City of Heroes: Live Forum Archive

How does elec rank now?

anachrodragon

By anachrodragon,
Posted on: 2009-09-16 22:10 in Brutes

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Smurphy View Post
I find the whole notion of tiers laughable.
I agree with you. Mostly people that have the sets claimed best, say they are. I've seen all of those do great in severe, SEVERE situations. I think they're all good in the right hands and with someone who plays passionately and not robotic-like with all the numbers sucking the fun out of it. From my experience all mmos, it's those people that play the worst, and people who just play for what all intents and purposes games are made for, rise high high above them all.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodFairy View Post
I agree with you. Mostly people that have the sets claimed best, say they are. I've seen all of those do great in severe, SEVERE situations. I think they're all good in the right hands and with someone who plays passionately and not robotic-like with all the numbers sucking the fun out of it. From my experience all mmos, it's those people that play the worst, and people who just play for what all intents and purposes games are made for, rise high high above them all.
I LOVE the way you think.

Words to the wise aren't necessary- it's the stupid ones that need them.

"You're right...I forgot...being constantly at or the near the damage cap is a big turn off. Definitely not worth it."
- Vitality

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rock_Crag View Post
I might bump Invuln down to the top of Tier 2, and Dark Armor down with EA on the bottom. But yeah, that's pretty much the jist of it. lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba View Post
SR gets very silly with IOs. Once soft-capped and backed by tough which stacks on the S/L portion of the passive scaling dam-res and juiced up with HP and Regen, yea, it ranks high.

But it takes a lot of "work" to get there. Add in Aid Self and you become functionally immortal.
Ok, so SR is in top tier after some work, yet invuln is in tier 2 and, dark is on bottom!!!

If your doing it in terms of when you put work and inf into it then, in terms of survivability, the tier probally fits better as all but fire and energy in the top tier IMHO

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ideon View Post
  • Top Tier: Invulnerability, Shield Defense, Stone Armor, Super Reflexes, Willpower
  • Middle Tier: Dark Armor, Electric Armor, Fiery Aura
  • Bottom Tier: Energy Aura
Or something like that, haha
I would move stone down to the a tier three if you wanted to be silly and rate them in tiers... it has limited usefullnessand is a one trick pony (good if you are doing an lrsf or anything that doesn't need lots of moving), you need to have a kin to be able to keep up with a halfway decent team and it is laughable in PVP.

Triumph
Gavalin Kingsbury LVL 50 INV/SS Tank and 26 other LVL 50 heroes and villians (all Triumph)
Heroes of Justice and Liberty/Loved or Loathed
"NCSOFT doesn't fork for anyone but they might spoon you if they like you"

 

Posted

I received the following negative rep for my post above:

Quote:
They aren't all mitigation sets, and there isn't one clear metric to rank them by. You should know better.
1: All brute, scrapper and stalker secondaries and tank primaries are mitigation sets. That is their purpose. To mitigate damage. That's why they have powers that reduce damage, or deflect damage, or dodge damage, or heal back damage, and in some cases, to provide the player more damage so that they can kill enemies faster so that they receive less damage.

2: There IS a clear metric in determining a set's worth. You throw X amount of enemies at it over Y time. If all the sets keep the character alive in an equitable manner, then all the sets are balanced. If one set shows an inferior level of performance over time, then it is an inferior set and should probably be buffed. If another set shows an out of the norm level of superiority over time, it should probably be knocked down a peg or two.

3: Since the devs have said nothing to the contrary, we are supposed to be viewing all the mitigation sets built around the powers available to us in game and slotted with SOs. That becomes our baseline. Utilizing that baseline against point 2 gives us the information we need to determine a set's worth.

Be well, people of CoH.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kingsbury View Post
I would move stone down to the a tier three if you wanted to be silly and rate them in tiers... it has limited usefullnessand is a one trick pony (good if you are doing an lrsf or anything that doesn't need lots of moving), you need to have a kin to be able to keep up with a halfway decent team and it is laughable in PVP.
Two things:

1. There's this travel power called "Teleport." Very useful for Stone, look into it.

2. People still PvP in CoH?

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouded View Post
Two things:

1. There's this travel power called "Teleport." Very useful for Stone, look into it.

2. People still PvP in CoH?
1. I'm sure that they are aware of the existence of Teleportation.

2. Just because you don't PVP, doesn't mean everybody else has followed suite.

"They've got us surrounded again, the poor bastards." - General Creighton W. Abrams

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Comeuppance View Post
1. I'm sure that they are aware of the existence of Teleportation.

2. Just because you don't PVP, doesn't mean everybody else has followed suite.
1. According to their first post, they haven't heard of TP.

2. Who cares?

 

Posted

For my part, I've just started playing a Brute (Mace/Elec) and I'm having a hard time understanding why Electric Armor was considered so strong. Maybe I'm too used to Tankers, but my Scrapper doesn't seem to have as much trouble as my Brute does. Werewolves are doing enough damage to defeat me in three hits (at L10), so I'm left to wonder what I'm missing.

 

Posted

You are level 10. On TOs there aren't any good armour sets.

As for tiering the brute secondaries... I'm not sure it's possible. Mostly because... well, what are we comparing them against?

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaosExMachina View Post
Or how do each or the armors rank for that matter?
Here is how I would rank the sets that I have played (I haven't leveled up SD or SR yet)

With just SO's or common IO's:
Stone Armor
Willpower
Invulnerability
Fiery Aura
Dark Armor
Energy Aura
Electric Armor

With IO sets:
Stone Armor
Energy Aura
Willpower
Invulnerability
Electric Armor
Fiery Aura
Dark Armor

I am sure SD and SR rank some where in there, but I haven't leveled either very far yet. As for how I ranked the others, that is just my opinion and from personal play experience. I am sure my impression was also colored by my primary choice as well.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Siolfir View Post
Personally, I discount Shields as a top tier set since I don't feel like spending more on a Shields Brute than on all of my other characters combined in order to get it from what I consider "worst survivability evar" to near best. Sure, if you spend enough inf to provide +25% defense to all 3 positions and perma-Hasten-level recharge so you have enough defense debuff resistance to hold onto that softcap you'll do okay, but when a Willpower with Tough and Weave, using 4 Reactive Armors in the resistance toggles and ED-limited defense slotting in the defense toggles can get the same or better survivability it seems a complete and total waste of inf.
Except people don't take /Shield because they want survivability. They take it because they can get near Willpower survivability with a +dmg aura and Shield Charge, not to mention a better taunt aura for better aggro management.

It would be better to compare the sets to each other based on what they are intended for. For instance. compare elec and dark because they are both exotic type armors with some extra dmg. or shields and fire because they offensive type sets that give up direct mitigation for indirect (extra dmg).

Level 50s: to many to remember at this point

 

Posted

For what their supposed to be good at or what people actually use them for?

Pinnacle
Arch light L50 INV/SS
Psiberia L50 Kin/Psi
Screaming Mentallica L50 Sonic/MM

Infinity
Arc Voltinator L50 SS/Elec
Mind Fire Kinesis L50 Fire/Kin
Flaming Screamer L50 Fire/Sonic

 

Posted

I have a level 39 elec/elec brute and I have no problems with it. I'm running +1/+2 and having no problems with anything. I didn't take lightning field b/c I don't find it useful. I tried elec/elec before the change from conserve power to energize and hated it b/c of having to take the medicine pool for self heal. I also take the fighting pool on every brute. I'll post my build when I finish it b/c it's a work in progress.

we can't run from who we are, our destiny chooses us.
The Furioso Family has moved to Virtue

global @Enrico Furioso
Enrico Furioso Level 50 DP/Rad Corr

 

Posted

so here's my build:

Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Lightning in Veins: Level 50 Mutation Brute
Primary Power Set: Electrical Melee
Secondary Power Set: Electric Armor
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Fighting
Ancillary Pool: Mu Mastery

Villain Profile:
------------
Level 1: Havoc Punch FtnHyp-Sleep/EndRdx(A), FtnHyp-Acc/Rchg(15), FtnHyp-Acc/Sleep/Rchg(17), FtnHyp-Sleep/Rchg(23), FtnHyp-Sleep(23), Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 1: Charged Armor ImpArm-ResPsi(A), ImpArm-ResDam(5), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 2: Jacobs Ladder Sciroc-Dam%(A), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(3), Sciroc-Acc/Rchg(3), Sciroc-Dmg/Rchg(13), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(13)
Level 4: Conductive Shield S'fstPrt-ResKB(A), S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(5), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(31)
Level 6: Hasten RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(7), RechRdx-I(7)
Level 8: Thunder Strike FrcFbk-Rechg%(A), Erad-%Dam(9), Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(9), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(11), Erad-Dmg(11), Armgdn-Dam%(43)
Level 10: Static Shield ImpSkn-Status(A), ImpSkn-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(15), ImpSkn-ResDam/Rchg(31)
Level 12: Swift Run-I(A)
Level 14: Health Heal-I(A)
Level 16: Grounded Aegis-Psi/Status(A), Aegis-ResDam(17)
Level 18: Chain Induction C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(19), C'ngImp-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(19), C'ngImp-Dmg/Rchg(25), C'ngImp-Dmg/EndRdx(25)
Level 20: Stamina P'Shift-End%(A), EndMod-I(21), EndMod-I(21)
Level 22: Lightning Reflexes Run-I(A)
Level 24: Build Up AdjTgt-Rchg(A), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx(27), AdjTgt-EndRdx/Rchg(34), AdjTgt-ToHit/Rchg(39), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 26: Boxing Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(A), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(27), Stpfy-Acc/EndRdx(39), Stpfy-EndRdx/Stun(45), Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(45)
Level 28: Energize Dct'dW-Rchg(A), Dct'dW-Heal(29), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(29), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(34), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(37)
Level 30: Tough ImpArm-ResPsi(A), ImpArm-ResDam(31), ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 32: Lightning Rod Oblit-%Dam(A), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(33), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(33), Oblit-Dmg(34), FrcFbk-Rechg%(40)
Level 35: Power Sink Efficacy-EndMod/EndRdx(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc(36), Efficacy-Acc/Rchg(36), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(36), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg(37), Efficacy-EndMod(37)
Level 38: Power Surge ResDam-I(A), RechRdx-I(39)
Level 41: Mu Lightning Entrpc-Heal%(A), Entrpc-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(42), Entrpc-Dmg/Rchg(42), Entrpc-Dmg/EndRdx(42), Entrpc-Acc/Dmg(43)
Level 44: Ball Lightning Posi-Dam%(A), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(45), Posi-Dmg/Rng(46), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(46), Posi-Acc/Dmg(46)
Level 47: Summon Striker C'Arms-+Def(Pets)(A), C'Arms-EndRdx/Dmg/Rchg(48), C'Arms-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(48), C'Arms-Acc/Rchg(48)
Level 49: Weave LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(50), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl Mako-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A)
Level 1: Sprint Clrty-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Fury

we can't run from who we are, our destiny chooses us.
The Furioso Family has moved to Virtue

global @Enrico Furioso
Enrico Furioso Level 50 DP/Rad Corr

 

Posted

I still say elec ranks kind of low. But thats only because the heal comes so late in the build. At that point the character just isnt worth playing anymore. I cant see myself struggling for 28 levels just to be playable. Its almost as bad as how regen used to be in the begining. 28 levels of being practically naked is how it used to be for regen. In this case the amount of damage being done on villainside is alot more than heroes, npcs are much harder.

Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator

Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!

 

Posted

I did not have issues with Elec before the change, I'm not having issues now. It's probably on-par with Invuln I'd say.

@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilRyu View Post
I still say elec ranks kind of low. But thats only because the heal comes so late in the build. At that point the character just isnt worth playing anymore. I cant see myself struggling for 28 levels just to be playable. Its almost as bad as how regen used to be in the begining. 28 levels of being practically naked is how it used to be for regen. In this case the amount of damage being done on villainside is alot more than heroes, npcs are much harder.
Huh? /Elec was playable before the heal, why is it so hard now? Electric Armor is anything but naked. This coming from someone who played a primary with no mitigation.

50 SM/WP Brute - D Block
50 FM/ELA Brute - Raging Daemon
50 Acher/MM Blaster - Dark Reiver
50 FM/SD - Firestorm Brigade

You were right to fear me...

 

Posted

ElA has and will be competent at most tasks. With a high-end build, certain sets will outperform others - especially defense sets, which are able to soft-cap themselves to maximize survivability. ElA maintains superior endurance management tools allowing a player to burn through endurance at a rate that most builds cannot handle. It also offers some more unusual resistances to end drain and psi that many sets do not offer.

In short, it would be very difficult to rank the armor sets once you begin considering invention sets. For example, for some builds recharge actually becomes the primary factor for survivability. This is shown especially for Fire's healing flames, though also being able to spam footstomp is especially effective at drastically increasing survivability.

I have three ElA brutes. Elec/Elec, SS/Elec and DM/Elec. Of them, my SS/Elec is often the most survivable, but there are situations in this game that none of my builds can effectively handle. This is because every build has its weakness. Try taking a soft-capped SR, SD, or Inv against the demon map if it spawns the map with psi and cold damage. Try taking a WP against a spawn filled with longbow with -regen. Try taking a fire against Rikti with Fire's 30% energy resistance. What it comes down to is which build has the best survivability against content that is available in game. That answer is highly debatable.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonality View Post
ElA has and will be competent at most tasks. With a high-end build, certain sets will outperform others - especially defense sets, which are able to soft-cap themselves to maximize survivability. ElA maintains superior endurance management tools allowing a player to burn through endurance at a rate that most builds cannot handle. It also offers some more unusual resistances to end drain and psi that many sets do not offer.

In short, it would be very difficult to rank the armor sets once you begin considering invention sets. For example, for some builds recharge actually becomes the primary factor for survivability. This is shown especially for Fire's healing flames, though also being able to spam footstomp is especially effective at drastically increasing survivability.

I have three ElA brutes. Elec/Elec, SS/Elec and DM/Elec. Of them, my SS/Elec is often the most survivable, but there are situations in this game that none of my builds can effectively handle. This is because every build has its weakness. Try taking a soft-capped SR, SD, or Inv against the demon map if it spawns the map with psi and cold damage. Try taking a WP against a spawn filled with longbow with -regen. Try taking a fire against Rikti with Fire's 30% energy resistance. What it comes down to is which build has the best survivability against content that is available in game. That answer is highly debatable.
I was about to voice my opinion on the topic, but then Tonality did it for me

 

Posted

I finally got around to respeccing my elec/elec Brute into Energize. I also used this respec to move from basic IOs to IO sets, emphasizing a mix of Def and Rch. So, good news/bad news. Good news is this is a whole new brute, far stronger. Bad news is, I can't speak to what's due to energize and what's due to new bonuses. Still, it's apparent that Energize is a big plus.

Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyro_Master_NA View Post
I was about to voice my opinion on the topic, but then Tonality did it for me
Pretty much what Tonality said.

Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by OnimusPrime View Post
Huh? /Elec was playable before the heal, why is it so hard now? Electric Armor is anything but naked. This coming from someone who played a primary with no mitigation.
Actually it wasnt, I had to get aid self just to make the set playable for me prior to this change.

Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator

Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!

 

Posted

From my experience (and patching in some theory where experience ends) I would rate the sets thusly:

Pure Mitigation, SO Potential:
1 Stone Armour
2 Willpower, Dark Armour
3 SR, Invuln, Shield
4 Fire, ElA
...
5 EA


For Pure Mitigation, Max IO Potential:
1 SR, Dark, WP
2 Invuln, Shield, Fire, ElA
3 Stone, EA

Now, there are obviously other factors in those rankings. Stone has fantastic survivability in Granite, but you have to deal with fairly large penalties. Dark can theoretically obtain the highest damage mitigation in the game, but Endurance is a major limiting factor. Fire and Elec trade off some durability for increased offensive options. Etc etc.


All things considered, 'Best' is highly subjective. Instead of asking what is 'best', define what you want out of your brute and then ask "What is best, for me?"

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Weatherby Goode View Post
For Pure Mitigation, Max IO Potential:
1 SR, Dark, WP
2 Invuln, Shield, Fire, ElA
3 Stone, EA
Would that tier change in these circumstances?

1) Rularru (there are a few maps redside)
2) +4x8 Longbow spawns
3) Eldersnakes

edit: I know EA wouldn't budge in 1 and 3. Poor EA facing AoE toxic damage and to-hit buffs.