New Superman for the "Twilight Age"
By
Agonus,
Posted on: 2010-10-25 10:31 in Comic and Hero-Villain Culture
Comic time =/= real life time.
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I am talking about comic time. He's not 29.
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Originally Posted by Scythus
Comic time =/= real life time.
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It's one of the constant issues for comics, especially when sidekicks age and get replaced and end up being the same age as their mentors. The progression of not one, but three Robins from kid sidekick to their own character really creates an inconsistency when examining the timeline and trying to figure out character ages. I prefer to simply chant the MST3K Mantra and hope for the best.
You're not super until you put on The Cape!
Attercap.Net
I would like to point out, that, while it seems this comic itself may not be as bad as the artical made it out to me, *my* grips stem mainly from what i presive as a trend, thanks in large part to smallville, to kind of add unessessry "drama" to an origin story that IMHO doesn't need it, and infact, IMO, in a way tants it.
If this comic isn't doing that, then, great. I may give it a shot and the artical is dead wrong. But, thanks to smallivlle, it was all to believable.
@KingSnake - Triumph Server
@PrinceSnake
My common sense is tingling... ~ Deadpool
If you can't learn to do something well... learn to enjoy doing it poorly...
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went to go and pick this up at my FLCS today during my weekly comic snag, damn thing sold out 3 or 4 hours after they opened the doors the day before. one of the owner's did manage to snag his own copy and was kind enough to let me take a flipthrough of it. |
Originally Posted by BatFan
Has anyone actually read this yet? I saw it in my local comic shop yesterday. But the price tag was hefty enough to discourage me from buying it without hearing some kind of review of it.
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im gonna be ordering it from amazon now. just from the quick once over it looks good, very, very good. (and of course not one damn thing like the idiot Post wrote about.)
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This right here, is what I heard from my comic book sources on one of the main reason why they are doing that.|
Originally Posted by Veritech
depending on how the court rules in the next couple of years, it wont belong to them, it'll belong to the siegel & shuster estates. also, this isn't the first time they've gone back to the roots and retold his origin story. but you're right (for once.
 ) in that there are certain immutable facts that make Superman/Clark Kent who he is and that no matter how much someone might try, those will never change. of course, that has absolutely nothing to do with the article that idiot wrote. ive seen that same article referenced a couple other times since i first read it, im looking forward to getting my hands on the GN on Thursday and seeing how wrong that frakhat really is. |
A lot of the oringinal Sups powers that were written by Siegel & Shuster are omitted with the characters they made as secondaries. Now this is all DC property so if they do lose him they got at least something in their own works so they do not lose what 90 years of history.
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From DC. I'm sure if you Google it you'll find it.
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Originally Posted by Durakken
Where are you getting that?
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The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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Yes, he is. No, it doesn't make sense and is utterly ridiculous. But his official age is 29.|
Originally Posted by Durakken
I am talking about comic time. He's not 29.
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Don't shoot the messenger; I didn't make the rule.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
Reminds me of boarding schools and kids in soap operas. The kids leave at 8, come back at 17 and start having sex with other people, all in 6 months.
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On All My Children Bobby went to camp and was never heard from again. 20 years later another character was locked in the attic and ran across a skeleton wearing a cap with the name "Bobby" on it. |
Originally Posted by BlackArachnia
Reminds me of boarding schools and kids in soap operas. The kids leave at 8, come back at 17 and start having sex with other people, all in 6 months.
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The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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Ah! Now that make sense. It would be a good move on their part, too.
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Originally Posted by Mylia
This right here, is what I heard from my comic book sources on one of the main reason why they are doing that.
A lot of the oringinal Sups powers that were written by Siegel & Shuster are omitted with the characters they made as secondaries. Now this is all DC property so if they do lose him they got at least something in their own works so they do not lose what 90 years of history. |
"I do so love taking a nice, well thought out character and putting them through hell. It's like tossing a Faberge Egg onto the stage during a Gallagher concert." - me
@Palador / @Rabid Unicorn
I read it, and I thought it was pretty good, one thing I liked was how all thru supes previously told origins he grew up all rainbows and sunshine where life was perfect and nobody ever said a harsh word. I don't care where you are from, any kid at any given time has the ability to be a completely cruel little punk at the drop of the hat for no particular reason other than to get themself over as a tough guy with their friends. I don't think any one person ever got thru their childhood without ever having to fight for one reason or another, it's a reality , it's going to happen. So here is a kid growing up, who if he so much as breaths on someone the wrong way he is going to cause some serious damage, so he has to avoid conflict. With kids, if they saw someone not defending themselves they would eat that kid alive, so the whole head down, hoodie up, laying low aspect makes perfect sense, he is trying to hide in plain sight. It is a very good story and I recommend it.
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He wasn't an orphan. He was raised from infancy by people who loved him. Krypton is not his home, Kansas is. He's honestly got no more reason to brood over it than I have knowing my biological parents were from Lithuania which is totally diferent now than it was when I was conceived.|
Originally Posted by KingSnake
You see, here's the thing, IMO of course. He does have "brood fodder". Destruction of his planet, being an orphen,
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Who cares what happens in Lithuania? I'm not FROM there. Why should Superman care beyond a curiosity? His upbringing left him wanting for nothing. Krypton.. and even his superpowers.. are just neat bonuses, ways for him to give back to the society which gave him a loving home.
In the book the ship that carries him to Earth is made with some weird Kryptonian technology that has data encrypted into the very atoms of the metal it is made of. He touches a piece of the spaceship and is infused with the knowledge of the events leading up to the destruction of krypton, including the life experiences of his real parents. So he is not without these memories, they were given to him.
why not try reading it, looks like quite a few of you find it interesting.
It is easy to just sit back and mindlessly trash on it, any idiot can just sit back and say everything is stupid or sucks, how about saying something postitive. All you are doing is showing how out of touch you are with comics.
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This honestly makes me sad. |
Originally Posted by PureAmerican
I read it, and I thought it was pretty good, one thing I liked was how all thru supes previously told origins he grew up all rainbows and sunshine where life was perfect and nobody ever said a harsh word. I don't care where you are from, any kid at any given time has the ability to be a completely cruel little punk at the drop of the hat for no particular reason other than to get themself over as a tough guy with their friends. I don't think any one person ever got thru their childhood without ever having to fight for one reason or another, it's a reality , it's going to happen. So here is a kid growing up, who if he so much as breaths on someone the wrong way he is going to cause some serious damage, so he has to avoid conflict. With kids, if they saw someone not defending themselves they would eat that kid alive, so the whole head down, hoodie up, laying low aspect makes perfect sense, he is trying to hide in plain sight. It is a very good story and I recommend it.
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I had a wonderful upbringing (until the age of 15, but that's another thing entirely). My parents passed on a good moral compass, they didn't hit me any more than was really necessary for discipline. Any fighting I did was not to be a *****, it was to fend off people who were pricks. I was also a little kid, so I got thumped, often. It really makes me sad that your childhood was so full of posing and bad behavior that you think that's the only way it could possibly happen for anyone.
And in-universe.. Clark did not lay low or avoid confrontation, and he absolutely protected himself. He just had to be very gentle and forgiving while doing so soas not to kill others. Given who his parents were, even without superpowers he'd have been the same boy.
He's not Superman because he has all these awesome powers... He's superman because he has all those awesome powers and still goes to work every day, still maintains a strong set of morals. He'd be just as "super" without the powers.. he just wouldn;t be able to help as many people at one time.
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That is beyond awesome if it's true.|
Originally Posted by Ironik
On All My Children Bobby went to camp and was never heard from again. 20 years later another character was locked in the attic and ran across a skeleton wearing a cap with the name "Bobby" on it.
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Read the comic preview, and the entirety of this thread. Honestly, this GN seems like it may be worth picking up. Not that i consider JMS a god of comics literature (i'm more likely to pick W(f'in)E for that), but this looks like it may be quite good.
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
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oh did you read it ?|
Originally Posted by NobleFox
This honestly makes me sad.
I had a wonderful upbringing (until the age of 15, but that's another thing entirely). My parents passed on a good moral compass, they didn't hit me any more than was really necessary for discipline. Any fighting I did was not to be a *****, it was to fend off people who were pricks. I was also a little kid, so I got thumped, often. It really makes me sad that your childhood was so full of posing and bad behavior that you think that's the only way it could possibly happen for anyone. And in-universe.. Clark did not lay low or avoid confrontation, and he absolutely protected himself. He just had to be very gentle and forgiving while doing so soas not to kill others. Given who his parents were, even without superpowers he'd have been the same boy. He's not Superman because he has all these awesome powers... He's superman because he has all those awesome powers and still goes to work every day, still maintains a strong set of morals. He'd be just as "super" without the powers.. he just wouldn;t be able to help as many people at one time. |
because you seem to think you have some sort of insight on the book and somehow you think you have some sort of insight on my life too, which leads me to think you are not wrapped too tight.
lol u rage over comics
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Your response proves my point about bad behavior. Not everyone is like you, though. If something pure and clean isn't believable to you, I'm honestly sad for you. |
Originally Posted by PureAmerican
oh did you read it ?
because you seem to think you have some sort of insight on the book and somehow you think you have some sort of insight on my life too, which leads me to think you are not wrapped too tight. lol u rage over comics |
There's really no other way to feel.
lol forum psychologist rage.
you have no point because you didn't read it. Go read it, come back and maybe then we will discuss your feelings. Sorry if I made you sad, so here is a picture of a kitty in a pumpkin to cheer you up.
there now you are smiling, you feel better ?
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While I have not read Superman's comic titles I can tell you that you are wrong from almost every incarnation I have run across.|
Originally Posted by PureAmerican
I read it, and I thought it was pretty good, one thing I liked was how all thru supes previously told origins he grew up all rainbows and sunshine where life was perfect and nobody ever said a harsh word.
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Superman the movie has him as quite the loser
It can be presumed that since he's friends with lex who was a nerd he'd likely have been loser there too...
And Smallville has him portrayed as an outsider and such as well.
Superman's past is pretty easy to understand...
Grew up a loser pretty much (which is awkward imo for a kid on a farm) and was conflicted with what to do with his powers. He went on a global adventure to find himself and when he came back he knew what he was going to do why and how (for the most part) He came back confident and sure of himself and wanting to save everyone and while he didn't understand what he was getting into as much as some of the others have, he's taken it in stride and become the symbol of hope, sometime doubting, but always overcoming that doubt both in himself and in humanity.
This whole doubting himself thing goes opposite his character, but then again different character pretty much.
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Originally Posted by Durakken
While I have not read Superman's comic titles I can tell you that you are wrong from almost every incarnation I have run across.
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It is easier to say something sucks or is a failure to come across as a smarty critic guy, rather than to actually put work into researching what you are talking about, and make an educated evaluation of something. So you comment about something you admittedly never even read and somehow you are an authority on the character? In Smallville the current storyline reflects a similar take on the character, so that is wrong too ?
Treat yourself and spend the $10.99 on it, read it, it's a good book. I am sure Amazon has it.
READ ! Just read please.
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Yes, READ.|
Originally Posted by PureAmerican
READ ! Just read please. |
You said you have not seen anywhere where Clark was an outsider while growing up and you viewed this as somehow original.
I pointed out that in every title I have ever come across you are wrong. The reason I said I had not read the titles is because of that it is possible they differ from the several sources; Superman the Movie, Smallville, DCAU, and various other comic sources I have read/watched and are the mainstream.
You are claiming some genius originality when the fact of the matter is it isn't original at all, considering all the mainstream sources have it that way.
Durakken's right, Superman has long been portrayed as having a lonely childhood due to being an outsider. In Earth One, though, Straczynski really underscores it with both a brief action scene and a longer soliloquy. I actually thought it was a bit on the nose, but the brilliant scene at the Daily Planet more than makes up for it.
This book reads like Supreme Power 2.0, as if Joe had just been practicing with that book to hone this story. Clark *does* come off as emo at the beginning, though, with his terse, sometimes monosyllabic responses. I was reminded of Jess from Gilmore Girls, actually. Maybe a little Hamlet. But soon enough he starts coming into his tried-and-true, red-yellow-and-blue persona we all know, with just a hint of a shadow behind his eyes because of the choice he's forced to make by circumstance... and the soft-peddled insistence of his adoptive parents. Bullying comes in many forms, even when your parents think they're giving you the best advice they have to offer, it can still be pressure. As I was reading it, I was thinking that Straczynski was doing a riff off of the excellent scene in A Few Good Men where Jack says to Danny, "You got bullied into that courtroom, Danny, by everybody. By Dawson. By Galloway. S**t, I practically dared you. You got bullied into that courtroom by the memory of a dead lawyer."
Overall, the book is just okay. I'd give it 3 stars out of 5. It's serviceable enough with some flashes of brilliance (the aforementioned Daily Planet scene, Jimmy Olsen standing up for what's right) but Straczynski is capable of a lot better.
The Alt Alphabet ~ OPC: Other People's Characters ~ Terrific Screenshots of Cool ~ Superhero Fiction
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Originally Posted by Durakken
Yes, READ.
You said you have not seen anywhere where Clark was an outsider while growing up and you viewed this as somehow original. I pointed out that in every title I have ever come across you are wrong. The reason I said I had not read the titles is because of that it is possible they differ from the several sources; Superman the Movie, Smallville, DCAU, and various other comic sources I have read/watched and are the mainstream. You are claiming some genius originality when the fact of the matter is it isn't original at all, considering all the mainstream sources have it that way. |
I claimed no such thing, I said no such thing, I said I liked it. I cannot go back and re-hash every instance of Superman's origin story that has been published since 1933, because that is dumb, there have been countless re-tellings of it. You don't even have a point of reference for just one, because you yourself stated you never even read a Superman comic, the extent of your knowledge is sitting in front of a TV. This is like saying " Rock and Roll was invented on my 16th birthday when I got a guitar as a present ". You don't even know the context of what is in the book, you have not read it, I merely pointed out that it parallels Smallville. Often times stories are made more modern to appeal to a new audience, in 1933 they had different social norms than now, to say that he should be that same character as he was then is absurd. The story has changed over the years and what you are interpereting is your idea of what his origin story is, from what you learned, my knowledge of the character is probably much older than yours and I have seen it transform over the years. I would never claim that the story of Superman is unique or original to begin with, how many different ways can the story of Moses be retold anyhow.
You can't get hung up on chronology in the stories. He's 29 and you just have to handwave away the fact it's impossible for him to have had all the adventures he's experienced in the 4 to 7 years he's been "officially" active in the DCU. (Depending on which writer you read. Byrne placed his debut around age 25. In Birthright his debut was about age 22.) Yes, it's silly, but that's just the way it is.
He is officially at least 12 years older than when he debuted which means he can't be 29... unless he traveled around the world and graduated from college before he was 17. It is literally impossible with official published time lines and such, even if you ignore all dating within the comics themselves and only pay attention to official time lines.