So how 'bout that Incarnate storyarc...


Adeon Hawkwood

 

Posted

I'mma drawin' aggro!

Okay, now that I've got that lame pun out of my system...


Seriously, other then Trapdoor (there is not profanity in the English language to cover my opinion of Trapdoor), the story arc was incredibly fun. I mean, I was practically bouncing in my chair in excitement when I finished it.

First off, I did the whole thing solo, with the exception of Trapdoor. (I fought him at +1, couldn't do it. Fought him at -1, couldn't do it. Finally, called in some outside assistance. Melee AT + massive enemy regen + poor visibility + minions that are CONSTANTLY being respawned... Yeah, not for me.)

So I was going through it solo, with a martial arts/regen scrapper. My favorite part had to be the end of the second to last mission. Honoree? Vanguard? FIVE Rikti portals? And me with about as much defense and damage resistance as a kitten.

What was I to do? Why, hit and run! I bounced around those mobs so much I must've made a Rikti monkey look tame. First I singled out the portals, then I dealt with the Rikti, all while trying to avoid the Honoree because the man could cleave off half my health with one hit.

Finally it gets down to just him and me, going at it with good old fisticuffs. I'm whittling him down with a bunch of high accuracy, but rather low damage attacks. He's tearing me apart with high damage, but low accuracy attacks. It basically came down to whether my healing powers would recharge before his next attack. And it kept coming down to that, again and again. But thanks to a fortunately timed crit, I brought him down.

I completed that mission without dying even ONCE. Again, with a character who is about as sturdy as jello. (Mind you, I DID die a lot on my first run. But I was contending with massive lag from the server status going red. My second run involved zero deaths.)

After that, I just breezed through the last mission, right until I got to Minos... Hehe... Minos. He managed to kill me. Once. I was trying to pace myself, expecting him to pull some sort of trick once his health got low. I was a little late on healing, though, and he killed me...

But I resurrected, fired off Moment of Glory to cover me as I switched my toggles back on, then tore into him like he was a steak.


...In short: Devs, you never cease to amaze me with the incredible story arcs you create. I appreciate all your hard work and I'd probably try to hug each of you if it wouldn't result in (probably) a dozen restraining orders.


 

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I really don't understand the whole Trapdoor thing... I've soloed him a dozen times, and have yet to have any real problems with him...

I wish I knew what you were doing so wrong as to have a problem with him, so I could help


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NarfMann View Post
I really don't understand the whole Trapdoor thing... I've soloed him a dozen times, and have yet to have any real problems with him...

I wish I knew what you were doing so wrong as to have a problem with him, so I could help
I think not everyone realises that most of his regen comes from his summoned minions. Also, not everyone is optimised for single-target killing, would would affect killing those minions fast, which then would affect how much uber-regen he gets per cycle..


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NarfMann View Post
I really don't understand the whole Trapdoor thing... I've soloed him a dozen times, and have yet to have any real problems with him...

I wish I knew what you were doing so wrong as to have a problem with him, so I could help
I don't get it either. I've soloed him with all my characters, practically all kinds of ATs.


Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522

 

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I soloed Trapdoor on all my 50s except my Scrapper, and that was only because she hit 50 while on a PuG and the team decided to help me out on the arc.

I can only imagine it's what signpost said. In my experience he summons bifurcations rarely enough that killing them quickly is no big deal, but I imagine if you don't he'll eventually have three or four or five and things get hairy then.

How does the game tell you the bifurcations boost his regen again? I think the flashing red text only mentions he summons one but not what it does. Maybe if they rewrite it to mention the regen boost people will have less trouble with the guy?


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NarfMann View Post
I really don't understand the whole Trapdoor thing... I've soloed him a dozen times, and have yet to have any real problems with him...

I wish I knew what you were doing so wrong as to have a problem with him, so I could help
Prolly my biggest problem is if you fail once, you have a ridiculously large upward battle for subsequent attempts as he'll continue to pop up his minions around the place.

For me, the problem tended to be getting enough damage on the clones and keeping my bots in my aura range. In the end, I ended up dropping a HVAS to hold his attention while clearing out the twerps and eventually pushed him into the lava and said screw it .


Let's Dance!

 

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The red text that pops up tells you what it does


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NarfMann View Post
The red text that pops up tells you what it does
My first time through the arc I missed the red text on his first summon but when I realized his health wasn't budging any longer I figured out what was happening and quickly dispatched any summoned minions.


 

Posted

Well I find him hard to nearly impossible for all my ATs, so there.


There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Signpost View Post
I think not everyone realises that most of his regen comes from his summoned minions. Also, not everyone is optimised for single-target killing, would would affect killing those minions fast, which then would affect how much uber-regen he gets per cycle..
I was aware of his minions being the source of his high regen. The problem? Every time I killed off his minions, he'd summon up some more within ten seconds. Even with my best powers and punching him constantly while he's going through the 'bifuricating' animation, he'd still regen to full by the time I killed off the next set of minions. Best I could manage was to get him to about 75% health.

I even checked out the Paragon wiki. It suggested luring him into the magma... Which I tried. But there's a bit of a problem there: It's really rather hard to keep him in the magma when I lack any kind of hold. He was completely immune to my disorients and my crippling axe kick... So that once I got him in there, he'd hop right back out.

...Also, why has the entire thread been about Trapdoor? I spent the majority of my first post talking about how great and fun the rest of the arc was!


 

Posted

Trapdoor was little more than a speedbump for my Fire/Rad troller. I don't think i even noticed him until what's left of him made the sole of my boot all sticky.

My Fire blaster had to work a bit harder, but she solo'd him pretty well.

My DM/SD scrapper had a %!+$# of a time with him. For some reason, he just laughed off my efforts to immobilize him in the lava, even though my blaster and troller had no problems with pretty much the same tactic.


Stay Gold, Paragon. Stay Gold.
Nolite te bastardes carborundorum.

 

Posted

Because I haven't seen it mentioned in this thread, I'd like to point out that each of Trapdoor's bifurcations also grants him 10% damage resistance. So if you get up to four or five simultaneous bifurcations, then it becomes a very steep uphill battle.


Positron: "There are no bugs [in City of Heroes], just varying degrees of features."

 

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A lot of people who fought Trapdoor before that patch. He was a big silly pushover before that patch. Hell, my electric/ice tanker clobbered him without even bothering with the bifurcates. My human-form WS was defeated once, but rezzed on the spot and with the help of a single fluffy, finished him off post haste.

After that patch, though... well, there were still controllers allegedly defeating him in 10 seconds or less, but none of my other guys could replicate that feat or defeat him without having to take out an inordinate amount of bifurcates in the process, which I found not challenging at all, but ANNOYING. Much like trying to light a candle while being pelted with water balloons.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiana Wolf View Post
I'mma drawin' aggro!

Okay, now that I've got that lame pun out of my system...

Lame pun, cool pic!


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaHaBone23 View Post
Trapdoor was little more than a speedbump for my Fire/Rad troller. I don't think i even noticed him until what's left of him made the sole of my boot all sticky.

My Fire blaster had to work a bit harder, but she solo'd him pretty well.

My DM/SD scrapper had a %!+$# of a time with him. For some reason, he just laughed off my efforts to immobilize him in the lava, even though my blaster and troller had no problems with pretty much the same tactic.
I suspect Trapdoor was specifically designed to be difficult for melee ATs to solo, to counteract all the complaints that melee ATs are overpowered and can solo ridiculous things. It seems the devs noted that a lot of players think that melee ATs have an unfair advantage while soloing (whether that is true or not is another discussion, but a lot of people feel it is), so they designed an encounter that is easier with ranged attacks.

I soloed him on most of my characters, and my defender and blaster were MUCH easier than any of my melee characters, including 2 highly IOed scrappers and an IOed brute. I think it has to do with the fact that characters with ranged attacks can just switch targets and kill the bifurcations without having to go running all over the map, moving 10-15 feet at most because the first ones he spawns seem to always be relatively near him.

That aside, I quite enjoyed the arc as well. It is one that I won't mind repeating when my characters in their 40s finally hit 50 and can do it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by NarfMann View Post
I really don't understand the whole Trapdoor thing... I've soloed him a dozen times, and have yet to have any real problems with him...

I wish I knew what you were doing so wrong as to have a problem with him, so I could help
I don't know what the deal is either. But last night, I was running +0x4 and I could NOT kill him.

No bifurcations out
SS/Inv Brute
75%+ Fury
Double-stacked Rage
Fighting him in the lava
Popping large reds like M&M's

And his HP bar WOULD NOT MOVE.


If I couldn't do it with that sort of combination, something is severely screwed.

And for those advising getting help, I say "why not turn it into a ****ing TF then"?



Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.

 

Posted

I can't tell if the above post is serious or satire.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiana Wolf View Post
...Also, why has the entire thread been about Trapdoor? I spent the majority of my first post talking about how great and fun the rest of the arc was!
Because people love to pontificate about how easy they found it.

Face it, other people will find stuff hard you won't, and vice versa.

OT, I agree, the arc is very nice. When I knew what to face in the Honoree mission having done it on Alpha, the portal room was much easier (Alpha got faceplanted by Holtz because I tried to fight them in the room, not realising that the portals kept spewing Rikti. By the end I was optic deep in 100+ minions)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nihilii View Post
I can't tell if the above post is serious or satire.
Because nothing makes you feel like edging closer to your Ultimate Power than having to yell for help from a bunch of friends/randoms-

Oh, wait...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect View Post
I suspect Trapdoor was specifically designed to be difficult for melee ATs to solo, to counteract all the complaints that melee ATs are overpowered and can solo ridiculous things. It seems the devs noted that a lot of players think that melee ATs have an unfair advantage while soloing (whether that is true or not is another discussion, but a lot of people feel it is), so they designed an encounter that is easier with ranged attacks.

That aside, I quite enjoyed the arc as well. It is one that I won't mind repeating when my characters in their 40s finally hit 50 and can do it.
Quite possibly. Thats why Vanguard is the way they are.


Furio--Lvl 50+3 Fire/Fire/Fire Blaster, Virtue
Megadeth--Lvl 50+3 Necro/DM/Soul MM, Virtue
Veriandros--Lvl 50+3 Crab Soldier, Virtue
"So come and get me! I'll be waiting for ye, with a whiff of the old brimstone. I'm a grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end!" Demoman, TF2

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiana Wolf View Post
...Also, why has the entire thread been about Trapdoor? I spent the majority of my first post talking about how great and fun the rest of the arc was!
Because Trapdoor is possibly the most polarizing boss in the game and people love to talk about how easy/hard he is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect View Post
I suspect Trapdoor was specifically designed to be difficult for melee ATs to solo, to counteract all the complaints that melee ATs are overpowered and can solo ridiculous things. It seems the devs noted that a lot of players think that melee ATs have an unfair advantage while soloing (whether that is true or not is another discussion, but a lot of people feel it is), so they designed an encounter that is easier with ranged attacks.

I soloed him on most of my characters, and my defender and blaster were MUCH easier than any of my melee characters, including 2 highly IOed scrappers and an IOed brute. I think it has to do with the fact that characters with ranged attacks can just switch targets and kill the bifurcations without having to go running all over the map, moving 10-15 feet at most because the first ones he spawns seem to always be relatively near him.
I think this is probably true. When I did it on my Tanker I was having a hard time dealing enough damage without luring him into the lava. I don't think it would have been impossible without the lava but it would have taken quite a bit longer. Conversely my Defenders were able to pop a few purples/reds and walk right over him.


 

Posted

It is a nice story arc. And I approve of the "some missions in an arc are allowed to be trivial" pattern it has (just like Ross' arc).

It would be nice if the incarnate artifact was more random than just origin. But then some really serious players would get offended about getting a divine plunger or something...


I do not suffer from altitis, I enjoy every character of it.

 

Posted

I've only done the Trapdoor mission twice, and even with my fire/fire brute I was having problems. Then I pulled he out of the room away from his bifurcations. When ever he summoned new ones, they would appear in the room, and offer him no aid. Was this patched?


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flarstux View Post
Lame pun, cool pic!
Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
Face it, other people will find stuff hard you won't, and vice versa.
That isn't the problem. The problem is how the majority of replies have been focused entirely on one part of the arc, when I was hoping to make a thread where people could come in and give their opinions on the whole thing.