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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
No that is what they said.
In the event the game ever go to a serverless enviroment there will be no refunds for server transfers. |
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| Isn't it fascinating to watch the lengths some people will go to in order to justify their delusions? In Skeet's case he's cherry-picking words and twisting meanings so he can get from NO REFUNDS to We might go serverless one day. |
Yes, that's what they and I take that caveat to mean they've at least considered the idea. From there, I just went on to point out changes that have happened in the meantime that make it more practical to do now and some speculation on what it might look like.
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Granted, I'm not on Pinnacle, so I don't have direct experience with your server. I do, however, play exclusively on Protector, which is also generally known as a low population server. If you couldn't find a team in 9 hours, and couldn't get anyone to help you with an AV mission, then you're doing something wrong. I don't know what precisely that 'something' is. Whatever it is though, the issue lies with you.|
Originally Posted by rsclark
Well, I've been on my server (Pinnacle) since launch day, so I'm not moving without all my characters and my SG base - which I don't see happening anytime soon. It certainly wasn't low pop when I picked it. I would have picked a different one if the name had been "watch the tumbleweeds roll by".
And I'm not talking about teams of 8. Sunday I played for 9 hours with LFG up and never saw an invite. When i finally needed to get more damage/debuff/whatever to take out 2 AVs I couldn't solo, it took another 2.5 hours to get 2 people to help - and to get them I had to give up asking people if they wanted to group and switch to asking people to do me a favor by helping out. |
Maybe you're not using the available tools. Maybe you need to work on your delivery when sending tells to other players. Maybe you need to make some friends on your server.
Between global friends, global chat channels, and all the other ways to locate other players, there is no reason not to be able to put together a group for any task.
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Originally Posted by SkeetSkeet
Settle down, Beavis.
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If I'm Beavis that makes you Butthead. And if you'll recall Beavis was the smarter of the two.
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I can vouch for PK on this.. |
Originally Posted by Westley
I HAVE no friends in game. I'm such a dick that no one will be my friend in game.
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I'll also chime in and back him up on the fact that with only a little bit of effort, you can form a team on any server at any time. I've done it countless times myself on Protector, even at off-peak times like mid-morning on a Tuesday, both blue & redside.
What it really comes down to, is that most players who complain about this issue simply don't want to put forth the effort to start and maintain a team. I can sympathize with that to a certain extent. Sometimes it's just more fun to tag along and not have to worry about anything other than what is right in front of you. That sympathy evaporates pretty quickly though, when the whines & rants about 'dead' servers and 'never' being able to find a team start.
I'm not sure the sense of entitlement being displayed regarding the "right" to play on a low population server is founded on anything concrete. I imagine if Paragon was suddenly hugely successful overnight and had a massive influx of players they wouldn't be adding more servers anytime soon since they have done a number of upgrades to handle increase loads.
Even if they did increase the number of servers would you then skip town from your home server and move everything to the new low pop one(s)?
Would the people proclaiming this "right" to play on a low population server in a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER online game then quit? Logic dictates it doesn't it?
Directly related to what Skeetskeet is saying the smoke you guys are throwing against a server-less environment, or a reduction in server count, is trivial to overcome. You personally might not like the results because of a variety of reasons some of which may have some credence and some of which are just fear of change.
In the case where you have multiple instances of the same name occurring across the same global I well imagine a legacy program could be instituted. Rather than (using an example listed earlier) Billz1, Billz2, Billz3 it would probably be:
Billz
pinnacle
Billz
virtue
But things like this have already been discussed in previous server merger threads. People may not like the idea, but if PS decides to do it one day you need to have a heck of a lot better ammo than you guys have now. Lets just say that if the anti-merger argument prepared so far was a zombie survival kit you guys would be dead when the very first zombie showed up. Maybe even before...
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says the gal who went out of her way to claim that at least half of the forum members were perverted |
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Play nice now, people - if you need to mock, do it gently - and still be helpful
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There is no such thing as an "innocent bystander"
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Finish it. As stated that's not that wild of an assumption. The reason why was. |
Originally Posted by BigFish
says the gal who went out of her way to claim that at least half of the forum members were perverted
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total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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Seems too sensible. Are you sure you got that right?
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
I'll give it a shot, but since I'm not your secretary I'm not responsible for anything that gets lost in translation.
I hope that helps.  |
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
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I'm on every server. And given the problems mentioned MANY times above that a server merge would likely encounter, in part or in whole, my "skipping town" wouldn't be to another server. |
Originally Posted by Frosticus
Even if they did increase the number of servers would you then skip town from your home server and move everything to the new low pop one(s)?
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| Would the people proclaiming this "right" to play on a low population server in a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER online game then quit? Logic dictates it doesn't it? |
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| But things like this have already been discussed in previous server merger threads. People may not like the idea, but if PS decides to do it one day you need to have a heck of a lot better ammo than you guys have now. Lets just say that if the anti-merger argument prepared so far was a zombie survival kit you guys would be dead when the very first zombie showed up. Maybe even before... |
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At most, expand it to (French Language Server) for the really thick headed ones.|
Originally Posted by Beber
Every EU server has a tag next to it in the server list, indicating its location. No need for a "Le Vigilance", it's already "Vigilance (FR)"
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Originally Posted by SwellGuy
Well okay, villains can have London.
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Orc&Pie No.53230 There is an orc, and somehow, he got a pie. And you are hungry.
www.repeat-offenders.net
Negaduck: I see you found the crumb. I knew you'd never notice the huge flag.
Also, as has been mentioned near the start of the thread; A number of our users are running the game on low-end machines. Machines that have trouble, on low population servers, of keeping up with the gathering of players/critters during events... And I'm talking regular events like a MS raid or Rikti invasion.
The recent 6th anniversary event, I went on virtue the first day; Horrible. While my system handled it like a champ (barely), others' couldn't... And I think the server its self was having troubles keeping track of all the recharge times. It was almost impossible to do anything because my powers were stuck recharging (even though they'd long ago recharged on my screen.)
While the next day, on triumph (one of the "dead"er servers), It was smoother, for the most part. I could actually enjoy the event and 'arrest' various large things along with everyone else (And believe me, there were still a lot of people there, despite the server's perceived size). Gatherings that cause everyone to come out of the woodworks like that are rare, but they do a good job of showing how populated the servers really are.
My only complaint is that certain things seem to affect low population servers disproportionally. The occasional new games and open betas do make it a bit more difficult to find teams... Although most of the time I'm among those checking out the new shineys, so I guess I'm part of that 'problem'.
"My inner mind has become a reality-cracking overgod. He torments me! Help!"
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I said there were 83,499 perverts here?
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Originally Posted by BigFish
says the gal who went out of her way to claim that at least half of the forum members were perverted
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
OH OH Some buddy don't no about Global Channel, Join a Server Global Channel is the best way to team up with other players. Also i like to address in the Winter of last year they where giving out free Server transfer, So alot of people went to other Server like Freedom and Virtue where there more Action. BTW Going Rogue comes out in July hopefully that will bring alot of players back to COX.
Never play another NcSoft game, If you feel pride for our game, then it as well, I Superratz am Proud of all of you Coh people, Love, Friendship will last for a lifetime.
Global:@Greenflame Ratz
Main Toons:Super Ratz, Burning B Radical, Green Flame Avenger, Tunnel Ratz, Alex Magnus
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I am one of those 83,499 Perverts you where talking about |
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
I said there were 83,499 perverts here?
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Never play another NcSoft game, If you feel pride for our game, then it as well, I Superratz am Proud of all of you Coh people, Love, Friendship will last for a lifetime.
Global:@Greenflame Ratz
Main Toons:Super Ratz, Burning B Radical, Green Flame Avenger, Tunnel Ratz, Alex Magnus
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Those that stand in the way of progress sometimes get run over.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
I'm on every server. And given the problems mentioned MANY times above that a server merge would likely encounter, in part or in whole, my "skipping town" wouldn't be to another server.
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| No, just people throwing up pseudo-logic about a MASSIVELY MULTIPLAYER blah blah blah strawman dictate it. |
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| You not liking the arguments does not mean they're "smoke." And I do have better ammo - because if they DID do it, the game *would* be on its way out. And it'd be on its way out even faster, because - after losing SG bases, membership, etc. from it, after getting characters forcibly renamed, after loss of characters, they'd have an even greater loss of subscriptions than whatever would have forced them to consider it in the first place. |
I'm actually being really friendly and trying to help. If/when PS does deem in necessary or in the best interest of the game to condense the population that list you guys revere as some sort of anti-merger holy grail will crumble with nothing more than a hard gaze cast toward it.
The biggest fear mongering of all is proclaiming that condensing the population will sound the death knoll for the game. Even though that puts you guys into the doom-criers allegiance (which is humorous) it is a very shortsighted and even ignorant view of the situation.
If PS made a release saying (hypothetical numbers used): our old server structure could only support 200 players in a single instance. So while our game world is vast and awe inspiring we were forced to spread players out over many instances. Rather than just creating numbered instances (which does currently occur during busy times) we opted to create separate named shards. We have since then upgraded our server tech to state of the art constructs that will allow us to support up to 3-4-5 hundred (pick w/e number you like) players in a single instance. To take advantage of our insanely fun, award winning and critically acclaimed zone events and to ensure that every player new and old gets to experience a bustling City Of. experience yada yada yada.
Well that sort of takes the wind out of the doom criers sails imo.
I mean if you can put a positive spin on a company that just failed a major acquisition resulting in a massive drop in share price and still convince investors to fork over huge sums of additional money then I really don't think convincing a bunch of addicted video game players that everything is hunky doory is even remotely a challenge. But it is all about perspective and I understand that a seemingly insurmountable problem for one is a small stepping stone for another.
Which is why I say you will need more than fear mongering, ranting about entitlement, and a few technical hurdles that can likely be overcome relatively easily if you actually want to make a case against a population condensation if/when the time comes. I'm really just trying to be helpful as I actually agree with much of what you say about enjoying the quiet times and what not as I'll often scoot over to DA or Creys to get away from seeing anyone for prolonged periods.
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Based on the things that only you said in that thread I'm pretty sure we determined you were the one that was perverted. I think the admins agreed and gave you a little vacation to explore some of those taboo fetishes. I don't judge, but leave that stuff to more appropriate discussion boards, they aren't hard to find.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
I said there were 83,499 perverts here?
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And who were the 83,498 others? |
Originally Posted by GreenFIame
I am one of those 83,499 Perverts you where talking about
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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The only doom criers are the people that cry for the servers to be merged.
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Originally Posted by Frosticus
Well that sort of takes the wind out of the doom criers sails imo.
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Massively multiplayer - you're ignoring the RP, of course. The genre is generally defined by a persistent world with multiple users on simultaneously (as opposed to, say, Diablo II in which there was a maximum of 8 people in any world, from the Rogue camp through the barbarian highlands.) |
Originally Posted by Frosticus
If you have a different understanding of what MMO stands for please share. I've accepted it as the standard definition. Personally it is why I left Infinity when I joined the game because for me it wasn't fitting the definition. What constitutes "many players" is debatable though.
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"Massively multiplayer" does not mean "work your way through Times Square crowds 24/7."
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| Just because you list it doesn't make it true. The list cited on the first page 7 of the 10 points are subjective personal opinion and nothing more than fear mongering aka smoke. |
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| 3 of them have some technical merit that would have varying degrees of difficulty to overcome. Not one of them can't be overcome though and not a single rename or lost SG, or lost characters would need to occur. |
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| I'm actually being really friendly and trying to help. If/when PS does deem in necessary or in the best interest of the game to condense the population that list you guys revere as some sort of anti-merger holy grail will crumble with nothing more than a hard gaze cast toward it. |
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| The biggest fear mongering of all is proclaiming that condensing the population will sound the death knoll for the game. Even though that puts you guys into the doom-criers allegiance (which is humorous) it is a very shortsighted and even ignorant view of the situation. |
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If PS made a release saying (hypothetical numbers used): our old server structure could only support 200 players in a single instance. So while our game world is vast and awe inspiring we were forced to spread players out over many instances. Rather than just creating numbered instances (which does currently occur during busy times) we opted to create separate named shards. We have since then upgraded our server tech to state of the art constructs that will allow us to support up to 3-4-5 hundred (pick w/e number you like) players in a single instance. To take advantage of our insanely fun, award winning and critically acclaimed zone events and to ensure that every player new and old gets to experience a bustling City Of. experience yada yada yada. Well that sort of takes the wind out of the doom criers sails imo. |
Sorry, your "counter" arguments don't counter much of anything. Going "oh, they just have to handwave this" doesn't fix or invalidate anything.
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*Hops up and down like a rabbit on crack.*|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
And who were the 83,498 others?
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OOH! OOOH!
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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MMO means there's lots of people on simultaneously. It doesn't necessarily mean they're all on the same node/shard/server though.|
Originally Posted by Frosticus
If you have a different understanding of what MMO stands for please share. I've accepted it as the standard definition. Personally it is why I left Infinity when I joined the game because for me it wasn't fitting the definition. What constitutes "many players" is debatable though.
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| Just because you list it doesn't make it true. |
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| The list cited on the first page 7 of the 10 points are subjective personal opinion and nothing more than fear mongering aka smoke. 3 of them have some technical merit that would have varying degrees of difficulty to overcome. Not one of them can't be overcome though and not a single rename or lost SG, or lost characters would need to occur. |
As to them being overcome, sure. But is the cost/time/feature/benefit matrix more desirable? A lot of people (including the devs) are saying "no".
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| I'm actually being really friendly and trying to help. If/when PS does deem in necessary or in the best interest of the game to condense the population that list you guys revere as some sort of anti-merger holy grail will crumble with nothing more than a hard gaze cast toward it. |
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| The biggest fear mongering of all is proclaiming that condensing the population will sound the death knoll for the game. Even though that puts you guys into the doom-criers allegiance (which is humorous) it is a very shortsighted and even ignorant view of the situation. |
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| If PS made a release saying (hypothetical numbers used): our old server structure could only support 200 players in a single instance. So while our game world is vast and awe inspiring we were forced to spread players out over many instances. Rather than just creating numbered instances (which does currently occur during busy times) we opted to create separate named shards. We have since then upgraded our server tech to state of the art constructs that will allow us to support up to 3-4-5 hundred (pick w/e number you like) players in a single instance. To take advantage of our insanely fun, award winning and critically acclaimed zone events and to ensure that every player new and old gets to experience a bustling City Of. experience yada yada yada. |
Also, you forget this is CLIENT-server technology. Simply because the servers can handle it, doesn't mean the clients can. Nor does it mean the network architecture (both hard and soft) linking the two can.
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| Well that sort of takes the wind out of the doom criers sails imo. |
Until the devs state otherwise, asking for consolidation is merely another form of "are we there yet? are we there yet? are we there yet?" and just as annoying.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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No more than you have any idea of it and can definitively say the things you are saying. The statement that you claim defeats my argument actually defeats yours completely. The difference is you are fear mongering with yours and I'm being rational with mine. When you have a red name I'll take your vitriolic rants and sense of entitlement as something more than a fear of sharing your toys.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Right. Because, after all, you know precisely how NC's databases are set up and how non trivial it would be to take care of all this... wait, your name isn't in red. So until you *can* prove that merging - say - Victory and Pinnacle (which would come up with more than 36 characters for me) would result in no lost characters, none displaced somewhere they don't belong, etc. you're as full of it as you want to say the list is.
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People that say "it can't be done" when they have no idea of what they are talking about are a personal pet peeve of mine. Such an unambitious view of the world aggravates me to no end. But there is a really large difference about what we are talking about. See, I have no idea how easy it would be to implement, but I'm not speaking to that, I'm speaking to overcoming the initial hurdle of how to approach the resolve without "losing characters, sg's, etc" that you are fear mongering with. The technical implementation is either possible or it isn't, at which point it just becomes work. And work being hard or easy is a subjective qualification.
That diatribe of tears posted on the first page will do nothing if/when the company decides to proceed. I seriously hope you guys don't think that it will.
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Ok, that's 2 down, 83,497 to go |
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
*Hops up and down like a rabbit on crack.*
OOH! OOOH! |
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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You should have said that his tears were delicious - that always gives more weight to a statement.
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Originally Posted by Frosticus
That diatribe of tears posted on the first page will do nothing if/when the company decides to proceed.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
Ages ago, before the NCSoft buy out, there was an "ask a dev" with one of the tech devs, who said that his dream was to have the game as a serverless environment, but he didn't say any more than that.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork