So, I did a Sutter TF today.

And a few things surprised me. if you're also late to doing it, like me, there may be some spoilers.

1: There were lots of optional things to get done, but from my position as a team member rather than a team leader, completing them didn't actually seem to do anything. No badges or anything. It threw me a little.

2: In the Apex/Tin Mage TF's, the IDF were presented as a force that defeated the Freedom Phalanx in the opening salvo, and took Incarnate-awakened heroes to even begin to match them as they attacked Paragon.

In this TF, people from level 20-40 could face them with no problem. That seems a little odd to me. Does the alpha slot penalty for not having it unlocked still exist in the two Praetorian TF's?

3: The under-sewer fight seemed rather, rather anti-melee. The constant flood of exploding ghouls, delivering a fair wallop of damage? The fact they come from several directions made me wonder how it could be possible to distract them while the AV summoning them was taken down. We took a lot of injury and defeats, and I was only safe due to being able to hover outside of their blast zone, them having no other attacks.

4: Primal Durray's teleporting seemed rather excessive, especially coupled with his air strikes, and then the spawns of Sky Raiders getting involved as well.

I enjoyed it, but... these things jab at me, and I was wondering if anyone else has noticed them too.

Well arent they lower level?

Lower-level content is always assumed to chronologically precede higher-level content. If you're doing Sutter, Apex hasn't happened yet. Yes, it does tie your personal timeline in knots, but such is the nature of non-static MMO timelines.

The level progression is usually assumed to be time-based - for example, level 20 loyalists are still going to hear Marchand telling them he hopes they can stop the war- he was still saying it in I19 after the Incarnate TFs, and I assume he's still saying it now after the Sutter TF and the first 2 Trials - and he's likely to keep on saying it even after we get the final showdown with Tyrant - because it's still part of unfolding storyline for new players and avatars.

I could rant forever about that TF. I complained awhlie back aout it. I hated how they crammed 500 objectives into that little Nav bar, rehashed Apex and Tin Mage for lower levels.

The Bright spot was the Preatorian Fusionette and Faultline.

The villains will the new SF/TF award. Guess Devs hate heroes now.

I've done Sutter 3 times now and I enjoy it. As for your concern over 20 levels suddenly being able to battle IDF... At some point every 50 level hero or Villain was a 20 level so why can't that be true of the IDF as well? The 54 level troops were tied up attacking Vanguard HQ, Portal Corp and Nerva (Tin Mage) and Kings Row (Apex) so the lower levels were called out to assist in Ind Port. There are 40 level Freakshow but how many of them do you see roaming the streets in Talos or Faultline?

I thought it was great that a 20 level has the opportunity to do a TF with more than One Arch Villain.

I do agree that the sewer battle gets a little intense.. Its been a while but I seem to recall missions in Praetoria where Ghouls and Failed Experiments were being groomed to become "Semi-human" bombs and really if you have run missions in Praetoria the now infamous Praetorian Ambush is very much like that.. when its over you look around and can't help wondering how did I survive THAT?

I have run both the new 20-40 level TF/SF now and enjoyed them both!

I think that the devs should of revamped new content every issue after an area goes kablooey. Like say, i20 should of revamped Steel Canyon, Kings Row, Nerva Archipelago and Peregrine Island, i21 revamps Skyway City and Talos Island, etc.

Would of went with the story, updated the game, give something asked for for awhile, and help spread out the revamping so it takes less dev time.

Both really, they both got beat up, I edited it like a minute ago.

Think of it like this: Cole and his Praetorian Guard only empower their IDF flunkies when they are nearby, as in the Apex/Tin Mage TFs and the Trials. In Sutter, they're not present. This attack is led by lower ranked Praetorian officers, who don't have access to Cole's Incarnate godliness.

Alternatively, as we have now seen that the Praetorians initial offensive was launched from the Floatilla, we could interpret the construction in Kings Row as a supression device, not a portal as originally thought.

It would make sense for invading Clockwork to position the device city-centrally so to speak to gain maximum impact against Primal Supers, hence Apex's need for incarnates to clear out the area so that Primal Techs can disable the equipment?

It would also make sense that Anti-Matter has similar supression for Primal Supers in Praetoria, hence the same power supression mechanic for our counter-offensive in the Tin Mage TF.

As for Sutter, we could concieve that the time it takes for Admiral Sutters fleet to get from the floatilla back to Paragon, that the Apex TF has succeeded and that Supers are now able to fight on an even level to the IDF.

The Sutter TF takes place just before or during the Apex one. One of the Sky Raiders mentions that their invasion is just a diversion from Battle Maiden's assault.

I think the problem here is that the IDF are being used for endgame Incarnate content and are suppose to, at the moment, require Incarnates to be a match.

Then suddenly level 20 non-Incarnates have no such trouble.

It's a kind of disconnect, you can't have the IDF being the endgame badass AND be matchable by a low level taskforce, it kind of peeves off Incarnate players since it makes them feel less powerful and doesn't do the enemy group justice.

Now if they'd stuck to just using Skyraiders that would have been fine.