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Without going into the numbers, those sound like reasonable suggestions. As it stands right now, the STF is the only thing in the game in which a tank is on my priority list when I'm forming teams. I'm not saying tanks are bad or that I won't take one, just that they can become irrelevant quite easily on a decent/good team.
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Any AT can become irrelevant on a good team.
I've been on controllers, defenders, blasters, scrappers, brutes, stalkers, peacebringers, masterminds, corruptors, dominators, and widows where I could go AFK with no noticeable change in mission speed.
ANY AT can be made unessential on a good team. Damage, and Buffs can be wasted just as easily as defense.
[/ QUOTE ] True, but it's easiest to replace tanks IMO.
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Without going into the numbers, those sound like reasonable suggestions. As it stands right now, the STF is the only thing in the game in which a tank is on my priority list when I'm forming teams. I'm not saying tanks are bad or that I won't take one, just that they can become irrelevant quite easily on a decent/good team.
[/ QUOTE ]
Any AT can become irrelevant on a good team.
I've been on controllers, defenders, blasters, scrappers, brutes, stalkers, peacebringers, masterminds, corruptors, dominators, and widows where I could go AFK with no noticeable change in mission speed.
ANY AT can be made unessential on a good team. Damage, and Buffs can be wasted just as easily as defense.
[/ QUOTE ] True, but it's easiest to replace scrappers IMO.
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"the reason there are so many sarcastic pvpers is we already had a better version of pvp taken away from us to appease bad players. Back then we chuckled at how bad players came here and whined. If we knew that was the actual voice devs would listen to instead of informed, educated players we probably would have been bigger dicks back then." -ConFlict
So clever....
Just altering it to fit my own perceptions. I've found it MUCH easier to replace a scrapper than any other AT in the game.
"the reason there are so many sarcastic pvpers is we already had a better version of pvp taken away from us to appease bad players. Back then we chuckled at how bad players came here and whined. If we knew that was the actual voice devs would listen to instead of informed, educated players we probably would have been bigger dicks back then." -ConFlict
I actually agree with Reiraku. There's something to be said while teaming for specialization. Yeah, the hybridization of this game makes it interesting, but Scrappers are in a place where they don't benefit as much from buffs as other ATs, and provide less damage than blasters. So if you have a tank, why add a scrapper when you can add a blaster for more damage?
Luckly for me I don't make up my teams like that. Luckily for me I haven't run into anyone in the game who actually does....
"Be a beacon?"
Blue Mourning: lvl. 50 Katana/DA
Bree the Barricade: lvl 50 Stone/Axe
Last Chance for Eden: lvl 50 Fire/Kin
Myra the Grey: lvl 50 Bots/Traps
1 Minute to Midnight lvl 50 Spines/DA
I can't really disagree. Both melee ATs can be replaced pretty damn easy.
The Repeat Offenders proved that quite easily.
EDIT: Then again, I did a 5th diff ITF with nothing but scrappers, so the statement is true for all ATs.
Be well, people of CoH.
Hey apple_eater, who made your avatar?
That looks like Starchasm's handywork.
QR:
Brute
Brute
I've tanked itfs on scrappers. I've offtank positioned the healie nict on a blaster (and defender. And tank. And scrapper!) so it's not like a broot can't.
Buffs/debuffs rule the game.
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Without going into the numbers, those sound like reasonable suggestions. As it stands right now, the STF is the only thing in the game in which a tank is on my priority list when I'm forming teams. I'm not saying tanks are bad or that I won't take one, just that they can become irrelevant quite easily on a decent/good team.
[/ QUOTE ]
Any AT can become irrelevant on a good team.
I've been on controllers, defenders, blasters, scrappers, brutes, stalkers, peacebringers, masterminds, corruptors, dominators, and widows where I could go AFK with no noticeable change in mission speed.
ANY AT can be made unessential on a good team. Damage, and Buffs can be wasted just as easily as defense.
[/ QUOTE ] True, but it's easiest to replace tanks IMO.
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Actually, it's equally easy replacing anyone, just click on the "invite to team" button.
Whether the replacement can effectively fill the role is another matter. 
I've been with the game long enough to have been part of all of the discussions about how tanks are made obsolete by so many other archetypes, yet a decent tank still makes the team safer than anyone else.
Arc ID#30821, A Clean Break
The only problem with defeating the Tsoo is that an hour later, you want to defeat them again!
"Life is just better boosted!" -- LadyMage
"I'm a big believer in Personal Force Field on a blaster. ... It's your happy place." -- Fulmens
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I've been with the game long enough to have been part of all of the discussions about how tanks are made obsolete by so many other archetypes, yet a decent tank still makes the team safer than anyone else.
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I can't disagree with this in any way; a decent tank, on their own, has the single greatest contribution to overall team safety on any decent team.
However, in my experience,
A) Most tanks are bad. I generalize, yes, but in my experience, most tanks are bad. (I main tanked more raids than I can remember, fwiw). I'll further caveat with most forum-reading tanks are probably not that bad, the same way most forum reading scrappers aren't (shades of that leeroy thread). However, in my experience, most tanks are bad.
B) Most of my teams don't require such a high level of safety from one toon. When someone does die, it's usually a plus (woo! Vengeance!) not a minus. With stacking buffs and debuffs (which come from characters that can multiply damage instead of adding it) the tanker is a really unattractive option.
It is not to say that the AT doesn't function as desired, simply that I don't often feel the need for its desired function. Furthermore, in the early game, tanks defenses aren't high enough to really handly 8man spawns, and by midgame, the other support classes have come into their own and 2-3 stacked support toons = win. I started on tankers, and I still have a few, but no content requires them the way other MMO's require 'tank' classes.
This is also my playstyle (8man teams that are heavy on def/cont) so I realize I have a narrow view of what I 'need' for my missions.
Whoops, this got a bit long, I'm enjoying being able to use a laptop instead of the Iphone to type again (Bus has wireless!)... now if only work VPN would connect...
If it is a bold tank who is willing to herd fast and charge into mobs ahead of the team to increase my AOEs, I would rather team with a tank, especially if it is the ITF where taunt can be useful.
If it is a chicken tank, the kind I find most often, who insists to pull every mob no matter how easy it is, I would rather quit team.
Hero PUGs will be a lot better after going rogue forces them to learn to run.
A game is not supposed to be some kind of... place where people enjoy themselves!
I hate to say it since Tankers are my favorite AT but I have to agree with the last couple of posts, way too many tankers are either simply bad players or they're afraid of tanking. I know that I have rather high standards for a tanker player's performance... there's so few tanks I've teamed with who measure up that I've had to adopt a policy of assuming incompetence until proven different anytime I'm not tanking.
When I'm tanking I always push the pace to the limit the team can handle... but not beyond that... and that's something that requires experience to accomplish. I do believe firmly that ONE good tank brings more to a team than any other single AT, but after you have that one good tanker you're better off filling the team with other AT's... multiple tanks don't add as much as other AT's.
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
I would rather team with a Kheldian or soldier of arachnos honestly than either a brute or a tank.
When something good happens to me, I can never enjoy it....
I am always too busy looking for the inevitable punchline...
BEHOLD THE POWER OF CHEESE!
the old discuss of wich one is better..
this wil never end :/
they are DIFFERENT
tanker as the name says is a TANK, can take more dmg
brute is more close to a scrap then a tanker (Y), can do more dmg
I preffer brutes cuz i love to kill things quickly and some brutes can farm to, like my ss/fire
Dominator/controllers. No AoE attacks to worry about, no self-buffing to worry about, even AVs can be held indefinitely with the right build.
Rather play a tank, I'm all about team play.
Rather play with a tank, unless I'm on a tank or a scrapper that can pick up the pieces for the team if the Brute dies.
(QR) rather play a brute, rather team with a tank.