Zwillinger's Call of (to?) Cthulu


Aggelakis

 

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Originally Posted by Aurora_Girl View Post
Highlights added by me.

Unnecessary adjectives, all. Maybe it's the journalist in me.
It's much more enjoyable to read with those adjectives though. Well, to me, that is.


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I just look at it like a mountain road trip as compared to a supersonic jet. Why am I going to drive 400 miles out of my way, at a slower pace, to get to the same place?

Yeah, I think that's it. I've been a journalist too long to appreciate good writing.

/sadpanda


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Originally Posted by EarthWyrm View Post
But I do understand that there is an internet rule that any bad idea must be presented by someone at least twice a year to remind everyone who hasn't already read every previous thread on the topic precisely why the idea is bad.

 

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Originally Posted by _PhoebusApollo_ View Post
He did indeed bust out a Cthulhu rant during Pinn's Mako Week! Then there were like 2 dozen+ tentacles that popped up in one giant mob haha
Two dozen? Infinity's PI got hit with 50 at once to end Wednesday's event.


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"Savage" and "insane" I will give you, but the rest of those green words completely alter the mental vision I have of the place.

"It was a grotto" does not have the same mental image of a twilit grotto. "A world of mystery and suggestion" does not conjure up the same feeling as with the adjectives. "A world of mystery and suggestion" sounds GOOD... put those adjectives back in there and you KNOW it's not good!


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Yeah, a lot of those bizarre "unnecessary" adjectives actually are very much necessary. As Aggelakis states, "a grotto" just doesn't set the same mood as "a twilit grotto." The latter implies strange shadows, the former does not. The words he used were supposed to imply the unusual and unnatural formations and features and beasts that his characters encountered... something truly alien to our mundane comprehension. Thus the reason why his protagonists always wound up insane in the end.


 

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Lovecraft is a poet as much as a writer of fiction (in his day there was not so much separation between the two activities). When he is attempting to invoke horror, fear or suspense, he calls upon those skills to describe the things his protagonist is experiencing.

This is actually why I recommended _The Shadow Over Innsmouth_ and _The Colour Out of Space_. The former can get a bit dense with all of the history it needs to relate and with the regional speech of the characters, but each of them reads more like something a journalist would write because each of them is ostensibly grounded in the real world, with the hints of the mad things just outside of our ken remaining mostly safely outside of our ken. We see their effects but face-to-face encounters with them are brief and are treated as prosaically as the events themselves are.

Overall, though, Lovecraft is most appealing to people who enjoy words; quantities and varieties of them. If you prefer your narration terse then you'll find yourself at a disadvantage, heh.


 

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Originally Posted by Aurora_Girl View Post
Unnecessary adjectives, all. Maybe it's the journalist in me.
I fully understand your position, although I'm of the opposite taste. For example, I find Hemingway generally unreadable; his prose too often scans like bullet points on a Powerpoint slide. I don't argue against his genius, mind you, just that his style isn't to my taste.

Different squamous strokes for different eldritch folks.


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Originally Posted by Aurora_Girl View Post
Yeah, I think that's it. I've been a journalist too long to appreciate good writing.

/sadpanda
The only thing I'd say about this is that you ARE wearing a journalist hat when you should be taking it off. It's not a coincidence that most of those words you marked in green were words that implied emotion and/or judgement of some sort. You weren't just looking at the density of the writing, you were attempting to turn it into a dispassionate voice such as one would use to write a news article.

The things Lovecraft is writing about and the experience he is attempting to give the reader is the furthest thing there is from "dispassionate". That also is one of the attractions of his writings for those who admire/enjoy them.


 

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Originally Posted by GlassGoblin View Post
IFor example, I find Hemingway generally unreadable; his prose too often scans like bullet points on a Powerpoint slide. I don't argue against his genius, mind you, just that his style isn't to my taste.
Oh lord, I remember the first time I tried Hemingway. I couldn't finish... instead I wanted to drill a hole in my head to get the bland out.


 

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Somewhat off-topic (I think?), but I strongly recommend Simon R. Green's Secret History series to anyone who enjoys the content and theme of Lovecraft's writing, if not his style. It doesn't pertain to the Cthulhu mythos at all, but it does deal with the same style of eldritch beings and forbidden knowledge that Lovecraft writes about. The books aren't dense and there's humor to boot!


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Originally Posted by dugfromthearth View Post
You do realize that Jane Austin took the Welsh book "Pride" by Fflewddur Fflam, updated it with the popular (at the time) conflict of Prejudice and made it a huge hit.
That's cool! I didn't actually know that. Can you link me to something discussing that? As a big fan of Pride and Prejudice, I'd love to read more about the origins of the story. I tried doing a Google Search, but came up with limited results.

Regardless, unless she literally took the entire text from Fflewddur Fflam, and then added her own text to it, or made some edits, then I still feel similarly about it. My issue with Pride and Prejudice and Zombies (and other similar books) is that you're taking one of the mechanically greatest writers of all time, and tossing in some other text written by a modern author who isn't even what would be called a contemporary, and sticking them together. It's not believable, and I still feel it is presumptuous to think you can write as well, or remotely well enough, to be able to smoothly integrate your own writing with that of Austen, unless you're absolutely sure of your own skill as an author. Perhaps Grahame-Smith is, but I'm doubtful .

Anyway, I don't want to be too stuck up about it, this is just my personal feeling about the book. It's probably a lot of fun (disclaimer: I haven't read it), but it's not my thing ^.^.

~Freitag


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Originally Posted by Nalrok_AthZim View Post
Freitag, don't make me copy-paste my Pride & Prejudice drinking game.
Is that the one where you have to drink each time you think that Elizabeth and Mr. Darcy should just get it on?


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Wanna impress me? Next invasion, have Deep One's attach the water boarded zone.

(and no, Corlax are in no way equal to Deep Ones)


It's 106 miles to Grandville, we got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing faceless helmets

... Hit it ...

 

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Originally Posted by Blue Rabbit View Post
Indeed, be careful how many and how fast you read them. Some of them can be quite... disturbing and produce some really wyrd, vivid, uncomfortable, maddening dreams...
eh, it's probably okay if you're weird to start with. I used to keep a dream journal and had numerous dreams in Lovecraft's settings back when I first read his works.


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Originally Posted by SlickRiptide View Post
The Colour Out of Space is another good one that skirts the border between "sci fi" (Lovecraft wouldn't have understood the term and probably wouldn't have acknowledged the story as being "sci-fi") and horror. Or maybe it illustrates, like the movie Alien, that sci-fi and horror aren't mutually exclusive genres.
Michael Shea wrote kind of a sequel, in Lovecraft's style, many years later: The Color Out of Time.


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Originally Posted by Jet_Boy View Post
Wanna impress me? Next invasion, have Deep One's attach the water boarded zone.
Wait, what? Who's getting water boarded?


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Originally Posted by Freitag View Post
That's cool! I didn't actually know that. Can you link me to something discussing that? As a big fan of Pride and Prejudice, I'd love to read more about the origins of the story. I tried doing a Google Search, but came up with limited results.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fflewddur_Fflam

Yeah, it's the right one.

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you're taking one of the mechanically greatest writers of all time, and tossing in some other text written by a modern author who isn't even what would be called a contemporary, and sticking them together. It's not believable, and I still feel it is presumptuous to think you can write as well, or remotely well enough, to be able to smoothly integrate your own writing with that of Austen, unless you're absolutely sure of your own skill as an author.
The challenges of origination are not the same as those of duplication or modification.

http://felixip.blogspot.com/2011/04/scream.html

I am curious, though; Austin's technical application is very regular. She isn't like Joyce, who keeps a cadence in, it sometimes seems, whatever the least obvious way would be. I would think that lends itself to duplication.


 

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UNDERWATER ZONE!

No wonder we had to gear up to be Incarnates... forget Arachnos, we're slugging it out with DEEP ONES!

*****

My first REAL experience with Lovecraft was playing the original ALONE IN THE DARK. (Ahhhhh, how many hours lost to playing that game...) Of course, I didn't KNOW it was Lovecraft at the time (or even years later).

Then I marry Bloodspeaker, who is a huge Lovecraft fan. And as he hears me talking about "this humongous multicolored molecule-looking thing that chases you through the house going WHOMMMWHOMMWHOMM," he knew EXACTLY who I was talking about. I then proceed to tell him about the game, and he nods the entire time, going, "Yep... yep... you did what? How fast did you die?"

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Originally Posted by Aurora_Girl View Post
Highlights added by me.



Unnecessary adjectives, all. Maybe it's the journalist in me.
Not so.

I direct you to the study on the use of Blasphemy in Lovecraftiana, by Robert M. Price at http://crypt-of-cthulhu.com/lovecraftsblasphemy.htm .

Simply put, Lovecraft was adressing extra-spatial entities and their effect on the environs. A tangle of bones is eerie, but perhaps they were arranged as in The Blair Witch Project, or warped to a degree. When HPL refers to "blasphemous" or "insane" or such, he merely tries to communicate the protagonist's rejection of normalcy for the eldritch. Amorphous entity could be "blob", but it leaves more to the suggestion of the mind. The Black Goat of the Woods With a Thousand Young could well be a mother-beast, but instead conveys Pan, Magna Mater, corruption of fertility cycles and so on.

However, if HPL is too wordy at times (and even I, an avowed fangirl, admit as much) then try some of the modern writers. Ramsey Campbell is...passable. Chambers is of Lovecraft's era and focused more on the King in Yellow (yellow being a flag of insanity at the time, not obvious today), and even Robert Price or heck Robert E. Howard transposed some of the Lovecraft mythos into his own places of work and haunts. The point of the Mythos is after all not to tell us about the blaspehmous, squalid, nethermost horror in the Ghooric Zone, but rather to expose the nullity of our human power (relative to the Ourter Gods or Great Old Ones) toward the cosmos. The omnipresence of external dread and our responses to it are what make the stories fun. Now, you aren't going to win any prizes for this stuff, but it is passable pulp fiction and some of the stories are gems.

In the end, it might not be your thing and that is TOTALLY cool!


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Originally Posted by Aurora_Girl View Post
A foot is a foot is a foot.
Well...

A foot is 12 inches is 1/3 of a yard.

And, a foot is a foundation is a base of a mountain.

So... there ya go.


August 31, 2012. A Day that will Live in Infamy. Or Information. Possibly Influence. Well, Inf, anyway. Thank you, Paragon Studios, for what you did, and the enjoyment and camaraderie you brought.
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Well... perhaps I was premature about that whole 'signing off' thing... - 11-9-2012

 

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I'm also a Lovecraft fan. My first experience with Lovecraftian themes was through Metallica's two Lovecraft-inspired songs, The Call of Ktulu from Ride the Lightning and The Thing That Should Not Be from Master of Puppets. I first heard The Call of Ktulu when I was very young, after my older brother let me listen to some of his casette tapes, and it absolutely terrified me. So much so, that I came to think "instrumental" meant "really scary song" instead of just "no lyrics" and avoided instrumental songs on casette tapes altogether until I learned otherwise.

Fast forward to a few years later, and I decided to give the song another try now that I was older and braver, and I thought it was pretty awesome. A local radio station here had what they called "Mandatory Metallica" where they played a set of three Metallica songs every night at 10:00. One time they played The Call of Ktulu, and the DJ mentioned that it was based on Lovecraft's work, which prompted me to check it out. And so began my descent into madness, which manifests itself in the Rogue Isles in the form of a Mind Control/Psionic Assault Dominator named Ilithoth.


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Lessons I Learned From The Lovecraft Mythos :

While many people were apparently seduced (or bludgeoned, perhaps) by Lovecraft's fondness for the bang sign and ripping off better authors, I was paying a more careful attention, wracking his tomes for the true mysteries of the cosmos. And therein, these eldritch secrets were revealed to me:

Non-white men are evil. Women are evil, although it may be because they are weak and easily possessed by the devil, rather than because of any inherent capacity to do wrong, mom. The best weapon to kill a god? Tugboat. Accreditation is over-rated. All ancient societies wanted to end the world. Anything you don't like is probably trying to kill you. Schizophrenia just means you're doing a good job. English food is disgusting.

As I lived according to these principles, I noticed the deluded and weak men of my acquaintance moving further from me and conspiring behind my back to chain me in an institution for those they claim are mentally unfit to be in society. But it is they who are unfit! They who have shackled society to the whims of dark and coptic spirits, who placate their black masters (TOTALLY NOT RACIST, GUYS) in the capitol houses (OKAY MAYBE A LITTLE) and halls of parliment, they who have -- BY ZEUS'S FLAMES, IT COMES FOR ME!!!!!!

(To be clear, the *mythos* is great. But basically everything great about it was invented by other people.

The Dream Key of Unknown Kadath was okay, I guess.

I will grant that most English food is pretty gross. It gets better the more alcohol it's made with and/or served with.)


 

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Originally Posted by Jack_NoMind View Post
I will grant that most English food is pretty gross. It gets better the more alcohol it's made with and/or served with.)
Lovecraft also didn't like seafood.


 

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Originally Posted by Jack_NoMind View Post

To be clear, the *mythos* is great. But basically everything great about it was invented by other people.
I'd take issue with that statement but it's a personal taste thing and Jack is hardly the only person to feel that way.

Lovecraft was a product of his times, as were Poe, Howard, August Derlith, and a dozen other contemporaries. Moreover, these guys all shared their universes with each other. That's part of what made the Mythos great, but there are just as many people like myself who prefer Lovecraft's own works over the "expansions", both contemporary and more recent.

Actually, for anybody at all, but especially for AuroraGirl, I would HIGHLY recommend the Roger Zelazney story, _A Night In The Lonesome October_. It's the Mythos wrapped around a story that is basically themed around old monster movies and horror novels, with Jack the Ripper as the hero (literally). The interesting thing is that the story is told from the viewpoint of Jack's dog, Snuff, and the animal companions of the other Players of the Game that is the central focus of the plot.

Really, it's wonderful. I read it every Halloween. In relation to this topic, it would act as a sort of tutorial into both the Chtuluoid side of the Mythos and the dreamlands side of things.


 

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Who lives in a lost city under the sea? *GREAT CTHULHU!*

Enormous and eldritch and squamous is he *GREAT CTHULHU!*

If dwelling in madness is somethinÂ’ you wish *GREAT CTHULHU!*

Then head to RÂ’lyeh and swim like a fish!


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