Crafting view from a new player - needs an overhaul

Thank you for clarifying precisely how much attention you believe the members of the forum ought to give you, going forward.

Well, no. They're making a reasonable and informed decision to treat your posts based on how you presented.

Ahh, but here's the thing.

You are sending exactly the same messages to any devs who read the posts. Furthermore, the devs in this game generally like the players. They have been known to ask players for advice about things, act on player guidance, and so on.

And they use the experienced players who know the game as one of the filters to identify "feedback worth considering".

You've just told the developers that your feedback is insincere and unconsidered, and they will doubtless react to it accordingly.

This defeats your stated purposes.

There's a reason Fulmens put the OP on ignore.

Nice curve. I'm not buying it though.

The devs will disregard or give merit to my comments based on their own judgments. I HIGHLY doubt that they will seek player approval first before giving an eye to anything I have to say, and note that that conveniently gives power to the forum members and takes it away from the devs.

To be honest that's one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard.

Don't be sad.

I could have certainly been too harsh in my OP. Perhaps just a bit of fine tuning would make it more palatable, but I do think I'm not imagining things here, and it seems there are at least a few that agree. The early system is a bit counter intuitive.

You've obviously haven't been playing this game very long. The very people your saying you don't owe anything to, are the very people the devs DO listen to. They are the vets, they are the ones who first discovered the power of IOs (back when they were released) they were the ones who first downed Hamidon, and then proceeded to down him again when they revamped Hamidon. (which by the way, was mainly done with PLAYER input in mind)

So quite simply put, the devs WILL listen to THEM much more then they will listen to YOU, especially when you flat out refuse to post FACTS, and are just working off your own OPINIONS.

I also love how you completely ignored the post about 'google' basically blowing your argument straight outta the water. By your own definition of 'do it for me' we have already discovered how much truth your saying, so what really makes you think the devs are going listen to you?

My experiences with crafting in games:
1) Fantasy single player:
- 1 scroll = experience (yes, the player's experience) + expensive components + memorized spell + game time. Crafted scroll is 1 level lower than the player. Somewhat useful for support type spells, but combat spells would be too weak.
- 1 weapon = expensive components + gold. Crafted weapon is not magical. When sold at vendor, cost of crafting is more than what vendor would pay. Weapon quality is equivalent to a common drop.

2) Another fantasy single player:
- closest thing to crafting is putting runes or gems in existing armor and weapons. To get the runes/gems, player repeatedly farms a level and a random rune/gem is rewarded after defeating a boss. This approximately takes 30-45 mins.

3) Some other superhero game:
- In order to craft, the player must have skill points equal or more than what the recipe requires.
- To build up skill points, player must research dropped gear of a certain type. Gear is broken down into components.
- Player buys recipe when skill point requirement is met. Recipe is learned.
- Items can be crafted from learned recipes with the correct amount of components. Sometimes, 20+ of a certain component is required.
- Player throws hands up in disgust after discovering that recipes to be learned produce items that are inferior in stat enhancement compared to mission drops. IE, it is better to equip drops from missions rather than crafted items. Said crafted items don't sell well in the auction house either.

I subbed a little over a year ago, and during my first 2 months, I slotted only the drops that I got. If I didn't have the parts, I didn't craft it. Even with this hodgepodge slotting, my toon made it to 50, finished the major story arcs and even completed lvl 50 strikeforces, albeit more dying than usual.

Like what other poster have mentioned before, this game doesn't require optimal power slotting in order to succeed. Also, compared to the 3 other games I played, this game has the best so far in terms of usable crafting. The crafted item is usable and tradeable. IE, if I make it for someone else, I can get compensated for my work. There are several ways to get recipes and salvage. The player doesn't have to constantly grind and raid for gear.

1) Your first comment does not impress me. It also doesn't change my point. They could be the folks that cured cancer, your not going to flip a switch and turn me into a sheep.

2) Perhaps they will. Again, this does not change the fact that I do not care about their opinions concerning my post, it's validity or whether or not it is valid or "will be heard". You can bet that isn't going to change any time soon. No amount of fantasy or slant is going to change that.

I do however support and encourage folks to disagree and post why they don't think it's an issue right in this thread...that way the dev's see all corners of the room and can make up their own minds.

3) The same thing that makes you think they will not. Imagine that.

I can't deny that the crafting in this game is good, IMO past 30, certainly one of the best (though IMO SWG had the best crafting hands down). I also like the lack of concentration on gear and the improvement of base abilities with enhancements, which further sweetens the crafting.

I still feel, however, there is no need for it prior to 30, or even perhaps 20. I just think it would be best to introduce it later in the game.

Well, yes, I'm confused why you found it necessarily to lie. As I linked, in one thread you repeatedly state that you are posting from the viewpoint of a new player. In another thread, you posted that you are a RETURNING player and, furthermore, implied that you had left and returned more than once.

Since those statements are directly contradictory, one of them must be a lie.

So you think crafting is one of the best after level 30 but before that not so much. Then why don't you just ignore crafting before level 30? Why would you want to take out crafting below level 30 when obviously some people enjoy it?

If you think there is no need for it pre 30 then ignore it. They say the simplest answer is usually the best.

Well well well. Lie, eh? It coudn't POSSIBLY be that you simply do not understand. Nope, that's not possible. It has to be that I am...lying.

Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant.

Ok, for once I will respond, only to demonstrate...well...let's just say (to remain within the rules) to show how...incorrect...your statement is.


I played for one or two months (cant remember) back 3 years ago. I just resubbed and are in my first month back.

If you still can't grasp what I mean...3 months tops. That means new player. I have no toons ABOVE 30.

I really hope I don't have to explain that further. Although I do wish I could have more fun with my response, I really need to remain within the forum rules....and when this post so strongly begs for it....oh well.

To the next incredibly witty comment you made, obviously well thought out...all I can say is this...read. If you do that you might find the folly in your comment.

Perhaps.

<shrug>
I read. I quoted. I linked. People will make their own judgements.

Fair enough.

...

Only if you expect not to be taken seriously.

Either you missed the point... or you really don't understand what you are saying.

The POINT of the post you quoted was that if someone posts a suggestion, full of reasons, and logic and a definable well-rounded reason for a change to be made in the game AND a lot of players seem to agree on the forums, it is FAR more likely to recieve Dev attention. Juxtapose that with what you are doing: posting an unreasoned, unsupported suggestion in which you deliberately disregard criticism by stating you don't care what other players think.

How can you possibly think a Dev will look twice at your post?

WHAT?

She doesn't think they will regard your post becuase you have no basis in fact, and no player support... how can that possibly be the reasons you think that it will? In what universe are those positives?

Because SHE THINKS....important point to make. Does not make it so, as I don't agree that I need to prove my point or have player support to be heard.

I really didnt think I would have to explain a response to one person to another person...but ok.

At any rate, we can continue to discuss why I should give player opinions more credit than I do, and continue to go nowhere if you guys wish.

I think your going to find ANY slant put in my direction is not going to have the effect you expect.

I disagree... you will summarily ignore it, thus defeating the entire point of a discussion board. I have to wonder, if you care so little of others' opinions, then why bother responding to any of us at all?

*NIGHTMARE FLASHBACK* No, no more Minotaur Hero's Brew. Please, anything but Minotaur Hero's Brew. No, keep it away from me NOOOOO!!!

(yeah, a little late to the party here but man did I hate Minotaur Hero's Brew. You had to brew it to know the pain.)

I had a few great conversations already about my posts. Even edited them a bit to make them more presentable, less opinionated, a bit more neutral, etc.

I don't think I have to explain to you the difference between those that actually want to talk...and those that want to argue.

As for the responses to diatribe...well, even I like to have fun. So I return a serve or two. Eventually they go away or put me on ignore and I can actually talk to folks that are genuinely interested in doing so.

So there you are.

I believe Baublie Diggs just might have been the devil.

So relaxing.

First off, i'm not a she...

Secondly, lets actually look at the sugguestion.

You want the IO system (but not the market) to be introduced to new players at level 30, or higher, instead of at level 10. Due to your opinion on the IO system being too complex for lower level characters to understand, or get any benefit from said IO system below level 30.

Your arguement was that the complexity of the IO system was one of the main factors in peoples complaints about CoH, and to introduce it later would mean characters would have less to worry about until then, and be of a high enough level that the IO system will benefit them more, then it would benefit a level 10 character.

Now, lets look at some of the sub level 30 IO sets:

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Category...r_levels_10-15
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Category...r_levels_15-20
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Category...r_levels_20-25
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Category...r_levels_21-25
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Category...r_levels_25-30

So, not counting doubles, your looking at about 123-ish Sets that run the gauntlet between level 10, and level 30. Your also looking at about 32 pieces of salvage in the level 4 - 25 range, and another 32 pieces of salvage in the 25 - 40 range. All of those would either have to be removed, or adjusted to drop at your new proposed 30+ range.

Looking again at the IO recipes in the pre-30 range, and you'll see plenty that of pretty good usage. Any damage procs in those range will function from level 7 upwards, adding to players DPS, Karma and Steadfast IOs (both don't drop below level 30) offer KB protection, and the steadfast +def IO is one of the most prized recipes due to the 3% defense boost it gives. There are also plenty of sets that can help with exemplaring at those level ranges, or help with a frankenslot build, as the dual-,tri- and quad-aspect enhancements are less affected by the limits of Exemplaring, which is explained here. http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Exemplar...n_Enhancements

So how exactly is the IO system not very useful pre-level 30, and somehow gets better post level 30?