Thats a pretty cool idea.
Something of the order of the Leadership toggles (+15% Dam, +5% Def, +10% to Hit) would work really nicely for a full team after an hour or a few missions.
I guess you'd have to consider Task Forces as an upper limit case, where a team often stays together for an hour or two at least.
Most PUGs Ive been on are rolling teams, sometimes the membership has changed almost completely over the course of my play, so you'd need details of how quickly new members get the buff, how they reduce for each person who leaves, and so on.
But yeah, I really like the idea. Encouraging teaming and team-leading is a good goal.
Seems like a good idea.
I wouldn't mind if they increased the drop rates for long lasting teams as well. Personally I am willing to give up the drop rate increase if I want to solo.
Would be nice if you could share missions so everyone could get the merit rewards at the end.
Honestly I have been waiting around to see what GR brings. I hope it brings more then 2 new sets for some or 4 new for others.. My assumption is other stuff will be added, so something along this line might already be in the works.
1. Why Soft Cap is Important : http://dechskaison.blogspot.com/2011...important.html
2. Limits: http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Limits
3. Attack Mechanics: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Attack_Mechanics
4. Rule of Five: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Rule_o...e_Law_of_Fives
I gotta say, this is a FANTASTIC idea and I'm not sure why anyone hasn't come up with it already. And, theoretically it does make sense, the more time you spend with people, the more you learn of their attack tendencies, strengths and whatnot.
My only concern is the team leader double buff deal. Last thing we need is people saying "No I want star" "Well I'm already the leader so you can't have it" *Person quits.* And let's be honest, we know it's going to happen. Maybe make it so the leader gets to decide which buffs the team will get? That way it's appealing, but not TOO appealing. Also, would these buffs be mission based or timed based (timed base I believe could be very exploitable)? And will the buffs become progressively stronger?
As I mentioned, I absolutely LOVE the idea; there're just a few kinks that need to be worked out, such as what Mike mentioned about new members joining. I look forward to seeing others thoughts on this topic as well. 
- Im Not Talking Fast, You're Just Listening Slow.
- To Each His Own
I don't like this idea at all - in my opinion it won't make a big difference, teams that had weak leadership are still going to break up, teams with strong leadership will keep going strong. So all you're going to do is reinforce the teams that didn't need a boost anyway.
The Paragon developers have already gone to considerable lengths to promote teaming. If it hasn't helped yet, maybe the players need to just bite the bullet and look at their own behavior first.
I would note that the anecdote related by the OP never occurs for the team leader.
So if you don't like team disbanding, the answer is so simple it's trivial: LEAD.
The idea behind it? Interesting.
The consequences? "I have to leave for X reason" - legitimately. What does it do to the rest of the team? If it deprives them of a buff, what are those members going to do when that person (and I'm looking more at a PUG situation, though it could I suppose get nasty in SGs too) shows up again and looks for a team? Someone getting sick, or having a kid to suddenly de-glue from the ceiling fan, family medical issues, or just plain "I've been awake 28 hours, need to sleep now" could, in theory, find themselves blacklisted... making it *harder* for them to find a team.
Or what about the late joiners? I can see (with my decided lack of faith in humanity) people just not wanting to have someone tagging along not as "buffed" as they are, thinking - however wrong - they'll end up as a liability.
What about task forces? (In some ways I could see this being good, potentially slowing down some of the 'speed runs' - .... ok, probably not - but OTOH I'd have to see them altered to have to counter these buffs.)
Worth trying to hammer this stuff out though.
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Although I'm not the OP, I'm not entirely sure what you mean here. Are you saying that a team gets buffed, but then someone drops, thereby causing a percentage of the buff to deteriorate, then thereby causing resentment amongst the players still on the team? |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
The idea behind it? Interesting.
The consequences? "I have to leave for X reason" - legitimately. What does it do to the rest of the team? If it deprives them of a buff, what are those members going to do when that person (and I'm looking more at a PUG situation, though it could I suppose get nasty in SGs too) shows up again and looks for a team? Someone getting sick, or having a kid to suddenly de-glue from the ceiling fan, family medical issues, or just plain "I've been awake 28 hours, need to sleep now" could, in theory, find themselves blacklisted... making it *harder* for them to find a team. |
If so, then I'd have to say I honestly didn't think of this sort of situation mainly because, while there are jerks in the game, they're definately in the minority; meaning good and understanding players will understand when this happens, and simply move on.
- Im Not Talking Fast, You're Just Listening Slow.
- To Each His Own
Thanks for the support, Rowdy
I agree. Allowing the leader to hand out buffs would be a better idea than giving him/her double buffs.
This way, no one will complain about wanting the leadership, all the while it keeps people interested and dedicated to the team.
There's no reason why late teammates should not be allowed buffs. Once in the team, if the team buffs are unlocked, you have it instantly, the same way you have buffs/debuffs upon entering certain zone areas. As long as there are 2 or more people to keep it alive.
Brillig, I actually love leading teams.
But if you were speaking in general, well, that sounds like an old-fashioned work-a-holic with no intent on experiencing new or amazing ideas. I honestly mean no offense by that.
I believe this idea would make that much of a difference, as I've seen it work very VERY effectively on other games.
A person who joins a team could easily just get bored and leave for another team. But they gain nothing new from the next team. Whereas a person who's been on a team that's been active for a long enough period of time gains abilities like bonus exp, higher chance of rare drops, etc. You stay more, you gain more.
If it won't change much, then there's really no harm in adding it
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Forgot to add, needless to say: Once a player leaves said team, their team buff(s) goes away, of course.
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Originally Posted by DreadBat
There's no reason why late teammates should not be allowed buffs. Once in the team, if the team buffs are unlocked, you have it instantly, the same way you have buffs/debuffs upon entering certain zone areas. As long as there are 2 or more people to keep it alive.
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i really don't see a need for this. if a team disbands, oh well. almost everyone knows they can pass the star, so there shouldn't be a need to fear the star. as for why people leave teams, it is for various reasons. RL, wanting to do other things in game and the whole slew of other reasons. while interesting, it needs to be fleshed out a whole lot more and i still don't really see a need for trying to force people to team and lead.
Interesting Idea Dreadbat,
I dont know how much it would promote teams staying together, because honestly when I am on a good team, I dont want to leave. Fatigue and real life are usually what pulls me away from them. Bad teams on the other hand, I cannot wait to get away from. I would rather solo than spend my time running back constantly from the hospital.
Here is another idea though, which would help promote teaming in general. Make it a Day Job ! Seriously, you build up your time on teams until you earn the accolade. Once you possess the accolade, you can choose a particular team buff from a list of buffs.
Or... maybe after "X" hours of teaming you earn your choice of certain rewards, much like a merit vendor. I realize that the merit rewards are already similar to this, but these special rewards could be something new and only available from TEAMING.
BIOSPARK :: DARKTHORN :: SKYGUARD :: WILDMAGE
HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF
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The point is to give players reason to be more willing to team/lead. Not force.
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Originally Posted by Sharker_Quint
while interesting, it needs to be fleshed out a whole lot more and i still don't really see a need for trying to force people to team and lead.
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Haha Bio, the only reason it couldn't be a dayjob is because dayjobs are what the heroes do when they're not out being heroes. If it worked that way, everyone would earn this accolade automatically because we all team. Same as how earning the influence badges are inevitable.
Yeah True,
It could be called something else though. Additionally, you may eventually earn the Badge, but the rewards would only accrue from continued teaming. So its slightly different.
Heck you could even add one of these team Accolades as time spent as Lead !!
That might shake things up a bit.
BIOSPARK :: DARKTHORN :: SKYGUARD :: WILDMAGE
HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF
Now you're talking 
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Oh, I'm all for new and amazing ideas. I just don't think your idea is either. I think it's a half measure at best that doesn't do anything to address the core issue and instead attempts to paper over it with an unbalanced, kludgy incentive. But no offense.|
Originally Posted by DreadBat
Brillig, I actually love leading teams.
But if you were speaking in general, well, that sounds like an old-fashioned work-a-holic with no intent on experiencing new or amazing ideas. I honestly mean no offense by that. I believe this idea would make that much of a difference, as I've seen it work very VERY effectively on other games. A person who joins a team could easily just get bored and leave for another team. But they gain nothing new from the next team. Whereas a person who's been on a team that's been active for a long enough period of time gains abilities like bonus exp, higher chance of rare drops, etc. You stay more, you gain more. If it won't change much, then there's really no harm in adding it |
Remember that there's no such thing as a free lunch.
If team effectiveness for long-standing teams is raised, then, by comparison, effectiveness for short-lived teams is reduced. In essence, you are asking the devs to create a preference for one form of teaming (long, static) over another (short, dynamic), which is what I object to.
Also, adding something that has no effect can still be harmful as it sucks dev resources away from things we might actually want.
I vaguely remember a game where every time you made a team, there was a separate XP bar for 'party level.' The more things you killed as a group, the more XP went into that bar. When it went up in level, I believe the team got more XP per kill or something to that effect.
It'd be a nice little thing to see implemented. If not an experience bonus, then other little random tidbits that feel rewarding for having played on a team.
I agree with Brillig to an extent. This idea too greatly favors the lone person who still wants to play over the seven others who decided to disband under the misguided assumption that the people who quit the team suffer from some strange mental condition that forces them to leave the team if anyone else does. It also enforces the idea that you *can't* quit the team to go re-solidify your dog, or jump ship because Super Doofus is irritating the **** out of you, because you just hit the hour mark, and that's when the GOOD buff starts applying.
Not to mention that the buffs are incapable of not affecting game-balance, and further detract from the appeal of a soloist.
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Some of this has to do with human psychology. It has to do with "group think". If you are in a social group and things are going well, there are no major conflicts, and everyone is enjoying themselves, you want to stay in that group. You don't want to be the first one to leave because that would be going "against" the way the group appears to be thinking, which is "stay together". |
Originally Posted by DreadBat
So, I'm sure I'm not alone when I say it can be frustrating when teams just disban all at once. The moment the team leader states that they must go, suddenly everyone has to cook dinner or their dog just got hit by a car.
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I know I do this myself when I am in teams. I know have done it not only sub-consciously, but consciously as well. I may want to leave go to do something else and sit there for another half hour or more. It could be something silly, like go get new enhancements or go pick up a particular mission from a contact that just unlocked for me, or go switch to a different toon so I can keep them relatively close in level. It may be something real world related such as making something to eat, watching a move, or whatever. In any case, I, like many others, have a tendency to sit in the team if the team is going well.
As soon as someone else mentions leaving though, it's an excuse. You are no longer going against the group by yourself, you have someone else doing the same thing. Once that second person leaves, it becomes even easier, and it progresses from there. Sometimes it doesn't even matter if they are running from the star or not. I had a case today where a team had hit that point, I was willing to stay, someone was willing to leave, but the team fell apart anyway.
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Originally Posted by DreadBat
I think it'd make team disbans a lot less frequent if there were a feature added to CoX where keeping a team alive for x amount of time unlocks a full team buff. Not only that, but having it change to color of everyone's name above their heads so that it shows. It would make people feel important. It would make them feel good. It would make everyone be HAPPY to be in a team that's lasting as long as it is.
So here's how it could work, for example. |
There are only a few different things that can really be buffed. You have Damage, Recharge, Accuracy, Defense, Resistance, Movement Speed, and maybe a few others.
There are already powers out there that handle team buffs of the combat related stats. In fact, that is what the entire "Leadership" power pool is for. Something like this could weaken the need for ever taking that set. Especially since a buff of this sort wouldn't require any endurance like the toggled buffs in Leadership.
Why is this bad? Because it's one more choice that players don't have to really worry about when designing their toons. So they do away with leadership and they take this other set that some other people are taking. And therein lies the rub. They just took one more difference between their toon, and others--one more thing that made them a little more unique--and they threw it away cause they don't need it anymore.
And I know that two of the boosters already include buffs to some of these same attributes, but these buffs are random. The player has no control over what gets buffed. They aren't handing out buffs to team members by choice. Also in both cases, there are possible negative side effects.
I do have an idea though, and it is one that will easily appeal to many many players in the CoH/V community...
Badges
Don't need buffs, just badges. Stay in a full team for an hour, get the first badge. Stay in the same team for 2 hours, get the second tier of that badge. Stay in the same team for FOUR hours, and get the third (and final) tier of that badge. As an added caveat, any hour you do not gain XP does not count. This would prevent people from creating a team and hanging out in Pocket D (not knocking RP. I RP there myself sometimes. It's just that that's not what the badge would be about), as well as parking a team in a mission or SG base and logging off for the night.
There are a lot of people who would go out of their way to stay in teams for an extended period of time for the badges.
Also, there is already a buff for being in a team, and it's the best buff of all... XP. In fact, for an 8-man team, the buff is a 150% XP bonus.
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Originally Posted by DrMike2000
Thats a pretty cool idea.
Something of the order of the Leadership toggles (+15% Dam, +5% Def, +10% to Hit) would work really nicely for a full team after an hour or a few missions. |
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Originally Posted by DreadBat
The point is to give players reason to be more willing to team/lead. Not force.
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Additionally, there is the XP bonus that is given to teams. The larger the team, the better the bonus.
There is plenty of reason to team already. Plenty of incentive.
Finally, the more free buffs you add to the game, the easier the game becomes. This is a bad thing. If a game is too easy, people become bored quickly. If a game is too hard, they become discouraged. The key is finding a good balance. CoH/V has done a good job of this, for the most part. I know there are some ATs and/or powersets that feel like certain things need to be changed (How ya doing there Bad Influence), but for the most part the challenge level (especially with adjustable difficulty settings) is in a good place.
Even if you don't get to the point were it gets so easy it's boring, as a company, it is bad business to make the leveling process too fast. The faster people level, the shorter the lifespan of the game. You know what I am referring to. The guy who leaves because he already has 12 level 50s on 5 different servers and just doesn't feel there is anything new for him to experience anymore. By the time you get to that point, there's almost no amount of new missions or power sets that is going to re-stimulate interest for more than a few weeks. Once you see it, you are right back where you were.
That's not a knock on this game or the devs at all. As I said, the game is just about where it should be right now. I am simply stating that care and caution should be taken before doing things that will make it too much easier.
- Garielle
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Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".
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Some people do want to be team leaders. Some people just don't. I just...eh. I can't describe what it is about the idea that bugs me. Possibly already summed up by Brillig, tbh.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Honestly, I never really understood starphobia. All you have to do is set a mission every 15 minutes or so. Maybe some people are just born leaders and others followers; and of course, there's nothing wrong with that.
- Im Not Talking Fast, You're Just Listening Slow.
- To Each His Own
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I think it's more avoidance of the process of recruiting people to fill the openings.
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Originally Posted by Rowdy
Honestly, I never really understood starphobia. All you have to do is set a mission every 15 minutes or so. Maybe some people are just born leaders and others followers; and of course, there's nothing wrong with that.
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- Garielle
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Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".
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You do realize there's a real world out there?..|
Originally Posted by DreadBat
So, I'm sure I'm not alone when I say it can be frustrating when teams just disban all at once. The moment the team leader states that they must go, suddenly everyone has to cook dinner or their dog just got hit by a car.
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Yes, teams do completely disband fairly frequently when the leader, or even a random teammate, leaves. Because everyone else decides they've been on a while and need a break, or actually DO some of the things on their daily to-do list.
Don't get me wrong; I think a minor buff that builds up the longer a team has been together, retaining (for example) at least four core members, is a nifty idea. Sort of a "Hey... we work pretty well together, don't we?" bonus.
Where to find me after the end:
The Secret World - Arcadia - Shinzo
Rift - Faeblight - Bloodspeaker
LotRO - Gladden - Aranelion
STO - Holodeck - @Captain_Thiraas
Obviously, I don't care about NCSoft's forum rules, now.
I think some sort of buffed that kicked in if you were on a team for more then an hour without a break would be awesome. Soloist Dual Boxers would just setup a dummy team mate for a free buff but that's not going to effect much else since they are already soloists.
Loosing your buff from a connection hiccup would suck a bit but it's not like getting nerfed for having to reload (although 6 months after the release people would claim that's exactly what happens).
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This, in essence, is why the idea doesn't appeal to me, either. Some people like long-lasting teams, but I don't, particularly, and it would be annoying to have my preferred play style penalised. CoX is generally very good at not pushing a particular style of play onto players.|
Originally Posted by Brillig
If team effectiveness for long-standing teams is raised, then, by comparison, effectiveness for short-lived teams is reduced. In essence, you are asking the devs to create a preference for one form of teaming (long, static) over another (short, dynamic), which is what I object to.
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Originally Posted by Garielle
Don't need buffs, just badges. Stay in a full team for an hour, get the first badge. Stay in the same team for 2 hours, get the second tier of that badge. Stay in the same team for FOUR hours, and get the third (and final) tier of that badge. [...]
There are a lot of people who would go out of their way to stay in teams for an extended period of time for the badges. |
Arc#314490: Zombie Ninja Pirates!
Defiant @Grouchybeast
Death is part of my attack chain.
So, I'm sure I'm not alone when I say it can be frustrating when teams just disban all at once. The moment the team leader states that they must go, suddenly everyone has to cook dinner or their dog just got hit by a car.
Now sure, sometimes these kind of things really happen and people actually do need to log off. But we all know that there are those who are just so dead-set on avoiding the star, they'll come up with any excuse to leave before it falls on them
Now, what I'm suggesting shouldn't be too difficult to do. At least, I'm thinking not. But even if it is, these suggestions are to be taken into account so... let's not have replies going on and on about "Oh, but that takes so much coding. Don't make them work so hard. Yadda yadda white knight garble". Everything takes oodles of work and coding. But it's their job to make this game as amazing as possible for us players so I'd rather not hear it.
Besides... I think a lot of people might actually love to see this idea come to life.
So here it goes:
I think it'd make team disbans a lot less frequent if there were a feature added to CoX where keeping a team alive for x amount of time unlocks a full team buff. Not only that, but having it change to color of everyone's name above their heads so that it shows. It would make people feel important. It would make them feel good. It would make everyone be HAPPY to be in a team that's lasting as long as it is.
So here's how it could work, for example.
1.Team forms.
2. Team goes on missions. Does their thing. An hour goes by.
3. Team is now buffed. Gains more attack power? Defense? You decide.
4. Now that team is buffed, all teammates' names change from green to Yellow (or Gold. Looks all exclusive and important). Yellow (or Gold) names are ONLY visible to anyone within the party.
5. Team LEADER'S name changes to Red and is visible to anyone IN or OUT of the party. This way, people can more easily follow the leader while on missions. Also, anyone outside of the party can spot that this person is a team leader and send them a tell to ask if they could join. Filling teams has never been easier! People would hardly need to broadcast after a while.
Now, there's one more thing to add to this to top it off.
There's still the whole "I hate leading" business.
Well, I say give the team leader access to buffs that they can give out to the team.
More people would be okay with having the star fall upon them/handed to them rather than running off in terror.
And this works into RP too. Think of it as a leader giving motivational speeches to their team to keep them in the fight. Infact, why not name these buffs "Motivation: So-And-So". Just like how there's "Mutation: Quick Reflexes". And make them golden, like the Dayjob buff icons. The grey buff icons in Mutation look too much like the Fortune icons and it makes some people think "Well, they already have a fortune. I don't need to read theirs".
Whether or not people think this idea would work, I just want to say this:
I've seen a similar system work on another MMORPG I use to play YEARS ago (Flyff). On that game, people actually WANTED to be team leaders and teammated WANTED to stay in teams. The leaders made the most effort possible to keep their teams alive for as many hours as possible because they would gain amazing team buffs. I think it was either based on the amount of hours the team stayed active or the amount of team points the team racked up while training. Yeah, I'm pretty sure they had a Team Exp feature that was separate from actual Exp. And one of the team buffs given out to teammates was additional exp gain. Another was for better chances to get rare drops. Something like that is sure to keep teammates on the team.
Anyway. I think an idea like this would not only keep more teams alive longer, but it would also make the community a lot more active, more talkative, and more people would want to play more often. This would also be AMAZING for Super Group teaming, as well as making new friends to invite to your SuperGroups.
So! That's my idea. Here's to hoping it'll be taken seriously.