Why don't I like The Hulk ?!?!?!
By
Agonus,
Posted on: 2010-09-22 24:41 in Comic and Hero-Villain Culture
I scripted a Hulk story once (ACTOR Comics Presents benefit book), and I have to say, it was really difficult to do. Because of the Hulk's limited vocabulary and emotional range, it's like trying to put words in the mouth of a very small child. So maybe what you're responding to is the feeling that he's not a fully developed character because, well, because kids aren't fully developed yet. I mean, we might like reading an adventure with the six year old Franklin Richards, but I'm not sure if we'd want to follow it on a monthly basis. It might be why I've always preferred the Hulk in team books like the Defenders, where everything doesn't rest on him. Or maybe he should be mainly the catalyst in his stories, like Steve Gerber's Man-Thing stuff.
Just throwing out a theory.
Troy Hickman - So proud to have contributed to and played in this wonderful CoH universe
Makes sense. I think Banner is likely meant to balance that out.
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That's a fair point if you're sticking with the classic rampaging Hulk, which makes a lot of sense if you're writing for an audience that aren't necessarily Hulk fans. Hence SuperOz and I geeking out over the Peter David run on the book. Bringing in the multiple personality thing could have been a cheap gimmick, but it wound up bringing much needed depth to the character.
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Originally Posted by TroyHickman
I scripted a Hulk story once (ACTOR Comics Presents benefit book), and I have to say, it was really difficult to do. Because of the Hulk's limited vocabulary and emotional range, it's like trying to put words in the mouth of a very small child. So maybe what you're responding to is the feeling that he's not a fully developed character because, well, because kids aren't fully developed yet. I mean, we might like reading an adventure with the six year old Franklin Richards, but I'm not sure if we'd want to follow it on a monthly basis. It might be why I've always preferred the Hulk in team books like the Defenders, where everything doesn't rest on him. Or maybe he should be mainly the catalyst in his stories, like Steve Gerber's Man-Thing stuff.
Just throwing out a theory. |
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When was this? Because it was never mentioned in Hulk's book, as far as I know.|
Originally Posted by Scarlet_Phantom
After his rampage in Las Vegas he ended up killing 26 people.
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I suspect that some other writer introduced that crap to make their hero look better when going against the Hulk. I would be surprised if it's in main pre-WWH Marvel continuity. (If it was during WWH, I could believe it.)
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The Las Vegas rampage took place in the FF book. Illuminati was were the aftermath is mentioned and the body count. Both coincided with the start of the Planet Hulk storyline in Hulks book.
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Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
When was this? Because it was never mentioned in Hulk's book, as far as I know.
I suspect that some other writer introduced that crap to make their hero look better when going against the Hulk. I would be surprised if it's in main pre-WWH Marvel continuity. (If it was during WWH, I could believe it.) |
Way to many alts.
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It was probably one of those times when Hulk got separated from Banner.
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Originally Posted by Scarlet_Phantom
The Las Vegas rampage took place in the FF book. Illuminati was were the aftermath is mentioned and the body count. Both coincided with the start of the Planet Hulk storyline in Hulks book.
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Only if you keep up with that negative attitude |
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
I've been patched together well enough to function, but I'll never be right.
 |
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And here we differ.|
Originally Posted by SuperOz
Well, let's be honest about the tv show. With Spider-Man, it was being made on a shoestring budget and did amazingly well for the seasons it was on air, and it had to be sold on 'The Fugitive' premise, where Banner goes from town to town, with the reporter chasing down Hulk sightings.
There was no way you could do justice to the Hulk as shown in the comics at that point, not without CGI or a much larger budget. And if you look at Spider-Man with Nicholas Hammond, that show suffered way more than Hulk did. As for Bill Bixby, he's in 90% of each episode. The show was Banner-heavy, because it needed to be. And honestly, I think he sells Banner brilliantly. Out of all the characterisations of Banner, his is probably one of the strongest, and every time I hear the 'Lonely Man' theme (I think that's the right name), I can feel the sadness and loneliness as his Banner walks off to another town. Show me another portrayal of Banner that's as haunted by the Hulk as his and I'll concede that to you happily. S. |
The theme Lonely Man irritated me to no end, and to use it during Norton's Hulk detratged from the movie for myself and my wife.
Here we agree to disagree. I never liked the TV series, I feel it was not true to the comic. You liked the series. So be it.
I think it's better when they focus on the "fighting off the monster" element than loneliness, namely because Banner is literally one of the biggest nerds on the planet so it's not like he's missing out on that zany social life he would have had otherwise.
- CaptainFoamerang
Silverspar on Kelly Hu: A face that could melt paint off the wall *shivers*
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This is correct. Hulk's lethal rampage was solidly canon in the buildup to Planet Hulk. At some point between then and when World War Hulk started, Marvel softened on it and appear to have unofficially retconned it. It's a weird situation, they've been very contradictory about it. Not unlike their handling of Ghost Rider continuity, only this happened in a much shorter period of time. Hulk killing people in Vegas was clearly canon at that point, and was just sort of forgotten about. By the end of World War Hulk, no one seemed to acknowledge that Hulk had killed people.
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Originally Posted by Scarlet_Phantom
The Las Vegas rampage took place in the FF book. Illuminati was were the aftermath is mentioned and the body count. Both coincided with the start of the Planet Hulk storyline in Hulks book.
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Wow, this is my post if i was articulate. |
Originally Posted by SuperOz
Well, let's be honest about the tv show. With Spider-Man, it was being made on a shoestring budget and did amazingly well for the seasons it was on air, and it had to be sold on 'The Fugitive' premise, where Banner goes from town to town, with the reporter chasing down Hulk sightings.
There was no way you could do justice to the Hulk as shown in the comics at that point, not without CGI or a much larger budget. And if you look at Spider-Man with Nicholas Hammond, that show suffered way more than Hulk did. As for Bill Bixby, he's in 90% of each episode. The show was Banner-heavy, because it needed to be. And honestly, I think he sells Banner brilliantly. Out of all the characterisations of Banner, his is probably one of the strongest, and every time I hear the 'Lonely Man' theme (I think that's the right name), I can feel the sadness and loneliness as his Banner walks off to another town. Show me another portrayal of Banner that's as haunted by the Hulk as his and I'll concede that to you happily. S. |
Ah yes, live action TV superheroes who aren't Superman. Hulk, Spider-man, Flash. Even Superman in Lois and Clark just shows that you can't really do superheroes the way they are portrayed in the comics on a TV budget.
Heck we can even toss Wonder Women into that list except that WW fans didn't care since they were ogling Lynda Carter. 
Biggest misstep in the TV Hulk was the Thor movie. Daredevil worked OK since he really isn't super powerful but what they did with Thor was just embarrassing.
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Way to many alts.
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I deny the ogling. I was to young. I had not even hit puberty yet.|
Originally Posted by Father Xmas
Ah yes, live action TV superheroes who aren't Superman. Hulk, Spider-man, Flash. Even Superman in Lois and Clark just shows that you can't really do superheroes the way they are portrayed in the comics on a TV budget.
Heck we can even toss Wonder Women into that list except that WW fans didn't care since they were ogling Lynda Carter. Biggest misstep in the TV Hulk was the Thor movie. Daredevil worked OK since he really isn't super powerful but what they did with Thor was just embarrassing. |
*Looks at images of Lynda Carter as Wonder Woman*
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I know exactly why.|
Originally Posted by Warp_Factor
This is correct. Hulk's lethal rampage was solidly canon in the buildup to Planet Hulk. At some point between then and when World War Hulk started, Marvel softened on it and appear to have unofficially retconned it. It's a weird situation, they've been very contradictory about it. Not unlike their handling of Ghost Rider continuity, only this happened in a much shorter period of time. Hulk killing people in Vegas was clearly canon at that point, and was just sort of forgotten about. By the end of World War Hulk, no one seemed to acknowledge that Hulk had killed people.
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If Hulk killed someone, it contradicts everything that's been laid down about the character over 40 years.
If Reed Richards shot the Hulk into space without a good reason, it contradicts everything that's been laid down about *that* character for over 40 years.
The writer of FF put the murderous rampage in to give Richards a good reason. I guarantee he did not vett it with the writer of the Hulk book, and it's never been mentioned there. It was lazy writing, in order to give a character some contrived motivation. That way Richards can continue to look like a hero (instead of a goddamned Hitler, which is how he came across in Civil War). Then they'll forget the rampage and/or retcon it so that it wasn't the Hulk's fault, which will allow the Hulk to continue to look like a hero.
Over any long time scale these things happen in the comics biz. I hate how flaky comics continuity is, but that's just how it goes.
...
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I actually like the Avengers: EMH version of Hulk more than most prior versions. Hulk is actually in control in that one and rarely goes into blind rage. He actually thinks about what he's doing and Banner is more of an active conscience than a control mechanism. I makes hulk not just a more effective fighter in the show, but a more dynamic character.
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Misstep? More like stepping off the edge and falling into the Grand Canyon. Viking THOR and the cajun commandos......ugh.
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Originally Posted by Father Xmas
Biggest misstep in the TV Hulk was the Thor movie. Daredevil worked OK since he really isn't super powerful but what they did with Thor was just embarrassing.
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I think also at the time that Editorial couldn't think of a good way to have HULK in the Civil War, so blasting him into space kept him out of that. |
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
I know exactly why.
If Hulk killed someone, it contradicts everything that's been laid down about the character over 40 years. If Reed Richards shot the Hulk into space without a good reason, it contradicts everything that's been laid down about *that* character for over 40 years. The writer of FF put the murderous rampage in to give Richards a good reason. I guarantee he did not vett it with the writer of the Hulk book, and it's never been mentioned there. It was lazy writing, in order to give a character some contrived motivation. That way Richards can continue to look like a hero (instead of a goddamned Hitler, which is how he came across in Civil War). Then they'll forget the rampage and/or retcon it so that it wasn't the Hulk's fault, which will allow the Hulk to continue to look like a hero. Over any long time scale these things happen in the comics biz. I hate how flaky comics continuity is, but that's just how it goes. |
Given that Banner is multiple personalities I can see him and the Hulk personas having different views about superhuman registration.
Plus: if Banner/Hulk is against registering.....it's not like there would be much that anyone could do to force him
I find that I flat out don't like most popular comic book characters, period.
Either by way of power-creep, ridiculously convoluted backstory, constant retcon, or what have you they just shed my interest and become boring to me. Another thing is that the more *super awesome* a character is portrayed/advertised to me the more critical I'm going to be of them, because of the hype. If they don't live up to it then I'm sorry, there's no coming back from that.
This isn't limited to Comic Book characters for me either, rather it applies to ALL forms of media/storytelling.
Hell, as a Trekkie raised on Next Generation I don't care for Data, Worf and Freaking Captain Picard much any longer because the longer TNG went on (particularly the movies) the more they focused on just those characters to the exclusion/detriment of all others. (Well, that's kind of a lie... I -never- liked Worf.)
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For me Hulk is hit or miss, mostly miss. I loved him as a kid but became meh over him later. However the one Hulk run which I will never stop loving is when Peter David was writing him.
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Definitely, This sums up my feelings exactly X. (Except the Deadpool part, always been a fan of Nova, who's trapped in another dimension at the moment).
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Originally Posted by LiquidX
Now, I'll be honest. I don't really care for the Hulk myself, either. However, the problem for me is not that I don't like the Hulk himself, but because I really don't care for Marvel anymore (With the sole exception of Deadpool). And this all boils down to one simple reason: Marvel has pretty much destroyed my ability to care about their characters. Simply put, theres no growth anymore.
Why should I care if a character dies, when they are simply going to be ressurected six months later (Despite however Marvel may insist otherwise)? Or if a character makes a life altering move, when it's simply going to be retconned away anyways (Once again, despite how much Marvel may claim otherwise)? Character gets married or finds a life partner? Hell, their just going to end up in a fridge, or their marriage will be anulled in the most asinine way possible by an editor who thinks he knows better, anyways. So... why? Why should I care? Nothings going to happen, everythings always just going to return to the Status Quo by the end of the month. |
As far as the Hulk is concerned, Hulk works best , as others have said, when they get into the psychological horror aspect of the Hulk. The way I always thought it worked best, was that Hulk and Banner are different aspects of the same person.
-Doesn't explain why they are separating him and Banner again. John Byrne did that quite a few years ago.
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Data was the biggest plot crutch in the history of TV.
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Originally Posted by Oathbound
Hell, as a Trekkie raised on Next Generation I don't care for Data, Worf and Freaking Captain Picard much any longer because the longer TNG went on (particularly the movies) the more they focused on just those characters to the exclusion/detriment of all others. (Well, that's kind of a lie... I -never- liked Worf.)
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Stop responding to Durakken.
*THE MORE YOU KNOW*
- CaptainFoamerang
Silverspar on Kelly Hu: A face that could melt paint off the wall *shivers*
Someone play my AE arc! "The Heart of Statesman" ID: 343405