YOUR Dream Team.

Fixt

Regarding Unholy easily being the best stalker he wouldn't have needed M3z on a Dom for a set up. -Maximum and Zero were the best well rounded arena stalkers in pre i13 period. Max and I required no set up for our matches outside of setting up easy double ASes when we ran a bubbler MM. If things didn't go down as they did I can bet GMW had a very good chance of taking over on the i13 villian ladder, but as it was, the pvp was forever altered and we will never know. Please don't think I am trying to take away from how good Vori or Unholy was, but as best he maybe crack's top 4.

MAXIMUM BEST STALAKAR EVAR.

******* troll.

Click me

Click me

Not trolling.

You say this every time, yet the same debates still arise. You're obviously not ending them, but just adding your repetitious opinion on each and every one. I honestly don't understand why you continue to voice yourself in every debate if your opinion never changes, never matters, and never has any affect on the argument at hand.

I think it's pretty pointless for you to comment on any discussion regarding anything any longer because you are pretty irrelevant.

Dream team is best of all time, time being past and present. So in this case what someone did 3 years ago is very relevant and is very much so on topic different system or not.






Silit,

How did you watches all of Max's movment as stalker? Stalkers and blasters play absolutely nothing alike. As I can recall arena cam's don't have + perc and to my knowledge you didnt stand over Max's or Unholys shoulder so you can at best give an educated opinon based on how they played other classes. As this video points out, its near impossible to see whats going on unless you were there.

Vori vs Renegades


If Unholy was EASILY the best stalker, then Vori should have never lost peiod. Kills were 97% atained from successful Assassin Strike + Scourge in all of our officials before Forts were released because villians didn't have unresistable damage outside Assassin Strike. If Unholy was easily the best stalker the rest of Vori's range dmg couldn't keep up with his targeting and had issues with locking/spiking enough to overcome our kill count. Since I was the target caller for Renegades and I was on my stalker, I know how fast Max was on target better than anyone as we often ran a 2 stalker line up.




What official was that and when did they beat Vori and Ujl to challenge us? Screenshots matter when they are officials and its the core reason they are outlined as officials as apose to practices or kickballs. Considering your an old school player I would expect you to be able to tell the difference.

View me

I remember seeing this one actually, CoTD was very under-rated considering they were the best PvP VG to ever exist. They might not have had the best stalkers in the game, but the core of their team, the skill level, the pace was far superior than ANY other team in existence. Basically, as far as the #1 villain team to ever play.. Renewho?

You're right that my comments regarding movement on stalkers were assumptions at best. I find however, that there are very few one-trick ponies in the realm of CoH PvP. Good players generally could play anything, whether they actually did play it or not.

As someone who has played with both players in other offensive capacities, I've seen their lock speeds/movement - it seems strange that a player would have problems locking on a stalker when they lock faster than almost anyone I've ever played with on a blaster.

I don't think any dream team where all classes are playable would involve a stalker anyway. And the whole dream-team debacle is a pointless one anyway, as most of the ones posted are either blatant sarcasm or people picking players based on their feelings for the players.

My post-i13 dream team is, and probably will remain WARE.gov. The only things we're missing are HoJ and Z... and maybe a more active Vex.

Even if it wasn't my "Dream team" I'd still love playing with them all, because that's why I do - and that's all that matters.

Your critical analysis of VORI vs. The Renegades, as well as Unholy's ability to be on target is laughable at best. I've target called with Unholy off of Ventrilo before due to connection issues and he was able to naturally assume what target I was going to go for and was there for each spike on a Stalker.

As far as those VORI vs. Renegades matches go, in the case of M3z, you're aware that M3z wasn't setting up Assassin Strikes at all during those matches, correct? Unholy worked almost exclusively with Volund, which is evident by the fact that in one match, Volund was the individual that closed the kills on your team.

M3z acted as pure disruption, in that he drew ridiculous amount of attention from teams while focusing on 1-2 targets when Domination was up. I'm also fairly certain that being perma-caged would not have afforded M3z the luxury of being able to capably set up AS spikes. However, the kills pulled on your team were off of ASes that Unholy snagged by predicting the movement of your team, with either Volund, Squish, or h0j following up.

If you think I don't know, I do. I played in those officials. I specifically remember your evasion tactic for Penny: fly pack to the top of the map because she was absolutely atrocious.

While I appreciate the underhanded tone that you and the rest of the Renegades have taken over the years regarding the officials against VORI, and VORI in general, and while I think it's cute that you will in one hand laud VORI as a capable villain SG while inserting yourselves into any discussion involving them whatsoever, reminding people that you guys did it best, please remember that VORI was a group of 14 year olds who screamed at eachother for 10 minutes straight on Ventrilo back when they unseated the FoL from the top spot.

In regards to your claim that 97% of villain kills in PvP were attained off of Assassin Strike, maybe for the Renegades that's the case, but having practiced and played with VORI in practices and officials for so long, I can assure you that the ridiculous amount of talented Masterminds and Corruptors garnered us more kills in matches than anything else.

Unholy being the best Stalker in the game doesn't account for the efforts of an entire team. There were plenty of critical players missing from our line-up for those officials, and we threw together who we had to in order to honor those matches. You're delusional if you're resting the successes or failures of a group on one player and one player alone.

@Vince

What are you talking about? Screenshots of a team beating another are totally relevant to a single player's offensive capability. MaXimum was the best.

I like how you downplay the wins by stating that they were 14 and were unruly on vent. Then at the same time talk about the ridiculous amounts of skill that they had.

Secondly the kills I refereed too were strictly in matches of Ren vs Vori. Vori didn't play the Poison/Thug MM+ Corr lineup in our officials. Renegades had gotten too comfortable beating it reliably in our practices against one another after about our 4-5 week of practice together or you guys got bans/got grounded by your parents for bad grades and couldn't play. Whatever makes you sleep better.

What I think upsets you is as talented as you and your friends all were, you still lost to a bunch of blue collar working part time players. Some of us being easy farm targets and easily flustered with loud obnoxious drunks that didn't always show up. We had core players get called away to serve over seas and issues of our own as does every roster so you will have to excuse me if I don't feel pity. We had some very skilled players, and we had some average players. We also played who we had available IE Penny.


Lately Vinnie you have run around the forums beating your chest and picking arguments over stupid things..... a banner font? REALLY?!?! Perhaps it is because you and I both know you have no competition for this league and currently in the game. Outside of yourselves every team has a variety of skill from kickballer/zoners to old rusty arena pvp players such as myself sprinkled in. Ware mocks the very purpose of the league while flashing kills of 40-0 and talking down to everyone, but you do that to garner interest in arena pvp and competition right? At this point I am done posting in this thread, I though Silit had closed our discussion nicely in his previous post stating,

" the whole dream-team debacle is a pointless one anyway, as most of the ones posted are either blatant sarcasm or people picking players based on their feelings for the players."

You suck. Just stop it.

Originally Posted by Black_Barrier Guess it's hard to click while actively trying to keep the drool away from the keyboard...

Notice that I said that the playerbase of VORI was 14 at the time that they played FoL. Were you in FoL? Reading comprehension isn't your strong suit.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. You speak with a level of humility and respect regarding a team until someone counters your argument with valid facts regarding officials. As soon as that happens, you come right out of your face and start talking incessant loads of ****. Are you blind? Did you even watch the video of the official that you linked? The entire line-up for the #1 Defense match was the exact same as the line-up we ran when we fought you guys again for the #1 spot, with only ONE stalker. What else do you see? A Poison and a **** load of Corruptors. Are you feigning ignorance to supplement your poor attitude?

You're making the grand assumption that I'm upset about anything to begin with. It was the membership of your group that constantly and consistently flew off the handle on the forums the moment that VORI was ever mentioned in a positive light (which was practically never, but you guys were the "Bad Boys of PvP" rofl). The only thing that anyone ever got frustrated about regarding those officials was that Pub never got the chance to play, we literally had everyone there that we wanted to play with in those matches save for Pub, and that's it. And it wasn't even a matter of thinking that the matches would have gone differently with Pub, it was a matter of Pub being absolutely hilarious to have on vent during officials. You're missing the entire point of why I brought up players missing to begin with. Whatever your blue collar job is, Kurgain, it can't involve reading. Because you'd be fired on the spot if your job relied on you making accurate assertions based on context.

Also, if you're using the term "blue collar part time players" as a way of saying that the Renegades didn't take the game seriously, you are so far outside of your mind that it's unbelievable. You were in game farming and on test more than anyone else that I knew. Be real, please.

I can't even take this comment seriously from you. You used to follow me around on the forums calling me Chris Crocker, of all people, and there was literally no one that thought that was even a worthy troll's effort.

Meanwhile, while you were doing that, if I was on Whirligig vent you were asking for permission to come into whatever channel that I was in in order to talk.

Perhaps.

Have you read our mission statement? Hold on, let me help you out:

Do you think that's a joke? Silit and Spiner are Scrappers from Protector; Dex is the random sonic blaster from Freedom that got his start kickballing; Vex was/is a premiere griefer who got his start on Pinnacle; Liberty had more relevance running the ITF on Infinity until dUmb picked him up, and Peril is so old that Penance is his favorite PvP team. The claim that I have been and still am a Roleplayer isn't an inaccurate one; every time that I return to the game I normally do it to casually PvE and RP. I was an avid RPer (like Spec) before I was a PvPer.

So if any team has a "variety of skill" that is being brought to the table, it's us.

Also, regarding competition, let's be frank: While the VORI/Renegades matches were highly competitive, the level of competition beyond that was practically non-existent. And while I can appreciate the pride your SG takes in its accomplishments, let's not try to act like you had 15 teams on the Villain ladder vying for the top spot at any time. There is a reason why the Villain ladder was referred to as the "WNBA". I loved Villain PvP as much as the next person, I really did, but if you're going to try and imply that it's wrong for my team to feel a level of pride for their capabilities, you're downplaying your accomplishments far worse.

The purpose of this league was/is for experienced players and arena enthusiasts to enter a league and engage in organized matches with the active playerbase that still enjoys PvP. It was not to generate new interest in the arena (as the Freedom league's intention was the year prior) - this is evident by the fact that we are not enforcing a rule in which we must play every player active and on the roster if they are available come time for officials. This is also evident by the fact that teams did not have to continue drafting until everyone had been selected.

If we are mocking the purpose of generating organized PvP matches, explain how and why we are constantly speaking with team leaders in order to get them to do practice matches during the week? Explain to how and why we lend our support and offense players to other teams in order to round out their experience while supplementing another team's line-up in order to keep matches moving smoothly?

We were the first team to start asking for practice matches, and we are consistently seeking out other teams for matches. We're the only team in the league asking for 20 minute matches, and we are the only team that is willing to go beyond an 8v8 for the sake of enjoyment. If that is mocking the purpose of what this league is intending to do, please explain what isn't. I would be more than welcome to read your expert opinion on such things, oh wise "blue collar" PvPer.

@Vince

Yes it's a joke and it's completely disingenuous as usual. You really expect people to evaluate Spiner based on the scrapper he played years ago at the start of pvp, just to point to one example? Take the people on your team and make a tally of their involvement in pvp leagues, ladders, etc. and compare it to the other teams. It isn't hard to do. It's hilarious how you guys are railing on other people as horribly bad one moment, then painting yourselves as the rusty little team that could in the next breath lol. Please keep it up.

As for the mocking--it's all there on your guildportal page. It's in the lulzy mission statement, the recap of the matches, etc. As for constantly asking for matches--lol you have to. A lot of the players involved would rather not waste their free time practicing with..well, I should specifically say people like you. I think you and a few others pretty much sour things for the rest of your team because you can't be civil, or even reasonable. It's understandable that people don't want to waste their free time on something like that.

Vinnie, please quit rap battling and whatever performance art it is you do and promptly become a lawyer. Your real talent is putting tortured spin on the obvious.

Speak for yourself. The only people that don't want to practice with WARE are shitties that don't want to get better or destroyed. Oh man they talk **** for fun! Who cares, it's a ******* video game.

Spiner had what notable team experience prior to usedtobegood in last year's league? Spiner was an accomplished Rad/Psy duelist years ago, that's it. He didn't have experience as a high end PvP emp until he randomly decided to try it out last year, only to reveal that his abilities exceeded that of noteworthy alpha emps before him.

Who did Klesk play for? Mediocre? When I came back to the game, the running joke was that Sneaky and Klesk were considered "good" emps. Outside of that one team, what test level experience did he have? What about Dex? Vex? The spread of experience that we have is comparable with a lot of other teams that are playing. As far as rustiness goes, there are plenty of people active in this league currently that played in the last league on Champion. I tried to put WARE together for that league and was subsequently denied. Many of the players in WARE re-upped their accounts for the sole purpose of playing in this Freedom league, and haven't played in a few months, up to a year and a half at the most. With at least 3 leagues having taken place in that time, that's plenty of "experience" for players to get.

People using "attitude" as a reason to not practice with other teams has been a long standing excuse. Acting like **** talking hasn't existed on test server or in competitive PvP since i4 is what's really disingenuous. My **** talking didn't run teams off then, it doesn't run them off now. Large margin score differentials are the real problem that people have trouble confronting. **** talk is fun, but I've always been open to helping teams out and making suggestions to them on play style tactics. But if people can't handle **** talk, competition in general just isn't for them. In games with a higher concentration of players, it gets much much worse.

While we may openly clown on Shu in our roster kill tally, he has asked me questions about playing Rad and I have answered him without hesitation. Even CriticalKat used to ask me for advice on PvP while her and I were engaging in flame-fests on the forums.

This discussion doesn't even involve you, yet here you are. You're doing exactly what you crawled up my *** for doing in the other thread regarding Peril's banner and site layout. It's endearing, really.

@Vince