balanced around, Regeneration ranks as one of the top if not the top performing secondary for scrappers.

Now once you start adding in the IO system, we see that Regeneration doesn't get as much direct benefits to its set as other secondary sets would. This is not to say that Regen doesn't get much benefit (the set can get some pretty noticeable benefits from IOs), but the same amount of "effort" to pimp out a Regen build would see a better "return" on other sets over Regen.

Take that as you will.

Now once you start mentioning AV Soloing, the RWZ Challenge, and other high-end challenging scenarios, then all comparisons start to get skewed. Internal balance is not, and should not, be based around these scenarios. That's taking Olympic-level standards to all athletes from pee-wee summer league and from world competition circuits and everything inbetween.

Of course, I would be happy if Regen got some buffs, since I play one. But do I think the set needs it? Not really. What about scenarios where I would need to use some buffs? Then I'll grab myself a defender. Simple enough.

Still whining over more buffs needs for Regen? Get native KB protection for DA and FA, and then maybe I'll listen.

I have a Wolf/Bane hybrid that I was able to get to respec level very recently. I am looking at the powers through the Bane branch to see which ones work best for me.

I've noticed that Build Up's animation causes a draw of the Mace. Does Placate's animation also cause the mace to be drawn as well?

I was recently convinced by a friend to make another Brute, so I decided to try sets that I haven't done before. I ultimately chose DB/SR.

What I am asking if there are any special considerations that I should need to know. I figure that I'm going to soft-cap the build and get enough +recharge so that I can get a smooth attack chain. I suspect that I should also pay attention to end management, and will probably also get Aid Self as well.

I'm not looking for any complete builds, but a few hints or ideas to consider, like "is Hasten needed?" or "Which combos, and thus attacks, work best given the secondary?"

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*thinking perhaps I need to update the guide now*

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You don't really need to, unless it's just to change the numbers. It will help to make a smoother attack chain, but unless it also reflects recharge times, most builds will still be the same.

Blue side is okay for a relatively quick TF for easy merits.

Red side is much better, with a better story and presentation, and much more challenge. With some of the complaints saying that "it's too hard" or "it's bugged", I only wish that I could get my scrapper on the Red side version of it.

The Red Side SF has the cut scene. The Blue Side TF does not.

Well, then I think the solution would be not to die then, correct?

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I fully agree that its very annoying to have to turn RTTC back on but what I am saying is RTTC is a melee power and no one but fightclucbbers or melee ATs stay in melee for it to matter

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RttC is not a melee power; it is the main form of damage mitigation for WP. Without it, you have a smattering of resists and defenses, and some +HP. Yes, it is much better when used in melee range, but it's a respectable power against ranged attacks, provided it doesn't drop, that is.

How's this for the solution concerning this "bug" about Blizzard:

DON'T DIE.

So far, this tactics has worked for me on any rain power that I use, as well as any other power in the game. Once I die, well then, I can't get any powers to work. So I advise avoiding dying as much as possible for the greatest potential.

I would agree with most of Shred_Monkey's list. The time commitment to making an AV-soloing build is much more than just playing a good scrapper, or any AT for that matter, effectively and efficiently. Soloing an AV now is also probably much harder than it once was in the past, and requires more than just a pre-nerf FOTM DM/Regen build.

The forum regulars is a small percentage of the actual player base, and the "visible" regulars is probably even smaller than that. Those who can solo AVs is even a smaller number than that, making AV soloing not as common as this board would make it seem.

I know for me personally, it took me forever just to get my first character to level 50, and then it took me a few years to perfect that build so I can get it to pass the RWZ Challenge. I only got one other 50 toon but it isn't even fully IO'ed yet, not for lack of trying. And I got a few other toons building up or stuck in limbo, all vying for attention when I do decide to login (which is common, but devoted to social gameplay in addition to just soloing). My top toon is a MA/Regen since Issue 1, which I know is not really viable for AV-soloing, so the next best option is to make a new toon and maybe hope that maybe in a year or two from now, that it might be ready to solo an AV.

With the exception of grinding for influence, merits, or other building materials for builds, making a AV-soloing build is a pretty solitary endeavor, both in the game and out of it. Considering the time to invest into the game, I find it's more enjoyable to team up rather than not. And I would rather do something fun than not. I applaud those who are able solo AVs, but at least for scrappers, the time investment is prohibitive for many players.

Well, to answer the OP, mag1 stuns don't do anything by themselves. You need at least mag2 to have any affect on mobs. Devs noticed this and thus made the change. However, this is excluding the fact that several MA/ players actually used TK's mag1 stun to stack with Cobra Strike's mag3 in order to stun bosses.

Nowadays, players can now stack CS with Eagle's Claw since that now has a 100% mag3 stun in order to stun bosses.

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By entertainment do you mean suicide?

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Well, as said above, this is mutha'[censored] Werner we're talking about.

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Most of the time when I see claims of /Regen power its a Kat or BS. When your primary caps you in 1/3 of your positional defenses Regen synergizes very well because none of it's mitigation is defense based. Willpower/Unvul doesn't synergize well since it is typed defense and SR/SD can cap without Parry/DA.


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Parry/DA can help soft-cap lethal defenses, which is plentiful out there.

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Sure. But it doesn't synergize quite as well.


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I don't think it's a matter of synergy, but just a matter of fact that Parry/Divine Avalanche is just a great defensive tool. The power can provide the exact same benefit for Regen as it does for Willpower and Invulnerability. The only reason that it seems to synergize better for Regen is because Regen doesn't have any native defense. It provides the same benefit for Regen as it does for the other sets, it might even do more for Willpower and Invulnerability where it stacks with lethal defenses. For SR and SD, I would admit that the extra defenses are not needed (if built that way), but that does free up a slot to be used for something else. Otherwise, Parry/DA provide great "synergy" for those two sets through stacking the benefits.

That said, I would admit that Regen would probably get more out of it than a Willpower or Invulnerability, but that seems to be more of a issue of layering different damage mitigation, as opposed to stacking the same.

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Though really what I meant is that I'd love to see some kick [censored] non-Parry/DA videos or read some stories of Regen feats like AV killing.

(While I'd love to see some Regen action in the RWZ challenge, it's my experience that Shockwave really makes a huge difference there so I suspect it would be a Claw/Regen scenario. Not that it isn't impressive to do with Claw/Regen.)

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I doubt I'll get to AV Hunting, but I was able to get my MA/Regen to complete the RWZ Challenge, though not without much trial and error. Anything less than soft-capped, regardless of secondary, is going to have a hard time on high-end challenges.

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Most of the time when I see claims of /Regen power its a Kat or BS. When your primary caps you in 1/3 of your positional defenses Regen synergizes very well because none of it's mitigation is defense based. Willpower/Unvul doesn't synergize well since it is typed defense and SR/SD can cap without Parry/DA.


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Parry/DA can help soft-cap lethal defenses, which is plentiful out there.

Because of the toggle-heavy nature of WP, you will want to get Stamina.

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it seems to be that the set called "Regeneration" should have more regen then WP, but the numbers make it look like WP has better regen (when around enemies).

[/ QUOTE ] That's only considering Integration and Rise to the Challenge. Once you add in Instant Healing, Regeneration does have more +regen than Willpower. Toss in Dull Pain and Reconstitution and you got heals (or "burst regen") to up the ante.

I'm looking at the different playstyle of both Regen and Willpower, and Regen does require a bit more skill to be used as effectively as Willpower. As to how much skill depends on the difficulty of what you are going up against.

Assuming similar costing builds and conditions, Willpower relies on herding to get the most out of RttC. Outside of that, its toggles just need to be maintained to provide constant level damage mitigation. Once HP starts to drop to a dangerous level, the player just needs to pop an inspiration or disengage and possibly "kite" the mobs to get some breathing space for RttC to get back into the green. Otherwise, it's a race to see who goes down first or a gamble to see if your defenses will hold up.

Regeneration doesn't require herding to be useful (outside of a primary that can dish out PBAoE damage) but it can still use the disengage and kite tactic if necessary. However, its click powers can provide more protection and mitigation than just disengaging. But those powers need to be used optimally if you want to get the most out of them. The "skill" needed to use Regen and its click is something that you talk about, but you really don't get the feel of it until you are put into a situation where it really matters. Do you want to use Recon right now, or save it and let Integration pull you through for a little longer? Should I hit Recon, DP or MoG next? What works now but might not work later, or vice versa? And given enough recharge and timing, Regen is going to have another "emergency" button that a Willpower wouldn't have in a near-defeat scenario, barring external buffs or powers or inspirations.

Given the different playstyles, I can see why some players prefer Willpower to Regen, or vice versa. Another thing to consider is making builds. With just SOs, the two sets are pretty comparable, but when you throw in IOs into the mix, Willpower could generally be much better improved than Regen could, until you are going into the expensive/min-maxed builds where effectiveness of your build largely depends on build direction and circumstances.

Broadsword actually does have an unlockable Katana costume piece with the Tracer badge.

Hmmm, it seems that many people want to play Banes as scrappers or brutes, which of course will be disappointing.

I more or less see the VEATs as team or "gestault" ATs. Individually, they might be okay, possibly mediocre, but when grouped together, are greater than just the sum of their parts.