Why no control over blue side pets?
By
Chaos Creator,
Posted on: 2009-08-04 13:53 in Suggestions and Ideas
Because none of the blueside ATs are pet classes. Only the pet class (Mastermind) gets full control over their pets. Other sets (Controllers, Dark Miasma, Electrical Blast, Devices) get pets as an addition to their set. Masterminds get pets as their set.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Because when the controller pets were designed the AI and interface to allow controllable pets didn't exist yet. It was something that was developed when City of Villains was being programmed.
They never changed it because the controller pets are still working exactly as they were designed to.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Originally Posted by halfthief
Why are none of the blue side pets controllable when MMs can control theirs. Fire imps are almost more a hazard than a benefit.
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Originally Posted by Fleeting_Whisper
Because none of the blueside ATs are pet classes. Only the pet class (Mastermind) gets full control over their pets. Other sets (Controllers, Dark Miasma, Electrical Blast, Devices) get pets as an addition to their set. Masterminds get pets as their set.
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Because the Singularity cares not for your social contracts and will do how it pleases.
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Originally Posted by halfthief
Why are none of the blue side pets controllable when MMs can control theirs. Fire imps are almost more a hazard than a benefit.
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Originally Posted by halfthief
Why are none of the blue side pets controllable when MMs can control theirs.
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Because late at night you touch yourself and that makes God cry.
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Unless you use teleport friend
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Originally Posted by Rush_Bolt
Because the Singularity cares not for your social contracts and will do how it pleases.
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If it ain't broke set it on fire, then say it was a fault in the design.
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Because the devs hate heroes? |
Originally Posted by halfthief
Why are none of the blue side pets controllable when MMs can control theirs. Fire imps are almost more a hazard than a benefit.
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On a serious note, it's like everyone else has posted - MM's are henchmen, not pets, and therefore, behave differently.
for the same reason Doms can't control their pets.
No
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Yeah, Brutes are so hard to control...
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Originally Posted by Psyonico
for the same reason Doms can't control their pets.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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That. It is a product of controls being introduced after heroes.
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Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Because when the controller pets were designed the AI and interface to allow controllable pets didn't exist yet. It was something that was developed when City of Villains was being programmed.
They never changed it because the controller pets are still working exactly as they were designed to. |
A game is not supposed to be some kind of... place where people enjoy themselves!
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Your thinking of Corruptor Pets.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Yeah, Brutes are so hard to control...
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As said above MM's don't use pets they use henchman.
There's also the fact that the MM primary is built around the henchman.
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This
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Originally Posted by Psyonico
for the same reason Doms can't control their pets.
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I've been running Fire Controllers for over 5 years and I can 'control' my Imps fairly easily.|
Originally Posted by halfthief
Why are none of the blue side pets controllable when MMs can control theirs. Fire imps are almost more a hazard than a benefit.
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I haven't accidentally aggroed a group I didn't want to with them for years now.
In fact I prefer their independent-minded AI over MM "micromanagement". I've tried playing MMs and I just can't stand how tedious it is to have to manually move their henchmen around. I'm not saying MMs are bad, I'm just saying I don't really like what's involved in playing them.
YMMV.
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So don't? |
Originally Posted by Lothic
I just can't stand how tedious it is to have to manually move their henchmen around.
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Even when you give Henchmen a goto or stay command, they'll move around a bit on their own. Set to attack of follow and they'll move around with about the same AI as your imps.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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Originally Posted by Lothic
I've tried playing MMs and I just can't stand how tedious it is to have to manually move their henchmen around.
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Originally Posted by Fleeting_Whisper
So don't?
Even when you give Henchmen a goto or stay command, they'll move around a bit on their own. Set to attack of follow and they'll move around with about the same AI as your imps. |
Besides I'm not entirely sure I could do what you suggest with all MM powersets equally. Part of what make Imps do what they do is that they are basically mini-scrappers without ranged attacks. I doubt Robots (with their ranged attacks) would react just as predictably.
The key to "controlling" Imps is the positioning of the character who casts them. Trying to play a MM like that would be like trying use an arrow as a melee weapon. You could probably get away with it occasionally, but what's the point if you're going to keep playing so far against the intended way to do it?
Again I don't think MMs are completely bad. I just don't enjoy playing them.
Of course I might change my mind on that depending on how cool the Demon Summoning set is going to be.
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Actually there are some MMs that perform quite well in melee with pets almost exclusively in bodyguard mode. Muireadhach Nuadha, my Necro/Storm MM is such a MM.
Also, the micromanaging of MMs' henchies in general is not so bad if you use good keybinds. Issuing new commands then is so fast and easy that you can do it during an average power activation.
If it has eyes, you can blind it, if it has blood, you can make it bleed, if it has a mouth, you can make it scream.
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I don't believe that, frankly. |
Originally Posted by ChaosExMachina
That. It is a product of controls being introduced after heroes.
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Barring Illusion controllers, Doms and Controllers are not "pet classes." Their purpose is not centered on their pets, but the controls (and buffs/debuffs or, in a dom's case, damage) they can bring. The pet is a bit of icing (or just plain ice.)
Masterminds, however, were designed specifically *around* their pets. Not having them controllable would be roughly as annoying as having a Blaster whose powers randomly target and go off all the time. Pets (or, to be more correct, henchmen or minions) ARE a mastermind's damage, and health, and defense. *That* is why they're controllable.
I do also seem to recall that, in the past, we've been told by a redname - if they gave Controller pets the ability to be directly commanded, they'd be hit hard with the nerfbat to compensate.
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Actually, to be honest, Robotics, Mercenaries, and Thugs (the ranged primaries) tend to work better than Necromancy and Ninjas (the melee primaries) for letting your pets run around on the Bodyguard leash. Ninjas have a tendency to zip around at high speed and accidentally aggro a second spawn, while robots will happily roast your enemies where they stand.|
Originally Posted by Lothic
I'm not entirely sure I could do what you suggest with all MM powersets equally. Part of what make Imps do what they do is that they are basically mini-scrappers without ranged attacks. I doubt Robots (with their ranged attacks) would react just as predictably.
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The one problem when leaving henchmen on Bodyguard is when the enemies are suffering from a lot of hard controls (eg, you're teamed with a Dominator), no attacks are flying towards you or your pets, not even splash damage, and so your henchies stop doing anything. And in that case, you can just set a few of them to Aggressive stance; and since you're doing it because you're not being attacked anyway, you're probably still going to be just as safe.
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Controlling their henchman or minion is the MM's thing. It's what makes the AT unique.
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I seem to remember that it was either BABsi or Castle who said that. So, it might well be true.|
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
I do also seem to recall that, in the past, we've been told by a redname - if they gave Controller pets the ability to be directly commanded, they'd be hit hard with the nerfbat to compensate.
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Also, they explained in that context that the pet controls were in a way part of MMs' inherent and that they were not planning on adding anythng similar to other ATs.
If it has eyes, you can blind it, if it has blood, you can make it bleed, if it has a mouth, you can make it scream.
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Well I think you basically illustrated -my- point that while you can kind of, sort of play MMs without having to manually control them all the time you'd effectively be playing the AT with one hand tied behind your back. You -could- do that, but why would you really want to? |
Originally Posted by Fleeting_Whisper
Actually, to be honest, Robotics, Mercenaries, and Thugs (the ranged primaries) tend to work better than Necromancy and Ninjas (the melee primaries) for letting your pets run around on the Bodyguard leash. Ninjas have a tendency to zip around at high speed and accidentally aggro a second spawn, while robots will happily roast your enemies where they stand.
The one problem when leaving henchmen on Bodyguard is when the enemies are suffering from a lot of hard controls (eg, you're teamed with a Dominator), no attacks are flying towards you or your pets, not even splash damage, and so your henchies stop doing anything. And in that case, you can just set a few of them to Aggressive stance; and since you're doing it because you're not being attacked anyway, you're probably still going to be just as safe. |
I have absolutely no problem with having different powersets with different schemes for "controlling" their pets. I don't think Controller types need or should have MM type controls (especially if that would necessitate major nerfages to compensate). I think people like the OP who "wonder why" Imps can't be manually controlled aren't really seeing the big picture. If they don't like those control schemes they shouldn't play with those powersets, the same way I don't really like MMs so I don't play with them.
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There responses are why I hate it when the Devs say post to the forums when you have a problenm and send apetition. The comments that were made are mostly foolish and do not answer the question but just make excuses for the inadequacies of the game.
And to the person who accused me of touching myself at night...Who would even think of that if they are not doing it themselves and love it so much they have to bring the subject up out of context of the topic?
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No one's making excuses. It's not inadequacies of the game, it's balance. MM's are all about their pets and the control of said pets. Controllers are all about crowd control with a pet as icing on the cake.|
Originally Posted by halfthief
There responses are why I hate it when the Devs say post to the forums when you have a problenm and send apetition. The comments that were made are mostly foolish and do not answer the question but just make excuses for the inadequacies of the game.
And to the person who accused me of touching myself at night...Who would even think of that if they are not doing it themselves and love it so much they have to bring the subject up out of context of the topic? |
It has nothing to do with MM's coming after controllers, or dominators would be able to control their pets.
All of the controller pets are incredibly powerful, especially taking into account the bread and butter of the AT that comes before the pet. Lock down the mobs, run into the middle and let pets shred stuff up.
Again, it's about balance. The capacity to focus fire increases power. If they were controllable like MM pets, they would have to be significantly decreased in power to compensate.
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Why are none of the blue side pets controllable when MMs can control theirs. Fire imps are almost more a hazard than a benefit.