Issue 19 - Patch Notes for build 1900.201011102104.23

Tried [Force Bubble] before and after last week's live patch. Before it worked. After, no it doesn't work. The mine layers are indeed, as Arcanaville put it, intangible. That means they walk right through the [Force Bubble] and it is completely ineffective. At one point Saturday night a mine was thrown into my face (3rd person doesn't work well next to walls).

Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters

yet? we saw a pic back at NYCC:

Yes! Very irritating, especially since you can't autocomplete Safeguards. Although in my case the villain in the elevator was also invisible; nothing but weapons, the bag and glowy eyes were there.

Why not add[*]Trapdoor's area no longer allows pulling to lava, no Shivans, Nukes, Temps, Insps, Kiting or Flying, and can only use Brawl.

Seriously, quit forcing your players into what you want them to play like, this is a game about custom-ability right? To think outside the box?

Your actions show you the devs do not want the player to play creatively, but by force by your own hands and dictation.

Good Luck trying to keep a playerbase if you continue that route.

If they didn't want us to be able to roast him, they would never of made that custom room for him.

Again, being able to pull him out of range of his bifrications doesn't make sense in the game by his own lore.

So..Let me get this straight..

While designing the room, they just totally didn't figure out people wouldn't pull him away? Really?

Look at Reichy, He never leaves his area, the devs didn't want him to leave his area, so therfore, they programed him to stay put.

After weeks of having Trapdoor being able to be pulled by players, the devs turned around and programmed him to not leave his post...Really?

Either somebody was space cruising while designing this scenario, or the devs just forcing gamers to play by their dictation.

Tell me there isn't a comic out there where the hero that faces a similar enemy, where their villain can multiply, and the hero not try to pull the original villain away so he/she can beat it down one on one, and save the day?

The best battle is the simplest one, but in the devs eyes, they want to have the player fight for 20+ minutes on 1 guy that has insane regen and now multiplies minions even more and at random places.

What it all boils down to, is that the devs were foolish to not program Trapdoor 1st to stay put like Reichsman, and to let the players be allowed to pull Trapdoor into the other room, then later down the road take this creative tool away by force by telling the player "learn2playRway"

Lore or not, it was a bad call to allow it and take it away when the player chose to think outside the box.

This makes more sense for how they should have done it.

This room is actually the one used in Burkholder's TF and possibly other places, minus the giant robot.

Gotta love how people are going "non-exploitive tactics", "thinking outside the box" and ****. Pulling isn't exactly rocket science, and it's pretty obvious by the big, bold flashing messages in front of your screen that you're supposed to play the encounter by defeating his reflections.

Besides, if your character can't even defeat an Elite Boss by level 50... Should he really be an Incarnate?

That said, I can't say I care for the changes either way, I'm just reacting to the reactions.

I haven't jumpe dont est to see how they did it. How doe sthe change work? Do his copies just always regen him while alive, does he not leave the room, or do they use a tether like the nictus around that roman guy?

I have to agree with these sentiments. He's not hard, but I don't really love the idea of making players play a certain way, and this 'feels' like that is what's going on. If it wasn't an exploit, which I can't see how it would be, I think outside-the-box tactics should be encouraged, not discouraged.

It is interesting that the devs have seemed to fly directly in the face of traditional MMO-type endgame content (imo) with the Tin Mage and Apex Task Force design. Those TFs seem to be ostensibly 'defeating' players' tendency to do endgame stuff/raids in a very 'controlled' and almost boring way, and make them much more dynamic, "think-on-your-feet" content (esp. Apex, kudos!). So it seems that this is an example of a creative solution on the part of the devs to what they seemed to consider a 'problem' (ie, staid old boring endgame content.)

But the case of the Trapdoor changes seem to philosophically contradict this idea of creative solutions.

Or maybe I'm being too analytical here. Ooo, Shiny!

The issue here is, it's not that (by lore) the duplicates do some buff to the main guy, but rather that they are the main duplicating himself through time, thus having more time to rest/restore himself - represented in game by the +Regen buff.

The writing is already "on the wall" in game for the Holtz/Honoree mission. Try defeating Honoree first and clicking on him. His text tells you that you have to clear the Rikti as well. So we will likely have to deal with a practically unending stream of Rikti coming out of the portals for ZERO xp/drops just to get the mission to end.

Heaven help you if you are a solo squishy vs 100+ Rikti & 2 EBs.

Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters

eh? I've defeated Holtz, then Honoree w/out touching the portals and finished the mish. I tended to use the Rikti from the Portals as FS/HL fodder

Same here - did so yesterday, in fact. The Honoree did NOT require me to defeat the Rikti that had spawned in the room.

You guys... please re-read what Snowy said:

"on the wall", I take to mean a possible future.
By defeating Honoree FIRST, you get a different message than if you defeat Holtz first (I think).

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Don�t say things. What you are stands over you the while, and thunders so that I cannot hear what you say to the contrary. - R.W. Emerson

You do. If you defeat Honoree first and then click on him to chat, the message indicates that you have to dispose of Holtz and the Rikti portals in order for him to talk to you (but not necessarily the Rikti themselves, although for most people that's a prerequisite for toasting the portals). As it stands right now, you don't actually have to get rid of the portals (or the Rikti), just Holtz.

I would not be surprised to see this changed down the line. However, if it is changed, it'll just be changed to be in line with how it's scripted already.

It won't change most of the way I do the encounter anyway - take out the two front portals (and associated Rikti), take out Holtz, take out Honoree (now: chat), take out the rest of the portals (and associated Rikti) (after the change: the chat with Honoree moves here). But then, I usually play scrappers, so pretty much the majority of missions I'm in are kill-alls, regardless of the instructions.

Link Steel will be happy about this.

Originally Posted by Nights_Dawn Hazy is right

Wrong order and complete reading failure on your part.

Complete reading failure on your part.

That is generally how the term has been used for the last 2,000+ years (the phrase pretty much came from the Book of Daniel in the Bible). I can't be accused of using a local idiom in this case. It is a widely used phrase.

That is exactly what I'm saying. If the Honoree is defeated first then you click on the Honoree you will get a different message than if you defeat Holtz first.

Triumph: White Succubus: 50 Ill/Emp/PF Snow Globe: 50 Ice/FF/Ice Strobe: 50 PB Shi Otomi: 50 Ninja/Ninjistu/GW Stalker My other characters

*sigh* not worth the headache...

Cende said it better than you did, when you don't include all the information, things like misunderstandings happen.

You can still defeat Honoree "first" before taking out the Rikti.

You currently have to defeat 2 EBs...he said defeat a specific one first and then check the click message.

This was a very linear logic path of 3 steps...anyone who couldn't follow it has only themselves to blame.

Also the post had a Flesch-Kincaid Reading Level of 6.7.

QFT. Honestly this game isn't hard, and all people do is complain when they are faced with a mediocre challenge.

I like games with smart AI where a villain wont follow you out of his "safety zone" where he will get owned. I rate this change A for, stop whining.

I have to agree with this. It doesn't make sense story-wise for him to be able to be separated from his bifurcations. Either he should be able to spawn them anywhere and they should follow him around, or he should refuse to leave the area where he can spawn them.

I'm all for creative tactics, but Trapdoor isn't supposed to be a complete idiot.

As for if the mission is too difficult -- meh. Incarnates are supposed to be the gateway to challenging endgame content, it should at least be a little bit reflective of that. If it's too tough for your solo FF/Elec defender slotted for end mod and with all 4 travel powers, that's what teams are for. You'll need one to run the Incarnate TFs anyway.

I've found the Honoree mission way tougher than Trapdoor anyway on my support-ish toons, due to how many rikti ambush you when set to x8, and the fact that he hits squishies like a freight train. It was still doable with him lowered down to an EB and judicious use of inspirations.