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Thoughts?
Ideas?
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Use your Search-fu!
Here's a post I did dated 7/9/9 to a similar thread (this comes up every so often)
https://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthre...ue#Post13732799
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I don't know who suggested it first, but I like the idea of giving defenders and inherent click power that builds like domination. Every power you use fills the bar (could even make that secondary powerset thing build the bar quicker 
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That would be pretty awesome actually, kind of fitting and most likely way over powered. Especially if you could perma it like domination. Don't get me wrong, I'd love it! I think it would do well to narrow the gap between how safe a controller makes a team versus how safe a defender makes them.
I'd be a little worried about it stacking though, or how strong it could be if you could perma it like domination.
I can't imagine being able to perma it would be too big an issue. There are still many perma-doms out there. Though the need to be perma has lessened with the buffs, but that's a discussion for the dom boards.
Well it would all depend on the buff values too. I could reasonably see a 5-10% defense to all, 10% tohit and at least a 10% damage buff. It wouldn't be much, but enough to help active defenders both teamed and solo. Would also reinforce a lot of what we already do.
Luminara and I know there is a Defender tankmage... shhh but its a secret, one of the most rarely played combos in the game.
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Whatever you say *smiles and nods*
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How much +Damage does FF offer?
How much -Res does FF offer?
You've got survivability, but you don't have the damage, not in the base, not in multipliers. You lack the "mage" half of tankmage.
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A "mage" is someone that zaps things from a distance. I'm a tankmage if I can survive anything and fry their eyebrows.
You don't need HIGH damage to be a tankmage. You just need ranged damage and great survivability.
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What if our own debuffs applied to us as well?
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Then I'd be screwed. I'm an archer. 
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What if our own debuffs applied to us as well?
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Then I'd be screwed. I'm an archer.
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Yeah but then you can also target yourself with healing arrow.
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Sure, my FFer would love to play a Tankmage, even more than he already does.
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FF/* isn't a tankmage.
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Always thought of Eclipsed, Double-Mired Warshades as the closet thing.
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if eclipse did defense instead of res i would agree with you
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That's why you do Eclipsed, Mired nova form with soft capped ranged defense from IOs.....
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A "mage" is someone that zaps things from a distance. I'm a tankmage if I can survive anything and fry their eyebrows.
You don't need HIGH damage to be a tankmage. You just need ranged damage and great survivability.
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Isn't the "mage" part just high damage, not range?
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A "mage" is someone that zaps things from a distance. I'm a tankmage if I can survive anything and fry their eyebrows.
You don't need HIGH damage to be a tankmage. You just need ranged damage and great survivability.
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Isn't the "mage" part just high damage, not range?
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Let's play a game. How many wizards/mages have you ever heard of that cast weakass spells?
Aside from the most famous ones, there are MANY MANY acolyte wizard/mages out there that are "mostly harmless". Being a wizard/mage doesn't NECESSARILY mean that you can rain fire from the heavens.
HOWEVER, almost all wizards/mages can shoot spells from a distance, with those that can't being the rare exception.
Now, how many wizards or mages do you know that are professional boxers or kung fu masters?
I rest my case.
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Let's play a game. How many wizards/mages have you ever heard of that cast weakass spells?
[/ QUOTE ]None that anyone gives a [censored] about.
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A "mage" is someone that zaps things from a distance. I'm a tankmage if I can survive anything and fry their eyebrows.
You don't need HIGH damage to be a tankmage. You just need ranged damage and great survivability.
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Isn't the "mage" part just high damage, not range?
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Let's play a game. How many wizards/mages have you ever heard of that cast weakass spells?
Aside from the most famous ones, there are MANY MANY acolyte wizard/mages out there that are "mostly harmless". Being a wizard/mage doesn't NECESSARILY mean that you can rain fire from the heavens.
HOWEVER, almost all wizards/mages can shoot spells from a distance, with those that can't being the rare exception.
Now, how many wizards or mages do you know that are professional boxers or kung fu masters?
I rest my case.
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However, in any MMO, which is what we're talking about, the mage-like character is basically a Blaster. High damage from long range is the defining mage role.
We're playing the Priests (clerics) or non-evocation wizards. Sure, Defenders have some damage capabilities, but it's not what we specialize in. We're that Illusion/Transmutation/Abjuration/Necromancy people. We've got a bit of damage but our specialty lies elsewhere.
50s: Bla- Arch/Mental Cont- Mind/FF, Earth/Cold, Ill/Therm, Earth/Rad Dominator- Plant/Psi, Elec/Earth Corr- Fire/Storm, Arch/Sonic, Rad/Kin, Beam/Sonic, Psi/Time Stalker- Elec/SR Def- Storm/Dark, Emp/Psi, Dark/Elec, FF/Arch, TA/Ice, TA/Elec, Kin/AR, Cold/DP, Traps/Psi Scrap- Fire/Shield Tanker- Dark/Mace, Ice/Kin Brute- Claws/WP, SS/Energy, BS/Elec
I like your idea. However it could be a bit complex for both the devs and the players (inherents are pretty straight forward in the game), and would prolly be turned into a Defender's version of Defiance.
Something like, every debuff you cast at enemies, every buff or heal you cast on your teamates gives you a short and cumulative +dmg buff.
Would be great 
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However, in any MMO, which is what we're talking about, the mage-like character is basically a Blaster. High damage from long range is the defining mage role.
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You'd be right, if this was a fantasy MMO.
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Wow, Quizzles, what a brilliant idea! You should get a medal.
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I agree.
We all know that Viligence sucks, but what I wonder is, do the devs?
Reading the devs digest I was suprised to see Castle posting in a tanker thread about Gauntlet. As far as I know, the devs are all silent about the woes of the Defender..despite my best efforts.
Now, I'm not saying Tankers don't need looking at - I never play that type of character. However if any inherent is going to be looked at, it should be the Defender one.
We need to make some more noise people. Not me either, anymore noise and I'll be labelled a troublemaker.
The term "Tankmage" originated in fanatasy games and has since crossed over into most if not all games to signify a character with both superior defensive and offensive abilities well beyond the norm.
But honestly I think your just dodging things you don't wanna see.
If you PL'd to 50 just to get an "epic" thinking you'd be �ber, you're going to be sorely disappointed with the HEATs, because the VEATs were designed so that anyone with one good finger and a braincell can rock the toggles.
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The term "Tankmage" originated in fanatasy games and has since crossed over into most if not all games to signify a character with both superior defensive and offensive abilities well beyond the norm.
But honestly I think your just dodging things you don't wanna see.
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You are correct. It doesn't have anything to do with range. It has to do with power.
Not saying I'm correct for sure, but didn't the term actually originate in one of the 2000 AD company's post apocalypse series? Wasn't there a sort of unstoppable supercop with awesome weaponry and armor that called themselves the "Tankmages"? Not sure exactly but I vaguely remember a promised but never released PC FPS based on being a Tankmage in 2002 or so.
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The term "Tankmage" originated in fanatasy games and has since crossed over into most if not all games to signify a character with both superior defensive and offensive abilities well beyond the norm.
But honestly I think your just dodging things you don't wanna see.
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You are correct. It doesn't have anything to do with range. It has to do with power.
Not saying I'm correct for sure, but didn't the term actually originate in one of the 2000 AD company's post apocalypse series? Wasn't there a sort of unstoppable supercop with awesome weaponry and armor that called themselves the "Tankmages"? Not sure exactly but I vaguely remember a promised but never released PC FPS based on being a Tankmage in 2002 or so.
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I thought it was simply a combination of tank and mage adding the defense of the perceived tank with the damage of the mage classes.
honestly, i would just be happy if vigilance counted the defenders health in the equation.
Jay Doherty: Yes, there was this one night that I was ready to go home but had to drop the browns off at the super bowl before I left for home. While on the throne it hit me. I stayed for a few more hours and that why we have the pain pads in the game.
Can anyone prove that defenders need an across-the-board-buff?
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Can anyone prove that defenders need an across-the-board-buff?
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Wait a minute, you want proof of something?
The novelty.
Please buff Ice Control.
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Can anyone prove that defenders need an across-the-board-buff?
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Only the Devs can 'prove' that using data mining, and then its still a fairly subjective thing. Relative advancement rate and popularity are about the only benchmarks that are reasonable to use to 'prove' that a buff is appropriate. Balance across so many aspects is an incredibly subjective thing, proving something is needed is virtually a pipe dream. Asking for proof an AT needs something is almost along the lines of asking for proof that strawberry ice cream is better than chocolate, its mostly personal preference with a bit of sales numbers none of us have to partially back up that opinion.
Better is to show mathematically that there is room for improvement without infringing upon a competing AT's territory. Show that an idea is reasonable, and leave it up to the Devs with their data, and frankly more important opinions, to decide if it is appropriate to use.
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I would rather see a damage buff to the team for defenders simply being on the team. it'd be a cool inherent. 5% global damage for team if a defender is on the team. Every additional defender grants a 1% bonus. Tweak the 5% and 1% to reasonable values (my numbers are a stab in the dark). I'd like to see that.
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Because defenders are so lame on teams.
Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.