Quote:
Maybe they'll be available to the squishies that actually can use them for mobility and KB protection.
|
Originally Posted by Heraclea
So now I've got bids out for a number of them. I expect quite a few to be discarded in disgust, and they still make you fly faster and jump higher.
|
Global name: @k26dp
Posi's blast is horrible; the bonuses are crap, it's acc is low, and it's damage is in no way ED compliant. And the 6th slot bonus and proc are bleh.
It's the Ghost Widow's Embrace of damage sets!
__________________
Currently listening to the Dead Milkmen's Chaos Rules; Live at the Trocadero
Chief Hamster of the Fist of Justice / Shadows of Victory
Victory Server: Join Victory Forum for team forming and general game chat and IRC Chat: irc.hashmark.net #victory for offline chatting.
Rock, rock on Hamster.
Quote:
To what? You can take the +recharge and +recovery from my cold, dead hands... As Minotaur said, they just need more targeted AOE sets: Posi is the only one with worthwhile bonuses, really. They noticed that with PbAOE recently, so I wouldn't be surprised if some got added in.|
Originally Posted by Satanic_Hamster
Eh. Kinda saw this coming for a while.
Just wish they'd revamp Positron's Blast... |
cozmic, Castle is on record as saying that it is far too easy to get a lot of defense from IO sets, but that he also knows he has to live with it (or something to that extent). I highly doubt there is going to be anything like a drastic change to IO sets. BotZ was just too good compared to other IO recipes, and it got slapped down.
Considering they made defense buffs easier to get a few issues back, and Castle was okay with that balance decision (or the devs were overall), I cannot see why they would possibly make any major changes. I think you're letting the doom cry too loudly in your heart.
I do hope you're not wishing for the days before ED, etc., though. Things were rather overpowered and silly back then...
*added*
Have to love these forums. You try to talk about the BotZ change logically, and people neg rep you. Tsk, tsk. (guessing this hapened on the big thread o'changes, not here).
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
[QUOTE=Satanic_Hamster;2726044]Eh. Kinda saw this coming for a while.
Just wish they'd revamp Positron's Blast...
[QUOTE]
I just want two or three more set options for Targeted AoE that doesn't include a PvP or Purple set.
As for lawlz set bonuses... was a fan of doing this: If you get a damage resistant bonus - you get a damage boost to that type of damage by half (Positron Fire/Cold 1.56, .78 boost to fire/cold damage, i.e.)
Also, mez resistance gives half back in duration increases. So, 1.65 sleep resistance increases the duration of sleep powers by 0.825 and the reverse would be true (2 percent increase in Hold effects gives a 1 percent hold resistance effect). I've always though an AT that uses fire should resist fire (even blasters) and a controller should resist holds... and this would be a way to do it.
Thank you, City of Heroes, for giving me a superhero social network combined with amazingly smooth game play. Petitions signed with realistic expectations.
I'm honestly surprised they didn't just make the set unique like they did with the Gaussian buildup piece.
Either way I only have 1 toon that uses this set and I can easily regain the ranged def by moving one piece. The AoE might take some work though.
At any rate the only reason I am annoyed was due to the small fortune the pieces cost. I didn't see the IOs being any more OP than many others out there that Castle has come out and said aren't changing.
<sigh> Viv says its no longer "all me".
http://wendy-mags.mybrute.com/
Quote:
It has 6.25% rech which none of the melee damage sets have and some recovery. Most of the bonuses for 2-5 are useful.|
Originally Posted by Satanic_Hamster
Posi's blast is horrible; the bonuses are crap, it's acc is low, and it's damage is in no way ED compliant. And the 6th slot bonus and proc are bleh.
It's the Ghost Widow's Embrace of damage sets! __________________ Currently listening to the Dead Milkmen's Chaos Rules; Live at the Trocadero |
My habitual slotting is 5 of them + a rech, or Acc/dam and dam/rech, acc/dam/end and dam rech, 2 from posis, 2 from detonate with a recharge if I have the slot spare (and a force feedback proc if it's a scrap or tank's energy torrent).
The bonuses are not for everybody, which is why we need more sets, but I like them on many of my toons.
It's true. This game is NOT rocket surgery. - BillZBubba
The 6th slot bonus is an Abomination against God!
__________________
Currently listening to the Dead Milkmen's Death Rides a Pale Cow
Chief Hamster of the Fist of Justice / Shadows of Victory
Victory Server: Join Victory Forum for team forming and general game chat and IRC Chat: irc.hashmark.net #victory for offline chatting.
Rock, rock on Hamster.
Quote:
It was much better than any other defense bonuses out there. For only two slots, you were getting more ranged defense than the Steadfast unique gets you, and you can slot multiples of those. Luck of the Gambler +Recharge is harder to do that with, given its cost, and lower availability of defense sets. It also seems that it's been around long enough, and they're okay with the amount of barriers there are to things like perma-hasten, etc. Whereas BotZ was just too much compared to other defense sets.|
Originally Posted by Toril
I'm honestly surprised they didn't just make the set unique like they did with the Gaussian buildup piece.
Either way I only have 1 toon that uses this set and I can easily regain the ranged def by moving one piece. The AoE might take some work though. At any rate the only reason I am annoyed was due to the small fortune the pieces cost. I didn't see the IOs being any more OP than many others out there that Castle has come out and said aren't changing. |
I would agree that the set would have made a lot more sense as unique, but oh well.
*added*
Oh noes, Ham! That last set bonus stinks!
The set has other things going for it. The proc is in line with other procs (better than some, since it's all energy), and the accuracy bonus somewhat makes up for the lower accuracy the set affords. We just need more sets to choose from, or to have the other two targeted AOEs revamped.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
Quote:
This is why the change is a kick in the teeth to me. The current values on test IMO effect more players that used this set sparingly than it does the people that slotted 5 sets of them.|
Originally Posted by Minotaur
The only people I feel sorry for are those who spent thousands of merits buying these for a build, that is a very large time investment wasted.
|
And to get back the 3% ranged defense I'm losing I'll either have to sacrifice some of my 375% regen and/or 150% recharge or move a slot out of Hasten and put it into Tough and go after a Gladiator's armor. Neither is something I'm looking forward to doing, I'd hate to reinvest as much time and effort again just to have more bonus changes down the road.
I'll more than likely return to my "50 then forget em" style of play.
Who do I have to *&^% around here to get more Targeted AoE recipes added?
Arc Name: Tsoo In Love
Arc ID: 413575
Hmmmm, I would think there were less expensive ways to get 3% defense than a Gladiator recipe, EB. I'd have to look at your build to say, though. Probably not as dire as that, all the same.
I guess I am a little flabbergasted at how much people are taking this change to heart. Since IOs came out, they have only introduced more IOs, or buffed them. The only "nerfs" were for ones that were not working right anyway, like that Guassian's set, this BotZ thing, taunt sets not working right in auras, etc. The way people are talking, you would think nerfing these sets is par for the course... when it is extremely rare.
I know the two are technically different, but no one really complains when the addition of new sets or buffs requires respecing and rebuilding old builds... just the nerfs. Just a perspective issue, I know, but it might help those that are stinging about this more.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
Something about "too much" in terms of recharge is that it's self balanced by endurance costs. Pending on your build and overall recovery, you may be able to pull off the elusive "attack chain" but not every move in your arsenal will be a part of it. Theoretically, defense bonuses are "free" if you stack them so it's more of a balancing concern if obtaining them is too easy.
I sort of arched my eyebrows a month or so ago when Castle noted that they made a deliberate choice to promote defense over resistance but he feels in retrospect it might not have been the best choice. He also noted that it was obviously too late to make any sweeping changes to it. While I personally can't stand the RNG, it would seem like a no brainer in my eyes that the ability to get 100% mitigation to everything should have been harder than always getting hit but trying to survive it.
Quote:
There are other ways to get the 3% back, but I'd have to sacrifice too much in terms of regen, recharge or damage. The easiest way would be to move one slot out of Hasten bringing it to 124 seconds recharge and using that slot in Tough for the Gladiators armor unique. That would also require less respecs as opposed to some other options I've been looking at.
|
Originally Posted by Grey Pilgrim
Hmmmm, I would think there were less expensive ways to get 3% defense than a Gladiator recipe, EB. I'd have to look at your build to say, though. Probably not as dire as that, all the same.
I guess I am a little flabbergasted at how much people are taking this change to heart. Since IOs came out, they have only introduced more IOs, or buffed them. The only "nerfs" were for ones that were not working right anyway, like that Guassian's set, this BotZ thing, taunt sets not working right in auras, etc. The way people are talking, you would think nerfing these sets is par for the course... when it is extremely rare. I know the two are technically different, but no one really complains when the addition of new sets or buffs requires respecing and rebuilding old builds... just the nerfs. Just a perspective issue, I know, but it might help those that are stinging about this more. |
Who do I have to *&^% around here to get more Targeted AoE recipes added?
Arc Name: Tsoo In Love
Arc ID: 413575
Quote:
The problem with defense sets is mostly that there's no alternative to them. So the defense bonus sets go for huge prices, especially the ones that don't require heavy investment in slots; and non-defense recipes go for a song. It's a boon to characters that can get very close to softcap on powers alone, like a shield scrapper with Maneuvers; they have the leisure of choosing to emphasize other things. |
Originally Posted by Grey Pilgrim
Have to love these forums. You try to talk about the BotZ change logically, and people neg rep you. Tsk, tsk. (guessing this hapened on the big thread o'changes, not here).
|
I really don't have a problem with a blaster who slotted 5 sets of this and as a result sits at the ranged softcap. That blaster took 5 travel powers rather than attacks, and his build is probably gimped in other ways. Except, maybe, for mobility.
I would like to see resistance buffs in sets increased to the point where they're competitive; right now they're laughable. Regeneration is probably at a good place now, though it too is hardly competitive with defense. Other sorts of survivability need to be made competitive, so that they're viable alternatives to building for defense.
<《 New Colchis / Guides / Mission Architect 》>
"At what point do we say, 'You're mucking with our myths'?" - Harlan Ellison
I do wish they had more resist bonuses out there as well. If nothing else, just to provide more options.
Interesting post from Castle on this. I'm rather surprised as well... I thought for sure some kind of AT-based def cap might be in the works, since defense was over the top. *sighs* Wish they would plan things out a little better: I actually think varying def caps based on the AT would be a good idea for the game and its balance.
If nothing else, this should make some of you feel better about changes in the works. The devs do not want another snafu like the GDN or Enhancement Diversification, that's for sure. Text of the post if you don't want the link.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BurningChick 
I can't help but get the feeling that I5 or I7 should've brought in AT-based def caps based on mob ToHit values ... instead of some arbitrarily huge value.
Actually, you're right. I didn't know the system well enough at the time to argue that effectively, but it would definitely have been a better route to have followed.
That said, the GDN has already happened and isn't going to be repeated, so I live with the limitations imposed by that decision.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
The only build this is going to really affect for me is my rad/sonic Def. She's only 32, so it's not nearly as big a deal as if he was already IO'd out, but my plans were 4 of these things to get him over the range cap (AM, CJ, SJ, and SS). But, with these changes in mind, and after doing a little tweaking of my build, she'll fall to about 40.5% range def. However, what's been sacrificed in defense has helped either recharge ( a little) or cheapen the entire build (no more Apocs, whee).
So I'm not at range def anymore. You know what I'm going to do from now on (once she gets to 50, etc)? I'm going to bring a purple or two.
@Death Conqueror
-Goal for 2011: Survive, stay alive, and continue to thrive.
That works for me, too. Think I have all my Blasters at 30-35% to ranged or Smash/Lethal, and they are all set to being the equivalent of 3-4 heroes when they solo. I'll pop a purple when facing an EB or something like that, but it's not usually needed.
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
RE: 30 - 35 % Defense......
This is the range I shoot for for most everything that has even a smidge of defense already in the build. I've seen literally no difference in the amount of incoming damage versus the 2 characters that I have with 45+% defense (both VEATS, with a separate Bane and Hunts build, all of which generally have 55+%) while fighting up to +1 level mobs, Bosses included. Once -Def attacks actually hit, things can go south of course. I don't know the drop off, but I know at +2, the 30 - 40% range starts to get hit more often, but it's not like you just lost whatever defense you had. It's plenty survivable, regardless of solo or teamed.
Anyway, by only aiming for this preferred range, I save oodles of trouble/inf/time and am still able to mow through whatever I want, because I have the other bonuses that I want at a good level. For the few guys I run solo just for inf/drops, I use -1 to +1 level and usually 5 to 6 man spawns with ease, keeping in mind I'm trying to maximize my time spent/reward chance at what I consider an acceptable level. Characters that can kill faster get a different/higher mission setting, but I don't recall any that rely on defense to live.
As for BotZ, I think it was needed, though I'm not sure why they immediately went to half-stats, though that kind of is status quo for how the Devs have always handeled things here *shrug* As long as the crafting requirements go down, I see no problem with the changes and it goes back to being in-line with the majority of things. With the presumed lower price/demand changes that will hit the market, these will actually be more worthwhile for me in the end, I think.
I've already forgotten about most of you
Par for the course.
PenanceжTriage
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Grey Pilgrim
Hmmmm, I would think there were less expensive ways to get 3% defense than a Gladiator recipe, EB. I'd have to look at your build to say, though. Probably not as dire as that, all the same.
I guess I am a little flabbergasted at how much people are taking this change to heart. Since IOs came out, they have only introduced more IOs, or buffed them. The only "nerfs" were for ones that were not working right anyway, like that Guassian's set, this BotZ thing, taunt sets not working right in auras, etc. The way people are talking, you would think nerfing these sets is par for the course... when it is extremely rare. I know the two are technically different, but no one really complains when the addition of new sets or buffs requires respecing and rebuilding old builds... just the nerfs. Just a perspective issue, I know, but it might help those that are stinging about this more. |
2 things :
The addition of new sets doesn't cause for a complete respec of a character built with a certain theme or goal in mind. It just gives more and different options. Changing a piece to lower or remove a bonus does.
The 3% Def Steadfast piece is 3% to everything, its not just 3% to ranged. If 3 slotting this set was giving 1.25% to everything after the nerf I would be fine with it. It just gives to 2 things, and those 2 things are the more common to be able to get +def for. The AoE is just a pain to replace in my current build. I'll probably just rework and pickup tough and a steadfast unique to fix it if I really want the AoE back.
<sigh> Viv says its no longer "all me".
http://wendy-mags.mybrute.com/
Quote:
...holy ****. Howdy V! |
Originally Posted by Patient_V
Par for the course.
|
Luckily, the only two toons this really affected were the two that are still only mostly finished. My shield/fire tank and Ele (katana/regen) are the only ones really using them right now, but neither of them are standing in finalized builds, so this didn't really hurt. It sucks, sure, but it's not horrible. The tank will have a little less hp to fill the hole, and Ele will cry some more until I figure out how to fix him.
again
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
I hate to be the bringer of bad news... but Willpower sucks!!! you're better off rolling a regen
|
^Professional Katana/regen build thread
Tl;dr
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by minotaur
the bonuses are not for everybody
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by the_coming_storm
it was op. Justified nerf.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by cozmic
i've had just about enough nerfs from this game.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by pennypa
it was needed.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by enigmablack
this is ... A kick in the teeth to me.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by minotaur
the set was op
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by voodoocompany
i have an opinion.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by grey pilgrim
people neg rep you
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by satanic_hamster
abomination against god!
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by satanic_hamster
eh. Kinda saw this coming for a while.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by necrotech_master
the respec system needs to be revamped
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by minotaur
multiple freespecs would be good
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by zamuel
i ... Arched my eyebrows ... When castle noted
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by castle
actually, ... I didn't know the system ... But ... It ... Has already happened and isn't going to be repeated, so i live with ... Limitations
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by toril
i'm honestly surprised
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by elegost
ele will cry
|
Dusty Trophies
Nice, I joke about negative rep, and that's what gets pulled out by Ryxx. Gee, thanks. All my great reasoning elsewhere, and that's the sum total that gets pulled out. 
Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc: Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory
You have no room to talk. He's half me and look at what I got. >:[
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze
I hate to be the bringer of bad news... but Willpower sucks!!! you're better off rolling a regen
|
^Professional Katana/regen build thread
The set was OP. I never slotted any as I haven't tried to do a high defence squishy yet, and I'm not paying the necessary cash for my melee types for KB protection I don't need.
That said, there are some builds it screws up and this can lead to the reslotting of 30 IOs quite easily, so multiple freespecs would be good.
I can see a number of melee types that softcapped without weave resepecing into it and that will make a right mess of some builds.
I think the reason Castle went public was because some people in the beta leaked this out rather than make a vast profit themselves.
And to Sat Hamster, posi blast is fine, could just do with a couple of new sets for targeted AoE.
The only people I feel sorry for are those who spent thousands of merits buying these for a build, that is a very large time investment wasted.
It's true. This game is NOT rocket surgery. - BillZBubba