How to Prepare for Future Content


Arilou

 

Posted

Playing on the Apex and Tin Mage Task Forces with some routine successful players on my server, I've never had any problems with the level 54 enemies. Yeah, they hit harder and take longer to kill, but everyone on the team was learned and accomplished and taking down two Goliath War Walkers, and then Neuron before Bobcat, all without anyone being defeated, well, it wasn't anything too difficult for us.

I've heard stories, however, of people attempting those Task Forces and dying left and right; often times giving up and abandoning the effort altogether. What for me and the people I play with wasn't too big a challenge sent other people packing with no hopes of ever returning. Combine this with news of people attempting the Behavioral Adjustment Facility trial on the Going Rogue beta server, and you hear the same remarks: level 54s are handing people's heads to them.

The reason so many people are having difficulties with these events (while the people I play with and I didn't have any major troubles with them) is because the game has been too easy for too long. Once the Invention system came into the picture, people became much more powerful than Single-Origin Enhancements let them be, and now we've got the Level Shift in the works. The game continued to grow easier and characters stronger, and there was no content geared for more powerful characters; the challenge plateaued and eventually started to decline.

And now that there's more challenge at long last, people are having major issues with it because they're not prepared for it. They've built their characters to perform well in level 50 content and their builds don't work so well in level 54 content. This isn't a failure of any kind, but it's a strong eye-opener that we need to make sure we plan in advance and prepare for the more challenging content that will be coming our way from now on.
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Things you can do to prepare for future content:


Slot for Accuracy

Higher level enemies aren't just more powerful. Your powers are actually less effective against them. If you're fighting an enemy 1 level above you, your powers are only 90% as effective as they would be if the enemy was the same level. Fighting a level 54 enemy even with a Level Shift, your powers are only 65% their full effectiveness. This applies to everything, including debuffs and damage and whatever else. If your power deals 100 damage to a level 51 enemy (and you have a Level Shift), it will only deal 65 damage to a level 54 enemy.

This mechanic, often referred to as the Purple Patch, manifests itself in a rather frustrating way in regards to Accuracy. Taking Accuracy and ToHit into account when calculating your final hit chance against a target may work just dandy at level 50, but if you're not keen on landing hits, you're going to be missing a LOT against level 54s. And when your power misses, it doesn't matter what the Purple Patch says: hits that don't land are 0% effective.

So slot for Accuracy before anything else. Before damage, before Endurance reduction, before +Defense set bonuses. I like to go way overboard and get 1.9X Accuracy on all my powers, but that's just me. One thing I can say, however, is that during the level 54 content, it's more a matter of taking down more powerful foes than it is missing all the time like you're level 12 all over again.


Acknowledge Archetype Strengths and Weaknesses

With stronger enemies coming our way and our powers becoming less effective as a direct result of the level difference, it's important to acknowledge the team dynamics and various roles filled by the different Archetypes. Defense buffs from set bonuses have gone a long way to make all characters quite survivable in level 50 content, but against groups of level 54s, you need to be careful, because your Scrapper might not be able to take the same kind of aggro it used to and live to tell about it.

While the enemies are certainly tough, Tankers and Brutes are fortunately still tough as well. The higher level enemies stand more of a chance against them, but they still take plenty of hits before going down, and will support from other teammates, they'll be able to hold aggro just as well as they always have. Know who can hold aggro, know who can buff/debuff/heal, know who can control the enemy, and know who can deal out damage. There is no Archetype that is only good for one thing, so be aware of what each Archetype is capable of.

Likewise, know what archetypes can't do certain things, and make sure those roles are accounted for. Some archetypes can't take many hits. Some archetypes can't hold aggro (I'm looking at you, Placate). Some archetypes don't do a lot of damage.


Know What You're Up Against

Most of the level 50 game just lets you run in and start bashing heads, but the newer content requires you to keep on your toes, and the Incarnate Trials specifically have been stated as requiring people to keep alert and know what to do. Even adjusting for the level difference and the team make-up, understanding of the objectives is very important for this content to be completed successfully.

Don't hesitate to ask questions in your global channels, to seek help on these forums, or to visit Paragon Wiki for details on how content is set up and what the objectives are. Knowledge is the greatest weapon, they say, and if a group of players charges in without knowing what to do, they may find themselves unable to pull it off.
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Interesting times are upon us, and it's a turning point for gameplay for a lot of us. What has worked in the past all the way back to Issue 9 is being turned on its ear, and we as a whole need to make adjustments to ensure we can participate in future content and have fun doing it.

Hopefully these pointers will be helpful in preparing for this future content.


 

Posted

Unfortunately, nothing player-based will fix Masterminds pets to stop them spacking out and acting like Captain McDerpyPants, running up and attempting to brawl with a War Walker. Or from getting mown down by Clockwork AoE -Def spam.

Currently messing around with more macros and even more stringent control of the flipping blighters, but Id much prefer someone to actually FIX the little pissants...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
Unfortunately, nothing player-based will fix Masterminds pets to stop them spacking out and acting like Captain McDerpyPants, running up and attempting to brawl with a War Walker. Or from getting mown down by Clockwork AoE -Def spam.

Currently messing around with more macros and even more stringent control of the flipping blighters, but Id much prefer someone to actually FIX the little pissants...
The Devs have been metaphorically bashing their heads against brick walls for years trying to improve pet AI. They've had some incremental (and slightly more than incremental) successes doing so over the years, but i don't expect a dramatic increase in pet AI "intelligence" any time in the near future.

Maybe they'll come up with some other way of making pets more effective against higher conning enemies. At least the pets already inherit the level shift. That's a nice start.


Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...

 

Posted

The Steelclaw Guide to Preparing for Future Content:

1) Revamp Spreadsheets.

2) Delete Characters.


My mind wanders so often you've probably seen its picture on milk cartons. - Me... the first person version of the third person Steelclaw

 

Posted

And what would you advise players who cannot or will not or choose not to prepare for this future content?

Sorry, it's not meant for you? Just quit until stuff for you gets developed, if ever? Hardy har, I can do it, so it doesn't bother me. If you -just- tried, you can do it, really! Here I'll take you!

(Without acknowledging some people don't have the capability, the time, or the will to grind repeatedly on content or systems they don't enjoy. A PvPer could use the same argument. Lol, I can PvP. You guys are wusses. If you just bought more IOs, chose your powers correctly, keybinded properly and got better reflexes, you can do it too! Without acknowledging that some people have no interest in getting better at it, period.)

There was an old argument for loot once that maintained IOs would be optional and SOs would still be sufficient. We have long gone tumbling past that slippery slope to the point where everyone "worth anything" is at least franken-slotting. Those who can't have already been getting whittled out by something as simple as Trapdoor (which can be brute forced with 4 lucks and lots of reds - I did this, I didn't have the patience to play with his endless clones) and it's getting worst from there.

I've supported the game without a break in my subscription for 7 years since I joined in Nov/Dec 2004. I have taken numerous breaks to prevent burnout, but my subscription has been maintained because I supported what the devs were doing to cater to all groups, solo, duos, small groups, large teams, and experimenting with innovative solutions and systems.

I have to say I'm very disappointed with the current trend (from Inventions loot onwards) and it is finally heading to a point of crisis for me personally. This isn't a snap decision, it's been going on for months. I will be staying on till April 18 to show that I don't mind the loyalty bribe of the pack. I will likely buy the Animal Pack to show support for development in that direction, of vanity costume microtransactions. There are still two months for things to change, to at least announce I21 or I22 plans that might cater to the player subsets that are currently not being addressed by I20 and indicate an inclusive, customization-friendly direction for CoH to go in.

After which, if nothing changes for the foreseeable future (six months on), I think it's time for me to cancel and let the raid-loving group pay subscription fees and development costs for the kind of content I'd prefer.


Invictus Est Level 50 Invul/Fire Tank
Malentis Level 50 Ice/Energy/Leviathan Dom (Freedom)
Black Jeremiah Level 50 Fire/Fire/Mu Dom
Sejanna Level 50 Dark/Dark/Elec Def (Virtue)
Arc #119664 - The MiniMech Cometh - Hess TF Mini-Sequel

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
Unfortunately, nothing player-based will fix Masterminds pets to stop them spacking out and acting like Captain McDerpyPants, running up and attempting to brawl with a War Walker. Or from getting mown down by Clockwork AoE -Def spam.

Currently messing around with more macros and even more stringent control of the flipping blighters, but Id much prefer someone to actually FIX the little pissants...
So would I, and I don't even play the AT. Each dead or just braindead pet is taking away from the MM's contribution to the team.


Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper

Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycaeus View Post
And what would you advise players who cannot or will not or choose not to prepare for this future content?
Bolded part is a self-inflicted wound.

You can try to get your driver's license, but if you willfully choose not to prepare for it, you are doomed to fail.


Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP

Remember kids, crack is whack!

Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it

 

Posted

Get an uber 10 billion dollar build.

Get a specialized team with a ton of buffs.

You're golden.

Poor mans way: Get nukes and shivans.

I also don't get why I should need to "prepare myself!" for new content. It's a game, not life and death. I shouldn't need to spend hours preparing myself to be able to enjoy further content.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycaeus View Post
And what would you advise players who cannot or will not or choose not to prepare for this future content?

Sorry, it's not meant for you? Just quit until stuff for you gets developed, if ever? Hardy har, I can do it, so it doesn't bother me. If you -just- tried, you can do it, really! Here I'll take you!

(Without acknowledging some people don't have the capability, the time, or the will to grind repeatedly on content or systems they don't enjoy. A PvPer could use the same argument. Lol, I can PvP. You guys are wusses. If you just bought more IOs, chose your powers correctly, keybinded properly and got better reflexes, you can do it too! Without acknowledging that some people have no interest in getting better at it, period.)

There was an old argument for loot once that maintained IOs would be optional and SOs would still be sufficient. We have long gone tumbling past that slippery slope to the point where everyone "worth anything" is at least franken-slotting. Those who can't have already been getting whittled out by something as simple as Trapdoor (which can be brute forced with 4 lucks and lots of reds - I did this, I didn't have the patience to play with his endless clones) and it's getting worst from there.

I've supported the game without a break in my subscription for 7 years since I joined in Nov/Dec 2004. I have taken numerous breaks to prevent burnout, but my subscription has been maintained because I supported what the devs were doing to cater to all groups, solo, duos, small groups, large teams, and experimenting with innovative solutions and systems.

I have to say I'm very disappointed with the current trend (from Inventions loot onwards) and it is finally heading to a point of crisis for me personally. This isn't a snap decision, it's been going on for months. I will be staying on till April 18 to show that I don't mind the loyalty bribe of the pack. I will likely buy the Animal Pack to show support for development in that direction, of vanity costume microtransactions. There are still two months for things to change, to at least announce I21 or I22 plans that might cater to the player subsets that are currently not being addressed by I20 and indicate an inclusive, customization-friendly direction for CoH to go in.

After which, if nothing changes for the foreseeable future (six months on), I think it's time for me to cancel and let the raid-loving group pay subscription fees and development costs for the kind of content I'd prefer.
Um, what post did you read? The OP was doing nothing more than giving some good advice/hints on some ways to cope with more challenging content.

Do you even understand the words you read before you posted your response?d


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by MunkiLord View Post
Um, what post did you read? The OP was doing nothing more than giving some good advice/hints on some ways to cope with more challenging content.

Do you even understand the words you read before you posted your response?d
Funny enough, neither TF is near as hard as STF or LRSF. So the way to cope with hard content is probably still....

Get an uber build

or

Get a ton of buffs/debuffs

or

Get a ton of nukes/shivans

or

stock up on insps.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toony View Post
Get an uber 10 billion dollar build.

Get a specialized team with a ton of buffs.

You're golden.

Poor mans way: Get nukes and shivans.
A decent understanding of game mechanics is significantly more important than anything you just mentioned.


Quote:
I also don't get why I should need to "prepare myself!" for new content. It's a game, not life and death. I shouldn't need to spend hours preparing myself to be able to enjoy further content.
If you want to do difficult things, you will need to put the effort in. If you're not willing to put in any kind of effort, that is completely your fault.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toony View Post
Funny enough, neither TF is near as hard as STF or LRSF. So the way to cope with hard content is probably still....

Get an uber build

or

Get a ton of buffs/debuffs

or

Get a ton of nukes/shivans

or

stock up on insps.
Or you could simply learn about game mechanics. Knowledge is much more important than any of those things.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by MunkiLord View Post
Or you could simply learn about game mechanics. Knowledge is much more important than any of those things.
Not really, no.


 

Posted

What separates the poor, average, good, and great players is knowledge. Any moron can come to the forums and copy a fantastic build. But if they don't know what they are doing in game, the only difference is it will take them a bit longer to get debt badges.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards View Post
Bolded part is a self-inflicted wound.
You can try to get your driver's license, but if you willfully choose not to prepare for it, you are doomed to fail.
That's fine. But it's a wound caused by items that were knowingly designed by the devs knowing that some of their players would run into it and get hurt.

Presumably, they are betting that enough players will shrug it off as a flesh wound, stand up again, and learn how to clamber around the obstacle.

Now the manner in which they encourage and slowly offer help and assistance for those who are having trouble to get around it, will affect the number of players who would put up with the obstacle being there in the first place.

Too abruptly, too dismissively, and one is liable to get players who decide that the meadow they originally picked to play in, is now full of falling boulders from the sky getting in their way, and deciding to head off to greener pastures.

The key to sustainability and profit for the devs is to balance this out so that they manage to retain more than they chase away.

I have stated what I would personally be content with in order to remain. You have stated by your replies that you are fine with their current point of difficulty incline. What we don't know are the feelings and attitudes of the numerous that never make it onto the forums to share their POVs. A proper conversation and discussion on the boards might coax more out of the woodwork.

It's a balancing act for the devs, and the more that share, the more feedback they will get along with the datamines and other evidences they are presumably using for their decisions.

Or then again it might not, and just lead to locked threads and a mod headache. That's a perceptible difference in community now too, that might have an impact for some people's decisions to stay or leave.


Invictus Est Level 50 Invul/Fire Tank
Malentis Level 50 Ice/Energy/Leviathan Dom (Freedom)
Black Jeremiah Level 50 Fire/Fire/Mu Dom
Sejanna Level 50 Dark/Dark/Elec Def (Virtue)
Arc #119664 - The MiniMech Cometh - Hess TF Mini-Sequel

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by MunkiLord View Post
What separates the poor, average, good, and great players is knowledge. Any moron can come to the forums and copy a fantastic build. But if they don't know what they are doing in game, the only difference is it will take them a bit longer to get debt badges.
In team content, all that is truly required is that the leader knows it. Wasn't Apex/TM supposed to be new hard content? I got on a team and no one but the leader knew what to do. The leader simply barked orders and we got it done. Mastered, too. No one else needed to study, change builds, etc. No one had to prepare.

Outside of that, they can, again, just pack a ton of items that shift it in their favor and blow past most content.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toony View Post
In team content, all that is truly required is that the leader knows it. Wasn't Apex/TM supposed to be new hard content? I got on a team and no one but the leader knew what to do. The leader simply barked orders and we got it done. Mastered, too. No one else needed to study, change builds, etc. No one had to prepare.

Outside of that, they can, again, just pack a ton of items that shift it in their favor and blow past most content.
That's my point. The leader's knowledge is why yall kicked the TF's ***. Now without the leader knowing anything, there is a good chance yall still would have completed. But it wouldn't have been nearly as efficient because yall didn't know what you were doing.

That is why I'm saying knowledge is more important than build, and the team's AT makeup. I'm not saying those things aren't important and don't help, just that knowledge of how the game works is more important.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycaeus View Post
I have stated what I would personally be content with in order to remain. You have stated by your replies that you are fine with their current point of difficulty incline.
I hope people aren't confusing me with another person again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycaeus View Post
Presumably, they are betting that enough players will shrug it off as a flesh wound, stand up again, and learn how to clamber around the obstacle.
It's happened before with stuff like the Imperious, Apex, and Tin Mage TF. People will understand, exploit, and conquer the new content as they have in the past.


Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP

Remember kids, crack is whack!

Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards View Post
I hope people aren't confusing me with another person again.
And whose fault is that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycaeus View Post
There are still two months for things to change, to at least announce I21 or I22 plans that might cater to the player subsets that are currently not being addressed by I20 and indicate an inclusive, customization-friendly direction for CoH to go in.
It's unlikely that I20 will evne be out in the next 2 months - so the chances of them starting to give an overview of I21 and I22 are pretty tiny

All we know about them for now is that the devs seem to be planning on adding at least one Incarnate Trial with each new Issue.


@Golden Girl

City of Heroes comics and artwork

 

Posted

Mine?


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Girl View Post
And whose fault is that?


Aren't you two brothers? Why do you get so upset when we mix you two up?


 

Posted

Quote:
I also don't get why I should need to "prepare myself!" for new content. It's a game, not life and death. I shouldn't need to spend hours preparing myself to be able to enjoy further content.
So you played all of the content to this point with no preparation at all? Never learned where the stores were. Never logged into the forum. Never checked the wiki for info. Never downloaded tools like Mids, Vidiotmaps, or a badging tool. Never slotted anything. Never used the market. Never asked others for help. Etcetera, etcetera.

Let's at least get better arguments for the whine threads, everyone. These kinds of arguments in these threads couldn't beat a grey conning deadman. If you need to whine, at least do that right. Show some pride.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by brophog02 View Post
So you played all of the content to this point with no preparation at all? Never learned where the stores were. Never logged into the forum. Never checked the wiki for info. Never downloaded tools like Mids, Vidiotmaps, or a badging tool. Never slotted anything. Never used the market. Never asked others for help. Etcetera, etcetera.

Let's at least get better arguments for the whine threads, everyone. These kinds of arguments in these threads couldn't beat a grey conning deadman. If you need to whine, at least do that right. Show some pride.
No, I never changed my build for new content or studies spread sheets or read up on strategies.


 

Posted

Good stuff GuyPerfect. With inherent fitness lots of people are taking tactics and/or assault. These also help to future proof your build. Then there is the incarnate cap to keep in mind. For incarnate content the new soft cap is 59% defense.