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I don't see a contradiction there, per se, just trying to express my opinion concisely. As other posters have said, by enabling the purchase of IOs and other Dev imposed time sinks, there are fewer and fewer reason to actually play the game... which runs contrary to driving more subscriptions as well as causing more of a push toward post 50 content then there already is... making the low levels MORE barren and encouraging repetition of this cycle for newer players... which is what's wrong with some other MMOs.
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Originally Posted by Thany144
You just condradicted yourself. They can sell what they as long as it isnt what you say?? LOL
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Thanks for saying that, Arcana, you nailed my issue exactly.
I don't think we'll see true IOs on the market, but I would put money (or Paragon Points lol) on Enhancements that are similar to those that were given out with the Gamestop Preorder for GR.
Here's a cut and paste of what they entailed:
Exclusive Enhancements: The five exclusive Enhancements increase the damage and recharge value of a character power and have a small chance to trigger an additional ability. The Enhancements and their additional abilities are:
* Will of the SeersChance for minor psi damage.
* Clockwork EfficiencyChance for minor energy damage.
* Might of the EmpireChance for knockdown.
* Resistance TacticsChance for minor smash damage.
* Syndicate TechniquesChance for minor lethal additional ability triggered.
These Enhancements are only available to newly created characters. Each new character will receive one of each Enhancement. They cannot be sold, stacked, or traded. These Enhancements are equivalent to a Security Level 20 Dual Origin Enhancement.
Since these were already made available for a price, I can see similar be added for th item shop. Probably similar added for every 10 levels or so....
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I'll be shocked if they don't have almost exact copies of purple sets in the store. It's a total cash cow. People WILL pay for things with real money because they are lazy. You can buy +1 stuff in some F2P games stores. YOU START with +1 gear and people buy them, with points.
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Originally Posted by SkyStreak_TM
I don't think we'll see true IOs on the market, but I would put money (or Paragon Points lol) on Enhancements that are similar to those that were given out with the Gamestop Preorder for GR.
Here's a cut and paste of what they entailed: Exclusive Enhancements: The five exclusive Enhancements increase the damage and recharge value of a character power and have a small chance to trigger an additional ability. The Enhancements and their additional abilities are: * Will of the SeersChance for minor psi damage. * Clockwork EfficiencyChance for minor energy damage. * Might of the EmpireChance for knockdown. * Resistance TacticsChance for minor smash damage. * Syndicate TechniquesChance for minor lethal additional ability triggered. These Enhancements are only available to newly created characters. Each new character will receive one of each Enhancement. They cannot be sold, stacked, or traded. These Enhancements are equivalent to a Security Level 20 Dual Origin Enhancement. Since these were already made available for a price, I can see similar be added for th item shop. Probably similar added for every 10 levels or so.... |
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I could see that, Skystreak. Be nice!
And, just to say? Travel powers at level 6 should not be made available in the store. I firmly believe that needs to be a QOL change for the game come i21. Its been a big improvement in my characters since I got that VR, but like Fitness I think it needs to be revisited for the player as a whole.
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But then they lose a considerable time sink with nothing to replace it with; spend time and effort or $10 per purple or almost purple? No contest. I'd just as soon see Purples only be available for Premium and VIP players. Purples are a reason to do content for extended periods of time - like it or not grind = time vs reward (as opposed to risk vs reward) which has a needed function in MMOs.|
Originally Posted by MrDead
I'll be shocked if they don't have almost exact copies of purple sets in the store. It's a total cash cow. People WILL pay for things with real money because they are lazy. You can buy +1 stuff in some F2P games stores. YOU START with +1 gear and people buy them, with points.
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And, as mentioned upthread, I'm afraid of the possible social consequences.
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You have that bass ackwards.|
Originally Posted by MrDead
I'll be shocked if they don't have almost exact copies of purple sets in the store. It's a total cash cow. People WILL pay for things with real money because they are lazy. You can buy +1 stuff in some F2P games stores. YOU START with +1 gear and people buy them, with points.
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Keeping VIPs here, and increasing the value of the subscription seems to be their drive. "Just because it makes money" seems to not be as high on the list for this Dev team. Which is a step in the right direction. Also, it bears noting that our Dev team is looking at other games as much for inspiration as to learn what NOT to do. That example is firmly in the latter category.
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Regardless of the arguments that can be made against the rest of the post, I would like to at least point out: Not everyone who is willing to pay money for stuff is lazy. There are some people, myself included, who do not get to spend NEARLY as much time in-game as they would like to. And I'm still opposed to selling purples in the Paragon Store. Though if the Devs go that route.. well it's their decision.|
Originally Posted by MrDead
People WILL pay for things with real money because they are lazy.
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Originally Posted by Psyte
I could see that, Skystreak. Be nice!
And, just to say? Travel powers at level 6 should not be made available in the store. I firmly believe that needs to be a QOL change for the game come i21. Its been a big improvement in my characters since I got that VR, but like Fitness I think it needs to be revisited for the player as a whole. |
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Agreed; some players have time, some don't. Work, school, family responsibilities, etc, can all get in the way of having time to play normally, nevermind getting high-grind items and such. Some of us only have time for a half -hour to an hour every few days to play! Are we lazy? No, quite the opposite!
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Originally Posted by Sapphire7
Regardless of the arguments that can be made against the rest of the post, I would like to at least point out: Not everyone who is willing to pay money for stuff is lazy. There are some people, myself included, who do not get to spend NEARLY as much time in-game as they would like to. And I'm still opposed to selling purples in the Paragon Store. Though if the Devs go that route.. well it's their decision.
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FYI, Free accounts can't use Inventions. |
Originally Posted by Psyte
I'd just as soon see Purples only be available for Premium and VIP players.
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
it's NEVER too late to pad your /ignore list!
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Well, that solves that |
Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man
FYI, Free accounts can't use Inventions.
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Just to be clear, those aren't sets atball, they are single proc Enhancements that are usable from Level 1 to 20.|
Originally Posted by MrDead
I'll be shocked if they don't have almost exact copies of purple sets in the store. It's a total cash cow. People WILL pay for things with real money because they are lazy. You can buy +1 stuff in some F2P games stores. YOU START with +1 gear and people buy them, with points.
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They give you a slight bonus early on compared to a same level character who isn't using them, but since it is only a sligh chance to activate, it's a minor edge.
It's nice, but not a game changer; just the kind of items that I forsee in a cash shop.
Can someone clarify this for me, because this has really infuriated me - if I've read it correctly.
VIP players will have to pay / trade in Paragon Points to unlock new powersets when they're made available? This isn't just for free/premium players?
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There's no OFFICIAL word on this either way. And we know for a fact that the new Time Manipulation powerset will be included with your VIP subscription.|
Originally Posted by Michael Cullen
Can someone clarify this for me, because this has really infuriated me - if I've read it correctly.
VIP players will have to pay / trade in Paragon Points to unlock new powersets when they're made available? This isn't just for free/premium players? |
Everything else is just speculation at this point. It was insinuated in last week's Massively.com article that one would have to pay to access Titan Weapons, but the writer of that article is in no way affiliated with the development team.
Feel free to weigh in on one side or the other, but there's no point in being infuriated months before the system is set to go live.
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
it's NEVER too late to pad your /ignore list!
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Currently, free players get some powersets for free, and some they have to buy by purchasing things like boxed expansions. In Freedom, expect that to continue: some powersets will be absolutely free to VIPs, and some will cost Points to unlock. Up to now, *all* powersets that were not free required cash to buy. In Freedom, you can buy them with cash, or you can buy them with points if you have any stocked up from the free allotment you get as part of your subscription. In all respects this is a better deal than what we have now.
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Originally Posted by Michael Cullen
Can someone clarify this for me, because this has really infuriated me - if I've read it correctly.
VIP players will have to pay / trade in Paragon Points to unlock new powersets when they're made available? This isn't just for free/premium players? |
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How is that better than what we have now? Now, ALL powersets are free to paying customers... how is it fair if some are restricted to those who can stump up the extra cash on top of their monthly fees? :-\
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Currently, free players get some powersets for free, and some they have to buy by purchasing things like boxed expansions. In Freedom, expect that to continue: some powersets will be absolutely free to VIPs, and some will cost Points to unlock. Up to now, *all* powersets that were not free required cash to buy. In Freedom, you can buy them with cash, or you can buy them with points if you have any stocked up from the free allotment you get as part of your subscription. In all respects this is a better deal than what we have now.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, the Going Rogue powersets are not free at the moment. If you have CoX but not GR, you cannot use Demon Summoning, Dual Pistols, Kinetic Melee or Electrical Control.|
Originally Posted by Michael Cullen
How is that better than what we have now? Now, ALL powersets are free to paying customers... how is it fair if some are restricted to those who can stump up the extra cash on top of their monthly fees? :-\
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edit: And its better, in theory, because if you hate certain AT's then you can ignore that but buy what you like. So, if you only like Melee types, ignore the new buff/debuff, control and ranged types. Likewise, since VIPs get point allotments, waiting to use those points means you can get the new sets at a lower out of pocket price or nothing out of pocket at all.
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As mentioned, not all powersets are free. You must have bought Going Rogue to have access to Dual Pistols and Demon Summoning. When City of Villains came out, you had to have bought that to have access to any of the villain sets. There have been times in the past, therefore, that even paid subscribers have had to pay for new powersets.
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Originally Posted by Michael Cullen
How is that better than what we have now? Now, ALL powersets are free to paying customers... how is it fair if some are restricted to those who can stump up the extra cash on top of their monthly fees? :-\
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... Am I the only one who giggles at seeing phrases like this?
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Originally Posted by Michael Cullen
free to paying customers
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Softcapping an Invuln is fantastic. Softcapping a Willpower is amazing. Softcapping SR is kissing your sister.
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Such as, for example, in the very first sentence of my post.
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Originally Posted by Sapphire7
As mentioned, not all powersets are free. You must have bought Going Rogue to have access to Dual Pistols and Demon Summoning.
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...nope.
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Originally Posted by Void_Huntress
... Am I the only one who giggles at seeing phrases like this?
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Not really, but I'm in advertising.|
Originally Posted by Void_Huntress
... Am I the only one who giggles at seeing phrases like this?
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For VIPs "free" means - "We'll give you something, but its basically there to sweeten the deal and hopefully retain you as a customer that much longer." VIPs will get Paragon Points, Transfers, Signature Stories, etc. - things Premium and Free players will have to pay for - for "free".
For Premium and Free players, "free" means - "We'll give you something, but its to try and get you to spend money with us." They'll get access to the game and such for "free," but more game options will be denied them until they spend money or, for select content, become VIPs.
Both are excellent ways to accomplish what they're trying to do.
But, yeah, again, I'm in advertising
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Because you couldn't get those powersets by also just playing normally for a certain amount of months to let your points build up and get them for no more than what you pay to play normally. You ALSO have the choice of paying a little more to buy them as soon as they appear. You didn't have a choice before- You could either pay your subscription fee and the extra price to get those powers, or you could not get those powers. Now, you can get those power sets just by waiting a little while and spending your gathered points on them.|
Originally Posted by Michael Cullen
How is that better than what we have now? Now, ALL powersets are free to paying customers... how is it fair if some are restricted to those who can stump up the extra cash on top of their monthly fees? :-\
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But again, nothing's certain about how much they'll cost, or how often power sets will need to be bought by VIP members.
[Edit] Quoted the wrong person there.
My personal take on the "paying" for new powersets is this. As a "VIP" customer maybe they should be allowed early access to them, similar as to what happened with dual pistols and demon summoning prior to GR? The examples given about "buying" powersets in relation to CoV and GR is moot. You were not just buying powersets, you were effectively buying a whole new game to add on to what you had that included new powersets for AT's or new AT's in CoV's case. Maybe even a discount on the cost of the new powersets could be implemented. That would also give another incentive for free/premium players to become VIP players as there would be a discount on powersets if they were VIP.
Just a thought.
Cat
1. The Devs have decided that game balance is important. It doesn't matter if the players think it is unimportant or even unfair, it is what it is. The Devs actively avoid doing things that will significantly unbalance the game.
2. The way others have fun in the game does directly impact how everyone has fun in the game:
A. Farmers affect the economy by flooding the market (not saying it's bad, but it's an effect)
B. We already see calls for "No S/L damage" and "Must be at least +1" for iTrials and TFs. It's not hard to imagine calls for "Purpled toons only" as well. Granted these people are doing us a favor by announcing what terrible teammates they are, and we know to avoid them, but it is still an effect.
3. The stronger toons are, the faster they get through content.'more very strong toons means more people running out of content faster. This in turn means either the Devs have to churn out more content to keep these people interested, or run the risk of losing players to boredom. An upper limit on the average strength of the majority of the playerbase ensures the survivability of content. That's why purples are very rare, and hard to get. Cash-buyable purples would throw that mechanic entirely out the window, unless they charged HUGE amounts of money. At which point players would rightly complain that only the IRL rich get the best goodies.
It's messy no matter how you look at it. I don't gamble, but I think it's a safe bet that purples won't be in the Paragon Market.