Not another word about Dim Shift and Cottage Rules

http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=184623

As I understand it Energize is a variant on the theme of Conserve Power. As in a reduction in the effect and duration of the Endurance discount, but a huge regen bonus and self-heal added. It's still a self buff and it does do some of what Conserve Power did and it's frankly a much more attractive option.

I'm not sure that the Cottage Rule applies here and it's certainly marginal at best.

Besides the epic pool issue, another thing to note about the change from Conserve Power to Energize is that the new power is still of the same type (click buff), performs a superset of the old power's functions, and accepts a superset of the old power's enhancements. As was noted in the discussion of the change, the "new cottage rule" appears to be that under certain circumstances, effects can be added to powers - Build Up can buff damage, accuracy, and build a cottage at your location. What this means for Dimension Shift is that, even if it does change, it still has to be a targeted power that accept intangibility enhancements - which means it still has to make something intangible.

So the question to pursue, I would say, is what Dimension Shift could do in addition to what it does now that would make it more useful. I rather like Arcanaville's suggestion of a brief intangibility duration, followed by an application of random unpleasant effects as the enemies suffer from exposure to hostile dimensions. Another amusing idea would be to shift a single target and the Dominator, without provoking aggro from the remainder of the spawn, and allow the Dom and the target to affect each other. Pocket dimension duel!

Fine. One second of intangibility followed by 20 seconds of fear from the shock of shifting dimensions.

It's ridiculous to go to that extreme, but if it satisfies the rule that shall not be named...

Not so terribly ridiculous. I'm sure there's someone out there who really likes the fact that Dimension Shift phases its targets, and has come to rely on it. And as silly as that might be, the rule exists so that people can rely on powers having recognizably similar effects from one issue to the next. Effects are frequently altered in magnitude, and occasionally supplemented by additional effects, but they're very rarely removed, and that's a good thing on the whole.

Dim Shift should not be changed. It's pretty silly to change one power when the whole concept of phase powers is poorly executed.

I know that they said that it's impossible to have phase effects be usable as toggles, but they really need to spend programmer time on it, or else come up with some comparable alternative effect so that a "phase" power is effective.

How about:
Phasing puts an invisible mob next to you that Taunts you 5 times per second. You cannot target anything but that mob, and you suffer -1000% debuff to Range (so you can use self-targeted and PBAoE powers only, subject to the 25% minimum range limitation). You also suffer -1000% Damage (so you can't Nuke while doing it). You also gain capped Damage Resistance and Defense while you're Phased. If they could put a flag on you to prevent you from using ranged powers at all, that would be even better.

Now you're almost fully phased out so you're very hard to hit/damage, you can't do much to affect others, but you're still in the real world so that it can be run as a toggle. When the toggle stops, the effects all stop. It's not true "phase" like it's done now, but it's close enough, and it's a lot more usable in the game, and it fixes all Phase powers rather than just Dim Shift.

What's with all you devil's advocates?

You lambaste gravity all the time, point at its lack of early AoE control, specifically name dim shift as a horrible power and here we have the devs changing another power from its fundamental purpose as a precedent for changing other sucktastic powers and all you can do is wrap yourselves in some obscure 'cottage rule' for a reason not to change dim shift?



Now's the time to strike at this horrible power, people. Not defend it. Nor defend a stupid rule that keeps it in the game.

WAKE UP

I don't believe I ever said I like Dimension Shift as it is. I'm just pointing out the likely limits of suggestions the devs would take under consideration. Changing the phase mechanic entirely from top to bottom is, at this point, unlikely. Making Dimension Shift not phase its targets for at least a little while is also unlikely.

And as a personal opinion, I'd rather not see Dim Shift turn into a standard mass mez. If the devs are likely to change it at all, I'd like to see it changed into something unique and interesting, in keeping with the rest of the set's character. You can go to other sets for simple, effective mass mez; only from Gravity do you get such oddballs as Propel, Wormhole, and Singularity. Turning Dim Shift from a useless oddball into a simple power seems like such a waste of potential. But any change that makes Dim Shift useful, whether it be to my taste or not, would only be for the better for Gravity as a whole.

I'm not interested in a holy war, though. Calm down.

Basically, the driving force behind Conserve Power's change is that the power already existed in Tanker and Scrapper Epic pools, and thus with this Proliferation Tankers and Scrappers would be able to pick two of the exact same power. Thus, it was changed to Energize. The power remained as is for Brutes since the release of CoV, and was uneffected by its Proliferation to Stalkers. So it is at least logical to conclude that the Proliferation to blue side is directly responsible for the change to the power.

Energize may be a different power than Conserve Power, but the basic function of the power was unchanged. The duration of the effect was decreased and its recharge made shorter, but that did not change the function of the power. Black Dwarf Mire had the duration of its effect decreased and its recharge made shorter, but that did not change the function of the power. Energy Assault Total Focus had its damage increased and its recharge made longer, but that did not change the function of the power. Such changes do not violate the "Cottage Rule".

Instead, new functions were added to the power. As I said, jokingly, in the thread in which this was announced, apparently this is a loophole around the "Cottage Rule". On the other hand, Repulsion Bomb has had disorient added to its effect, when it did not have that effect before, and it has had its damage increased. (Pretty much from no real damage at all to meaningful damage) So while I may joke about it, yeah, there's precedent for this as well.

So that's it, that's the "Cottage Rule". You can add new effects to a power, change the duration, magnitude, and other stats of a power, but you can't make it stop doing what it currently does. You might even remove penalties or other secondary effects that it might have had before. (Such as with Invincibility) But Dimension Shift makes foes intangible, that's what players expect it to do, and all precedent is that the devs aren't going to change that effect.

Now, if you want a stun or fear when the foes come out of intangibility, that's fine. Personally, I would like to see Detention Field do a small amount of damage to a foe held in it, or just have it prevent regeneration, so foes don't heal back up. I think that would be a useful change to Detention Field, and it might be a useful change to any foe intangibility power, just so it doesn't make you lose any progress you've made towards defeat of the foe.

WTH is "Cottage Rule?"

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Lets examine this a bit.

Conserve Power is a 90s 119.2% End Discount with a 600s recharge. An (enhanced) uptime ratio of 30% (without external buffs). On average, it equals 35.76% End Discount.

Energize is a 30s 60% End Discount with a 120s recharge. An (Enhanced) uptime ratio of 50% (without external buffs). On average, it equals 30% End Discount.

Which doesn't look like much of a change from it's original form.

The fact that Energize has a 25% heal and a decent regen boost (which is perma-able) is just gravy. Energize is just Conserve Power V 2.0. It does everything CP does, and more.


So don't expect Dim Shift to ever stop being an AoE Cage power. It might have it's mechanics changed to make it easier to use. It might even get a new name. But it won't stop being a phase.

Here is a cottage rule thread for those unfamiliar with the term. I believe the original post where the term originated is purged already. But the link does have a red name confirming its meaning.