The Unofficial Powerset Revamp Suggestion Box
By
AquaJAWS,
Posted on: 2009-08-10 12:16 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
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Originally Posted by DechsKaison
Mercs.
Reduce recharge on SpecOps debuffs/control. |
And improve Serum. Seriously, the most complaint about Merc is the inconsistent controls from spec-ops. Merc trades defense and resistance (Robots get more resistance types + defense from Protector bots) for extra controls from Spec-Op. On paper, it looks cool but the super long recharge on Flashbang (120s) and Tear Gas (180s) make it very "unreliable" because you can't tell Spec-Ops when to use those two powers. For example, the battle lasts 2mins and your spec-ops use aoe control on a runner so in your next fight, spec-ops have no aoe controls to start the fight. That's how unreliable their controls are.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
Defender Vigilance: Turn it into a power that reduces endurance cost the more people who are on the team, and in the other direction boosts damage the fewer people there are on the team. Most of the damage boost coming while solo ( the flavor text could be "When operating solo, you no longer need to concentrate on the welfare of teamates and can concentrate more power into your attacks" ). So when solo you can actually kill things; but in groups Defenders won't be overpowered.
Time Bomb : Turn it into a Remote Detonator; when you set the bomb clicking the power again will detonate it. Probably it would need to be reduced in power for balance, but having a power that's actually useful would be better than a stronger one that isn't.
Arc #40529 : The Furies of the Earth
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That's a fantastic idea - I could get behind that.|
Originally Posted by Obscure_Blade
Defender Vigilance: Turn it into a power that reduces endurance cost the more people who are on the team, and in the other direction boosts damage the fewer people there are on the team. Most of the damage boost coming while solo ( the flavor text could be "When operating solo, you no longer need to concentrate on the welfare of teamates and can concentrate more power into your attacks" ). So when solo you can actually kill things; but in groups Defenders won't be overpowered.
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Then they just need to change the PB/WS inherent to buff the team (within a certain radius) as well as the Kheldian and we're good to go.
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This, but still keep it tied to the team's HP. More %HP, less End Discount, more damage buff (a moderate boost, to just barely below Corrupter base while at maximum) Less %HP, less damage buff, more End discount. This way, it gives the defender an incentive to keep the team at full health and to use his secondary when they're there.|
Originally Posted by Obscure_Blade
Defender Vigilance: Turn it into a power that reduces endurance cost the more people who are on the team, and in the other direction boosts damage the fewer people there are on the team. Most of the damage boost coming while solo ( the flavor text could be "When operating solo, you no longer need to concentrate on the welfare of teamates and can concentrate more power into your attacks" ). So when solo you can actually kill things; but in groups Defenders won't be overpowered.
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They still don't really have any damage advantage over Corrupters, as they never get crits, and they solo a good deal better. (as the current formulas have the team always at full if you're solo.)
And you don't have to change any of the existing Vigilance formulas that way, less coding! (I didn't say no coding, just less)
All that is planned fails. All that is born dies.
All that is built crumbles. This will always be true.
But memories remain, And that is beautiful.
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/signed|
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
/Devices
Trip mine - Cut animation time down to 1 sec. Time Bomb - Cut animation time down to 1 second and allow the caster to set the delay from 4 - 15 additional seconds. Gun Drone - Cut animation time down to 1 second. Make it a permanent pet that doesn't expire unless destroyed. ALL SNIPES - Reduce the interrupt to 1 second. |
Should be able to just fire (drop) and forget the bombs. Press the arm button and drop. Suddenly, Devices is an excellent set, what the heck!
-Set Fix Suggestions-
Blaster: Electrical Blast, Devices (As per Mila's suggestions)
Controller: Gravity Control
Scrapper: Fiery Aura
Tanker: Fiery Aura
Brute: Fiery Aura
Dominator: Gravity Control
I suggest the Devs Balance the defence powers for tankers.
Check out all the build the "Power Gamers" are talking about and you'll see certain armor types NEVER talked about.
Even if your not a power gamer and don't slot purples or even IO Sets. No one that plans on tanking the higher end (40-50) and have done any amount of research at all would consider Dark Armor, Ice Armor,Fire Armor etc. no one would would want to sacrifice a DPS slot on their team for a second or third healer.
And what's with all the melee attacks in the blasters secondary?
Blasters are the Wizards of other MMO's and in other MMO's I dont see too many getting into melee as a desired effect. All be it, at low levels it sometimes comes in handy and perhaps getting 1 melee attack might be good for IO sets or whatever but 4-5 attacks? They are very useful if ya intend to get all your debt badges by lvl 30.
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I would, as long as the person knows what they're doing. All three of those can be *immensely* powerful in the right hands.|
Originally Posted by Blueraven
No one that plans on tanking the higher end (40-50) and have done any amount of research at all would consider Dark Armor, Ice Armor,Fire Armor etc. no one would would want to sacrifice a DPS slot on their team for a second or third healer.
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And what's more, I would do it without even a first "healer".
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| Blasters are the Wizards of other MMO's and in other MMO's I dont see too many getting into melee as a desired effect. All be it, at low levels it sometimes comes in handy and perhaps getting 1 melee attack might be good for IO sets or whatever but 4-5 attacks? They are very useful if ya intend to get all your debt badges by lvl 30. |
On topic...as much as I love my Mercs/Poison MM, I would like to see both Serum and Poison Gas Trap looked at. But that's only a couple powers. There's really no entire powerset that I think needs revamped. A couple powers here and there...but that's it.
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The last word in this quote pretty much sums up the tone of the whole post. Ignorance. There's no such thing as a healer in this game, there are defenders/controllers. And, in a team setting, most defenders and controllers would probably be doing more damage than a so called DPS class (indirectly through Buffs/Debuffs) anyway, so even if those tanks did need another defender, you're hardly losing out.|
Originally Posted by Blueraven
I suggest the Devs Balance the defence powers for tankers.
Check out all the build the "Power Gamers" are talking about and you'll see certain armor types NEVER talked about. Even if your not a power gamer and don't slot purples or even IO Sets. No one that plans on tanking the higher end (40-50) and have done any amount of research at all would consider Dark Armor, Ice Armor,Fire Armor etc. no one would would want to sacrifice a DPS slot on their team for a second or third healer. |
However, they don't need another defender. If the players know what they're doing, then they can tank anything in the game. I've been in plenty of groups where we've had a Stone or Inv tank, had them leave, replaced them with a Dark, or Ice or Fire, and done far better. Now, it might be true that it's easier to be good on Stone, but that doesn't mean for an instant that the others are bad.
Fire is also a good source of damage, particularly when partnered with /Fire - a F/F/Pyre Tank is an awesome AE damage dealer.
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And what's with all the melee attacks in the blasters secondary? Blasters are the Wizards of other MMO's and in other MMO's I dont see too many getting into melee as a desired effect. All be it, at low levels it sometimes comes in handy and perhaps getting 1 melee attack might be good for IO sets or whatever but 4-5 attacks? They are very useful if ya intend to get all your debt badges by lvl 30. |
Trick Arrow :
To me Trick Arrow falls a little short of other debuff sets, especially vs AVs. I'd like the following adjustments, most of which are based on TAs ability to stack debuffs on their enemies. I won't mention fixing Oil Slick cos that's a given (oops, too late).
Acid Arrow : Allow to self-stack. This would add to the overall feel of Trick Arrow being the "stacking effects" debuff set. Would be very handy and make TAs more useful in AV fights in terms of being able to debuff Resistance. In standard PvE it wouldn't overpower the set really as most fights will be over before stacking can happen.
Poison Gas Arrow : Add a Regen Debuff of around 100. Also allow the debuffs to self-stack as with Acid Arrow.
Disruption Arrow : Add a Regen debuff of 100.
Taken together these would give TA even more of an active "stacked debuffs" feel and make them closer with Rad and Dark Miasma in terms of usefulness in AV fights, without giving them the same sort of -Regen as Rad and Dark off the bat (you'd have to be stacking over time to get close to them).
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You have no clue what you're talking about. Ice Armor has been in and out of FotM status for just about forever. It has the most potent taunt auras available to tankers, and can readily maintain agro without ever touching taunt, as well as survive that agro. Dark Armor has always been known as one of the most survivable scrapper sets, and retains its high survivability as a tanker set. In fact I believe the quote on that is "Dark Armor sacrifices your endurance bar on the altar of survivability... but it gives you the survivability." And with IOs to fix the endurance drain issues and lack of KB protection, the only armor that does better at surviving is Granite. And even Granite has a Psy hole. Fiery Aura has issues with tanking, yes, but the devs themselves stated that Fiery Aura was made more as a "scranker" set. Fiery Aura gives up defensive prowess to be an offensive powerhouse among tanks.
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Originally Posted by Blueraven
Even if your not a power gamer and don't slot purples or even IO Sets. No one that plans on tanking the higher end (40-50) and have done any amount of research at all would consider Dark Armor, Ice Armor,Fire Armor etc. no one would would want to sacrifice a DPS slot on their team for a second or third healer.
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Originally Posted by Back Alley Brawler
Did you just use "casual gamer" and "purpled-out warshade" in the same sentence?
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Or if you intend to mezz and then CRUSH THE SKULLS OF anybody who tries pulling melee on you. Seriously, my /energy and /elec blappers have ridiculous survivability. If it can be knocked back or stunned, it is not winning a close combat fight with me without backup. Period.
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Originally Posted by Blueraven
And what's with all the melee attacks in the blasters secondary?
Blasters are the Wizards of other MMO's and in other MMO's I dont see too many getting into melee as a desired effect. All be it, at low levels it sometimes comes in handy and perhaps getting 1 melee attack might be good for IO sets or whatever but 4-5 attacks? They are very useful if ya intend to get all your debt badges by lvl 30. |
Having Vengeance and Fallout slotted for recharge means never having to say you're sorry.
Teleport - less animation time, less endurance cost.
A day without sunshine is like...you know...night time.
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I so /Sign that|
Originally Posted by Obscure_Blade
Time Bomb : Turn it into a Remote Detonator; when you set the bomb clicking the power again will detonate it. Probably it would need to be reduced in power for balance, but having a power that's actually useful would be better than a stronger one that isn't.
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I can't see any use for Timebomb in any builds, nor have I ever, afaik, seen it in use. Useless? It would seem so.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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No, Blasters are offensive powerhouses. They do damage, in any possible form, and do it very well. No one said it HAD to be range. |
Originally Posted by Blueraven
And what's with all the melee attacks in the blasters secondary? Blasters are the Wizards of other MMO's and in other MMO's I dont see too many getting into melee as a desired effect. All be it, at low levels it sometimes comes in handy and perhaps getting 1 melee attack might be good for IO sets or whatever but 4-5 attacks? They are very useful if ya intend to get all your debt badges by lvl 30. |
Very bad idea, if you suggest changing that. If you don't fancy melee, choose /Devices. The only melee(ish) range power in it is taser.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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^This. If Teleport could be faster than the other travel powers with just a single Range SO/IO in it and able to be continually used without running you out of End in that situation, then I would choose it a lot more often. As it is I only have Teleport on my mastermind now, because that was the only build with so many spare slots that I could justify throwing 4 slots into teleport so that I could cap it for range and endrdx (which makes it about twice as fast as Super Speed running the 3miles end-to-end in Nerva).|
Originally Posted by cybrstorm
Teleport - less animation time, less endurance cost.
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I would also like to see Fly get a boost in speed so that slotting a single Fly speed SO/IO and having Swift was enough to hit the flight speed cap - just like Super Speed and Super Jump can reach their caps with just the base slot and Swift/Hurdle.
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So would I. And so would everyone else. Because that would make it hands-down the best travel power in the entire game for basically any possible purpose. Every travel power needs to have some pros/cons. If you could spam teleport without worrying about endurance AND it's the fastest, there's no reason to take any of the others.
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Originally Posted by Lord Mayhem
^This. If Teleport could be faster than the other travel powers with just a single Range SO/IO in it and able to be continually used without running you out of End in that situation, then I would choose it a lot more often.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Sure there is. Fly makes it easier to chat while travelling or just afk-travel across a zone, Super Jump is the most fun to use (imho) and Super Speed is the most useful travel power indoors (acts like stealth and easier to speed around when there's a low ceiling). Plus Teleport still doesn't work so well when you have lots of latency, so that's a drawback.
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Originally Posted by Dispari
So would I. And so would everyone else. Because that would make it hands-down the best travel power in the entire game for basically any possible purpose. Every travel power needs to have some pros/cons. If you could spam teleport without worrying about endurance AND it's the fastest, there's no reason to take any of the others.
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Um... not to burst your bubble, but unenhanced teleport is already faster than even hard capped superspeed.|
Originally Posted by Lord Mayhem
^This. If Teleport could be faster than the other travel powers with just a single Range SO/IO in it and able to be continually used without running you out of End in that situation, then I would choose it a lot more often. As it is I only have Teleport on my mastermind now, because that was the only build with so many spare slots that I could justify throwing 4 slots into teleport so that I could cap it for range and endrdx (which makes it about twice as fast as Super Speed running the 3miles end-to-end in Nerva).
I would also like to see Fly get a boost in speed so that slotting a single Fly speed SO/IO and having Swift was enough to hit the flight speed cap - just like Super Speed and Super Jump can reach their caps with just the base slot and Swift/Hurdle. |
http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Travel_Powers
Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
Everything Dark Armor | The Softcap
don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
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Those are all pretty good points, actually.|
Originally Posted by Lord Mayhem
Sure there is. Fly makes it easier to chat while travelling or just afk-travel across a zone, Super Jump is the most fun to use (imho) and Super Speed is the most useful travel power indoors (acts like stealth and easier to speed around when there's a low ceiling). Plus Teleport still doesn't work so well when you have lots of latency, so that's a drawback.
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But, teleport is already really fast and has a lot of advantages, like being the only one that can still move you even if you're hit with a web grenade. Its only real disadvantages are that it eats up endurance like crazy and that it's not that great indoors. If it was spammable and endurance wasn't an issue, and it was expanded to be dramatically faster than all other options, it would be way too good of a travel power.
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Originally Posted by PRAF68_EU
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Teleport is pretty great indoors for Granite tankers/brutes |
Originally Posted by Dispari
Those are all pretty good points, actually.
But, teleport is already really fast and has a lot of advantages, like being the only one that can still move you even if you're hit with a web grenade. Its only real disadvantages are that it eats up endurance like crazy and that it's not that great indoors. If it was spammable and endurance wasn't an issue, and it was expanded to be dramatically faster than all other options, it would be way too good of a travel power. |
My EM/EA stalker used to make pretty good use of it too - he had Hover and would teleport around in combat - it was a concept thing that fell by the wayside when I started min-maxing heavily though and also realised I just couldn't enjoy playing a melee character without CJ+Hurdle (and using autofollow to stick with targets) - but TP+Hover still worked fairly well... I guess.
Ok lets compromise. What if Teleport with a single slot, with a range/end set IO in it, never ran out your endurance (with no toggles on but also no stamina, as a base) but also was the same speed as Super Speed when crossing a zone, allowing for zero latency and a player with good reaction-time for clicking to the next TP hop? Then Super Speed still has clear advantages when both powers have no extra slots (SS is better indoors, gives stealth, usually requires less clicking/key-inputs while moving, faster if terrain is flat or you get bad latency or your reaction times aren't so good), but Teleport still has the potential to be fastest travel power by adding extra slots if you can spare them (something SS & SJ can't do, as they hit the cap with base slot), plus has the vertical component that SS lacks for those zones that can be a pain to cross with SS (like GV and TV).
TP would also still have the drawback of needing to take a pre-requisite (Recall Friend or TP Foe) that is often less desirable to most players than Air Superiority/Hover, CJ or Hasten.
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You missed my first reply to you. |
Originally Posted by Lord Mayhem
Ok lets compromise. What if Teleport with a single slot, with a range/end set IO in it, never ran out your endurance (with no toggles on but also no stamina, as a base) but also was the same speed as Super Speed when crossing a zone, allowing for zero latency and a player with good reaction-time for clicking to the next TP hop? Then Super Speed still has clear advantages when both powers have no extra slots (SS is better indoors, gives stealth, usually requires less clicking/key-inputs while moving, faster if terrain is flat or you get bad latency or your reaction times aren't so good), but Teleport still has the potential to be fastest travel power by adding extra slots if you can spare them (something SS & SJ can't do, as they hit the cap with base slot), plus has the vertical component that SS lacks for those zones that can be a pain to cross with SS (like GV and TV).
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Teleport is already the fastest travel power without being enhanced.
Faster than fly. Faster than superjump.
It's faster than capped superspeed.
Without being enhanced.
If you only put one end redux in it, you can teleport endlessly, and travel faster than someone at the speed cap for superspeed. And you have vertical movement.
I'll say it again: Without range enhancements, teleport is faster than any travel power, even at their caps.
Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
Everything Dark Armor | The Softcap
don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
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Yeah sorry about that - came here by link from my subscriber list and it jumped to Dispari's post as last unread.|
Originally Posted by DechsKaison
You missed my first reply to you.
Teleport is already the fastest travel power without being enhanced. Faster than fly. Faster than superjump. It's faster than capped superspeed. Without being enhanced. If you only put one end redux in it, you can teleport endlessly, and travel faster than someone at the speed cap for superspeed. And you have vertical movement. I'll say it again: Without range enhancements, teleport is faster than any travel power, even at their caps. |
I didn't realise TP was faster unslotted - never felt it to me, but then I do get a lot of latency. Admittedly I had to keep stopping to recoup end, even with 1 endrdx in base slot both on my mastermind (before he slotted up TP) and on my stalker (who went with it single-slotted for most of his life befroe I respecced him), so I'm not convinced on that score. Maybe toggles were to blame, but any travel power that makes you turn off toggles to become useable isn't going to be popular with me. I need to be able to cross Nerva without stopping halfway to Rest.
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Personally, I love using teleport. I try to slot it with at least one range and one end and I do fine. I've never needed to stop and rest.|
Originally Posted by Lord Mayhem
Yeah sorry about that - came here by link from my subscriber list and it jumped to Dispari's post as last unread.
I didn't realise TP was faster unslotted - never felt it to me, but then I do get a lot of latency. Admittedly I had to keep stopping to recoup end, even with 1 endrdx in base slot both on my mastermind (before he slotted up TP) and on my stalker (who went with it single-slotted for most of his life befroe I respecced him), so I'm not convinced on that score. Maybe toggles were to blame, but any travel power that makes you turn off toggles to become useable isn't going to be popular with me. I need to be able to cross Nerva without stopping halfway to Rest. |
Crossing Nerva could be an exception, but whenever I've had to travel very very far, I use the two seconds of hover to recoup. I click my next teleport just before I start to fall for one or two jumps. Slows me down a tiny bit, but that time is more than enough to keep from running out of endurance.
Also, my mastermind has the three leadership toggles, and I often forget to turn them off when I exit a mission and start teleporting around. I don't ever remember having to stop and turn them off to keep moving.
EDIT: I guess the disparity here is the fact that I'm comparing with a teleport that's been slotted with a level 50 IO end redux, so it's slightly more effective than one SO. Even so, I'm sure with one SO, you shouldn't have endurance problems with normal travel.
Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
Everything Dark Armor | The Softcap
don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
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I love using TP too, but I just found that without heavy slotting like my MM has it just chews through my end on the longer trips across zones. |
Originally Posted by DechsKaison
Personally, I love using teleport. I try to slot it with at least one range and one end and I do fine. I've never needed to stop and rest.
Crossing Nerva could be an exception, but whenever I've had to travel very very far, I use the two seconds of hover to recoup. I click my next teleport just before I start to fall. Slows me down a tiny bit, but that time is more than enough to keep from running out of endurance. Also, my mastermind has the three leadership toggles, and I often forget to turn them off when I exit a mission and start teleporting around. I don't ever remember having to stop and turn them off to keep moving. |
Admittedly I tend to click for my next TP hop as soon as I appear - I get latency a lot (can't be helped where I live) so if I don't click as soon as I appear I tend to fall from the sky while aiming to make my next click.
Honestly though I just think the two main reasons TP is not such a popular power - and the reason I so rarely take it - is down to the pre-reqs and the (perceived) necessity to slot it. I usually can't spare slots on 95% of my builds and very rarely do I consider Recall Friend or TP Foe as a required power, ergo I hardly ever take TP.
I do think the Vet bonus for 60 months will help - being able to take TP without a pre-req - but sadly due to my hiatus away from the game and not starting to play CoH until a little after EU release I'm still two years away from that.
Sometimes I just wish we could pick a travel power at certain level, regardless of our normal power picks, and have it just work at peak efficiency from the start, as I believe is done in Champions Online (not many things from that game I'd want to see here, but that's one). Until then I'm likely to continue taking Super Speed or Super Jump as travel power on 95% of my characters simply because I usually want their pre-reqs and they're at maximum speed without extra slots.
Sonic Resonance
Sonic Siphon: Change from single target to target AOE, 8-foot radius.
Sonic Repulsion: Reduce endurance cost by half, from 1.04/sec to 0.52/sec, remove the -2.5 endurance from each target knocked back. Change knockback to knockdown.
Clarity: Add small heal, same level as O2 boost. Increase endurance cost to compensate. Sonic dispersion makes this power somewhat unnecessary in most situations - this will give it some use.
Liquefy: Reduce recharge time from 300 seconds to 120 seconds (4x power duration).
Trick Arrow
Increase all non-defender debuff values to current defender levels (masterminds might not go to defender levels, but they should still be increased from what they have now), increase defender debuffs by ~20% or so.
Poison Gas Arrow: Change from 66% chance of mag 2 sleep to 100% chance of mag 2 sleep. Increase -damage debuff duration from 20 to 30 seconds. Keep the non-stacking component.
Oil Slick Arrow: Just fix this buggy power. Please.
Thats all I got for now.