Life Begins at 30
By
afocks,
Posted on: 2011-09-30 20:38 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
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I sometimes find myself just throwing around a few slots because I can't find anywhere to put them, but more often than not I'm left wishing I had more. I tend to build for PvP, where you can't really afford to waste a single slot and you need to squeeze as much as you can out of set bonuses, though.
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Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Some of my characters could use them, sure. Others are going to be going "OK... now where the hell do I put THESE?" I do actually have characters I'm throwing away the last two slots on.
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@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
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On the contrary, taking fullest advantage of the benefits of set bonuses typically increases demand for slots. Using IOs primarily to "frankenslot" can certainly decrease demand for slots, because you can get more total enhancement in fewer slots than with SOs or even common IOs. However, desirable set bonuses often motivate either the use of more slots than would be necessary using "pure" frankenslotting[1], or motivate the use of partial frankenslotting to obtain strong enhancement after getting a desirable bonus in less than six slots[2]. IOs also include numerous "one-slot-wonder" pieces, which motivate people to add extra slots in places they probably would not when slotting for enhancement value alone.[3]|
Originally Posted by Cannonball
I agree that, after a certain point, slots become less important thanks to IOs.
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1. Consider the defense benefits of sets like Touch of Death, Mako's Bite, or even something like Coercive Persuasion purple set. The five non-proc pieces of all these sets provide more than ED cap their primary effect, and decent slotting of secondary aspects of a power like accuracy, endurance and recharge. However, pursuit of the defense bonus compels one to include a sixth piece.
2. Consider the total enhancement of a set like Kinetic Combat, which gives a highly desirable bonus in four slots, has an often skipped fifth (proc) piece, but does not have very high enhancement values. It is common to supplement slotting this set with 1-2 more enhancements, often from another set to achieve well-rounded slotting.
3. Consider slotting Combat Jumping, which needs very little enhancement outside of seeking IO benefits, is often slotted with Kismet: +Acc (toHit); LotG: +Recharge; and/or 1-2 pieces of BotZ. Also Health is frequently five- or six-slotted with set IOs, where it would take no more than 3 slots at most with SOs or common IOs.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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This sums up the whole of the game for me these days.
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Originally Posted by Laevateinn
Life begins at 50+3 and a 15 billion inf build for me these days. The process of getting there is just a really long testing period to see if I like the character.
It's about the destination, not the journey. |
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Actually, for the ones I'm thinking of - since I don't typically IO out my builds (I have too many alts to play, that's where the fun is for me) - were hitting that "Useless slot" list with SOs. (My usual build ends up a mix of SOs, commons, and maybe a few bits of sets.) |
Originally Posted by Cannonball
I agree that, after a certain point, slots become less important thanks to IOs (I think for my characters that point occurs somewhere around...level 35-40?). Though if it is thanks only to IO sets, then the people without access to IOs (or those who don't want to deal with crafting them) will benefit from the extra slots more readily, I have no doubt.
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IO builds, IHOP... er, IMHO, are where the "extra slots" would come into more play (and, again, possibly be a tad more trouble) because you'll have more bonuses coming in than you would before because you *can* squeeze in an extra whatever - even if it's .625% max health that you wouldn't before, or throw a "why the heck not" set in somewhere.
A character's life for me starts at 23. I just can't skip the low 20's arcs. Field Agent Keith Nance, Special Agent Jenni Adair, Roy Cooling, Vincent Ross, Darrin Wade, that other guy... I love these arcs. Well, except for the glue bombs. Seriously, whose idea was it to put those in EVERY mob on long maps? Whoever it is, you should be shot. Out of a cannon. Into pig slops. Which explode into poo.
After I finish those arcs though I'm back on the leveling train until 31 where I finally start getting SLOTS! Slots! I love me some slots.
I doubt it's just me but I have a definite love for the redside story arcs from level 35+. It's not uncommon for me to go redside and stay there long enough to do some of those great arcs (and some of the best tips in the game... seriously, I have toons that I keep Rogue but just do Villain tips with because they are just so good) and get my patrons before I go back blueside.
Been here since beta, I feel like they made the lower levels (1-20) much less vexing. And by that I mean, you no longer want to pull your hair out as you try to plan stamina within the 16-18-20 levels. Now you get more powers and less waiting to get a power that should've been "free" to begin with. Either way, life gets fun at 32 and up, life is relaxed at level 20.
"If you can make a girl laugh, you can make her do anything"
"You're like Giraffe's, the way you look down on me, with your vegetarian scorn."
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I thought the game started at 1.|
Originally Posted by Talen Lee
It used to be that level 20 was the point where characters transformed, where the builds blossomed into all the good fun stuff. That's when you got stamina, and suddenly 21 was slots for stamina, and then 22 was SOs to put in those slots and it all avalanched from there.
These days? I'm finding that I'm champing at the bit for slots. Slots slots slots. So many power choices and I have so few slots to work with before level 35 or so. Interesting how things change. |
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Originally Posted by Laevateinn
Life begins at 50+3 and a 15 billion inf build for me these days. The process of getting there is just a really long testing period to see if I like the character.
It's about the destination, not the journey. |
I'm going to back 37 on this. Not a surprise considering my earlier post in this thread.
But I'll also point out that the first ward arcs are a hell of a lot of fun and very well written. I've only done a little of the new lowbie arcs, but especially villain side they have very good writing, and interesting play challenges for the level. The signature story arcs are also pretty cool and offer rewards for all levels.
Lots of the newer content is coming out mid-level.
For me, the game is still about having fun all the way through.
"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
Returning player here, back in CoH after a hiatus since 2008:
Do I understand correctly that one no longer needs to take the Stamina power to have a viable build? If so, that is a huge improvement in game enjoyability since I stopped playing 3 years ago.
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Originally Posted by Parsifal
Returning player here, back in CoH after a hiatus since 2008:
Do I understand correctly that one no longer needs to take the Stamina power to have a viable build? If so, that is a huge improvement in game enjoyability since I stopped playing 3 years ago. |
No, the change to Stamina was that it - along with entire fitness pool - is now inherent, and you get 3 extra power picks instead of having to fit it in the first 20 levels.
I've always had the most fun playing from 22-30. SO's and equivalent slots become available, most characters can do thier job respectably yet theres still some risk. After 32, things just become a zerg fest anymore and it only gets worse from 38.
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This! SOs from lvl 1 and nice buffs so you can hit stuff, plus the new shiny IOs. Love the trial
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Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
With beginners luck, the Gamestop 1-22 dual-aspect procs, and temp powers from DFB? Life begins at level 1 for me, pretty much. I used to try to plow past the lowbie levels as fast as possible... but I've definitely enjoyed going from 1-20 twice in a row since the release of Freedom (I'd have made more progress if I played more often
 ).I'm about to start doing the First Ward content in earnest on them, and from the little I've already done on my BR/Traps, it's going to be damn good |
Originally Posted by Megajoule
We're being invaded. Again. This time, instead of aliens, zombies, or eyeballs with teeth, it's the marching band.
I seem to average out at 34.... As an end, not a start
Most of my alts stall around the 34-38 range as I get distracted by a new Shiny and play that for a bit (until it too is discarded for the next new, shiny thing).
I've been playing since 2005. I've 4 level 50s and 1 Incarnate.
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Hm wondering what you guys do when you hit 50? I mean I have several IOed out lvl 50 chars but after a while I just get super bored with repeating boring trials. Of course I did badging and story Arcs with my main, but not with all 50s.|
Originally Posted by macskull
Same here. The first 49 levels are just an annoying hurdle to get over.
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Trying out new powerset combinations is still the most fun for me. So what is fun for you guys?
Originally Posted by Megajoule
We're being invaded. Again. This time, instead of aliens, zombies, or eyeballs with teeth, it's the marching band.
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From 12 on DOs is good, but 22 and SOs is a noticeable leap in performance.
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Originally Posted by Tormentoso
I'm finding its the other way around. Used to be 22 was when the engines got running, but with inherent fitness, the underground trial, the revamped Posi TF, and level 15 IOs, the tens are really enjoyable.
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Seriously, I hit 50 and Incarnate plus out a few characters, and I'm done. Every so often, I'll break the guys out to tear things up, hang with people, but it's largely shelf time.
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Originally Posted by Razia
Hm wondering what you guys do when you hit 50? I mean I have several IOed out lvl 50 chars but after a while I just get super bored with repeating boring trials. Of course I did badging and story Arcs with my main, but not with all 50s.
Trying out new powerset combinations is still the most fun for me. So what is fun for you guys? |
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level 17 and IOs gets you virtually the same leap quite a bit earlier.
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Originally Posted by ThePill
From 12 on DOs is good, but 22 and SOs is a noticeable leap in performance.
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"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
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What is DFB? I've been away too long!
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Originally Posted by Kitsune Knight
If you get the +accuracy "temp" power from DFB, you tend to hit fairly well from 1-22 (the point it expires... unless it takes you 168+ hours of play time to get to 22). It's not 95% cap (once Beginners Luck goes away), but, if being just shy of that bothers you, TOs/DOs will get you the last time bit no problem.
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Death From Below, the low level sewer trial. Grants bonuses for completing.
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Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly
What is DFB? I've been away too long!
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If you PL a character or even just rush through the low levels via trials or what have you, you miss out on the joy of turning experience off at level 30 and rolling the hero (or presumably villain) merits that you've been accumulating before turning experience back on. Sure it takes a week or two depending on how many you've been collecting but it also enriches you both spiritually and financially. Plus, you end up with a few of the lotgs, uniques and so forth that you're going to need in your build anyway. I guess now that they've altered the way SSA rewards work it isn't quite as lucrative now as it was for that golden age that was late september/early october, but it ain't bad. Lucky for me they released a bunch of new power sets during that period as well so I was able to get a bunch of new lowbies through it.
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Originally Posted by Silas
Heh, pretty much this for me. I've become so used to playing with IOs (and pretty much all the play I do nowadays is 50s) that I have very little patience for sub-50 play.
The builds don't always cost 15b though :3 |
You are right, sometimes they cost more
. My DM/SD build for example... 5 purple sets, the 3 PvP uniques, +3 Hami-Os, 5 LotGs, etc... I should calculate the actual total cost sometime.
TW/Elec Optimization
I think by 20-30 the character is about ready and from there on out, its just a fine tuning exercise to get them truly sorted.
My masterminds don't feel whole until level 32. I love the laser light show from the Bots. Demons really rock with their second upgrade. Necromancy explodes, especially with the Lich controls.
Defenders hit their stride right around level 12. Speed boost, Fearsome Stare, Hurricane, Lingering Rad (radiation defenders could take powers til 12 and make a good living with what they have), Dispersion Bubbles.
My new dark/dark blaster got to level 22, had his SOs, and I thought >>> there's MOAR to come?? I love that little blaster guy.
I agree with a previous poster about level 26 on the soldiers of arachnos.
Warshades when they get stygian and the end/health replenish button... woo hoo.
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
You know, I could never get a character beyond 25 for the longest time. I kept being told that once I got to 30, things would open up, but I solo a lot and I don't tend to play for that long on a single character so I never really saw it.
Then I got to 30 on my Brute, and it was pretty fun for a bit. I had almost all of my primary and secondary and even a good deal of extra powers by about 32, and I was playing with the whole toybox, and then...
Nothing. The game just stopped. 34+ was just an exercise in "Oh goody, I've got more slots. I want powers, can I have more powers?" until by about 38 I just couldn't stand the long slogs that earned me nothing I was interested in. The initial discovery - the 1 to 20 - remains my favourite period of the game for power-sets I haven't tried, because it's all about seeing my shiny new powers and thinking how great they'll be when I get stronger. I have no desire to grind to get the incarnate powers, because I just don't find that sort of thing fun... so there really wasn't any drive to level after I had all my powers.
Sure, it means a lot of people just brush me off when I RP on my low-level alts, but they probably aren't worth hanging out with anyways.
Basically, I can't agree that life begins at 30. Having got there and beyond at last, it feels distinctly... underwhelming. Like I've finally collected all the coins for my collection, but now I don't have anything to do. I've got capes, auras, four costume slots, all the primary, secondary and power pools (except ancillaries) that I want... there really isn't anything I care about anymore.
It's probably mostly a case of that character being a brute, but I got a blaster to around 34 and it felt about the same. Am I unusual?
Some of my characters could use them, sure. Others are going to be going "OK... now where the hell do I put THESE?" I do actually have characters I'm throwing away the last two slots on.
Of course, this means - if they get it working - more things getting six slotted, more piling on of sets, more power creep... like we're not already trivializing content at this point. Have to see how it goes. My triform khelds won't argue, though.